Vapourware Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Remake from Saber Interactive

[Hace El Oso]

Uninteractive? Dude this is getting released on a system for people who worship Chrono Trigger as the greatest RPG ever. Uninteractive is almost a requirement for success. Dumber the better.

Is Chrono Trigger any good? I've been thinking of picking it up, never played it.

 

[Butter]

Uninteractive? Dude this is getting released on a system for people who worship Chrono Trigger as the greatest RPG ever. Uninteractive is almost a requirement for success. Dumber the better.

Is Chrono Trigger any good? I've been thinking of picking it up, never played it.

It's very shallow and easy, but it's a fun romp. The time travel aspect is handled well, the story is pretty good, and the game looks and sounds great.

 

[Wilian]

But it was supposed to be merely a remake...

The only things they were planning on using from the OG were the story beats and the sound assets. The rest was being made wholecloth.

Yes, that's what a remake is. Thank you for your dictionary duties.

 

[bionicman]

Shame this happened... I was looking forward to the kotor: refunded

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

Yes, that's what a remake is. Thank you for your dictionary duties.

Yeah, and the implication was that Aspyr would have had to remake everything but the story and sound, which is where all the real labor is and where the need for their own expertise arises. Saying "It was supposed to be merely a remake... (how could they fail?)" is the equivalent of saying "All they needed to do was make three quarters of an RPG." with no prior experience.

 

[luj1]

Uninteractive? Dude this is getting released on a system for people who worship Chrono Trigger as the greatest RPG ever. Uninteractive is almost a requirement for success. Dumber the better.

Is Chrono Trigger any good? I've been thinking of picking it up, never played it.

JRPGs are not my thing but Chrono Trigger, FF 7 and Xenogears are supposed to be the best

Some people also praise Ogre Tactics and Secret of Mana

 

[Falksi]

Uninteractive? Dude this is getting released on a system for people who worship Chrono Trigger as the greatest RPG ever. Uninteractive is almost a requirement for success. Dumber the better.

Is Chrono Trigger any good? I've been thinking of picking it up, never played it.

Depends on how you're wired.

Butter's summary is pretty good, although I'd say the story is more serviceable than good (Frog's story is good, the rest pretty cliched tbh)

The first 8 hours are great because it constantly throws new things at you, and nails it's presentational aspects. Then the novelty wears off and you really have to be into the time travel concept, characters, and presentation to get much out of it from there on.

Personally I find that it's totally unengaging combat and predictable battle setup make it drag big time for me after that initial good start. Its ridiculous how many times you have to fight the exact same battles in the exact same places to travel though time gates, and you'll be lucky to see a party member die for the first 80% of the game or so hours, never mind a game-over screen.

I also don't buy into the time travel gimmick either, loads of it's fans see it as revolutionary and innovative, all I see when playing it is a cheap ass way to recycle the same overworld and skimp on exploratory design.

I can see why a lot of noobs to the genre love it, and as a kid for a once-through I really liked it (although it still felt like a big step-back from Phantasy Star 4, which has way better writing, humour and comic-book style presentation). But for a seasoned RPG player it doesn't have the gameplay/challenge required, and anyone who's played some of the best CRPG story driven games will find it's story basic AF too.

 

[Absinthe]

Honestly, I don't think anyone was yearning for the combat of KotOR. KotOR combat was utterly forgettable, largely uninteractive, and pretty much seemed to play itself. Character builds seemed like pretty much anything works without particularly trying and, being d20-based, the level-ups often didn't feel impactful either, especially if you were playing a Scoundrel. Once your character became a jedi it got a bit better but even there there is very little build-up from weak powers to stronger ones. You can pretty much cherry pick all the coolest powers you want and obtain them, so you really don't need to bother with build paths. So it's pretty hard to give a fuck about KotOR's combat. The only requirement to do better than KotOR here is that the combat actually feel like combat and not like time-wasting.

The bigger source of complaints would be if their new action-based combat results in the lack of party members. The other source of major complaints will of course be the revamping and butchering of KotOR's characters and story, as well as derailing the story to satisfy the need for players to experience the "cool stuff" the remaster team threw in. The story and characters still have to feel like KotOR, and narrative pacing matters. This is probably the spot where it can get absolutely clobbered in the customer reviews and even a number of the professional ones.

