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KickStarter King Arthur: Knight's Tale + Legion IX standalone expansion - dark fantasy turn-based tactical RPG from NeocoreGames

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What's the matter Eurogamer, can't recommend two tactical RPGs in the same month? https://www.eurogamer.net/king-arthur-knights-tale-review-nice-ideas-cant-lift-a-trudgy-core

King Arthur: Knight's Tale review - nice ideas can't lift a trudgy core
Bors.



A dark RPG-strategy hybrid that's not without its pleasures, but tends towards numb repetition and becomes a slog.

I once got bullied out of going to see the film A Knight's Tale by the cashier at the cinema. He took one look at me and my brother and thought he saw kindred spirits."Do you like cars?" he asked. "Um..." we stalled. "You should go and see Fast and Furious," he said. But we didn't want to: we wanted to see Heath Ledger. So naturally we agreed and went to watch the cars, and I've never seen A Knight's Tale since.

King Arthur: A Knight's Tale is from Van Helsing studio NeocoreGames, which has made King Arthur before. King Arthur: The Role-Playing Wargame came out in 2009, and there was a sequel in 2012, but whereas those games were a blend of RPG and real-time strategy, meaning huge battles with hundreds or thousands of units, this new game brings it all in on a smaller scale. It's much more like XCOM.

Missions involve running a party of four around smallish maps and fighting a few battles. There's a bit of dialogue sprinkled in, a few choices to make, but everything is usually solved by fighting. And when you fight, it's turn-based. The space around your heroes turns into a grid and you're governed by available action points and abilities. It's very familiar.

After the missions, there's a lot more to do. You'll get the XP and loot you earned during the mission, which may mean levelling up and choosing new skills, or re-equipping your characters, and you also get a chance to do things to - and in - Camelot.

"Nothing ever seems to stretch the player. There's never that feeling of having overcome, or having solved, a particularly tricky puzzle or battle."

You are in charge of Camelot, you see (you can have a base elsewhere - there's a choice - but I chose Camelot) and it's in ruins so you need to rebuild it, using money and a building resource you earn doing missions. Gradually, you rebuild places like the Cathedral and Hospice and Training Grounds, and doing so brings added functionality.

The Cathedral, for instance, is where your characters' heal injuries they suffer during battle. They can get the Plague, which isn't helpful, or Lethargy - there's a whole load of things. And you get rid of these by sticking them in the Cathedral for a mission or two. How long it takes depends on upgrades to the Cathedral.

The Training Grounds, meanwhile, give your heroes XP and levels them up, which is particularly useful for keeping characters you don't choose for missions up to speed. And all of your buildings can be improved by upgrades, getting you better equipment and bonuses and so on, so there's a whole base-building side-game to consider.

It's not much but I call it home. It's actually quite pretty fullscreen, but there is a tinge of smog to it all, in keeping with the game's atmosphere, and it doesn't help present it well here.

Central to all of this, of course, is your Round Table, where you recruit and appoint your champions, and give them titles, which is fun (and improves their loyalty, and gives bonuses) and you will attract a lot of names from legend to you. You can only take four on missions, though, so that means - as seems to be the way in RPGs - a lot of them will be sitting around, scratching their bottoms.

But not here! Here, you can send them away on quests, which is a lovely nod to Arthurian legend and all the relentless questing there, though it's all a bit po-faced here rather than silly, which is a missed opportunity if you ask me. Events pop up on the world map with outcomes to choose from, and one of them usually involves sending one of your knights away to deal with it (meaning they'll be unavailable for a mission or two).

What you choose has consequences, which is another area of the game I find appealing. Knight's Tale records your choices and then plots them on a graph, which is a cross shape, with tyranny and benevolence at either ends of the vertical line, and Old Gods and Christianity at either ends of the horizontal line. Choices all favour one of those things, and a little marker tracks your progress. It takes a while to move it but it's a fun kind of encouragement to role-play, though the depictions of good and evil are a bit juvenile.


I love these portraits (apart from Mordred's), and while it looks like there are lots of lovely stats and skills to play around with, they don't really come into play until later, if it all. Selecting a higher difficulty would bring them more into focus.

Choices also affect character loyalty towards you, and if their loyalty is good, they can get positive buffs, and if it's bad, negative effects. And, naturally, they all like different things.

It's this area of the game, around the core, that I really like. I enjoy tinkering with characters' skills and equipment and making the most out of my Camelot, and juggling my roster as I manage training, quests and injuries. And it's all put together in an attractive, if dour, kind of way - browns and stone greys, and rusty iron hues. I appreciate the effort.

