Review RPG Codex Review: Darth Roxor on Disappointment, thy name is Pillars of Eternity

[mastroego]

Funny as now the apologists have to resort to what if scenarios to defend PoE, they are still wrong tho, there's no way that Sawyer would have been allowed to do then what he did with PoE now, without mentioning that something like that happened, Compare people's opinions about BG2 and IWD 2.

Sorry, similar points in my post.
Great minds etc.

 

[J_C]

The general disinterest towards Icewind Dale is already proof of that, but those games were at least "tolerated" since they were a different series that didn't taint BG.

There is no general disinterest toward the IWD games. Many people love it here.

 

[mastroego]

As in "love it for what it is?"

Just look at how many mods BG spawned, and compare it to Icewind Dale.

 

[J_C]

As in "love it for what it is?"

Just look at how many mods BG spawned, and compare it to Icewind Dale.

Not love it, but LIKE it. And how many mods PST has?

 

[Athelas]

You are wrong.
People are perfectly capable of distinguishing and debating the "finer" differences between BG1 and BG2 today, a Sawyerized BG3 would be recognized today as an abomination and enthusiastically erased from canon by the cognizant portion of the populace just as the Star Wars prequels have, or worse.

The general disinterest towards Icewind Dale is already proof of that, but those games were at least "tolerated" since they were a different series that didn't taint BG.

It's a game series with the likes of Aerie and Minsc in it. Any danger of the series being 'tainted' is entirely imaginary.

Also, Black Isle's Baldur's Gate 3 wasn't even going to have anything to do with the previous BG games (the title was presumably for marketing purposes), and was more similar to Fallout in design philosophy.

 

[imweasel]

Alternate history scenario: Interplay management is a bit less retarded, and after BioWare finishes with the Baldur's Gate series, a Baldur's Gate 3 by Black Isle is immediately greenlit. Josh Sawyer is the lead designer, and the game his team finally releases in early 2003 is similar to Pillars of Eternity in most aspects.

If you don't think that game would have been considered a beloved Black Isle classic today, you are deluded.

You are wrong.
People are perfectly capable of distinguishing and debating the "finer" differences between BG1 and BG2 today, a Sawyerized BG3 would be recognized today as an abomination and enthusiastically erased from canon by the cognizant portion of the populace just as the Star Wars prequels have, or worse.

The general disinterest towards Icewind Dale is already proof of that, but those games were at least "tolerated" since they were a different series that didn't taint BG.

Give it some more time, someday everyone will consider the prequels to also be classics. So sayeth teh logic of teh codex.

lulz

 

[hiver]

Infinitron wasnt around to see how lovingly Sawyers interventions into Fallout were taken during Van Buren.

But hey, as long as he can make any retarded statement its all good.

 

[Hegel]

Not love it, but LIKE it. And how many mods PST has?

Nobody would defile the work of a God. Well, nobody other than Sawyer, he cut MCA's NPCs.

 

[Kz3r0]

Alternate history scenario: Interplay management is a bit less retarded, and after BioWare finishes with the Baldur's Gate series, a Baldur's Gate 3 by Black Isle is immediately greenlit. Josh Sawyer is the lead designer, and the game his team finally releases in early 2003 is similar to Pillars of Eternity in most aspects.

If you don't think that game would have been considered a beloved Black Isle classic today, you are deluded.

You are wrong.
People are perfectly capable of distinguishing and debating the "finer" differences between BG1 and BG2 today, a Sawyerized BG3 would be recognized today as an abomination and enthusiastically erased from canon by the cognizant portion of the populace just as the Star Wars prequels have, or worse.

The general disinterest towards Icewind Dale is already proof of that, but those games were at least "tolerated" since they were a different series that didn't taint BG.

Give it some more time, someday everyone will consider the prequels to also be classics. So sayeth teh logic of teh codex.

lulz

So Feargus is going to sell Obsidian to Bethesda then?

 

[mastroego]

As in "love it for what it is?"

Just look at how many mods BG spawned, and compare it to Icewind Dale.