But there's still the expectation that it would play similarly, not necessarily identical.
e.g., a lot of gameplay elements in Dragon Age Origins are similar to Neverwinter Nights and Baldur's Gate. I have issues with DAO's simplification of some things, but I generally found it to have some of the most enjoyable combat in any RTwP game I've played, eschewing the unnecessary hidden rounds for true real time was a great improvement over its predecessors in my opinion.
If a kotor remake had combat like Dragon Age Origins, I think very few fans of the originals would be upset. It wouldn't be a subgenre-departing change from the originals, and have a very similar playstyle, party control, so forth.

However, if a kotor remake decided to be more like Witcher 3 or other action RPGs then there cause to complain. There would be no character of the original game in this, it wouldn't be a remake.

Honestly, a transition to a more DAO-like system would probably be well received, yeah, but would people really complain if it suddenly started playing more like Star Wars: Jedi Knight, perhaps as a third-person shooter? The only real complaints would be if it was poorly done or got in the way of player companions.

Another source of complaints would be if they butcher the aesthetic. Redoing it to look better is fine, but if the visual design stops feeling like KotOR you'll lose people. Often enough, remasters seem to just remake all the parts of the original without factoring in how the overall design is supposed to fit together to create an overall mood or impression, which will fuck with the aesthetic side of things. And sometimes remasters pretty much do their own thing and overhaul it into something that doesn't feel like the original at all. There is, in fact, a fair bit of artistry and direction required in crafting a remake that still feels like the original. That said, the original KotOR's graphics weren't exactly impressive, so there's room to improvise without too much critique. It's probably more important that the design comes together and moves through the narrative appropriately than that the design perfectly replicates the original.

This is the main reason I mentioned the dismissal of their art lead who previously was an artist & art lead on Star Wars Galaxies, which has a very similar visual theme to the kotor games. A likely reason to do such, if the game itself wasn't canned, is a complete change of art direction to be more like Jedi Fallen Order or some such.

Another reason to do so is simply because the suits considered him overpaid or they decided they were just going to reuse assets with a new coat of paint. It looks like the current direction is a transition from an actual remake to some enhanced edition type stuff. I'd expect something botched like Warcraft 3 Reforged at this stage. The idea that the suits want to radically overhaul the art into another direction seems dubious to me, because that's expensive and they're annoyed at the remake costing too much money and time.

 

[Dr1f7]

Shame this happened... I was looking forward to the kotor: refunded

yeah i was saving money for the "dark side choices" loot crate

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

Honestly, a transition to a more DAO-like system would probably be well received, yeah, but would people really complain if it suddenly started playing more like Star Wars: Jedi Knight, perhaps as a third-person shooter? The only real complaints would be if it was poorly done or got in the way of player companions.

I would, but I'm probably in the minority. I think we have more than enough shooters in Star Wars already, and the animations and gravitas of the lightsaber duels would decline drastically going that road. For all the fun you can get from it, Jedi Outcast/Academy combat is only slightly above shit to look at. It doesn't really look anything like lightsaber combat due to circle-strafing and all the other trappings that come along with Quake clones and FPS. What KotOR's combat needed most was increased difficulty, a larger feat pool/power and the ability to issue complex commands to the party. The latter is the only thing worth stealing from DAO.

Another game they should be looking to steal from is the Witcher 1, not for it's quicktime combat, (though I'd argue at certain points in combat these may add to it for interrupting actions) but for the fluidity of how knockback is incorporated into attack chains that syncs very well to the elaborate animations. In that game when you begin dueling on one side of a room you'll end on the other as the enemy is driven back naturally. This is something KotOR lacked with it's static combat and, as far as I know never improved in melee in Dragon Age.

 

[AdamReith]

Been purposefully avoiding this thread because KOTOR is one of my all time favorites. Joyful news!

I have a feeling that the decision to gender/race flip characters represented the entire output of their development team.

Hopefully we'll see more ships flying the fag flag sink in the coming months.

 

[Wunderbar]

Jason Shreier now says the game was moved from Aspyr to Saber. And not just Saber, but an Eastern European division of Saber, which means it's either Hungarian, Belarusian or Russian devs (though the Russian studio have their hands full with WH40k Space Marine 2).

Scoop: The highly anticipated Star Wars KOTOR remake has been moved from Texas-based Aspyr Media to a Saber Interactive studio in Eastern Europe.

Parent company Embracer hinted at the transition last week, and Bloomberg News can confirm it today:

In an earnings report, Embracer said it is not "expecting any material delays” from the transition, but of course, developer pivots like this are rare and almost always lead to delays. The game is at least two years away from completion, say people familiar

Embracer hinted that the game was moved due to quality issues. People familiar with development say that Embracer as well as stakeholders Sony and Disney were not happy with Aspyr's progress. Some say they're optimistic about the transition in the long run

I guess it's technically true that there won't be any "material delays" when the game has no release date in the first place.

