Dark Sun: Shattered Lands is fucking great

[mondblut]

Someone should reverse engineer and make Crimson Sands great again. This is one game I almost cry over never having to play.

 

[thesheeep]

Someone should reverse engineer and make Crimson Sands great again. This is one game I almost cry over never having to play.

https://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/131643/postmortem_ssis_dark_sun_online_.php

Ah... I had actually never heard of this game.
You're right, I would've loved to play it.

 

[Lord_Potato]

I had a similar experience to some people here. Darksun Shattered Lands is best in the first area - the arena, dungeons, sewers etc. When you reach the open world it looses a lot of appeal. I will propably finish it one day (managed to get my team of 4 triple multiclass characters to level 6 so far) but I somehow lost motivation along the desert road.

 

[Outlander]

Did you guys ever come back to the slave pens after a while? It's packed with templars.

 

[Sacred82]

the only bad thing Templars could do was Charm Person, wasn't it?

I would never escape with the slave gangs but always murder them, then stick around until everyone was like level 5/5/5

by that time the huge scorpion things would appear in the arena together with Sand Reapers and wreck me, so it was time to piss off

 

[Skall]

While Shattered Lands lacked polish, it's probably my favourite CRPG that I first "discovered" in recent years. It's essentially a Baldur's Gate precursor with turn-based combat and a more interesting setting.

It also has many neat little touches: an item you can talk to that provides fast-travel and quest-tips, huge AoE spells that cover immense chunks of the map in flames/oil/fog, various side-quests and optional areas (with unique art assets to boot), interactive objects that require some puzzling/experimentation to use properly, and more.

I disagree that the game got worse once the arena escape was finished. The introduction did a good job of letting the player get used to the combat, dialogue, map-interaction, resource management, etc. -- it was focused and presented a linear progression of A->B->C while slowly teasing optional areas and side quests. It didn't outstay its welcome, but once I was past the farms, I was ready to wander the world at my own pace. And the game did not disappoint!

The exploration is similar to Baldur's Gate with each area logically connecting to a few others via exit points. Within each map, you encounter random battles, treasures, travelers, and more involved mini-scenarios/stories in the dungeons/settlements. You generally can't "auto-attack" your way through combat, but it's not overly difficult so it's possible to explore the world at your own pace without getting completely curb-stomped. Open the spoilers tag for a large collection of screenshots from my playthrough.

Spoiler

And of course there was the offbeat music!

FM Playlist
Roland LA Playlist

The band/artist that did the audio for the Dark Sun games has a tiny YouTube channel with a few original recordings, which is where I got the trailer above; was really cool to listen to after finishing the game.

If you enjoy top-down, party-based CRPGs but haven't played this one, I'd suggest powering through the manual/DOSbox setup/etc., as the actual game is quite enjoyable.

 

[thesheeep]

I think the impression that the game got worse after the arena has much to do with the setting.
It is, after all, a big desert planet.
Deserts just aren't particularly interesting to look at or explore, even if there is content.

 

[Sacred82]

I think the impression that the game got worse after the arena has much to do with the setting.
It is, after all, a big desert planet.
Deserts just aren't particularly interesting to look at or explore, even if there is content.

well, at least they visually depicted differen kinds of desert; sand, salt, rock. Not that it made any mechanical differences as far as I'm aware... could be that certain types of terrain used up movement points more quickly than others, which would be consistent with the claim in the manual that Elves move more quickly over difficult terrain than other races. Could also be that Elves simply had more movement points than other medium and small sized races though.

 

[Saduj]

One thing I always wondered was whether how many allies you recruit affects the final battle. You have to recruit the major towns in order for the game to progress. But then there are a few smaller groups here and that are optional. The final battle is a jump in difficulty and a party that rolled through the rest of the game can have a hard time with it. It would make a lot of sense if recruiting more people resulted in more help in that last fight. From what I've seen, having those extra groups on your side doesn't matter. Anyone know for sure?

 

[Sacred82]

if I hadn't run into the endgame bug I would have liked to verify that, too. I took care to recruit everyone that seemed possible to recruit in the game, with the exception of the gladiators, possibly (I think they don't make any concessions after pissing off anyway). I'd say we can assume if there are no additional units beside your party showing up on the battlefield, recruiting people didn't really make a difference. It may or may not reduce the number of enemies you face, but from what I've seen, there's always a fuckton of them.

