KickStarter System Shock 1 Remake by Nightdive Studios

[SomeGuyWithAnOpinion]

The problem with the art is the mix of the relatively realistic lighting/gore/etc with the highly pixellated texture, it's very strange looking.

Anyone else had issues with controllers?

I know controllers are decline but when you have housemates and want to socialise with some couch gaming, then a controller is mandatory, and the controller support in this game is ABYSMAL.

They say they are going for a console release, but it's not going to be a success with controller support this bad.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

My biggest gripe is same as with Prey - complete lack of tension/horror.

At least you're not allahu akbaring the art style.

Because on the webz everyone seems to be jizzing with happiness about the bright, colourful, cartoony visual style and the funky pixelated textures of this survival horror, while simultaneously complaining it's not scary or even tense.

Fucking modern gaymers man.

Original SS was way more funky and colorful and was p universally considered scary.

I don't think graphics have much to do with this. Mostly the remake combat being very slow paced and the game has audio mixing problems so you cannot hear enemy quips most of the time. You have to feel threatened to be scared and in SS2 one of the creepiest parts was hearing hybrid/robot ramblings somewhere in the distance.

 

[cvv]

Original SS was way more funky and colorful and was p universally considered scary.

That's something I see a lot and I actually had to think about it a bit because it's not wrong.

My counter to this would be
a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom
b) I think I found the color palette and some of the wall panelling a bit weird and cartoony even way back in late 1990s when I played the original, considering SS was supposed to be an immersive survival sim

But again, kids today seem to love cartoony, even in a supposedly scary, immersive sim, so who am I, a moldy old grognard, to dis them.

Next time when they remake Dead Space 2 as a loli anime I'll be silent.

 

[MLMarkland]

Original SS was way more funky and colorful and was p universally considered scary.

That's something I see a lot and I actually had to think about it a bit because it's not wrong.

My counter to this would be
a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom
b) I think I found the color palette and some of the wall panelling a bit weird and cartoony even way back in late 1990s when I played the original, considering SS was supposed to be an immersive survival sim

But again, kids today seem to love cartoony, even in a supposedly scary, immersive sim, so who am I, a moldy old grognard, to dis them.

Next time when they remake Dead Space 2 as a loli anime I'll be silent.

Harder to get scare blind making a game in 90s than now is the main reason why a game might be more tense with lesser GFX.

As for the lolanime Fortnight thing — that’s mainly a cost structure thing. It’s more expensive to make something photorealistic and there is no evidence it sells better.

I’ve certainly avoided working on lame shit with a couple of exceptions — but most people don’t have a choice as a developer, anymore than the guy at Home Depot has a choice which power tools they carry or whether they are fully stocked of all various dimensions of galvanized steel sheeting.

 

[cvv]

As for the lolanime Fortnight thing — that’s mainly a cost structure thing. It’s more expensive to make something photorealistic and there is no evidence it sells better.

That may be too.

You got any background in dev? What about the pixelated textures, a cost cutting measure or a stylistic choice? Or the former rationalized by the latter?

 

[v1c70r14]

The Fortnitefication of video games is partly due to how cheap it is, partly due to it being less demanding on the hardware and makes it easy to port to smartphones, but also because high-detail graphics destroy the readability 90's games had with the sparse environments. The System Shock remake is a good example of the issue, beyond looking like amateur hour the game has huge readability problems from all the greebling on the walls and floors from what I've seen of it. The more detail you add the more things get lost in it, enemies, pickups, and other interactibles. They tried putting atrocious flashing neon lights on everything in hopes of it attracting the player's attention, but it mostly just adds to the noise and visual pollution.

The other solution is to have these glowing and highlighted items, but that looks like shit too. 90's level design, and game design in general, doesn't square with current fidelity levels. Indie retro shooters do a terrible job emulating it and I have plenty of other bad things to say about them, but generally they at least understand what the abstraction level does for a game and how to control it.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom

Eeeeh, Dooms definitely didn't look "goofy as fuck" to gamers back then, not even wolf 3d did. Then there was already realistic grimdark stuff like Space Hulk or the first AvP on Jaguar. SS's graphics were definitely a conscious artistic choice that somehow worked out.

 

[MLMarkland]

As for the lolanime Fortnight thing — that’s mainly a cost structure thing. It’s more expensive to make something photorealistic and there is no evidence it sells better.

