Incline Colony Ship RELEASE THREAD

[Pink Eye]

Neither your post nor the lengthier apologia from Pink Eye are addressing the basic fact that evasion does not do anything.

You're acting like this is a negative, if anything, this is a good thing. Evasion by itself shouldn't be giving you the ability to dodge bullets, but should serve as a supplementary source to increase defense on top of wearing armor.

 

[notpl]

Neither your post nor the lengthier apologia from Pink Eye are addressing the basic fact that evasion does not do anything.

You're acting like this is a negative, if anything, this is a good thing. Evasion by itself shouldn't be giving you the ability to dodge bullets, but should serve as a supplementary source to increase defense on top of wearing armor.

It's very frustrating how you keep deliberately sidestepping my point - I don't see anything to suggest you're too stupid to understand it, so this is the only explanation I'm left with.

First of all, let's address this ridiculous "you can't dodge bullets" notion. Of course you can. Shoot a couple of cans in your yard and then try to hit a squirrel from that same distance. Are these two tasks equivalent in difficulty? Congratulations! You've just confronted an evasion build in the wild - they can be rather effective.

Secondly, if evasion is intended to be a lesser supplemental defense skill, then why does it cost the same skill and feat resources as armor? You say one is intended to supplement the other, but these two qualities come at a direct cost to one another, and one is flatly superior for survivability. Even a fast-handed dex build is going to receive greater defensive benefits from tagging Armor Handling than Evasion, and from taking Armored Warfare rather than Artful Dodger. The game is quite literally tricking players by presenting them as two equivalent-seeming options that compete for the same resources. It is the very definition of a "trap option."

 

[True Ukrainian]

Because a fast handed gunslinger doesn't want to eat the AP penalty from wearing heavy armor?

 

[notpl]

Because a fast handed gunslinger doesn't want to eat the AP penalty from wearing heavy armor?

And the armored character does? No build "wants" to have less AP. Again, you're introducing a totally separate argument to avoid confronting the primary one: that evasion is flatly inferior to armor handling yet carries the same costs, which in an RPG implies that they will yield equivalent results.

 

[Pink Eye]

Of course you can.

Is that right? I would love to see you dodge an automatic rifle spraying within your general vicinity. Golly gee I sure do wonder why all these companies keep investing millions into defensive equipment in order to supply our troops with the best combat armor, bullet vests, when they can simply just dodge the bullets. It's that easy, right? After all, a semi-automatic firearm missing a target such as a squirrel which is difficult to line shots up when it scurries around quickly is equatable to the situations a ship borne would find themselves in.

Even a fast-handed dex build is going to receive greater defensive benefits from tagging Armor Handling than Evasion

Not really. No. Evasion has its uses. One of which is freeing that character from donning heavy armor with heftier penalties. Building for evasion assumes you're stilling wearing the best armor your character can realistically equip in order to mitigate grazes.

 

[notpl]

I apologize for over-crediting your intelligence in my earlier post.

 

[True Ukrainian]

Because a fast handed gunslinger doesn't want to eat the AP penalty from wearing heavy armor?

And the armored character does? No build "wants" to have less AP. Again, you're introducing a totally separate argument to avoid confronting the primary one: that evasion is flatly inferior to armor handling yet carries the same costs, which in an RPG implies that they will yield equivalent results.

The trade off between armor and evasion isn't in skill points alone. Wearing heavy armor prevents the character from using the powerful legshot headshot combo in a single turn which neuters most enemies. It prevents them from effectively using rifles. There is an opportunity cost in taking heavy armor.

 

[TheDarkUrge]

Neither your post nor the lengthier apologia from Pink Eye are addressing the basic fact that evasion does not do anything.

You're acting like this is a negative, if anything, this is a good thing. Evasion by itself shouldn't be giving you the ability to dodge bullets, but should serve as a supplementary source to increase defense on top of wearing armor.

It's very frustrating how you keep deliberately sidestepping my point - I don't see anything to suggest you're too stupid to understand it, so this is the only explanation I'm left with.

First of all, let's address this ridiculous "you can't dodge bullets" notion. Of course you can. Shoot a couple of cans in your yard and then try to hit a squirrel from that same distance. Are these two tasks equivalent in difficulty? Congratulations! You've just confronted an evasion build in the wild - they can be rather effective.