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

For a few short weeks I was relieved that I wouldn't have to parse through hundreds of remake pages shitting up the search results whenever I needed to find content relating to the original game. Sure is good to have dreams.

 

[Roguey]

Remakes have become common in recent years, but it’s rare for a game to switch companies in the middle of development. Doing so almost always leads to major delays. The new developer must learn how to adapt to unfamiliar code and in most cases will revamp or at least modify previous decisions made for the project.

They're scraping it, starting over, and expecting the new version to be out in 2-3 years come hell or high water. Bloodlines 2 part 2.

(on the upside this might mean they'll stick to the original script to save time)

 

[Ghulgothas]

Aspyr's version of the game may be dead and buried, but some of their designs appear to have made it into the wider world in the form of what were absolutely intended to be tie-in merchandised action figures.

Not exactly strong black female Saul Karath, but...

Butterface Bastila

Malak's New Dentalpiece

Bastila's inoffensive, but Malak isn't as imposing when he's not built like a brick shithouse in his wrapped musclesuit. Can't see new Malak headlining the title screen with presence and ambience alone like I can the original.

But I guess it's a moot point since these designs are relics were thrown out with everything else. Probably the the best point of comparison we'll have between the two versions. I mean, aside from whether or not one version actually ends up getting finished.

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

Malak's wearing a tunic when he should be wearing a body-glove. I think they got the three scapulas correct, the mask is definitely too bulky on the sides and his shoulders should be a bit wider. Face looks really nice though.
Bastila's hair is all wrong as per fucking usual with official products, jawline is too wide. Leather is too oxblood colored.

The Revan one is decent, hood's a little off:

Spoiler

Much better Gentle Giant diorama of Bastila.

Spoiler

I own the earliest ones from 2007 and man are they bad. Revan is using a reskinned Sith mask from the game that the sculptor must have lifted from a screenshot for a reference, and Malak is a manlet, shorter than Revan.
Still wish I bought the ones of Exar Kun, Ulic and Bastila before I stopped collecting.

Spoiler

 

[Sykar]

It could be worse. You could have made a shitty techno Darth Revan tribute, like this guy!

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

It could be worse. You could have made a shitty techno Darth Revan tribute, like this guy!

Hey, that's primo 2006 YouTube content you're shitting on!

 

[Sykar]

Well at least she used KotoR footage all throughout the video instead of playing as Luke Skywalker in Jedi Academy MP for 90% of the video time.

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

Well at least she used KotoR footage all throughout the video instead of playing as Luke Skywalker in Jedi Academy MP for 90% of the video time.

When you posted that, a KotOR video set to Evanescence's "Bring Me To Life" came to mind but it was nowhere to be found anymore. All those videos lost in time... like tears in rain.

 

[Sykar]

Well at least she used KotoR footage all throughout the video instead of playing as Luke Skywalker in Jedi Academy MP for 90% of the video time.

All those videos lost in time... like tears in rain.

I wish I could give a second rating for the Blade Runner reference:

Edit: I found one for Ruin umm Ryan Johnson's and Jew Je.... errr J.J. Abrams Star Wars shi... cough cough movie:

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

I wish I could give a second rating for the Blade Runner reference:

I wish I could give you a second rating if not for the...new and improved™ version:

 

[NecroLord]

A shame that instead of getting a proper Kotor 3(a direct continuation of Kotor 2 where it is established that the Exile went looking for Revan in the Unknown Regions) we got a trash MMORPG instead. The Old Republic...

 

[Atlantico]

MMOs were all the rage back then and EA is in it to make games to make money.

Fleece the dumb public. MMOs is the cancer that becomes the "metaverse". Rent your life, own virtual things and pay forever.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

MMO part and story part of swtor might as well be two separate games. The class story content is entirely free(free free, not free with strings attached) which is probably like ~50 hours of decent single player star wars rpg. This is what was available in the game at launch.
funny enough despite being EA, it also has one of the best monetization models in the market. You just pay $15 once and unlock all the content released up to that point forever. No separate expansions or anything.

If you liked Kotor and have free time to burn it's worth checking it out imo. Also, the sith agent class story doesn't deserve being held hostage in such a game, would be considered a classic if it was just a standalone game.