Vapourware Scam Citizen - Only people with too much money can become StarCitizens! WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW MORE?

[Grunker]

one side trying to discredit the other on the basis that they are speculating IS ABSOLUTELY RETARDED.

Yes. That would be yourself:

And you're doing that thing where you're not addressing what I've actually said, instead shifting the goalposts and falling back on "Well, you can't know yet"—which hasn't stopped you from leaping to PAY 2 WIN! conclusions, I note.

And you've done that several times. Please point to where I've done anything remotely similar to this. You've accused me and Dexter of speaking in the blind and making conclusions plenty of times, yet you do exactly the same. You and Dexter are the only ones here trying to discredit the opposition by pointing to their speculating.

Bah. There's no reason to continue that discussion. If you're not even a tiny bit critical of a positive comparison to one of the ultimately worst P2W-models ever, there's no way we'll find any sort of common ground.

I'm not skeptical because bringing up WoT as an example doesn't mean that this game will be a carbon copy of WoT's system

Nice strawman! Who the fuck ever said it would be? It's more than enough reason to be extremely sceptical, however.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

Gentleman, remember - facts before theory.

 

[Blaine]

Yes. That would be yourself:

No, it isn't. I am aware that both sides are speculative, and that sentence of mine makes no claim that my side isn't speculative.

Bah. There's no reason to continue that discussion.

That's true, since you won't be satisfied until I agree with your opinion to the extent that you feel is appropriate.

Dexter has dollar values to harp on and refuses to consider absolutely anything else (and that post confirmed that I won't be discussing this with him any further), while you've had a knee-jerk reaction to a name-drop, but again, little has changed except a worsening of your expectations due to the same issue.

 

[Grunker]

Gentleman, remember - facts before theory.

The only facts we have are these:

1) You can buy ships now.

2) You can buy credits ingame.

3) Chris said that it won't be Pay 2 Win.

4) Then he made a positive comparison to World of Tanks.

Now tell me - is the sane man a sceptic or an optimist based on those facts?

That's true, since you won't be satisfied until I agree with your opinion to the extent that you feel is appropriate.

I want you to admit the quote is worrysome. If you won't even do that, that's more than adequate evidence to me that our disagreements cannot be reconciled.

 

[Blaine]

The only fact we have is this:

1) You can buy ships now.

2) You can buy credits ingame.

3) Chris said that it won't be Pay 2 Win.

4) Then he made a positive comparison to World of Tanks.

Now tell me - is the sane man a sceptic or an optimist based on those facts?

If you choose to completely disregard anything not set in stone in a live game right this minute (descriptions of game mechanics and ship balance, for example), then we won't see eye-to-eye.

I want you to admit the quote is worrysome. If you won't even do that, that's more than adequate evidence to me that our disagreements cannot be reconciled.

And I want you to admit that he may not realize it's notoriously grindy for free players, and intentionally stacked against them (key point), preferably without tacking an Catch-22 insult onto the end, but I doubt that will happen.

If he knows exactly how World of Tanks works, then yes, it's worrisome... but even still, I'm not going to be as worried as you. After all, I can sell off my limited-quantity ships for not only a refund, but a profit.

 

[Blaine]

Grunker
It's been brought to my attention that Chris Roberts changed his mind about admiring World of Tanks' business model, specifically because of premium/imbalanced tanks, and said so on the livestream this weekend. I must have missed it.

It's all recorded, so I'll go find it now.

 

[Mortmal]

Grunker sums up the facts.. Even the nice chart you posted earlier blaine is just a guildeline, specs of those ships may change, i cant even tell wich will be faster in the list from i300 or drake . I am browsing the web quite a lot to find info on gameplay, but except that they are working on shields atm theres really no info. They are doing pretty ships, theres a lot of attention to details wich is a good thing and the main reason it make me less skeptical about the game but thats about all.

You have no idea how the matchmaking will be done, its an open space, so you zone in an area with your pals using hornets and a fully loaded idriss corvette with 6 ships in hangar for different purposes. In this area of space you get 10 hostiles players using aurora, how will it resolves ? are hornets considered the same tier as the aurora, will it match the idriss and hornets vs the noobs using aurora ? Will it stay on hold indefinitily till more players join the theater of action until theres an acceptable balance ?

Theres a few infos i gathered( http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/10/26/roberts-on-star-citizen-becoming-a-space-crime-lord/) . First he wants to simulate a real economy, the insurance will cost more if you go to dangerous systems , this guy played demon souls, not only world of tank, and he says that death means a penalty while not as punishing, its a significant penalty. Suddenly that life insurance thing is much more appreciable....

"you’re flying from planet A to planet B. Ben over here is flying from planet C to planet D. You two are going to intersect. He’s a pirate and you’re a merchant, so you’re in conflict. It creates an instance, which is dynamic and isn’t permanent, and puts you into it to resolve your conflict. It will allow other players to drop into it. You’ll have slots saved so that if you have friends and you’re under attack, you can send out to your friends and say, “Hey, I’m under attack! Anyone close by, come help me out!” They see that message pop up when they’re flying around and they can hit it."

Theres no mention of balancing, this sounds like a free for all, you and your friend will steam roll the opponents with inferior ships. Oh of course in a few months this may even out with everyone having access to the same ships, but at release not so much. Maybe in a few months he will also sell some extra packages to buy super capitals too, who knows, or less extreme, premium modules packs.