Secondly, if evasion is intended to be a lesser supplemental defense skill, then why does it cost the same skill and feat resources as armor? You say one is intended to supplement the other, but these two qualities come at a direct cost to one another, and one is flatly superior for survivability. Even a fast-handed dex build is going to receive greater defensive benefits from tagging Armor Handling than Evasion, and from taking Armored Warfare rather than Artful Dodger. The game is quite literally tricking players by presenting them as two equivalent-seeming options that compete for the same resources. It is the very definition of a "trap option."

It's time to pull out the spreadsheets lads and post effective HP of evasion+shields/distortion or armor+shields/distortion

Personally I went with evasion for everyone but Jed cause I dont wanna bother with adjusting armor every time I find some loot

 

[Cyberarmy]

but unless I'm being retarded something seems a bit off with the game's pathfinding.

Weird, I've actually been pretty impressed with how good the pathfinding has been, at least in the early areas. Maybe it still needs some tweaking to deal with some of the later environments?

My only big problem about the game is pathfinding, especially if I order somewhere far. It happens mostly because party members keep bumping each other. I don't like to teleport around but this forces me to do that mostly.
Kinda reminded me of good'ol Fallout 1 days where Ian traps you into a corner and you either had to kill him or reload and older save.

 

[ItsChon]

I have a few quick questions.

Just to confirm, the game is fully finished and ready to play, right?

What is the rough length of the game?

How does the difficulty of the combat encounters compare to AoD and Dungeon Rats?

What is the general consensus so far on the games overall quality?

Excited to finally play this!

 

[Cyberarmy]

Just to confirm, the game is fully finished and ready to play, right?

Yes, it is finished.

What is the rough length of the game?

20-25 hours with replayability. But I don't think this one is as replayable as AoD. Edit: Because of party members, if you have full party you can do most stuff that game offers. That was not possible in AoD.

How does the difficulty of the combat encounters compare to AoD and Dungeon Rats?

It is easier if you go with party. Harder if you go alone. Edit: But consumables are OP and a well placed grenade will trivialize most of the fights.

What is the general consensus so far on the games overall quality?

Dunno, I'm a bit torn. Don't get me wrong, as a sci-fi lover, I'm loving the setting and lore but game haven't charmed me yet like AoD did. I'm having fun but I'm not planning builds or thinking about the game while AFK which I do for the RPGs I love.

 

[Camel]

Used sneak to break into an apartment and...
View attachment 43354

Didn't expect to see racemixing in this game

Black male - white female too.

 

[Lord of Riva]

The game falls of towards the end content wise, as others have stated here, we seem to come all to the same conclusion seemingly, it's the best idea to ally with the fourth faction that seems less about furthering their own power base and instead focusing on actually ending the conflicts.

In the end that means, for me, that the factions don't do what they are supposed to do, they fail to make the decisions interesting, or in other words the factions are basically all the same. The endgame is really wierd as well, My last fight was in the Hydroponics red Zone after that it was only talking and a bit of persuasion checks as I never waged open war on any of the factions before and convinced them all to stand down.

There is this fancy Beliefs and Reputation system in game but it does not do anything really, I had *one* skill check influenced by good reputation after being forced to give the machine to one of the factions that's it.

The mutants are completely underutilized, why even have them there for this short interaction you have with them.

All in all I enjoyed the premise, the exploration, contrary to what many stated the "learn by doing system" and the fights, warts and all.
The game is lacking in the story department, getting the setting across well but lacking in the details, it seems more like a sightseeing show to some extent I had trouble understanding the motivations of most characters tbh. and I did not enjoy being railroaded into paths, rather than having nuance and having the story just retcon former decisions.

like

Spoiler

Getting the factory completely controlled by the Keepers or trying to ally the pit, the shuttlebay and other independent factions for the monks to just shut them down.

Difficulty wise I found it to be relatively easy, I couldn't be arsed to fight against old bub though, I had two party wipes in turn two and though to myself that it's not worth it.

No regret buying it, I had fun, it's rather short though for an RPG.

 

[Tigranes]

for above - I think the game has the story & 'world map' scoped for a fairly big RPG, but not the amount of resources/content. I would personally have loved to see the Pit stay the hub the whole game, have some extra places where you keep hearing about the Habitat and its goings-on ... meeting Mother and her refugees who tell tales of the Shuttle Bay, intercepting, ambushing and negotiating faction envoys and expeditions near the Pit, maybe trying to repair an alternative train route, always hearing unconfirmed rumours and hearsay about each faction and the journey to Proxima.

