Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker Builds and Strats Thread

[J1M]

The "it's slightly different, so it should stack" argument is a little weird. It's like saying that a +4 enhancement bonus and a +6 enhancement bonus are slightly different so they should stack.

There's also the matter that Canny Defense isn't really acting like a feat, it's acting more like a caster level or similar in that you have 5 stacks of it at level 5 in that class.

Allow me to highlight how badly this needs an errata by being truly pedantic:

Canny Defense (Ex)
At 1st level, when a kensai is wielding his chosen weapon, he gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name, save that his chosen weapon may be of any type.

Canny Defense (Ex)
When wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, a duelist adds 1 point of Intelligence bonus (if any) per duelist class level as a dodge bonus to her Armor Class while wielding a melee weapon. If a duelist is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied her Dexterity bonus, she also loses this bonus.

So according to the Rules As Written, all the Kensai version does is allow you to use your Kensai weapon when counting your Duelist levels towards a dodge bonus. If you don't have any Duelist levels, your Kensai shouldn't be seeing an AC boost.

 

[Yosharian]

The "it's slightly different, so it should stack" argument is a little weird. It's like saying that a +4 enhancement bonus and a +6 enhancement bonus are slightly different so they should stack.

There's also the matter that Canny Defense isn't really acting like a feat, it's acting more like a caster level or similar in that you have 5 stacks of it at level 5 in that class.

Allow me to highlight how badly this needs an errata by being truly pedantic:

Canny Defense (Ex)
At 1st level, when a kensai is wielding his chosen weapon, he gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name, save that his chosen weapon may be of any type.

Canny Defense (Ex)
When wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, a duelist adds 1 point of Intelligence bonus (if any) per duelist class level as a dodge bonus to her Armor Class while wielding a melee weapon. If a duelist is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied her Dexterity bonus, she also loses this bonus.

So according to the Rules As Written, all the Kensai version does is allow you to use your Kensai weapon when counting your Duelist levels towards a dodge bonus. If you don't have any Duelist levels, your Kensai shouldn't be seeing an AC boost.

 

[Cael]

The "it's slightly different, so it should stack" argument is a little weird. It's like saying that a +4 enhancement bonus and a +6 enhancement bonus are slightly different so they should stack.

There's also the matter that Canny Defense isn't really acting like a feat, it's acting more like a caster level or similar in that you have 5 stacks of it at level 5 in that class.

Allow me to highlight how badly this needs an errata by being truly pedantic:

Canny Defense (Ex)
At 1st level, when a kensai is wielding his chosen weapon, he gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name, save that his chosen weapon may be of any type.

Canny Defense (Ex)
When wearing light or no armor and not using a shield, a duelist adds 1 point of Intelligence bonus (if any) per duelist class level as a dodge bonus to her Armor Class while wielding a melee weapon. If a duelist is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied her Dexterity bonus, she also loses this bonus.

So according to the Rules As Written, all the Kensai version does is allow you to use your Kensai weapon when counting your Duelist levels towards a dodge bonus. If you don't have any Duelist levels, your Kensai shouldn't be seeing an AC boost.

Lol! That is pretty bad. Someone just lazily referred to the Duellist class (a 3.5 PrC straight from the DMG, by the way). There are good reasons to always write out everything, and one of them is plain to see here.

Paizo, ladies and gents.

rofls!

By the way, enhancement bonus don't stack. That is part of the same type of bonus don't stack rule. Uncanny Defence is typeless as far as I can see, and those most definitely stack.

 

[hell bovine]

But for once my build feels somewhat alright: hits like a truck and it's hard to get hit.

Meanwhile a level one smilodon gets five attacks per round, apparently. Should've gone summoner.

 

[Shadenuat]

Not to mention he's gonna be molested by every dryad and nymph and their ilk with charms, hold persons etc. That is why that pally 2 dip is always worth it

Fey which really matter have about DC30+ permanent bewildering aura, at levels you can first meet them it doesn't matter how high your saves are really, you'll have to change tactic anyway.

 

[toro]

But for once my build feels somewhat alright: hits like a truck and it's hard to get hit.

