Baldur's Gate Planescape: Torment — Original Incarnation. Also, MM, MoP and EED

[AwesomeButton]

Just chiming in to inform you that I've long since predicted the possibility of Lilura paywalling her blog and I'm keeping local copies of all articles.

 

[JarlFrank]

Of course she isn't going to like PS:T. She said herself that she skips the dialogue in RPGs to get to the combat. Obviously this is not her kind of game.

Why she enjoy NWN 1 then which has absolutely terrible combat?

 

[Roguey]

Refusing to use a fan patch that fixes bugs because it's not completely "purist" (e.g. Qwinn et al "fixed" things that weren't meant to be fixed, etc) is certainly a particular kind of autism.

I guess I can sort of relate since I refused to use a patch past 3.whatever for ToEE and never used the plus patch for Bloodlines.

Why she enjoy NWN 1 then which has absolutely terrible combat?

That Swordflight though.

 

[JarlFrank]

Why she enjoy NWN 1 then which has absolutely terrible combat?

That Swordflight though.

I started playing Swordflight just this weekend because of Lilura's recommendation, and it's reasonably enjoyable. Great dungeon design, nice alignment impacts in dialogues, some cool unique encounters and puzzles in dungeons.

But DAMN is the combat just terrible. Playing a fighter, taking the bard girl companion along with me.
Most combats with melee enemies = pre-buff with potions, then watch as my fighter dukes it out in melee with the enemy, which is sloooooow. Much slower than it was in the IE games. Just sit and watch two characters circle around each other for a long while.
And then, there's the problem of the companion AI being retarded as fuck. I gave the bard chick a crossbow so she wouldn't run into melee all the time, and a staff as backup weapon so she won't provoke AoOs all the time in case an enemy gets into her melee range (or she runs straight into AoO range for NO FUCKING REASON while wielding her crossbow), but I had to take away her staff since it just made her switch from crossbow to staff and charge into the fray, where she gets herself killed in two or three hits, because that's what support characters are supposed to do, obviously, rather than stay back and... you know... support.

At least the excruciatingly slow walking speed can be modded to something more bearable so you won't have to wait half a minute to traverse a map.

 

[Lilura]

no one has really understood what Lilura bitches about when talking about those locking-out dialogue situations

A woman "bitches" but a man constructively criticizes (dispassionately and judiciously), amirite?

Of course, the 'Dex is overflowing with examples of male-poster even-handedness.

 

[Roguey]

Most combats with melee enemies = pre-buff with potions, then watch as my fighter dukes it out in melee with the enemy, which is sloooooow. Much slower than it was in the IE games. Just sit and watch two characters circle around each other for a long while.

I didn't notice, but I also used a 20 strength fighter with a two-hander for the 1.5x strength modifier, and of course cleave and eventually great cleave I think, so everything died pretty quickly.

And then, there's the problem of the companion AI being retarded as fuck. I gave the bard chick a crossbow so she wouldn't run into melee all the time, and a staff as backup weapon so she won't provoke AoOs all the time in case an enemy gets into her melee range (or she runs straight into AoO range for NO FUCKING REASON while wielding her crossbow), but I had to take away her staff since it just made her switch from crossbow to staff and charge into the fray, where she gets herself killed in two or three hits, because that's what support characters are supposed to do, obviously, rather than stay back and... you know... support.

She certainly is an annoyance but I think in the dialogue menu you can say "only use ranged weapons" and that won't be a problem? I had her camped far away from actual fights for the most part, though I learned rather quickly that I couldn't just leave her right at the entrance to any given dungeon on account of hitting triggers that spawned new enemies.

 

[JarlFrank]

Overall, I wholeheartedly agree with Lilura's post on why NWN should have full party control and think Beamdog are complete retards for not implementing that in the EE, because that's one enhancement this game would really have needed.

 

[Lilura]

As you can see in this Vault link, Swordflight is one of the most voted-for modules. Why don't 'Dexers vote? Is the Vault too annoying to register at/use? I can understand that, I guess. But you should make an effort because it's basically the only 'Dex-approved module (outside of ADwR, seemingly).

 

[Roguey]

But you should make an effort because it's basically the only 'Dex-approved module (outside of ADwR, seemingly).

I've never seen anyone here say anything negative about Excrucio Eternum, which I swear by. It barely has combat of course.

 

[AwesomeButton]

FPC would actually require Beamdog to write their own functionality. Hence, no chance of them ever doing it.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

Of course she isn't going to like PS:T. She said herself that she skips the dialogue in RPGs to get to the combat. Obviously this is not her kind of game.

Why she enjoy NWN 1 then which has absolutely terrible combat?

Like Jack Lemon’s male love interest says to him at the end of Some Like It Hot, nobody’s perfect.

no one has really understood what Lilura bitches about when talking about those locking-out dialogue situations

A woman "bitches" but a man constructively criticizes (dispassionately and judiciously), amirite?

Of course, the 'Dex is overflowing with examples of male-poster even-handedness.