Meeting all the faction chiefs and visiting the hubs in this short way weakens the setting, I think, and there's simply way too many characters per screen time. Thematically, hearing distant rumours of the factions or even that we might soon be approaching Proxima or that the Ship may be breaking down, feels much more interesting as an echo of the Mutiny and even of origin stories about the journey itself.

That said, I imagine that originally ITS may have expected to fill things out more, that most players probably still want to visit and see these places, and that this is a problem that haunts almost every great RPG in the genre's history.

 

[Zanzoken]

I started playing this evening and got a few hours in. Very early impressions...

- The combat feels good and familiar. There is a nice variety of ranged weapons.

- Love the addition of feats to the character system. I don't understand the design goal behind making the skills learn-by-doing, but we'll see.

- The ability to pick between different game starts in AoD (i.e. assassin, praetor, merchant, etc) was a great feature that I feel is sorely missed here. Those were excellent at immediately anchoring your character into the world and inserting them into the game's plot in an organic way. In CS you are essentially shoehorned into a position of prominence in the first main quest and feels very Chosen One ish.

- Speaking of, the Pit in general is not a very fun starting area to explore or navigate. I guess thematically this makes sense given that it's essentially a dark, sprawling mess of shipping containers, but it kind of reminds me of Taris / Peragus from the KOTORs (i.e. the long, boring level that you have to beat before you get to start doing fun cool Jedi stuff). The level's use of verticality also feels weird in combination with the fixed isometric camera.

- Crafting and Lore are strange omissions, given how prominent they were in AoD. I know, every fucking game has crafting now, but the post-apocalyptic genre is one of the few where you expect to see it. And this setting has the same "there is power in unearthing the secrets of the past" type of vibe that AoD had.

Will post more as I get farther in. I don't like it as much as AoD based on what I've seen so far, but I am having fun and happy to keep playing. I think I'll restart with a custom build though (started with the Warrior preset).

 

[Pink Eye]

Jesus Christ. How do you miss two shots in a row while in point blank. Was she distracted thinking about random shit? Just how. She rolled so badly she didn't even graze.

Screenshot

 

[True Ukrainian]

Accuracy should be tweaked. Missing point blank shots with a shotgun is ridiculous.

 

[Pink Eye]

Accuracy should be tweaked. Missing point blank shots with a shotgun is ridiculous.

Doing a graze would be fine too, but come on, rolling so badly you miss completely while in point blank is just silly.

 

[Whisper]

Neither your post nor the lengthier apologia from Pink Eye are addressing the basic fact that evasion does not do anything.

You're acting like this is a negative, if anything, this is a good thing. Evasion by itself shouldn't be giving you the ability to dodge bullets, but should serve as a supplementary source to increase defense on top of wearing armor.

Yes, this is bad combat balance and design that Evasion does not really work while DR stacking is the king and is anwer to everything.

In Dungeon rats both Evasion (Dodge) and DR (Block) builds were viable.
This is clear decline.

 

[cvv]

Of course you can.

Is that right? I would love to see you dodge an automatic rifle spraying within your general vicinity.

Then watch Commando.

/thread

 

[jackofshadows]

I haven't really seen anything yet where you can steal an important item.

There's also some metagaming involved where you know Lockpick, Bio and Steal gets starter training, whereas Computer, for example, is a strong candidate for tagging.

After submitting first psy brain you can pass 3 steal check in order to steal a battery mk1 for gadget.

And the same chick there in hydroponics green teaches basic computers.

 

[Alienman]

Jesus Christ. How do you miss two shots in a row while in point blank. Was she distracted thinking about random shit? Just how. She rolled so badly she didn't even graze.

Screenshot

Welcome to X-com, baby.

 

[Technomancer]

I would personally have loved to see the Pit stay the hub the whole game, have some extra places where you keep hearing about the Habitat and its goings-on

Very early, like before anything was made I think this was the plan. With armory machine becoming your hub and base of operations that you would need to defend, upgrade, maybe even customize. Of course that idea had to go nearly instantly.

 

[fantadomat]

Sooo can you do missions for all the factions till a certain point,or do yuo get locked in the moment you start a quest with one ?

 

[True Ukrainian]

I tried to play both sides with the brothel guy and the regulators in the pit, taking money from both of them. But that just locked me into brothel guy's path.