Vapourware Scam Citizen - Only people with too much money can become StarCitizens! WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW MORE?

[hiver]

Blaine

I know. Annoying trope.

All together, Spaceships should only dock to orbital stations, not land on planets themselves.
If the rest of the game is good it will be tolerable.

Are there going to be any moding tools?

 

[Blaine]

Only problem (If everything works and is fun that is) is who knows how long it'll take to reach a ship that can handle multiple people in-game without preordering.

For shit like that we have Blaine.

Yeah, I have:

• Roberts Space Industries Constellation [Long-range Mercantile/Space Superiority/extremely customizable] — crew of 4 (pilot, two gunners, berthed snub fighter pilot/other)
• Aegis Dynamics Retaliator [Strategic Bomber/jump-capable] — crew of 6 (presumably pilot, five weapons officers/turret operators)
• Aegis Dynamics Idris-class Corvette [Light Capital/"pocket carrier"/good for boarding actions] — crew of 9-12 (captain, various station operators, up to three fighter pilots)

Are there going to be any moding tools?

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/101-engineering-manual-for-modders

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

I wonder if we can get enough people to fully man the Idris.

 

[hiver]

http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/21/4453530/first-look-at-star-citizens-bmw-spaceship-the-300i

Roberts is not a monster.The gamer within him has more sway than the ad-man or even the industrial designer.
You can have the 300i, if you are prepared to work for it. Nothing is sold in Star Citizen that cannot be earned. Not only that, but all spaceships, ultimately, get the player from A to B.
Players can get by with just an Aurora, if they wish. Everything else is a personal choice.

-

"There's no ship that's like a 90-level character that's always going to kill a 7-level character," said Roberts. "There's always an element of skill. The ships are very rock-paper-scissors. There's a lot of customization and there's always trade-offs. Is my ship set up for combat or trading or long range scanners for exploration? So there are trades and balances. It's up to the players to choose their play style and how they want to configure it."

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/101-engineering-manual-for-modders

o_O ... 20$?

 

[Blaine]

It's a fucking hardback physical book they've got to have printed and then mail it out to you, are you fucking stupid?

There'll be a digital version for free.

 

[Blaine]

Looks like 4chan is "raiding" the livestream:

 

[Mortmal]

I really don't get the masturbation over the most obviously Pay2Win game in the fucking universe.
Buy virtual ships for $300? What the fuck and why are people jerking off over this and happily lining this assholes pockets?
What am I missing? This seems worse than Hat Simulator 2 in any way, at least there it barely has gameplay influence.

Its a matter of blind faith, this guy created wing commander , back then we spent easily the equivalent of 2000 of todays euros of hardware just to play origin games, wing commander 1-2 strike commander and the ultima required a beefy pc .Those games were the greatest of their time and theres still nothing similar 20 years later.
Like classic rpgs there's no more space sim and space operas , lately ive played x3 , years ago freelancer and thats about it .
Hes kind of some gaming guru and adepts are more than happy to give their hard earned cash to fullfill the vision.

Right now those ships sales give a big advantage, if he copy the eve online system, its the lifte time insurance . Even if you dont get to keep the modules its lot of money saved.IF its a good game, and a competitive pvp mmo, it may be money well spent

 

[hiver]

suck an elephant dick,

i dont see any free digital versions on that page. I was commenting what i was seeing - if you dont fucking mind, asswipe.
-

 

[Blaine]

suck an elephant dick,

i dont see any free digital versions on that page. I was commenting what i was seeing - if you dont fucking mind, asswipe.
-

I'm just yanking your chain, but if you'd looked a little closer you'd have seen it's a physical add-on.

 

[hiver]

You are, yes.

Good of you to state it so clearly
Are you going to cry too, hemorrhoid?


- the bloody point is that the bloody physical copy is all thats bloody there - costing nice big 20 bucks - and the smiley :beatingdeadhorse: primary meaning was that im out of money currently, ffs...