Meanwhile a level one smilodon gets five attacks per round, apparently. Should've gone summoner.

That's why Harrim exists

That one or Monster Tactician.

 

[vazha]

Not to mention he's gonna be molested by every dryad and nymph and their ilk with charms, hold persons etc. That is why that pally 2 dip is always worth it

Fey which really matter have about DC30+ permanent bewildering aura, at levels you can first meet them it doesn't matter how high your saves are really, you'll have to change tactic anyway.

It took me about 15 save loads to take out that lowly dryad at bald hilltop with a melee heavy party. everybody was either laughing their ass off or held. Trve story.

 

[Fedora Master]

Is there any downside to using Heightened spells in place of regular ones?

 

[santino27]

Can anyone tell me how sneak attacks work in this game? Is flanking the only requirement? What if you're under the effect of greater invisibility? Do all attacks get the bonus damage or just the first one? What if you're a spellcaster? Does it apply to melee and ranged touch spells? If so, how do spells like Scorching Ray work? Do you get a sneak attack bonus on each ray or just the first one that hits?

Great Invis. allows you to sneak attack as long as it lasts, provided enemies don't have something like true sight.
All attacks get the sneak attack bonus including shield bash, nice when dual wielding.
Spell casting is kinda weird, I'm not sure it's supposed to apply but a 1 vivisectionist/9 eldritch archer/10 arcane trickster using Scorching Ray does sneak attack on with each ray AND the bow attack. Dunno if AoE spells apply sneak attacks.

The game applies sneak attack for ranged touch spells, which is why it works for scorching ray. AOE spells will not get sneak attack.

Does the Arcane Trickster stance apply Sneak Attack to your AoEs?

My AT isn't level 10 yet, but it looks like they did implement surprise spell, so assuming it's working... I'd say yes. That should only apply to flat-footed though, whereas sneak attack on ranged touch spells applies to flanked as well.

 

[Shadenuat]

It took me about 15 save loads to take out that lowly dryad at bald hilltop with a melee heavy party. everybody was either laughing their ass off or held. Trve story.

You want fun, I recommend Rill-And-Spill. This location is now not bugged and features a great enemy who loves to point her Dominate on everyone.

After my first win I had Nok-Nok rush to my main and crit her for 60 damage instantly killing her. Good times.

 

[Cael]

Not to mention he's gonna be molested by every dryad and nymph and their ilk with charms, hold persons etc. That is why that pally 2 dip is always worth it

Fey which really matter have about DC30+ permanent bewildering aura, at levels you can first meet them it doesn't matter how high your saves are really, you'll have to change tactic anyway.

It took me about 15 save loads to take out that lowly dryad at bald hilltop with a melee heavy party. everybody was either laughing their ass off or held. Trve story.

Protection from <<Alignment>> helps with the Dominate and Charms. Can't remember off the top of my head if it helps vs laughter. Protection from X really should be a staple of any low level party, but most people underestimate them.

 

[Shadenuat]

Not in this game it doesn't.

Level 8 Cleric spells should, but monsters seem to aptly ignore them anyway.

In fact, is there any version of Chaotic Commands in this game? I seen all Cleric spells up to level 8 and I never found anything which could counter shit Fey bombard you with (automatic Bewildering Aura, Dominate, Confusion, etc.); Free Action against Wild Hunt doesn't count. Maybe I missed a scroll or an Inquisitor lithany or something.

I guess 5th level Spell Resistance is best we get until level 8 Shield of Law (and that shit seems to be bugged). But they can probably Overcome it.

Well, all the more reasons for that +2 infinite cold iron arrows quiver to exist. Nothing escapes the Arrow of Wakanda.

 

[Cael]

Not in this game it doesn't.

Artificial difficulty inflation caused by dropped or missing features coupled with stat and HD bloat... Masochists.

 

[Cael]

Owlcat should make it so that compulsion spells do not work on things with Int < 3.

