KickStarter System Shock 1 Remake by Nightdive Studios

[Melan]

The concept for System Shock was conceived "between December 1992 and January 1993", if Wikipedia is to be believed, and the game shipped September / December 1994 (floppy disk/CD-ROM version). That's two years to make one of the greatest games of all times.

This thread was started November 2015. Over seven years and multiple redesigns later, the game is still not out, and the latest update is touting features like "When accessing a locked area, you’ll now scan the appropriate card to gain entry". Will it be good when it releases? Welllll....

Par for course for a culture that is forgetting how to make roads.

 

[Morgoth]

God this game looks like dog shit. I can't believe they spend so many years on this.

At least give us SS2 Enhanced already, at least that one doesn't look so offensive.

 

[mkultra]

The concept for System Shock was conceived "between December 1992 and January 1993", if Wikipedia is to be believed, and the game shipped September / December 1994 (floppy disk/CD-ROM version). That's two years to make one of the greatest games of all times.

This thread was started November 2015. Over seven years and multiple redesigns later, the game is still not out, and the latest update is touting features like "When accessing a locked area, you’ll now scan the appropriate card to gain entry". Will it be good when it releases? Welllll....

Par for course for a culture that is forgetting how to make roads.

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.
FO1 took 3.5 years, engine and everything, small team. Today it would either be seen as "impossible" or it would take 7-8 years, with much, much better tools/engines, then 2-3 years of patching up the mess they created.

 

[Naraya]

God this game looks like dog shit. I can't believe they spend so many years on this.

At least give us SS2 Enhanced already, at least that one doesn't look so offensive.

I don't want a SS2 Enhanced, it doesn't need enhancing! We all know what it would look like. Was there any "remaster" that wasn't actually a blatant cashgrab? Only C&C comes to my mind.

 

[mkultra]

God this game looks like dog shit. I can't believe they spend so many years on this.

At least give us SS2 Enhanced already, at least that one doesn't look so offensive.

I don't want a SS2 Enhanced, it doesn't need enhancing! We all know what it would look like. Was there any "remaster" that wasn't actually a blatant cashgrab? Only C&C comes to my mind.

Most people play with the upgraded (SHTUP) texture pack already, and perhaps with my (vurt) mods too, so in a way it is already enhanced, the enhanced version will include those mods + some new stuff that aren't in current mods. The new character models actually looks pretty good... Anyways, it'll still be possible to play SS2 in it's original form so i don't see the problem.

 

[Naraya]

God this game looks like dog shit. I can't believe they spend so many years on this.

At least give us SS2 Enhanced already, at least that one doesn't look so offensive.

I don't want a SS2 Enhanced, it doesn't need enhancing! We all know what it would look like. Was there any "remaster" that wasn't actually a blatant cashgrab? Only C&C comes to my mind.

Most people play with the upgraded (SHTUP) texture pack already, and perhaps with my (vurt) mods too, so in a way it is already enhanced, the enhanced version will include those mods + some new stuff that aren't in current mods. The new character models actually looks pretty good... Anyways, it'll still be possible to play SS2 in it's original form so i don't see the problem.

You are right, I was being grumpy. As long as the original SS2 edition is available they can do whatever they want.
edit: I play SS2 the way you mentioned so I'll just say - thanks for your contributions!

 

[Junmarko]

I don't want a SS2 Enhanced, it doesn't need enhancing! We all know what it would look like. Was there any "remaster" that wasn't actually a blatant cashgrab? Only C&C comes to my mind.

Homeworld 1 & 2 Remastered were excellent

 

[DJOGamer PT]

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.

Exactely because the tools were more primitive that it took less time to develop

 

[mkultra]

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.

Exactely because the tools were more primitive that it took less time to develop

I'm not so sure about that, making 2D art is way, way simpler now for example, especially a character which will be animated and have different clothing, weapons.
Primitive tools does not equal easier or faster workflow, but sure sometimes it can be, for a 2D RPG i kind of doubt it though.

I've worked with the FO editor tools (for modding purposes) and it's both primitive and complex at the same time in comparison to something more modern.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

Things overall might be simpler to make, but also I would say more time consuming since the tech is more complex
On 3D animations alone you can spend months to get the appropriate feel, even if you use motion capture

Besides, these idiots blew most of their cash on that stupid "re-imagining" version before shitcanning it in 2018
So the actual dev time of this current project is more like 5 years
And I would say this seems more like a "passion project" to them, since their main source of revenue are the remasters of abandonware games

 

[Nikanuur]

I don't want a SS2 Enhanced, it doesn't need enhancing! We all know what it would look like. Was there any "remaster" that wasn't actually a blatant cashgrab? Only C&C comes to my mind.

Homeworld 1 & 2 Remastered were excellent

Tbh Prey was a pretty good SS2 remaster.

 

[Zog]

Watch. The remake will once again get delayed in some fashion. I hold zero faith in Nightdive releasing on time.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Doesn't matter if it gets released or not tbh. They're demanding a full price for it, which means no one will play it anyway and it's guaranteed DOA status. Just get it out of the way so I can try SS2 EE.

 

[Semiurge]

Robot Wars

Looks great, love the gibs.
I do wonder if the gibs are mostly a thing after death though, that would be disappointing.. calculating that in combat is probably complex / demanding, after death not so much..