That may be too.

You got any background in dev? What about the pixelated textures, a cost cutting measure or a stylistic choice? Or the former rationalized by the latter?

I’m the guy that tried to save the game biz from idiotification and failed.

Pixelated textures, depends on the game and circumstance.

What game?

Sometimes it’s a memory saving / render thread management technique.

Sometimes someone delegates making the PC version work on Xbox to an idiot and they arbitrarily compress all the textures to Xbox density.

Sometimes individual artists suck.

Most game teams don’t know how to fully utilize a game engine and production pipeline on a multi-platform project with high art standards (most = 99%).

 

[cvv]

a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom

Eeeeh, Dooms definitely didn't look "goofy as fuck" to gamers back then, not even wolf 3d did.

Bruh

Wolf 3D was the first game I've ever played on my first ever PC. I breastfed on that game. I ate and drank it. And I can reliably tell you the looks and sounds were absolutely a top meme at school.

"MUTTI!"

"MEIN LEBEN!"

"EINE KLEINE AMERIKAAANE! HAHAHAHAHA"

Yes. Yes Wolf 3D was goofy as fuck.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Czechia in early nineties must've been like Jetsons or something, if schoolkids thought of wolf 3d graphics as "goofy" and "meme".

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

The remake is okay. The main problem is the lack of physical impact. You hit an enemy with a laser rapier and don't feel its contact with him. Even in Morrowind or Deus Ex 1 the impact felt better.

You can get used to it. But it's an obvious flaw that greatly impairs the feeling of the game. It irritates me much more than the lesbian-brothel visual style and lack of melodic music.

 

[Junmarko]

a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom

Eeeeh, Dooms definitely didn't look "goofy as fuck" to gamers back then, not even wolf 3d did.

Bruh

Wolf 3D was the first game I've ever played on my first ever PC. I breastfed on that game. I ate and drank it. And I can reliably tell you the looks and sounds were absolutely a top meme at school.

"MUTTI!"

"MEIN LEBEN!"

"EINE KLEINE AMERIKAAANE! HAHAHAHAHA"

Yes. Yes Wolf 3D was goofy as fuck.

Eating dog food to get your health back

 

[Tacgnol]

a) you can't exactly do realistic and immersive with early 1990s technology; everything 3D looked goofy as fuck back then, including Arena, UU or Doom

Eeeeh, Dooms definitely didn't look "goofy as fuck" to gamers back then, not even wolf 3d did.

Bruh

Wolf 3D was the first game I've ever played on my first ever PC. I breastfed on that game. I ate and drank it. And I can reliably tell you the looks and sounds were absolutely a top meme at school.

"MUTTI!"

"MEIN LEBEN!"

"EINE KLEINE AMERIKAAANE! HAHAHAHAHA"

Yes. Yes Wolf 3D was goofy as fuck.

Eating dog food to get your health back

Even some of the music

 

[Tweed]

Eating dog food to get your health back

Drinking BLOOD to get your health back.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Extremely hindsight takes (or simply impressions from someone whose first contact with the game came long after its release). Of course wolf's overall tone is very pulpy. But the typical reaction to its graphics, which is what we're talking about here, from a schoolboy gamer was looking for your jaw on the floor, not "hehe maymay".

 

[kangaxx]

My biggest gripe is same as with Prey - complete lack of tension/horror. The only thing that startles me sometimes are the ragdolls spazzing out. Guess I'm just too old and cold.

The ragdolls get me as well. It's almost every time you enter a room in which a slaughter has already taken place.

I've had a couple of jump scare moments from enemy respawns, but I agree it doesn't have the tension of something like SS2. But then should it have? The original SS didn't have the tension/horror of SS2.

 

[Lemming42]

The thing about games like Doom and SS is that they were considered scary at the time because of the "immersion" (to use a word that's lost all meaning). I remember my dad doing the classic thing everyone did with Doom, where you'd actually physically lean in your seat IRL in a futile attempt to peek around corners in the game.

But I don't think either of them are actually "horror games" in intent. Yes, there's elements designed to invoke dread and certain sections clearly intended to get an "oh fuck" reaction out of the player (obvious ones being the dark/flashing room at the end of E1M5 and the entire pitch-black deck in SS), but the games as a whole are much more about action with a bit of surrealness and humour thrown in. If you want the player to feel genuine constant fear and dread, you don't play roaring heavy metal or pumping techno over the experience.