 

[Saduj]

I haven't played in a long time but I believe there were NPC units on your side in the last fight. It didn't seem to me like any of them were there to represent those smaller groups. The less enemies thing is possible but I don't think it works that way either.

BTW - If anyone is reading this thread and thinking about playing this for the 1st time: Every one one of your characters should be at least dual classed and you should make sure to have lots of spells/psionics to throw in last battle.

 

[Outlander]

One thing I always wondered was whether how many allies you recruit affects the final battle. You have to recruit the major towns in order for the game to progress. But then there are a few smaller groups here and that are optional. The final battle is a jump in difficulty and a party that rolled through the rest of the game can have a hard time with it. It would make a lot of sense if recruiting more people resulted in more help in that last fight. From what I've seen, having those extra groups on your side doesn't matter. Anyone know for sure?

As far as I remember the three cities send a whopping 3 fighters (1 from each city) to aid you in the final battle and they get wiped out p. fast, so it doesn't really make a difference.

A certain OP item, a ring I believe, with a huge and strong AoE is actually a big help.

 

[mondblut]

BTW - If anyone is reading this thread and thinking about playing this for the 1st time: Every one one of your characters should be at least dual classed

Not if you plan to use them in Wake of the Ravager. Dualclassing in Shattered Lands means wasting the whopping 5 or 6 levels in primary (and secondary if applicable) class. Persevere.

 

[Sacred82]

BTW - If anyone is reading this thread and thinking about playing this for the 1st time: Every one one of your characters should be at least dual classed

Not if you plan to use them in Wake of the Ravager. Dualclassing in Shattered Lands means wasting the whopping 5 or 6 levels in primary (and secondary if applicable) class. Persevere.

probably meant multiclass with at least 2 classes

 

[Fowyr]

Yea, max level for any class in Shattered Lands is 9. Wake of the Ravager have so much exp, that my imported single-class Preserver maxed her level just after leaving city.

 

[Saduj]

BTW - If anyone is reading this thread and thinking about playing this for the 1st time: Every one one of your characters should be at least dual classed

Not if you plan to use them in Wake of the Ravager. Dualclassing in Shattered Lands means wasting the whopping 5 or 6 levels in primary (and secondary if applicable) class. Persevere.

probably meant multiclass with at least 2 classes

Yeah, that's what I meant.

 

[JarlFrank]

I think the impression that the game got worse after the arena has much to do with the setting.
It is, after all, a big desert planet.
Deserts just aren't particularly interesting to look at or explore, even if there is content.

It is about 1000 times more interesting to me than exploring Baldur's Gate 1, which is just extremely generic and uninteresting.

Desert landscapes are relatively rare in RPGs so they're more interesting to explore.

 

[Skall]

I think the impression that the game got worse after the arena has much to do with the setting.
It is, after all, a big desert planet.
Deserts just aren't particularly interesting to look at or explore, even if there is content.

I think they actually did a really good job with this, and you can see it in the screenshots I posted above. There were sandy dunes, salt flats, cracked soil, volcanic terrain, sun-baked mesas, and some more verdant lands/oases. Plus, the caves/castles/etc., added further variety. I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of visual diversity (taking that word back) in the game, which probably didn't help with its (art asset) costs.

well, at least they visually depicted differen kinds of desert; sand, salt, rock. Not that it made any mechanical differences as far as I'm aware... could be that certain types of terrain used up movement points more quickly than others, which would be consistent with the claim in the manual that Elves move more quickly over difficult terrain than other races. Could also be that Elves simply had more movement points than other medium and small sized races though.

The races definitely had a different amount of movement points/attacks, but I don't think the terrain itself played much into it.

One thing I always wondered was whether how many allies you recruit affects the final battle. You have to recruit the major towns in order for the game to progress. But then there are a few smaller groups here and that are optional. The final battle is a jump in difficulty and a party that rolled through the rest of the game can have a hard time with it. It would make a lot of sense if recruiting more people resulted in more help in that last fight. From what I've seen, having those extra groups on your side doesn't matter. Anyone know for sure?