Not love it, but LIKE it. And how many mods PST has?

Many mods were made for BG because people wanted more of it. Only a few mods were made for PST because there was nothing to add.
Only a few mods were made for IWD because hardly anyone cared.

 

[J_C]

Many mods were made for BG because people wanted more of it. Only a few mods were made for PST because there was no need for them.
Only a few mods were made for IWD because hardly anyone cared.

Or, the quantity of mods hasnt got anything to do with the quality of the game.

 

[Hegel]

Irenaeus and J_C, how much are you getting paid, you shameless shills.

 

[J_C]

Irenaeus and J_C, how much are you getting paid, you shameless shills.

A free hooker each day. Best deal of my life.

 

[Hegel]

Not if you're the hooker.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Give it some more time, someday everyone will consider the prequels to also be classics. So sayeth teh logic of teh codex.

lulz

It's a somewhat interesting topic actually, I wonder when did BG2 for example first sneak its way into Codex best RPGs list? If it's just a matter of time passed (as simple as that) we shall no doubt see DA:O (best Bioware game according to Codex review) enter Codex top 5 and supplant BG2 any year now, I'll be waiting.

 

[J_C]

Not if you're the hooker.

Hey, im still getting paid either way.

 

[Irenaeus]

Irenaeus and J_C, how much are you getting paid, you shameless shills.

Your mom pays me in BJs. The pay is satisfactory, I got several raises.

 

[Jasede]

You mean Sawyer would have got rid of those unbalanced D&D spells and mechanics and implemented his own system for BG3? Yes, I guess that would have spawned a few megathreads.

Because BG1 and BG2 weren't some bastardized version of DnD for retards (look at me, ma, I am playing a dee-an'-dee gaem!) but an authentic DnD experience.

I'll bite.

What the fuck is an "authentic DnD experience"? When you answer, please keep in mind that there are many different styles of play. While you're at it you can name some games that provided this effusive DnD experience.

 

[DeepOcean]

PoE is more comparable to NWN2 rather than BG2.

NWN 2 character system is better.

 

[almondblight]

What is in it that stands out so much to call it classic?
Fighting system? Story ? Exploration ? Setting ?

I thought you were talking about BG2 here until I read your last sentence.

 

[Ninjerk]

In 2003, had Sawyer even begun to develop his philosophy WRT player experience?

 

[Irenaeus]

PoE is more comparable to NWN2 rather than BG2.

NWN 2 character system is better.

Agree, except for the cultural and background profession thing.

NWN2 character system was awesome to me at the time (2006). Those orc caves on the other hand... And let's not get started on the Trial

 

[hiver]

You mean Sawyer would have got rid of those unbalanced D&D spells and mechanics and implemented his own system for BG3? Yes, I guess that would have spawned a few megathreads.

Because BG1 and BG2 weren't some bastardized version of DnD for retards (look at me, ma, I am playing a dee-an'-dee gaem!) but an authentic DnD experience.

No, but they were good games at the time.

With clear evolution and improvements in BG2.

BG2 is remembered so fondly and its memory grows brighter with time passing precisely because since that time - there were no games that reached its level of quality. Let alone improved on it.
Not that a fucking moron like you would know anything about quality or lack of any.

And those games were never meant to provide any kind of "authentic DnD experience" whetever the fuck that is.


PoE will never get such a reverence because it is worse then those old games, just like the idiotic abomination of W2 is utter shit that will never be considered actually good by anyone except complete retards like you.

Because - you value quality depending on how much you enjoyed the game or didnt.

I'll bite.

What the fuck is an "authentic DnD experience"? When you answer, please keep in mind that there are many different styles of play. While you're at it you can name some games that provided this effusive DnD experience.

What do you expect him to say?

Theres no logic or reason to that thing.

Authentic shit is whatever he enjoyed and whatever he didn isnt.

 

[Jasede]

Yes. So therefore...?

 

[hiver]

therefore all he is saying is complete bullshit made of fallacies covering fallacies.

but, ok... if you want to do it yourself, be my guests.