Dragon Age must sell 2 million copies

[Pablosdog]

I don't have a problem with unified inventories, it removes hassle.

And how the fuck do stats relate to inventory management?

 

[Volourn]

"In Icewind dale my fighters always have the strong back feat so as to be able to carry massive loads, ending up with all my stuff in 1 inventory ANYWAY. "

Been awhile since I played IWD, but isn't this impossible no matter your character's strength since in the IE games you are limited how much loot you can carry not just by strength but by inventory space? Hmmm...

 

[Darth Roxor]

Who are we to dicate what games casual gamers, can and can't play.

Casual gamers can play whatever the fuck they want, as long as it doesn't fuck up the stuff I want to play, and if 'baaaaawwww, game_x is teh hard', grow some fucking balls and take your beating or don't play at all, simple as that.

Why is Auto-regeneration bad ? They penalize you if you die. It's just like saving and reloading in Baldurs gate, minus the annoying loading screen. With either one you end up with less resources after the battle - a series of encounters will still wear down your resources.

Are you shitting me or are you really this dumb? Saving + reloading actually requires you to replay a scenario, change the way you approach it etc.

Both penalize you if you die? You mean, the great penalty of 'Right, let's use kamikaze tactics but remember about keeping AT LEAST ONE GUY ALIVE OR WE WON'T REZ AND REGEN AFTER THE FIGHT!!!!!' in the case of regen, opposed to handling all party members with care, because you can actually lose them for, like, forever in extreme situations?

Either one will make you end up with less resources after the battle? No. Autoregen will make you end up with less resources DURING the battle, because there's absolutely no need to use any healing spell/potion/whatever after it, while no regen means you have to plan ahead with inventory management and often take risks (should I risk resting and getting raepd by encounters or drink up one of the last healing potions?)

 

[DreadMessiah]

Last healing potion in DA? hahahahahahhahaha Potions! Last! hahahahhaaha They made them waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too easy and cheap to make. I had 100+ of minor/normal mana and health potions at 13th lvl with 200+ gold on nightmare pc version. The problem with dnd system was while potions were expensive or not beneficial (low level/high level) clerics were mobile healing/ressurecting machines. How is that better than regeneration? Between sleeping anywhere with a simple reload sometimes due to "random" encounters and a healing spam bot or two dnd was not exactly hard. Half-elf cleric/mages ruled 2nd edition games like BG and IWD. Healing spam bot plus unleasher of fury bot with great saves. Yup real hard.

 

[Grunker]

The Witcher had the perfect solution for that cramp at least, for all its flaws. The toxicity-system and the actual integration of potions into the tactical system. Something like this could easily be implemented into the sturdier (aka better) systems than that of the Witcher.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

Who are we to dicate what games casual gamers, can and can't play.

Casual gamers can play whatever the fuck they want, as long as it doesn't fuck up the stuff I want to play, and if 'baaaaawwww, game_x is teh hard', grow some fucking balls and take your beating or don't play at all, simple as that.

Do tell, what happens in this case?

By the way you guys keep discussing game mechanics like this is rocket science. It's a game, the mechanics work perfectly fine for it. I don't spend my free time thinking about if and why X is better than Z as long as the game is fun and challenging.

 

[1eyedking]

You are easily amused Marcelo. I personally prefer my <s>comedy</s> fun to be of a more cereberal nature.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

You are easily amused Marcelo. I personally prefer my comedy fun to be of a more cereberal nature.

Fixed. Gotta keep up with the times grandpa :wink:

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

The Witcher had the perfect solution for that cramp at least, for all its flaws. The toxicity-system and the actual integration of potions into the tactical system. Something like this could easily be implemented into the sturdier (aka better) systems than that of the Witcher.

That is a good point, actually. I would really like to see a system like that applied to other games. For all of the game's flaws (and there are many), it's alchemy system was definitely not one of them.

 

[1eyedking]

Fixed. Gotta keep up with the times grandpa :wink:

 

[Lesifoere]

As for games and movies - I will be the first to agree that the majority of movies (and games) are crap. But games can learn from movies none the less, camera angles and sound etc - directing. There's nothing wrong with a game giving you some cinematic moments.

So go play Final Fantasy 10, moron. I hear in some of those games you can even give your characters pretty dresses.

Dnd is not easy to learn

If your cerebral capacity is on the same level as that of a dead snail, sure.

Someone deport this dimwit back to the Bio boards.

 

[Grifthin]

You just love selectively quoting what I said, don't you ? Dnd as a system isn't intuitive. There are MANY rules systems other than dnd that are easier to learn and provide ample role playing opportunities. Don't get me wrong, I love Dnd - especially the 3.5ed rules, but many other games systems have simpler systems that allow you to roleplay whatever you want.

@ DreadMessiah - yes and a lesser/normal potion that you had hundreds of does absolutely fuck all for a fighter that has hundreds of HPs. Come back to me and tell me how many thousands of potent/greater potions you had, since it can easily cost you dozens of gold for a few of them, preventing you from buying high level gear.

@ Grunker - Agreed, the witcher Potion system was one of the best so far. Loved the Toxicity system.

 

[AlaCarcuss]

Both penalize you if you die? You mean, the great penalty of 'Right, let's use kamikaze tactics but remember about keeping AT LEAST ONE GUY ALIVE OR WE WON'T REZ AND REGEN AFTER THE FIGHT!!!!!' in the case of regen, opposed to handling all party members with care, because you can actually lose them for, like, forever in extreme situations?