So complex and demanding that Rebellion's Aliens vs Predator did it in the 90's. You could shoot limbs off aliens and androids and they'd still keep attacking despite the greatly reduced health they had left, the shotgun wielding androids would even switch to one-armed loading and firing of their automatic shotguns if deprived of one arm. The human npcs had the same gib system of course, but since they're puny humans they die instantly if you take off a limb, or the head obviously. The xenoborg could be rendered harmless if a clever sharpshooter shot off its laser gun. The aliens dragged themselves on the ground with their arms if they were missing a leg, AvP2 kept this same legacy feature but only for the xenomorph drones afaik, maybe facehuggers too.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

Looks great, love the gibs.
I do wonder if the gibs are mostly a thing after death though, that would be disappointing.. calculating that in combat is probably complex / demanding, after death not so much..

They did a video on this years ago (literally):

 

[mkultra]

Looks great, love the gibs.
I do wonder if the gibs are mostly a thing after death though, that would be disappointing.. calculating that in combat is probably complex / demanding, after death not so much..

They did a video on this years ago (literally):

Right, i remember seeing this video now

Robot Wars

Looks great, love the gibs.
I do wonder if the gibs are mostly a thing after death though, that would be disappointing.. calculating that in combat is probably complex / demanding, after death not so much..

So complex and demanding that Rebellion's Aliens vs Predator did it in the 90's. You could shoot limbs off aliens and androids and they'd still keep attacking despite the reduced health they had left, the shotgun wielding androids would even switch to one-armed loading and firing of their automatic shotguns if deprived of one arm.

True. There actually were quite a few games back then that had it, Soldier of Fortune was another. Ultima 7 had NPC schedules, 30 years ago, even to this date many devs don't implement it in open world RPG's/ARPG's.. But yeah, it's more complex and more demanding than not having it, it's why it's left out so often :/

 

[Ivan]

the dismemberment is stoopid

 

[gerey]

I still don't quite understand what this remake is supposed to have over the original.

Increased graphical fidelity is worthless if the art direction is dogshit.

QoL basic bitch features that have been a staple of every im sim for decades now?

I genuinely would have preferred if they had gone forward with the reimaging, as they had initially planned, instead of subjecting us to this inferior copy of the original.

"When accessing a locked area, you’ll now scan the appropriate card to gain entry". Will it be good when it releases? Welllll....

The hilarious part is that the animation looks stupid as fuck. Instead of the character stretching his arm out, palm with card in had facing downward so it can be scanned, he holds it up in his face like a crayon muncher.

Even Duke Nukem 3D had this shit figured out.

 

[Tyranicon]

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.
FO1 took 3.5 years, engine and everything, small team. Today it would either be seen as "impossible" or it would take 7-8 years, with much, much better tools/engines, then 2-3 years of patching up the mess they created.

There are a lot of factors, but it's probably mostly down to:

• Dev commitment/passion/competency
• Small team size
• Mastery of tools and processes
• Less corporate involvement

 

[GhostCow]

• Less corporate involvement

I used to think this was a good thing, but Star Citizen has proven this to be wrong. Devs are retarded and they need a tard wrangler to ever hit any goals.

 

[Tyranicon]

• Less corporate involvement

I used to think this was a good thing, but Star Citizen has proven this to be wrong. Devs are retarded and they need a tard wrangler to ever hit any goals.

I would say there's a difference between "proper management" and "corporate involvement." I take the latter to be mostly intervention from people not involved in the making of the actual game, such as marketing, finance guys, and other corporate stooges.

Also, individual devs/small teams often cared way less more about ideology and politics, so there's that too.

 

[Hammer Of The Heretics]

I wonder if the Dunbar limit is relevant here? When a team gets so large that it becomes impossible for a person to track what everyone else is doing then you get extra management layers, office politics and free riders.

 

[SharkClub]

I genuinely would have preferred if they had gone forward with the reimaging, as they had initially planned, instead of subjecting us to this inferior copy of the original.

I think there came a point where they didn't have a choice on how to proceed with the game's development. They spent years showing absolute crap about stupid niche mechanics (all that ice/freezing stuff for example) for their System Shock reimagining and grifting for backer money, then people got fed up and finally started asking where the actual game was, and by that point they had spent all the years of development time and money on nothing so they downscaled the project massively to be able to put together any product at all, and the easiest thing to go with at that point was a 1:1 remake of System Shock 1's layout/progression but with fancier graphics (and any soullessness that comes with such an endeavour).

I feel like if they kept on the original track for the project (the "total reimagining") then the game would probably have turned out as bad if not worse than Underworld Ascendant. As it stands this iteration of it is still likely going to have issues but it will be pulling enough from the original game that it will definitely also not be total shit.

 

[Semiurge]

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.
FO1 took 3.5 years, engine and everything, small team. Today it would either be seen as "impossible" or it would take 7-8 years, with much, much better tools/engines, then 2-3 years of patching up the mess they created.

There are a lot of factors, but it's probably mostly down to:

• Dev commitment/passion/competency
• Small team size
• Mastery of tools and processes
• Less corporate involvement

• No life

 

[Tweed]

This is something that always amazes me with old games, how fast they were developed and with way more primitive tools.
FO1 took 3.5 years, engine and everything, small team. Today it would either be seen as "impossible" or it would take 7-8 years, with much, much better tools/engines, then 2-3 years of patching up the mess they created.

There are a lot of factors, but it's probably mostly down to:

• Dev commitment/passion/competency
• Small team size
• Mastery of tools and processes
• Less corporate involvement

You could have just said sunk costs.