Icewind Dale The Icewind Dale Series Thread

[Roguey]

Healing potions are 9 HP and would take several minutes to spam while running back to town only improves that to healing ~20 HP per hit at a cleric. Far easier to simply hit the rest button.

Should've gone into the settings menu to disable extended resting. Immersion matters in a game like IWD.

Rest until healed automatically casts any and all healing spells you have memorized to make it go by faster. If you have absolutely none memorized, then yeah it's going to take forever.

 

[Average Manatee]

I easily had enough money and (virtually infinite) potions that I could have done it without resting but spending several minutes spamming them just to make an entirely arbitrary number that the rest of the game doesn't care about smaller doesn't make sense to me. I'm sure you could do a restless minimum time run if you wanted to though.

 

[Grunker]

Healing potions are 9 HP and would take several minutes to spam while running back to town only improves that to healing ~20 HP per hit at a cleric. Far easier to simply hit the rest button.

Should've gone into the settings menu to disable extended resting. Immersion matters in a game like IWD.

Rest until healed automatically casts any and all healing spells you have memorized to make it go by faster. If you have absolutely none memorized, then yeah it's going to take forever.

Original IWD didn't have automatic healing on RUH, did it? The original Baldur's Gate did not. I assumed that was why. If he is playing a version with automatic healing on rest, then he is a bigger idiot than I imagined! :D

 

[Average Manatee]

IWD 1.41 does have rest until healed.

 

[0sacred]

Tried a few strategies for Yxunomei. Turns out when you have 6 characters with low THAC0, 2 APR, dealing 16-20 damage per hit, the best one is to just run in and hit her.

my tactics usually consisted of a hasted dwarf with the +2 throwing axe and a round of resurrections for everyone else afterwards

 

[Roguey]

Original IWD didn't have automatic healing on RUH, did it? The original Baldur's Gate did not. I assumed that was why. If he is playing a version with automatic healing on rest, then he is a bigger idiot than I imagined! :D

From the Icewind Dale manual:
When you select the Rest button on the world screen, you're
entire party will rest until everyone is at full health. When you
select the Rest button on any other screen, you will be presented with
three options: normal Rest (8 hours), Rest Until Healed (rest until
everyone is at full health) and Cancel

 

[Nano]

Original game feature or no, resting until healed is cheating.

 

[Roguey]

Original game feature or no, resting until healed is cheating.

It's just automating a process you can do manually.

 

[Nano]

It's just automating a process you can do manually.

Resting more than once is cheating. In fact, resting in inappropriate locations is cheating too. If a human DM wouldn't let you do it, don't do it.

 

[Roguey]

Resting more than once is cheating.

Nothing stopping people from taking an extended break except random encounters.

In fact, resting in inappropriate locations is cheating too.

"You can't rest here" is a feature they could have chosen to use in any area they wished.

Oh and re: the improper use of "you're" in the manual:

Manual
Chris Avellone

That excellent Chris Avellone writing one keeps hearing about.

 

[Nano]

Everything Chris-senpai writes is gospel. If he says you're means your, I believe him.

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

I always try to limit resting until I reach a point in which I am heavily resource depleted, but calling the resting cheating is just wrong.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

There's no way to get adequate food and water in a dungeon as required by the rules, therefore you wouldn't be able to rest there beyond whatever provisions you brought with you, certainly not enough to rest for years.

 

[mediocrepoet]

There's no way to get adequate food and water in a dungeon as required by the rules, therefore you wouldn't be able to rest there beyond whatever provisions you brought with you, certainly not enough to rest for years.

What if you set up a supply chain by caravan back to the village to keep you supplied and sell your loot in order to fund it? You'd basically be colonist adventurers, establishing a Dungeon Town "Dunton" if you will. And after clearing the final level of the Dunton, villagers could move in, establishing a socialist paradise with free land and housing.

 

[Average Manatee]

As I said, I could have easily downed healing potions to replicate resting. Healing potions have unlimited stock at Oswald Fiddlebender and cost 76g apiece for 9 HP. I ended the game with 250k gold, enough to buy over 3000 health potions. And health potions have no weight inside potion bags (not that my 6 fighter party wouldn't have been able to carry 100 potions per character easily). Resting was purely anti-tedium since you can only drink one potion a round and it would take up to 2 minutes of potion spamming to heal someone to full. And it's not like I was resting every battle, I was clearing most/all of dungeons in one go and rested mostly for bosses. If anything it's caster-heavy parties that need to "abuse" resting.

Once thing I did notice was that it seemed like certain previous areas respawned over time and after a long rest there would be a ton of enemies, possibly as much or more then originally inhabited areas. It was only a few but I remember seeing something like 15 Myconoids when I went back that way from dorn's deep.

I'm surprised people are making fun of me for the irrelevant # of days taken rather than the fact that I used the Berserker kit.

I always try to limit resting until I reach a point in which I am heavily resource depleted, but calling the resting cheating is just wrong.

I do think resting constantly for every battle and constantly spamming your strongest spells is a bit cheesy. Otherwise if you can at least clear 1-2 map areas between rests its fine. The problem is really about casters who have so many 1 round/level buffs that can make you completely invincible for one or two battles and you're opening every battle by spamming 3 fireballs ontop of warriors immune to fire and so on.