"I compel you to shoot that guy!"
"Duh! Shoo-ooot??"
"Kill him!"
"He no hurt me."
"Just do it!"
"Doo eettt? O-ke!" *starts dancing* "You gotta do it, do it! You gotta do it, do it!"
"No! That's move it, move it, you imbeci- Oh gods, now he's got me doing it!" *caster has lost 2 Int; next time pick on someone your own (mental) size*

On a more serious note, it means Feeblemind has a secondary usage :D

 

[Shadenuat]

Mass mind blank it is then

Too bad Octavia chose Abjuration as her opposition school huh! and they say Valerie is a dumb one

 

[Reinhardt]

you'll have to change tactic anyway.

Like MORE paladins levels?

 

[Yosharian]

Mass mind blank it is then

Mind Blank grants a +8 resistance bonus against mind-affecting spells. This is the same bonus that a ring of resistance gives. You'll most likely find some of those. So don't expect miracles from that spell.

 

[vazha]

So effectively a relatively high will save is a must for a fighter. Fortitude you'll most likely have, reflex you can somewhat mitigate through freedom of movement, immunities and spell resistance, but will is a game-changer.

 

[Cael]

So effectively a relatively high will save is a must for a fighter. Fortitude you'll most likely have, reflex you can somewhat mitigate through freedom of movement, immunities and spell resistance, but will is a game-changer.

Will had always been a game-changer. You hit the other side's best fighter with a Dominate and it's all over if he fails the save.

That is why in PnP play, one of the first things you want to get is a permanent Protection from Evil item and graft it on to your melee party member. If he resists, knock him out then weld it to the inside of his cranium.

Let me put it this way: You want that black superman with the outlandish point buy and optimised feats and equipment that fires entire forests every round to be on their side???

 

[Reinhardt]

You want that black superman with the outlandish point buy and optimised feats and equipment that fires entire forests every round to be on their side???

My fighter can kill him in two hits. Now if she fail will save...

 

[Cael]

You want that black superman with the outlandish point buy and optimised feats and equipment that fires entire forests every round to be on their side???

My fighter can kill him in two hits. Now if she fail will save...

She will be the next target after the Paizo Gary Stu, and you know it :D

 

[hell bovine]

But for once my build feels somewhat alright: hits like a truck and it's hard to get hit.

Meanwhile a level one smilodon gets five attacks per round, apparently. Should've gone summoner.

That's why Harrim exists

That one or Monster Tactician.

Harrim is fine as a grumpy doom & gloom cleric, so it'd have to be a custom hireling.
Though I'd rather make a custom fighter and have the main character as the summoner, because a) higher persuasion, and b) Valerie, ugh.

 

[Cael]

Is there any downside to using Heightened spells in place of regular ones?

It takes up a higher level spell slot. For example, a Fireball Heightened to a 4th level spell takes up a 4th level slot, not a 3rd level one. However, everything else remains the same (max damage cap, etc.).

Heighten is useful for penetrating things like Globe of Invulnerability, increasing spell DC (it is a 4th level spell, so DC is 14+casting stat bonus for that Fireball example) and for certain PrC qualifying shenannigans, but other than that, not really.

 

[toro]

Not to mention he's gonna be molested by every dryad and nymph and their ilk with charms, hold persons etc. That is why that pally 2 dip is always worth it

Fey which really matter have about DC30+ permanent bewildering aura, at levels you can first meet them it doesn't matter how high your saves are really, you'll have to change tactic anyway.

It took me about 15 save loads to take out that lowly dryad at bald hilltop with a melee heavy party. everybody was either laughing their ass off or held. Trve story.

If you are referring to the insane dryad then I can tell you that she went down in like 3 turns. The only issue was that she cast some rock entanglement but it was too late for her. I can live with this kind of outcome.

 

[toro]

But for once my build feels somewhat alright: hits like a truck and it's hard to get hit.

Meanwhile a level one smilodon gets five attacks per round, apparently. Should've gone summoner.

That's why Harrim exists

That one or Monster Tactician.

Harrim is fine as a grumpy doom & gloom cleric, so it'd have to be a custom hireling.
Though I'd rather make a custom fighter and have the main character as the summoner, because a) higher persuasion, and b) Valerie, ugh.

We agree to disagree.

Harrim sucks balls as a pure cleric and because of his high WIS it's better to multi-class him to Druid, Ranger or Inquisitor.