What I'm less keen on is the core of the game itself, the missions, and it's a frustratingly fundamental problem to have. There are a few reasons why. The moment to moment combat seems to lack sophistication. There are things like attacks of opportunity, cover, overwatch, buffs, debuffs, magic - all things that are familiar to players of turn-based games - but even with it all in play, there never seems to be much strategy to battle. It's usually just 'walk there, whack that'. Nothing ever seems to stretch the player. There's never that feeling of having overcome, or having solved, a particularly tricky puzzle or battle.

In Knight's Tale's defence, it does get better. As you get to higher levels and unlock more abilities - enemies too - there's more variation on the battlefield. But not that much more. And by that time, it's repeated a thin formula so much you'll be all but worn out on it, leaving the game feeling like a trudge.


A battle, and a better lit one than most. There are typically a lot of trash enemies and few interesting ones to fight - or few that fight strategically as a team.

This trudginess is reinforced by the game's technical struggles. It's not a looker, particularly - it can convey an atmosphere but it looks dated when up close - and this choice of grim-dark and murky mires what the game has available to work with, leaving it all feeling a bit dreary. It doesn't run particularly well either, and while some of this is probably to do with my ageing machine, I don't get the impression it's well optimised. And beyond that, there's an inherent lethargy to how it moves, to how the characters' move and how they attack. Sometimes that works in Knight's Tale's favour, like when one of your armoured knights swings a giant sword like a life-sized stone chess piece would, and it comes crashing down on an enemy, but usually it lacks zip. You can hold the spacebar to speed turns up but it doesn't eradicate the sluggishness.

There's also very little variation in missions, not just in terms of where they take place, but also what you do in them. The structure always seems to be the same: run slowly around a bit, talk to a character, follow some arrows on the map to some battles, which all feel the same, maybe fight a boss, and done. And I know "boss" sounds exciting but they aren't. They tend to look just like the other enemies. Only one or two have stood out, and they died without much of a fuss.

It's a shame. I'd happily see fewer missions and trash battles in favour of more imagination and surprise, and it would really help getting players to more exciting enemies quicker.


Getting a feel for the gloominess? Here's that morality tracker chart, and a multiple choice 'event'.

It could also do with being a good whack more difficult, though this is something you can rectify by dialling it up a notch at the start, and I suggest you do. Normal is too easy. There's even a Roguelite mode if you fancy it, which doesn't let you freely save and load. A bit more challenge might help bring more elements of Knight's Tale into play, as you pick up more injuries and are forced to use substitute picks, and it could help battles feel less mindless. Then again, it could exacerbate an already slog-like core.

There's things to like here. Wooden as the story and characters can be, I still like the fantasy, and I find the reverence endearing. And there are some lovely touches relating to it, like duels you can fight in missions instead of pitched group battles. They're just one-on-ones but they mix the formula up a bit.

A lot could be achieved with tuning and tweaks, and I've no doubt NeocoreGames will continue to do exactly that. But there's a creakier core that will be harder to solve. King Arthur: Knight's Tale is not without its charms, then, but it's not the once and future king you might have been waiting for. Maybe watch Fast and Furious instead.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
"Nothing ever seems to stretch the player. There's never that feeling of having overcome, or having solved, a particularly tricky puzzle or battle."
:what:

it should be illegal to review games if you play them on the easiest difficulty
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
xsgkRRI.png
 

Saravan

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You know a game is hitting the right spots when it triggers game journalists and the casualized crowd. I'm not saying this is the best tactical RPG of all time but it sure as fuck is a solid title that has come out in recent years.
 

Harthwain

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I have a question about alignment: is it possible to get points in the opposite aspects (Tyranny vs Rightfulness and Old Faith vs Christianity) of the chart or are different points invalidating each other? I mean, can I get 3 points of Tyranny and 5 Rightfulness or will I just end up with 2 Rightfulness (because 5 - 3 = 2)?
 

Shackleton

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I'm appreciating the way you can alter what happens in the missions. I'm not sure if it affects anything other than the loyalty of the heroes with you, but I've had options to bargain instead of fight and in one of the recruitment missions, the option to sacrifice the knight I was coming to recruit as he'd turned out to be a total moron. Being intentionally vague, but that same mission looked like it could play out three different ways, albeit quite minor differences.

It'd be nice if these choices opened up other side missions but maybe that's a bit optimistic. Still, I'm liking that the 'evil' path isn't just totally cartoon villainy. Each tyrant choice does have some discernible logic behind it that elevates it above the likes of Bioware kitten-kicking for the sake of it.

Also going to have to bump it up to Very Hard now as I'm breezing through lvl 9-10 missions.
 

Saravan

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Later one, it's always has been a scale, in the same sense of the DnD classical axe.