Are you shitting me - this never fucking works in DA. The mobs will always hunt your remaining member down and kill him/her. I always handle each member with care for this very reason - been wiped too many times on hard.

Honestly, way too much is being made out of this rez/regen thing in DA. I'm sick of hearing about it. You get injuries when you fall and they stack up. So you have to use injury kits rather than pots post battle? - bug fucking deal.

There are already mods that make falling in battle have more serious consequenses, for all you fucking hardcore prima donnas - no doubt there'll be plenty more. But, I agree with VD, this is rez/regen done right.

 

[Drakron]

"In Icewind dale my fighters always have the strong back feat so as to be able to carry massive loads, ending up with all my stuff in 1 inventory ANYWAY. "

Been awhile since I played IWD, but isn't this impossible no matter your character's strength since in the IE games you are limited how much loot you can carry not just by strength but by inventory space? Hmmm...

Both, there was a limited slot inventory and the weight that could be carried by that character was tied to the character strength.

The Strong Back feat added 50% of more carry weight but considering how inventory was limited by slots it simply was not very useful, maybe for fighters that had a take a feat but could not pick one that was useful for their build.

 

[Grifthin]

And the fact that most fighters had 18+ strength so they could carry a veritable ton of heavy gear like different kinds of plate armor etc. Did you have different tabs too ? (been a long while since i played it.)

 

[GarfunkeL]

Pablosdog & Grifthin

What's wrong with making things more convenient - how does it make a game better if it's more cumbersome to do things ?

We have completely different outlooks on how PC gaming and especially RPG's should play like. I don't think any amount of tug-o-war between us here would result in anything meaningful. You two are part of the reason no-one makes Arcanum 2 or ToEE 2. Or why GoldBox-series are still the most hardcore DnD games ever made (and no, it's not about the UI).

And could you kindly stop with the lies about the complexity of DnD? Fuck, if you want complexity, bring out GURPS and you have a valid argument. Especially your claim of the difficulties of 2nd ed player would have for jumping into 3rd ed. Boo-hoo, if such idiots exist, they should live in a padded room in some institute. Not influencing the games I get in the future because they want to pay for shitty crap.

 

[Grifthin]

We do rather don't we ?

I'm all for a Arcanum 2 or ToEE 2 - it sucks that Troika went down the shitter. I really like the arcanum steam punk setting, even though the combat was horribly, gorribly broken.

How am I telling lies ? Paranoia, Risus, Old Core World of Darkness, Freeform, labyrinth Lord - these are all systems that newbies normally find easier to get into.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Do tell, what happens in this case?

teh dumbin' downz.

Honestly, way too much is being made out of this rez/regen thing in DA. I'm sick of hearing about it. You get injuries when you fall and they stack up. So you have to use injury kits rather than pots post battle? - bug fucking deal.

Yeah, except that I heard that the injuries are laughably weak (want to see how injuries should work and fuck you up completely? Play Betrayal at Krondor and run to mommy) and healing kits seem to be lying around everywhere so there're no shortages of them (again, compare to Krondor where in the later parts almost every enemy carries poisoned weapons, but alas, your supplies of silverthorn antidote are very, very, VERY limited).

 

[Grunker]

Both Grifthin's statements about videogames learning from cinema as well as the complexity of D&D are good points. Aside from my studying, I've been working with team-building and in an institution. Both places being in charge of roleplaying. Both children and grown-ups learn other systems than D&D 3.0/5 notably faster. The system is also retardedly difficult to master, actually, mainly because it's not a system. It's puts up a lot of rules, sure, but a system is defined by being coherent with these rules. D&D breaks itself and uses different parameters to describe stuff.

The above is the key reason for the choice of dumbing dumb 4th ed. They just forget to make it intuitive, so the children still prefer other systems.

The cinematic lessons we can learn are selfexplanatory, really. We are dealing with a visual medium. No reason we can't learn from the best in that case, just as when it comes to the quality of writing.

 

[Grifthin]

Dear Gods - Grunker, quickly disagree with me, the codex can't have you being reasonble!

 

[Dionysus]

Yeah, except that I heard that the injuries are laughably weak (want to see how injuries should work and fuck you up completely? Play Betrayal at Krondor and run to mommy) and healing kits seem to be lying around everywhere so there're no shortages of them (again, compare to Krondor where in the later parts almost every enemy carries poisoned weapons, but alas, your supplies of silverthorn antidote are very, very, VERY limited).

In my experience, the system does punish the player for repeatedly squeezing through battles with only one or two characters surviving. But I certainly can get away with that once in a while. I start to notice the presence of injuries when my characters get a couple, at which point the injuries will beget more injuries.

I think the real problem with the criticisms against autoregen is that they tend to ignore the obvious problems with most games that employ an alternative. DA is just one instance of autoregen, and I think it works better than some games that don't use that system, like Bioware's BG series.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Bah, I never claimed that DnD is the easiest system out there. I wrote that saying DnD is too difficult to learn / takes a long time to learn is completely wrong.

Aping Hollywood hasn't really produced anything awesome in games. It has only lead to hugely increased install-sizes and general dumbing down.

 

[baronjohn]

Hopefully it'll sell like 100 copies on the PC and Bioware will finally get the message and quit making PC games.

Their shitty games belong on the PS3 or something.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Hopefully it'll sell like 100 copies on the PC and Bioware will finally get the message and quit making PC games.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Hopefully it'll sell like 100 copies on the PC and Bioware will finally get the message and quit making PC games.

Their shitty games belong on the PS3 or something.

So much hate in this one... Well, at least if Skyway gets hit by a bus, we'll have a backup ready in no time.