- not that i would ever pay a fucking cent for moding fucking manual anyway -

U tri pičke materine... koji jebeni putalj.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

With that Dumbfuck tag you are at a bit of a disadvantage.

 

[warpig]

Roberts is not a monster.The gamer within him has more sway than the ad-man or even the industrial designer.
You can have the 300i, if you are prepared to work for it. Nothing is sold in Star Citizen that cannot be earned. Not only that, but all spaceships, ultimately, get the player from A to B.

So you can buy all these cool ships with in-game money? Doesn't sound all that bad, but everything depends on the grind/tedious shit to fun ratio. I'd prefer a normal game that you just buy and play to have fun. I mean, there was no grinding or buying shit with RL moneyz in Quake and it was fun as fuck.
I lost track on all that Star Citizen stuff. But they did not turn it into a free to play game, right? Just hope that at least single player will be a proper campaign not some shitty glorified tutorial.

And yeah, that new ship is very sexy <3. Imo it looks better and much more "real" than all that Star Wars or BSG crap.

 

[Szioul]

Apparently Brian Fargo will be making an appearance on the livestream at some point.

Edit: In 10mins apparently.

 

[Dexter]

That settles it. As I thought, it is not pay2win. It would be pay to win, if you could by better equipment, which are not available for purchase for ingame money. By buying a ship with real money, you get a short term adventage in PVP after release, but that's it.

Pay2Win is when specific players gain an advantage over everyone else by paying money, I do believe buying stronger ships very much qualifies.

Assuming it is possible to unlock them or “buy” them in game, albeit some of the strongest and most expensive ships seemed to be “Backer Exclusive” on the higher tiers, there will be an excruciating grind equal to the amount of money people have paid tied to it and “backers” will still have the insurance situation thing which puts us back on Pay2Win.

A simple fact for now is that nobody will exactly know how it will work till the game releases, saying “It’s not Pay2Win” without even playing it first in light/despite of the most obvious and large amount of evidence pointing towards that (Being able to pay anything from $25 to $250+ dollars for “virtual ships”).

There’s already talk about ships with different weapons systems, dozens of player crew and NPCs and whatnot, just see your very own brainwashed Blaine talking about them further above and you are trying to tell me that a game with this type of a payment structure won’t be “Pay2Win”? Which games with a similar payment plan did you see that didn’t end up being such so far?

Most good F2P games use only cosmetics and let everything else be fair play e.g. see League of Legends, Awesomenauts, even to the largest extent Hat Fortress 2.
The less awesome games are the ones where you can gain the same things you can buy through gameplay but the gains are largely just alternative weapons or play styles but don't offer hard noticeable gameplay advantages/disadvantages (like in say Tribes: Ascend) and it does only circumvent a few (dozen) hours of gameplay.
The even less awesome variant or nearing exploitative ones are those where you have to grind for months for something and stuff you buy for real money gives you an obvious advantage over the other players e.g. Bonus damage, better items/equipment etc. like Planetside 2 or APB
It gets ever more ridiculous the more it builds on that and when free players can’t even use certain items and have many restrictions in regards to paying ones like say Star Wars: ToR, Age of Empires Online, Battlefield Heroes, World of Tanks and all those Social Gaming games and cow clickers.

Star Citizen is resting somewhere at the lower end of that spectrum with the cow clickers.

Seeing as the ships seem to have more features and are better the higher priced they are I don’t see how you can even start arguing this won’t be the case in the first place. One of two things will happen, either it is indeed a “fair playing field” and/or they will easily be acquirable within the game at which point the people putting out hundreds and thousands of dollars will ask themselves what they put out the money for in the first place or it isn’t and they will have an advantage over everybody else and for everyone else it will be an insufferable month- or year long grind to even be able to try and gain on those people.

Everything else is just justifying it to yourself how you’ve spent hundreds of dollars for virtual currency and items that don't even exist yet. At this point someone like Blaine is so far invested in the game that he wouldn’t say something bad about it even if it would stare (or hit) him right in the face.
All I’m seeing is a bunch of people and raging fanatics using that justification because “they want to believe”.