 

[Blaine]

That's it—I've had enough.

I don't particularly mind discussing the pay-to-win issue, but I do mind the debate garbaging up this thread and crowding out everything else. We've accumulated entire pages, dozens of posts, and many dozens of paragraphs—all directed at me and/or in response to comments I've made regarding pledge ships, the credits shop, and other subjects relating to pay-to-win concerns. I'm the magnet for most of this nonsense, and thus a good way to curb it is to stop participating.

The fun's over. Unless a mod wants to make a separate thread, I'll no longer be reading or responding to anything having to do with pay-to-win concerns. You can write your manifestos warning people how terrible the game will be, quibble with each other, et cetera, but I'm not going to add fuel to the fire anymore.

 

[TripJack]

Now tell me - is the sane man a sceptic or an optimist based on those facts?

the sane man is always a sceptic

 

[Overboard]

Leave Star Citizen alone!!!

Look what you guys have done, you rubbished his shitty logo and refused to stop posting facts about his favourite blatant cashgrab game concept. Now he's taken his ships and gone home.

 

[hiver]

- without a shadow of doubt.

 

[Grunker]

Leave Star Citizen alone!!!

Look what you guys have done, you rubbished his shitty logo and refused to stop posting facts about his favourite blatant cashgrab game concept. Now he's taken his ships and gone home.

I think Blaine is a boss for putting time and effort into a Codex Squad.

That said:

The fun's over. Unless a mod wants to make a separate thread, I'll no longer be reading or responding to anything having to do with pay-to-win concerns. You can write your manifestos warning people how terrible the game will be, quibble with each other, et cetera, but I'm not going to add fuel to the fire anymore.

Get off your high horse man. The Codex doesn't split or move shit just because new discussions arise. If don't want to contribute to a discussion, stop posting about it. Throwing a hissy-fit is only going to invite trolls like the above - it certainly want warm up legitimate posters to your stance.

 

[Disgruntled]

Interesting livestream
I was looking forward to seeing the full Freelancer brochure and upgrades but I guess they're still working on it; which gives me hope the design is made more appealing.
Not much else grabbed me by the purse strings. The avenger seemed meh and while im interested in a Starfarer/Retaliator, the prices are a bit too high.
$10-30 for a fancier Freelancer is enough for now.

Heard there will be something on the economy on monday. That might clear up a few controversies.
Im not all in with the project but ive seen enough potential to take a chance.

 

[hiver]

Whats the cheapest pledge to get the game now?

 

[Grunker]

Whats the cheapest pledge to get the game now?

Swear alliegance to the Codex Squad and bribe uncle Blaine for one of his early bird copies (20$, correct?)

 

[hiver]

Whats the Roberts stance on DRM then?

 

[Mortmal]

He can throw a tantrum if he wish, i never intented to target him, he do what he wants with his cash,its similar to some eve players buying plex and pvping in full officer fitted faction ships, fine . But dont bullshit me its clearly gearing into a pay to win . When you read RSI forums all we have are wild speculations about the game based on what the developpers said in interviews, the infos he posted in the thread are about as much reliable .

One exemple , some dev said yesterday than the drake cutlass was a cheap easily replaceable pirate ship, now a few guys on the forum are moaning and lamenting that their 110$ ship is a junk ship and are reclaiming their package to get something else, just for a dev comment that might be an " in lore " comment .

I read they are puttting a sale soon for a new even more expensive ship than the idriss , a destroyer ! They would be stupid not to do so since yesterday 150 idriss corvettes were sold in 9 min . How much will it be ? 2500, more ? Thats insane the amount some are willing to put to crush in game, again dont bullshit me its not to give good chris robert money and make an even better game, its for priviledges and crushing noob skulls . Oh the humanity as he said...

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Whats the cheapest pledge to get the game now?

Swear alliegance to the Codex Squad and bribe uncle Blaine for one of his early bird copies (20$, correct?)

Can't remember, but do those $20 copies have the Wing Commander-like, the Freelancer/Privateer-like, and the Eve-like all included? Got it in my head that you have to spend more to get the whole thing but I'm not actually sure.

 

[J_C]

Whats the cheapest pledge to get the game now?

Swear alliegance to the Codex Squad and bribe uncle Blaine for one of his early bird copies (20$, correct?)

Can't remember, but do those $20 copies have the Wing Commander-like, the Freelancer/Privateer-like, and the Eve-like all included? Got it in my head that you have to spend more to get the whole thing but I'm not actually sure.

IIRC the pledges are for different ships, you get all game modes anyway.

 

[Grunker]

^ pretty sure J_C is correct. Again Blaine can confirm.

 

[Blaine]

The cheapest package that includes Squadron 42, user-hosted mod-able multiplayer, Star Citizen, alpha access and so on costs $35, according to my options in the Pledge tab.

 

[Drakron]

... but they changed and in the case of this game extremely sharply since it changed development studios mid-development and all previous work was thrown away.

Wrong.

What you are seeing is conceptual art, Cryptic had to do everything from the ground up (part of why the game is such a big mess) since that was the only thing they inherited.
And it did not changed development studios mid-development exactly, Perpetual bankrupt and Cryptic pick it up ... with no actual development to show for outside concept art.

 

[Blaine]

Oh, fuck.

Well, now I have someone else to hate, so this is good news in a way.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

Shoot at sight?

 

[Blaine]

Shoot at sight?

Of course. That's not the half of it, though: