Dota 2 Discussion (~Boston Majors & Road to TI7~)

[meh]

About right now. Currently, there are at least 8 codexers online now, we could make that 5x5.

 

[Cromwell]

no time at the moment. where do I have to join in the future to look for the codex dota anonymus?

 

[Cyberarmy]

Some new info about incoming patches, heroes with a mean Half Life 3 joke... New sets are pretty ugly...

http://www.cyborgmatt.com/2013/04/dota-2-24th-april/

 

[Demnogonis Saastuttaja]

Yo, I'm trying to learn this game but information is scattered over the internet as usual. I heard some good things of it, about possible different comps and variety in heroes so I decided to see if there's something worthwhile here compared to LoL. I like the labyrinthine map a lot more at least and the varied jungle.

So I got my first win ever with Skeleton King, probably because he has no skills, you just thwack at things, we killed our opponents early on as they just charged in at level 3, went 6/0/15. Other games not so well, I played Outworld Destroyer against Life Stealer and he just kept killing me over and over.

What's a reasonable thing to do at this point, just try out every hero to see what they all do?

 

[Kane]

What's a reasonable thing to do at this point

don't.

 

[subotaiy]

Just play 1 or 2 heroes of each type until you familiarize yourself with the mechanics.
And raw shows again his shitty taste in games.

 

[Humppaleka]

@Demnogogis Saastuttaja you should come play with the glorious codex squad to A) piss everyone off and B) learn the basics while messing matchmaking up completely. There's me, Malakal, meh Merk and other assorted gentlemen.

 

[Merkwürdigliebe]

Yo, I'm trying to learn this game but information is scattered over the internet as usual. I heard some good things of it, about possible different comps and variety in heroes so I decided to see if there's something worthwhile here compared to LoL. I like the labyrinthine map a lot more at least and the varied jungle.

So I got my first win ever with Skeleton King, probably because he has no skills, you just thwack at things, we killed our opponents early on as they just charged in at level 3, went 6/0/15. Other games not so well, I played Outworld Destroyer against Life Stealer and he just kept killing me over and over.

What's a reasonable thing to do at this point, just try out every hero to see what they all do?

Here read This, it covers the basics fairly well.

 

[MetalCraze]

Dota has the worst community that makes CoD kids look like MIT graduates in comparison. So many retards that have no common sense and fuck the rest of the team.
I had 3 games in a row yesterday where people playing as Venomancers were constantly trying to carry with obvious outcomes, feeding the opposing team which means that there is some correlation between people picking Venoms and people being retards. So if you see a dude pick Venom your game is probably GG before it even began.

Also I prolly raged a bit during one of those games where retard was going "dis is my first game as this char!!1" and then dying 20-25 times by rushing 1 vs 5 and my account was flagged as disruptive, can't call people feeders for a day now

 

[Kane]

venomancer is just a shitty hero - so yeah your theory isn't too far off.

i read about that flagging dumbshit and holla is there some hitler working at valve.

 

[Damned Registrations]

? Venomancer is a great hero. He's just not useful for scrubs that don't appreciate things like lane control, map control, dewarding or anything but getting kills.

 

[Zed]

veno isn't that great after gale nerf.

 

[Kane]

? Venomancer is a great hero. He's just not useful for scrubs that don't appreciate things like lane control, map control, dewarding or anything but getting kills.

no stun, no escape, no utility, no hp pool, no damage

thing is shit unless enemies are a bunch of idiots and you can farm scepter in 15 minutes.

oh wait, that's already "proper gameplay" in dota 2.

 

[Damned Registrations]

veno isn't that great after gale nerf.

My bad, haven't played in a while. He'd be pretty lackluster if gale got nerfed too hard.

Wards are still amazing utility though. Of course anyone who thinks you should farm a sceptre on him wouldn't be able to recognize that.

 

[Castanova]

I'd be up for a Codex inhouse game. I'm in the US though so I would imagine the timezone would present a problem for most of you.

 

[MetalCraze]

How to own at your noob tier when you are new to the game

1. Pick/draft Ursa
2. Get Vladimir
3. Own all retards who dare to blindly charge you (most of them)

 

[Demnogonis Saastuttaja]

Heh. I'm still trying to learn various heroes... Thus far I dig Skeleton King, Ursa, Sven, Pugna and Undying. Especially Undying really. Don't understand almost anything about the game though, like about compositions or what is everybody supposed to even do since there's no clear cut top/mid/jungle/duo bot meta. Or what to level and when, too much choice, I'll just level strenght and Q as Sven because strength seems a good stat.

 

[Cromwell]

clear cut top/mid/jungle/duo bot meta.

what does that mean?

 

[MetalCraze]

Playing on the same tier with Ormagoedden and Zed vs. pros pays off

Heh. I'm still trying to learn various heroes... Thus far I dig Skeleton King, Ursa, Sven, Pugna and Undying. Especially Undying really. Don't understand almost anything about the game though, like about compositions or what is everybody supposed to even do since there's no clear cut top/mid/jungle/duo bot meta. Or what to level and when, too much choice, I'll just level strenght and Q as Sven because strength seems a good stat.

Go with recommended build first. It usually works well enough. Just remember to buy items by parts whenever you have money. So you won't lose them when you die. It's a mistake I've made for the first 7 or 8 games.

The most important thing to do at the start is to pick your lane. For example if you are not a middle-laner (this is usually a char with a very high-dmg output and long range attacks - examples: drow, viper, pudge, sniper etc) and your items are highly dependent on components from secret shop (my viper above is a good example) pick a lane with a secret shop. Since sending courier option may be slower / not always available.

If you are playing support chars (like mages) it is important to buy courier and wards since carries and pushers need all the money for their items as they are the main force behind your victory. A LOT of newbies never buy courier and wards and it's a huge mistake. Because observer wards will show you if you are about to be ganked and sentry wards reveal invisible units (these let you rape the fuck out of Riki for example - since without his stealth he's pretty shit). Noob tier NEVER wards and so if you will take your time to ward jungles and runes with observer wards and lanes with invisibility-relying chars like Riki and Weaver with sentry wards - it's almost a guaranteed win for you.
Again noobs often disregard the power of support chars - and having them vs. not having them makes all the difference.

(my top3 winning char is support - Disruptor)

Of course the best way to learn is to play on "high difficulty" - as in join Dex party (although Codex is often really shit at teamwork) and play vs lvl 30+ players as a support. It will be hard at first but it's the way you'll learn about all the best warding spots and plus you'll support the carries of better players.

 

[Merkwürdigliebe]

Those item builds.

Mom, midas radiance kunkka?! The fuck is tree trying to make? Shadow blade? Seriously? Drow, I don't even. Is that doom trying to make a vlads and not even completing it by 40 mins? Life stealer going for a shadow blade? Well that works, but he can't farm for shit. Blood stone huskar, top lel. And of course Alchemist with absolutely nothing at 40 mins, how can two of the perhaps best farmers have nothing?

You've improved since you started Skyway, however consider your items builds more perhaps. Vanguard is usually a rather poor choice of item, especially on ranged heroes.

Gives a 70% chance to block 40 damage if the wielder is melee, or a 70% chance to block 20 damage if the wielder is ranged

Try either just getting a vitality booster, which can then be upgraded into a heart, or build a manta. It costs more but gives almost as much health and the as/ms works fantastically for viper. As well as the active which give nice damage and removes lots of debuffs. Such as dust, letting you use the shadow blade for escape.

 

[Kane]

viper is so ridiculously OP. i literally just rightclick into the enemy and get triple kills.

 

[MetalCraze]

Welcome to my noob tier.

I picked Viper mostly because the other team had Naix. Viper's ult just rapes Naix's rage, making him useless.

Then again I've played games versus vipers in my tier and there were many instances where people just sucked with viper. All I needed was a speedy ranged carry with stun and a lifesteal item. Like Luna.

Vanguard is usually a rather poor choice of item, especially on ranged heroes.

Yeah I will go for Manta. But it was more of a "well why not get some more hp" by the end. Since I p. much went for Agnaim's and Butterfly first.

You've improved since you started Skyway

Lul I just apply knowledge I got on "high difficulty" playing vs lvl 30s since on my tier people are too pussy, don't know their chars well to make right calls, never ward. In previous Ursa game which we won with me doing 14k 2d I had to buy courier myself even though we had 2 supports (that constantly whined they have no money).

Right now though I pick some char from the list, watch Dotacinema guide about him on jewtub, then launch bot practice and do it until I've learned char enough (usually takes 2 games). Bots in Doturd play A LOT better than noob tier.

 

[Zed]

Magic stick is awesome on viper. I've lured countless people into thinking they can take me on 1-on-1, only to pop the wand and have viper's "+dmg to weak" skill kick into effect. It's often a FB. The branches are good starting items too.
The only heroes I usually build vanguard on is axe and timbersaw.

(theorycrafting time)
With that amount of money (craze's screenshot) I would actually have gone abyssal blade on viper. 1) very effective against 'magic immunity' assholes like Naix and Jugge, 2) high damage, 3) stuns fuck Huskar hard, 4) not an orb, 5) less riskier than carrying a divine, 6) with items like butter, even considering the ranged penalty to stun, you will be stunning quite a lot, 7) synergises well with shadow blade in that you can get up face-to-face to land the use stun.

With vanguard and butter, you probably have survivability enough for divine not to be a risk (not to mention naturally high hp from levels). But with divine I would also have wanted to see a manta. At that point you might as well forgo the natural poison orb and go for helm of domi or something as well.

 

[Demnogonis Saastuttaja]

Go with recommended build first. It usually works well enough. Just remember to buy items by parts whenever you have money. So you won't lose them when you die. It's a mistake I've made for the first 7 or 8 games.

The most important thing to do at the start is to pick your lane. For example if you are not a middle-laner (this is usually a char with a very high-dmg output and long range attacks - examples: drow, viper, pudge, sniper etc) and your items are highly dependent on components from secret shop (my viper above is a good example) pick a lane with a secret shop. Since sending courier option may be slower / not always available.

If you are playing support chars (like mages) it is important to buy courier and wards since carries and pushers need all the money for their items as they are the main force behind your victory. A LOT of newbies never buy courier and wards and it's a huge mistake. Because observer wards will show you if you are about to be ganked and sentry wards reveal invisible units (these let you rape the fuck out of Riki for example - since without his stealth he's pretty shit). Noob tier NEVER wards and so if you will take your time to ward jungles and runes with observer wards and lanes with invisibility-relying chars like Riki and Weaver with sentry wards - it's almost a guaranteed win for you.
Again noobs often disregard the power of support chars - and having them vs. not having them makes all the difference.

(my top3 winning char is support - Disruptor)

Of course the best way to learn is to play on "high difficulty" - as in join Dex party (although Codex is often really shit at teamwork) and play vs lvl 30+ players as a support. It will be hard at first but it's the way you'll learn about all the best warding spots and plus you'll support the carries of better players.

Thanks for the advice bro, I figured some of that out already. But say where do you go as a support like Sven (I kinda just roam around) or Necrolyte? It seems like Carries are so popular I'm not touching them at the moment, how about Pugna, something about the little fucker seems cool to me. And what I'm wondering is if you should just level your spells as a mage of some sort, or do you need to take levels in intelligence early on?

I suppose there's a "good ward spots map" around somewhere in the internet, I have to take a look at that.

If somebody want's to play with a total noob add vihakosto in steam.

 

[Cromwell]

Thanks for the advice bro, I figured some of that out already. But say where do you go as a support like Sven (I kinda just roam around) or Necrolyte? It seems like Carries are so popular I'm not touching them at the moment, how about Pugna, something about the little fucker seems cool to me. And what I'm wondering is if you should just level your spells as a mage of some sort, or do you need to take levels in intelligence early on?

I suppose there's a "good ward spots map" around somewhere in the internet, I have to take a look at that.

If somebody want's to play with a total noob add vihakosto in steam.

You dont support as sven. You sven them. If the opponent team has masisve disables and or magic nukes, get a bkb and kill them. You stay in lane and farm, if the opportunity presents itself you get kills. Your ultimate makes you very strong very early so if you maybe skll (hats ot a "do this everytime") your stun, one point in your movespeed and one point in your ult you should get some kills early on. If you have someone in your lane who babysits you and can stun them, speak with him, tell him when youre ready let him stun your enemies run towards them and if they get away after a few hits stun again with your own. Someone told me to get some stats with him early on, mstly to have enough mana for a stun speed ult combo or a double stun. Thanks to your ult your not as dependant on damage items as other carries early on.

Bottomline, sven is no support, there are other heroes who should play your ward sluts and buy couriers and all that support stuff. You farm, you kil, you carry the match.

every hero who seems to be build around him going to some enemy and stabbing them in the face as you right click furiously is mostly a carry.

But I am a noob myself so take it with a grain of salt.

Edit:

If im not mistaken its not very good to level stats early on (with a few exceptions like sven or skeleton king maybe) always get your skills up. if you play a hero who has escape/ initiate skills try and put at least one point in them very early (had a match a few days ago with a riki who maxed backstab and afterwards the cloud before he spend even one point in the jump).