Half-Life is another one in the same vein - yeah people at school at the time were talking about how they couldn't play it in the dark and they were too scared to run past the tentacle monster in Blast Pit, and yeah there's sections which are clearly horror-focused, but again I'd argue it just isn't a "horror game" in any meaningful sense of the term. My main memory of all these games (Doom, SS, Half-Life) is of a sense of giddiness and adrenaline, not of skulking about in the dark going "wuuugh" when an enemy pops out, even though that does happen in all three games. The horror mostly comes early on in all three games, before the cathartic payoff of you becoming comically powerful and blasting your way through increasingly unlikely high-stakes scenarios in the second half of the story.

In other words - when I think of Doom, I think of going apeshit with the chainsaw while ripoff Pantera songs play in the background. When I think of Half-Life, I think of charging the tank with the Tau Cannon in Surface Tension while "Diabloical Adrenaline Guitar" plays. When I think of System Shock, I think of flying through the air at high speeds with the laser rapier while techno blasts out and SHODAN says "Nice jump". Not the main memories you'd take away from horror games.

To remake Doom or Half-Life with a minimalistic soundtrack, low lighting, and weepy audio logs would be to miss the point of the game entirely and strip it of pretty much everything that made it so stylish and fun. Same for System Shock.

 

[kites]

A few loose thoughts

Tried using controller input and it seems a bit rough at the moment, probably won’t have a real touch-up until they release the console versions later this year.

I hate the junk scrapping, not because it’s necessary but because I feed into it compulsively

The contrast/color scheme/lighting wears on me quickly. Maybe I was tired but I was playing very slowly just to clearly read the environments

While I did’t love cyberspace in the original, the wireframe look felt more abstract and trippy to me

A bit embarrassed how long it took me to pull the name of the loop that faintly plays in the opening bedroom

 

[SlamDunk]

Thanks for the impressions, guys.

Buy-at-sale it is, then.

 

[DrLocrian]

Encountered a bug where the the surgical bed is always in use and not available to heal yourself anymore.

 

[JDR13]

It's honestly OK, just overpriced.

Overpriced compared to what? Maybe it costs more in whatever region you're in, but it's only $39.99 here. I think the price is fine.

My biggest gripe is same as with Prey - complete lack of tension/horror. The only thing that startles me sometimes are the ragdolls spazzing out. Guess I'm just too old and cold.

Prey had plenty of tension in the first half. The only problem is that the player becomes too OP later on for there to be any tension in the late game.

I agree there's not much tension is SS, though I'm still very early in the game so that could change. For me, it's because of how dumb the AI is. Most enemies just stand there until they see the player and then simply beeline towards you.

 

[Tweed]

Dying instantly doesn't bring much tension, most of my deaths have been from sudden explosions.

Oh and another gripe, the energy pool. This is one thing these morons could have fixed that was flawed in the original, but noooo let's 1:1 one of the weak features that makes energy based weapons garbage.

 

[Average Manatee]

Dying instantly doesn't bring much tension, most of my deaths have been from sudden explosions.

Oh and another gripe, the energy pool. This is one thing these morons could have fixed that was flawed in the original, but noooo let's 1:1 one of the weak features that makes energy based weapons garbage.

In OG SS1 energy pool meant that energy weapons were great when you were just going back through floors or areas you already visited, helping to maintain your ammo. Though you got so much ammo that ammo conservation wasn't a big deal. Laser rapier was also incredible, if its not so in the remake then that's a major mistake.

 

[Tweed]

Dying instantly doesn't bring much tension, most of my deaths have been from sudden explosions.

Oh and another gripe, the energy pool. This is one thing these morons could have fixed that was flawed in the original, but noooo let's 1:1 one of the weak features that makes energy based weapons garbage.

In OG SS1 energy pool meant that energy weapons were great when you were just going back through floors or areas you already visited, helping to maintain your ammo. Though you got so much ammo that ammo conservation wasn't a big deal. Laser rapier was also incredible, if its not so in the remake then that's a major mistake.

It's the only energy weapon worth using both in the original and the remake. It can kill Diego in one or two swings in the original with a berserk patch.

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

Is this or Prey better?