It’s making it all the more fucking ridiculous how everyone put out all this money into virtual ships before the fucking game is even finished and they ACTUALLY KNOW how the game systems will work, if it ends up being any fun or how exploitative it’ll end up being instead of defending it on the basis of “developer said it won’t be Pay2Win”, just lol
If you want to invest thousands of dollars into a cow clicker or a card game I'll think you are retarded all the same and in some cases I'm hoping for government intervention: http://www.serkantoto.com/2012/05/18/gacha-regulation-official/ but at least you'll know the results of what you are doing and what you're getting.

As far as I can tell, this is the most blatantly Pay2Win and exploitative set-up for a game that I’ve ever seen so far (maybe short of Molyneux’s Curiosity, but almost nobody fell for that) and it doesn’t even use Microtransactions, more like Macrotransactions.

I was very excited about the game at first too and might have even pledged a bunch after seeing a few of the videos due to blind faith if their site didn’t go down in the first few days, but fortunately my critical thinking faculties set in at some point after that saying “Wait a moment, this asshole has based his entire game on a Pre-Purchase cash shop and is trying to trick a large amount of gullible people into buying the most expensive and awesome-est looking virtual ships before the game is even out, they know how they work and it'll work and I’m supposed to trust this guy? This is the type of shit even EA hasn't managed or thought of pulling yet. They've Pre-sold the games, they've pre-sold what they call "DLC" months before a games release but they haven't had the ingenious idea of starting to sell cash shop items years before a specific game was even out.”
Starting from that premise his "assurances" at the moment mean fuck all.

 

[Blaine]

Assuming it is possible to unlock them or “buy” them in game...

I find it interesting that you know so much about this game and its revenue model, yet must still make assumptions about basic information. There is no "assume"—it's been confirmed in no uncertain terms that absolutely every single ship hull sold to backers will be available to purchase for in-game credits, with the sole exception of the Vanduul fighter, which can be captured instead.

...albeit some of the strongest and most expensive ships seemed to be “Backer Exclusive” on the higher tiers...

No, none of them are "backer exclusive."

...there will be an excruciating grind equal to the amount of money people have paid tied to it and “backers” will still have the insurance situation thing which puts us back on Pay2Win.

I can just as easily say that there will not be an excruciating grind.

...and “backers” will still have the insurance situation thing which puts us back on Pay2Win.

You mean the insurance that idiots such as yourself still don't understand, and which all players will be able to afford in-game for a pittance? Lifetime Insurance simply waives that small fee, "regular" insurance otherwise functions identically.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/12986-Lifetime-Insurance-Clarification

A simple fact for now is that nobody will exactly know how it will work till the game releases, saying “It’s not Pay2Win” without even playing it first...

Regardless of evidence for or against (and there is plenty against, whether you choose to disregard it or not), saying "it's Pay2Win" without playing it first is equally speculative.

And it gets ever more ridiculous the more it builds on that when free players can’t even use certain items and have many restrictions like say Star Wars: ToR, Age of Empires Online, Battlefield Heroes, World of Tanks and all those Social Gaming games and cow clickers. ... Seeing as the ships seem to have more features and are better the higher priced they are I don’t see how you can even start arguing this won’t be the case in the first place.

Pledge ships are ship hulls with no upgrades, no fuel, and only basic stock weapons. All upgrades must be purchased in-game.

Larger ships aren't just straight-up "better" as you assume. Each player can only fly or crew one ship at a time, and his skill is a major deciding factor. For larger ships, you'll need multiple players/hired NPCs. Larger ships cost more to buy, they take more manpower to operate, they're more expensive to fuel, repair and maintain, and they're more expensive to buy upgrades for.

Do you want only single-seat fighters with the exact same weapon loadout in this game? I don't. There are tradeoffs, checks and balances, and ship roles with a rock-paper-scissors-esque character.