While this forum may be a hive of scum and misogyny, I’m pretty sure anytime anyone complains about/criticizes anything, someone else will immediately call it bitching. And one man’s “even handed constructive criticism” is invariably another man’s “stop being a cuck, you faggot.”

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

I used bitching because I like the verb and frequently use it when I mean "small" comlplaining or criticizing, even for myself. I didn't mean anyshing derogatory or sexist with it. "Constructive criticism" OTOH is for fags and the kind of PC talk I don't talk.

 

[Serus]

I used bitching because I like the verb and frequently use it when I mean "small" comlplaining or criticizing, even for myself. I didn't mean anyshing derogatory or sexist with it. "Constructive criticism" OTOH is for fags and the kind of PC talk I don't talk.

Lilura being a woman (or a "woman" ?) needs to bitch about bitching though. Which only makes it more hilarious.

 

[Lilura]

I was actually just trying to be friendly. (Guess I'm just not good at it.)

 

[aweigh]

Aren't there mods that spruce up the companion AI (and thus weapon switching)?

Also what's the mod for faster movement, and I assume it affects all creatures equally (to avoid cheating)?

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

I was actually just trying to be friendly. (Guess I'm just not good at it.)

Watch out ! Being friendlly on the Codex tends to lead to dialogue lock-outs.

 

[Lilura]

Aren't there mods that spruce up the companion AI (and thus weapon switching)?

Not sure why you'd want to bother?

Also what's the mod for faster movement, and I assume it affects all creatures equally (to avoid cheating)?

There is an always run option or you can just hold down shift.

 

[Blakemoreland Hybrid Boss]

I was actually just trying to be friendly. (Guess I'm just not good at it.)

Been there.

 

[Alpan]

Never mind the title: This is actually the Lilura thread the Codex deserves.

I'm not one to get involved in IE-related discussions -- honestly, I don't see the point -- but I would like to give thanks for her oceanic knowledge of NWN modules: I've read (and gone on to download) many of her recommendations and look forward to playing Swordflight later in the year.

 

[Lilura]

Thanks! I've actually only scratched the surface of NWN modules, 717 of which are listed by me in alphabetical order in Core (I've added to that post as recently as yesterday). But I can't imagine anything being remotely comparable to Swordflight, since none of the other Hall of Fame modules come close (at least in regard to the principles of design I appreciate). If I was the CEO of Larian/Obsidian/whoever, I would be looking to hire Rogueknight 333. Without meaning to come across as too much of a base-flatterer, I haven't met anyone with his knowledge of RPGs. His reasoning for why he designed something the way he did is also thorough-going.

 

[Elex]

i have a sexual fetish about magic missiles, btw.

 

[Lilura]

Ok, next post is up:

Planescape: Torment — Tanking & Physical-Based Damage Dealing (AC, DR, HPs, Regen, THAC0, ApR, Strength, Itemization)

 

[Alkarl]

Lil, a couple of criticisms:

Your blog posts are generally very informative and written with a very authoritative tone; but this previous post, your part one, was rife with condescension and sprinkled with smugness. The end cap of this post was the worst offender where you basically shit on some people on reddit? Why? I don't think addressing them is worth your time, especially if, like you said, they've written off your blog in its entirety.

Also, you complained a couple times about how buggy some parts of the game are while insisting on playing without community mods or patches. I get what you're trying to address, but at this point, after all these years, can we safely say the best way to experience and play this game is with that community support? I'd argue this is the way most people are going to play this game, provided they haven't been ripped off by beamdog.

While I can't help but agree with many of your criticisms, I also feel like criticizing PS:T for being combat light and dialogue heavy is a lot like criticizing water for being wet. I actually really enjoyed your second post about tanking, et al, and I think it is a topic that could use this kind of treatment, even in this kind of game. However, I don't feel like PS:T is really your cup of tea. The initial article is pretty tone deaf. You go from a tone of condescension when talking about versions, to glib smugness when talking about the games lack of interesting combat and wordiness, to waxing nostalgic about certain parts of the OST and different character dialogues. There isn't much to bridge these gaps.

I hope to see you approach this game from a different angle, and that a future post will touch on playing with community fixes.

 

[Lilura]

1. Part I is a very general overview, and PS:T is an odd game: it has stellar aspects and shit aspects; that's why the tone shifts.

2. The forum-posting fanbase for PS:T is disgusting. 19 years of liars, posers and pretentious illiterati. I have every right to criticize them. I also have every right to start criticizing individual posters. Mmm... maybe I will. If you have a l'il muscle why not flex it a bit?

3. Fixes and mods are not the original game. I play the originals, bugs and all. PS:T v1.1, ToEE patch2, IWD 1.06 etc. If people want to remember what a game is like, they will go to my blog.

I've covered PS:T mods, anyway. Just not in retrospectives (that would be effrontery).

4. Being against my criticism of PS:T combat/dialogue, and being pro-mods, makes me devalue you as a poster.

 

[Fairfax]

Overall, Dragon Age: Origins > BG2.

Better characters, better writing, better combat, better C&C.

Do you stand by that? Just curious, considering the more extreme turn you've taken.