From what I recall, the final battle was actually split into 3 different fights on the same map. There was some talk of the enemy armies being thinned out, but I don't know if that actually happened. The different settlements you saved did send a handful of friendly NPC fighters to the encounters, though. Not sure how much they helped, but I do remember they got some of the kills in the fight, so they might've helped tip the balance in a fairly difficult battle.

I actually enjoyed the end-game quite a bit. It gave the player an excuse to use all those limited-cast-number items and go nuts with the most powerful AoE spells. Plus, the fact that the main quest and how it was completed affected it to some extent was pretty satisfying.

 

[thesheeep]

I think the impression that the game got worse after the arena has much to do with the setting.
It is, after all, a big desert planet.
Deserts just aren't particularly interesting to look at or explore, even if there is content.

It is about 1000 times more interesting to me than exploring Baldur's Gate 1, which is just extremely generic and uninteresting.

By now, yeah, sure... mostly because I know most of the BG1 & 2 contents by heart
However, given the choice between playing a new RPG in a forest setting and a new RPG in a desert setting, I sure won't be picking the desert.

Desert landscapes are relatively rare in RPGs so they're more interesting to explore.

They are rare precisely because they are NOT interesting to most people.
It's fine if you like them, you'll just have to live with most people not particularly enjoying a prolonged desert setting. People like familiarity, and most are more familiar with forests and plains than deserts.
When I think desert, I think shitloads of sand with nothing in-between except maybe a few rocks, it's just a boring premise to me and it would really have to be sold well to me. Like zombies...

Don't get me wrong, I played through Dark Sun as well (though it was quite some time ago), and the world isn't empty outside of the starting area.
Not more or less so than other games.
I'm just explaining why I think many people had the impression of emptiness after the arena, which would IMO be the setting.

 

[JarlFrank]

It's fine if you like them, you'll just have to live with most people not particularly enjoying a prolonged desert setting. People like familiarity, and most are more familiar with forests and plains than deserts.

I like uniqueness, and going through yet another typical forestland is the option I'd be least likely to pick. Give me deserts, jungles, volcanolands, heck give me mushroom forests like Morrowind, give me something interesting!

If I wanna explore a forest I can go outside and walk five minutes to the edge of my village. Plenty of forest there. In RPGs, I want to explore unfamiliar and interesting environments, not something that's already familiar.

 

[agris]

if I hadn't run into the endgame bug I would have liked to verify that, too.

What is "the endgame bug"?

 

[Sacred82]

if I hadn't run into the endgame bug I would have liked to verify that, too.

What is "the endgame bug"?

like Jarl said, there's a bug that can make it impossible to fight the final battle. I don't know if it still exists in patched versions, I played basically the disk version from a gaming magazine CD back then, could well have been unpatched.

You don't enter that area normally but are teleported there. I got to view the battlefield and the arrayed enemies, it's just that my party never showed up and I basically had to forcequit the game.

 

[Sceptic]

Endgame bug is there in patched game too. Once it triggers there's no way around it, final battle won't spawn, or your party won't, in any case you're stuck and can ever actually start the final battle. I think the most likely culprit, from various reports over the years, is the letter you find near the corpse and the bullette as soon as you enter the map, after leaving Draj. Presumably, if you leave the letter there and don't pick it up, it prevents the final battle from starting. I've never been able to test the theory though.

 

[Sacred82]

huh

so do you still see the credits roll if the battle doesn't start or wut

 

[MRY]

Saduj It's been ages, but my recollection at least is that the NPCs who show up in the final fight do represent each of the communities you've befriended.

thesheeep Nah, I think the impression arises from the fact that the first area is extremely tight, with tons of scripted interactions and interlinking quests at a very high density. The rest of the world is less dense in that regard.

Skall Damn, I'd forgotten how beautiful the game was -- I did remember loving the graphics (and hating those of the sequel as a consequence), but I didn't remember all those scenes. That said, and while I do think it pioneered a certain kind of isometric, branching-dialogue-based RPGs, it is missing one key feature of BG: companions. Even the NPCs who join the party are pretty much ciphers. Also, I don't remember the same amount of quest-branching and variety in BG. To me, it's more a proto-Fallout for those reasons, even though it doesn't really have skill/stat based options to the same degree.