If you unlock something in one part of the scale, it stays unlocked even if you move to another quadrant.

Are you sure? I just tested this. Was at 18 tyrant and had unlocked Extra Yield. Picked a righteous option and went 17 tyrant and lost the Extra Yield as well.
 

Saravan

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Welp. I finished the game on classic mode, I died way earlier on roguemode. Tried for 2 hours to kill the final boss on very hard but ultimately gave up and finished on hard. Kudos to anyone who manages to do it on the hardest difficulty (without abusing the shit out of Balin or Tegyr).

There will also spawn an additional 3 end-game bosses after the final story boss (King Arthur) is killed. They are even more insane.
 
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Generic-Giant-Spider

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Welp. I finished the game on classic mode, I died way earlier on roguemode. Tried for 2 hours to kill the final boss on very hard but ultimately gave up and finished on hard. Kudos to anyone who manages to do it on the hardest difficulty (without abusing the shit out of Balin or Tegyr).

There will also spawn an additional 3 end-game bosses after the final story boss (King Arthur) is killed. They are even more insane.

How long was your playthrough?
 

Jermu

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Just finished this one Christ-righteous on hard. Surprised how good this game is great setting and quite long. Got kinda bored to random fights nearly end game so I tuned in pinball Lancelot which was kinda fun.

Played around with quite many characters since its easy to keep 8 chars evenly leveled.

Defenders only used Mordred since no point really to level 2 of those. Quite nice class with a lot of options.
Champions used Kay and swapped to Lancelot. Another nice and somewhat balanced class unless you go with teleport build.
Marksman is shit middle-late game but fine early. Edit unless you go for some AP each kill + damage each kill build then it can become strong
Vanguards yeah broken as hell. Still pinball Lancelot is probably stronger for most of encounters.
Arcanists are good early-middle but kinda fall off end game. I only tried Ector but other characters skilltrees were looking kinda meh.
Sage is probably my favorite class used Guinevere pretty much every fight. Damage is okayish with backstabs which is easy with teleport and great support skills.

Tried first postgame boss and it was quite easy even when I skipped every postgame side mission and being 5 levels under.

Dont think Im going to replay this for a while since its quite long and dont think story is going to be different enough to justify another playthrough.
Back to chalice 2
 
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Saravan

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Welp. I finished the game on classic mode, I died way earlier on roguemode. Tried for 2 hours to kill the final boss on very hard but ultimately gave up and finished on hard. Kudos to anyone who manages to do it on the hardest difficulty (without abusing the shit out of Balin or Tegyr).

There will also spawn an additional 3 end-game bosses after the final story boss (King Arthur) is killed. They are even more insane.

How long was your playthrough?

I believe it was around 35-40 hours.
 

Jermu

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Around that long yeah. Post game is quite letdown can finish it very quickly. I was severely underleveled but nothing that few double AP potions cannot fix. Potions in general are very broken without AP cost and can chug two in a row.
 

Saravan

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From my perspective on Very Hard difficulty, I would say that in terms of difficulty and the pacing of such that it's very challenging early game (Act 1 to beginning of Act 2). The difficulty starts to fall off during mid-game (Act 2 to mid Act 3), especially if you get lucky with relics. From the first Deepwoods-related mission in mid Act 3 until Act 4 the difficulty picks up again at a rapid pace and becomes even more challenging during Act 4 due to Fomorians. The final story boss was just impossible for me at this difficulty setting. Unfortunately, however, due to Vanguards being a completely broken class if built correctly (+AP per kill from passives/relics and combined with buffs such as blessed/inspire from party members and stacked with bless potions if really needed for bosses) they can trivialize the entire game, even on Very Hard. Disregarding that unbalanced factor, if you don't abuse the stealth/jump mechanic of the Vanguard, and I don't blame you if you do, the game is really challenging overall on the highest difficulty setting.
 

Generic-Giant-Spider

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Yep I want it to be known I am abusing Vanguard until the end of the game and if anybody shames me I'll grapple ya.
 

Modron

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Yep I want it to be known I am abusing Vanguard until the end of the game and if anybody shames me I'll grapple ya.
Codex loves cheese, look at Serpent in the Staglands where all the character building advice is just use one character to kite the enemies while the rest of your party pelts them with ranged attacks or KotC 2 see that hard enemy, just have your fighter hug him.
 

Generic-Giant-Spider

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Why would we shame you? If you want to lower the difficulty to Very Easy outside of the menus, it's totally up to you :smug:

I'll have you know I held the "Stop & Go" construction sign when the path of least resistance was being paved. I'm a disgrace, nigga.
 

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