 

[mediocrepoet]

As I said, I could have easily downed healing potions to replicate resting. Healing potions have unlimited stock at Oswald Fiddlebender and cost 76g apiece for 9 HP. I ended the game with 250k gold, enough to buy over 3000 health potions. And health potions have no weight inside potion bags (not that my 6 fighter party wouldn't have been able to carry 100 potions per character easily). Resting was purely anti-tedium since you can only drink one potion a round and it would take up to 2 minutes of potion spamming to heal someone to full. And it's not like I was resting every battle, I was clearing most/all of dungeons in one go and rested mostly for bosses. If anything it's caster-heavy parties that need to "abuse" resting.

Once thing I did notice was that it seemed like certain previous areas respawned over time and after a long rest there would be a ton of enemies, possibly as much or more then originally inhabited areas. It was only a few but I remember seeing something like 15 Myconoids when I went back that way from dorn's deep.

I'm surprised people are making fun of me for the irrelevant # of days taken rather than the fact that I used the Berserker kit.

I'm not sure anyone's making fun of you, per se. More the absurd idea of spending years in a dungeon. The option to walk around like a bottle depot, clinking the whole way and hoping not to trip and break everything is equally as hilarious.

The main issue with RPG healing that tries to adapt tabletop healing times and then tracks in-game time as if it were real is that a tabletop game has only a minimal fraction of the combat in a CRPG. If it was otherwise, you'd have TPKs all the time since there's no reload ability.

 

[Melcar]

Implementing a time limit to some quests can solve the resting issue. Like taking 2 years to reach Conlan's son and the rest of the captives. He ded by now son.

 

[Average Manatee]

I'm not sure anyone's making fun of you, per se. More the absurd idea of spending years in a dungeon. The option to walk around like a bottle depot, clinking the whole way and hoping not to trip and break everything is equally as hilarious.

The main issue with RPG healing that tries to adapt tabletop healing times and then tracks in-game time as if it were real is that a tabletop game has only a minimal fraction of the combat in a CRPG. If it was otherwise, you'd have TPKs all the time since there's no reload ability.

Oh yeah, it's pretty silly. "just hang out in that room Yxunomei, imma spend 26 days in the single corridor entranceway leading to you."

The best idea I've had to discourage rest spam for RPG dungeons is that resting after starting the dungeon should cause AIs to be more prepared. Like, 95% of traps make no sense in IWD/BG... unless the AI knows you are coming and has hours of time to prepare. Similarly stuff like SCS-style buffing for casters and potion usage for non-casters should become more prevalent if you are resting in dungeons, but unlike how SCS is actually implemented in BG it should reward doing large sections in one go by having enemies not prebuff or have significant extra consumables to spam if the player is "surprising" them by blitzing through a dungeon in a short amount of time.

Implementing a time limit to some quests can solve the resting issue. Like taking 2 years to reach Conlan's son and the rest of the captives. He ded by now son.

Probably wouldn't do much. For any party with a cleric rest times to full heal is 8 hours or 16 hours thanks to the cleric healing people. For them resting every battle would still take vastly less time than a pure fighter party resting even once per dungeon.

There's no way to get adequate food and water in a dungeon as required by the rules, therefore you wouldn't be able to rest there beyond whatever provisions you brought with you, certainly not enough to rest for years.

Right, which is why if I rest for a month in front of the only exit a dungeon has, everyone inside should die of thirst. And according to D&D rules, I should get full XP this way.

 

[Acrux]

Just use Ctrl+R. Then the only reason for resting is running out of spells.

 

[Roguey]

The best idea I've had to discourage rest spam for RPG dungeons is that resting after starting the dungeon should cause AIs to be more prepared. Like, 95% of traps make no sense in IWD/BG... unless the AI knows you are coming and has hours of time to prepare. Similarly stuff like SCS-style buffing for casters and potion usage for non-casters should become more prevalent if you are resting in dungeons, but unlike how SCS is actually implemented in BG it should reward doing large sections in one go by having enemies not prebuff or have significant extra consumables to spam if the player is "surprising" them by blitzing through a dungeon in a short amount of time.

This was brought up in the early days of Pillars of Eternity and Sawyer mentioned that it's the equivalent of designing each area 1.5 times (meaning less content overall). A good idea depending on how long you're fine with an RPG being.

 

[Average Manatee]

This was brought up in the early days of Pillars of Eternity and Sawyer mentioned that it's the equivalent of designing each area 1.5 times (meaning less content overall). A good idea depending on how long you're fine with an RPG being.

I don't really agree. IWD already includes more or less enemies depending on difficulty. The way SCS is coded basically every AI caster uses a universal AI casting script with the spell selection being randomized based on class/kit/level (which also varies up or down based on level), and the same goes for giving potions of invisibility to thiefs and healing/to everyone. SCS also semi-randomizes caster prebuffing based on difficulty level AFAIK. Basically nothing where you need to hand-code things.

It'd be easy to simply up the effective difficulty level by 1 notch if you rest for 8-16 hours and 2 notches if you rest for more than a day. It'd also be easy to do the same for traps with some quick scripts (at least from a developer point of view, I'm not sure if infinity engine supports adding traps), you'd disable 90% of traps to begin with then enable 50% then 100% depending on time.

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

It's just automating a process you can do manually.

Resting more than once is cheating. In fact, resting in inappropriate locations is cheating too. If a human DM wouldn't let you do it, don't do it.

That is what the iron spikes (1 CP each in 1st edition players handbook) were for....to seal shut dungeon or castle doors to secure rooms from wandering (low IQ) monsters and get some rest in hostile environments.

 

[Nano]

Someone here was triggered enough to run to Reddit for emotional support.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Huh, I always verify my opinions on reddit before posting them on the codex and thought everyone does the same.

 

[Tigranes]

Do you also verify your beer by pissing in it first