 

[AstroZombie]

Brian Fargo time

 

[mikaelis]

Blaine, I am pledging in the next few days and was wondering about those i3xx packages. I am hesitating between i300 and i315 right now. So any idea about the difference other than long range engines and tractor beam? Will i315 have reduced hull resistance or weapon power in comparison to i300 which seems to be the base ship from this category? Or is it unknown at this point?

EDIT::
Hmmm, looks like you cannot pledge for i300 package anymore. There's only i315 (explorer), i325 (fighter) and i350 (racer)

EDIT2::
Or, I guess there is no i300. More like they announced that there will be three sub-classes within i300 class, no?

EDIT3::
Nah, there is still i300 for £55 as a ship-only option (but not the package with SP game and other goodies). WTF did they do?!?!

 

[Blaine]

Blaine, I am pledging in the next few days and was wondering about those i3xx packages. I am hesitating between i300 and i315 right now. So any idea about the difference other than long range engines and tractor beam? Will i315 have reduced hull resistance or weapon power in comparison to i300 which seems to be the base ship from this category? Or is it unknown at this point?

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2821399/300series_brochure.pdf

The 300i base model should still be purchasable. It may be a display bug on the new site, which was just implemented midday today.

The 300i is an armed luxury touring craft, the 325a is more heavily armed and armored and is a fighter variant, the 350r is the racing variant with more/better engines and power plant, and the 315i (the one you're interested in) has a more efficient power plant for longer range, plus an advanced sensor package for exploration.

By the way, I can purchase packages at the original prices and with LTI on your behalf up until the end of November (packages bought before July 6 also get LTI, so you'll be fine going ahead and getting your own before then).

 

[Szioul]

I think you'll be able to put in bought modules on the standard 300i, to make it the same as the 315 and 325. 350r has a different hull though.

 

[Blaine]

I think you'll be able to put in bought modules on the standard 300i, to make it the same as the 315 and 325. 350r has a different hull though.

That's correct.

 

[Blaine]

Banu (one of the alien races) first look:

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/engineering/13106-Banu-Reveal

 

[mikaelis]

Many thanks for .pdf. That clears most of the things. Would be great if some more info were disclosed about the engines and shields. E.g., what is the difference between each engine (they are all different for each ship, though I can assume it is about the type of "petrol" and how fast you will use it) and also what's the difference between Gorgon AllStop and Gorgon Forcewall shields, especially in comparison to some corvette class and even heavier ones (like in X-series, for example, where they are rated in MJoules)

Anyway, I'll have some sleep and decide which one to take: i315 or maybe i325 fighter. Or the basic Aurora if I stay reluctant to MMO component.

But, I must say, after seeing some of those brochures and general attention to details and so on, I am getting more and more hyped.

 

[hiver]

I see no problem with playing the game to earn or otherwise get better ships. Quite the contrary.

Instead of hypothetical "dull grinding" some imagine - ill be doing missions, cargo runs, group based escorts or attacks. Exploring ship graveyards, maybe risking jumping to Tiber and doing a speed run. Boarding other ships is available as a game mechanic- so bigger ships could be boarded and captured - there are pirates, law, factions and star systems to explore, Vanduul scythes to capture and so many nice pledge ships to steal from these fanbois.

- Plus the SP story to play through.

I wont buy ships -im gonna steal em.
and if i get some good hours out of it - all the better.

If the game doesnt play like that then i wont play it. Plenty time left to see how it will shape up.

 

[Blaine]

Livestream highlights:

 

[Blaine]

New Jump Point today, here are all seven:

Jump Point Issue 1: Mayan End of the World Edition
Jump Point Issue 2: Last Flight of the Seraphim
Jump Point Issue 3: Flying Into a Hornet's Nest
Jump Point Issue 4: The Vanduul Horde
Jump Point Issue 5: Aurora First Light
Jump Point Issue 6: Charting the Constellation
Jump Point Issue 7: The Next Generation is Now