Why do people hate Oblivion so much?

[PorkBarrellGuy]

Damn, mfkndggrlll you could at least try to be as entertaining as Makabb.

Makabb's a paid professional though so I'm willing to forgive mfkndggrfll's inept flailing and straw-grasping

 

[mfkndggrfll]

From your narrow-minded perspectives maybe. As a matter of fact Morrowind is the mark of decline in the series, you just arent a fan of the ES games.

Right. If that had been all you posted in this thread, I actually know some people around here that would have given this to you.

How can Morrowind be the most declined entry, when as you say, it is the beginning of the series decline if, just follow me here ok, if Oblivion comes after Morrowind. Oblivion would be more declined, using that logic, right? That's how chronological progression works. Surely you know this. Right?

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

This game also brought the cancer in gaming known as essential npcs. This is a thing that needs to burn in the deepest pits of hell.

This guy doesnt get bored of showing how ignorant he is rofl... Unkillable NPCs existed before Oblivion. In Daggerfall you couldnt even hit them, with Oblivion you can hit them and knock them down. It is a sign of incline.

 

[Okagron]

This guy doesnt get bored of showing how ignorant he is rofl... Unkillable NPCs existed before Oblivion.

You call me ignorant but then you don't realize that essential npcs are not the same as unkillable npcs, you retarded dipshit. Morrowind had essential npcs and guess what? You can kill them. You can't kill a single essential npc in Oblivion and most of them are not even tied to the main story.

While games prior had unkillable npcs, at most they had one or two and you can't even attack them. Oblivion is filled to the brim with essential npcs that you can attack but can't die because the devs don't want consequences in their game. So, don't call anyone ignorant when you are biggest fucking ignorant here.

You are not even allowed to attack unkillable npcs in most games, while in Oblivion you can attack essential npcs but they can't die. Effectively making attacking them pointless. Giant difference between not even allowing me to attack them and allowing me to attack them but they don't die.

 

[DalekFlay]

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

And yet for me Morrowind is still easily the best game in the series. Opinions are like assholes and all that. My main point thought was to try and explain to you that Oblivion was objectively a more mainstream, console-focused game that mostly got praise and attention for succeeding in those areas. That's what was so annoying and frustrating at the time, to have reviews openly praising things like no longer having to find quest solutions but just have an arrow leading you to them.

 

[Alkarl]

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

Ok, let me phrase this a different way: If Morrowind is the start of the series decline as you say, would this not make Oblivion more declined? Because logic.

 

[mfkndggrfll]

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

Ok, let me phrase this a different way: If Morrowind is the start of the series decline as you say, would this not make Oblivion more declined? Because logic.

I guess its all this codex bullshit about incline/decline getting in my head. Morrowind marks the death of the series to me. Oblivion is an attempt at reviving it.

 

[Squid]

with Oblivion you can hit them and knock them down. It is a sign of incline.

 

[Moonrise]

My main point thought was to try and explain to you that Oblivion was objectively a more mainstream, console-focused game that mostly got praise and attention for succeeding in those areas.

When someone asks me if they should buy Morrowind for PC or Xbox, I tell them to get the Xbox game--I know it'll work perfectly.

 

[existential_vacuum]

P.S. Oblivion is shite

 

[Alkarl]

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

Ok, let me phrase this a different way: If Morrowind is the start of the series decline as you say, would this not make Oblivion more declined? Because logic.

I guess its all this codex bullshit about incline/decline getting in my head. Morrowind marks the death of the series to me. Oblivion is an attempt at reviving it.

How so?

 

[moleman]

...The thief guild's questline alone is worthy of a Thief game...

You can't be serious about this!! The Thief (1,2,3) games are the pinnacle of stealth games. Even most other stealth games look like shit compared to them. This is just wrong!!!

 

[DalekFlay]

"When someone asks me if they should buy Morrowind for PC or Xbox, I tell them to get the Xbox game--I know it'll work perfectly."

You're not wrong to throw that out there, and it's definitely, absolutely true that Morrowind on Xbox was a turning point for the industry. However Morrowind on PC didn't feel compromised. Oblivion did. That's the main difference. Morrowind felt like a traditionally PC style game they made work on a console, while Oblivion felt like a traditionally PC style game they heavily modified to make more mainstream and console focused. It was a big early decline mountain ride at the start of the overall decline Xbox 360 era.

 

[Okagron]

I love that the OP gets the answer to the question he asks in the title of the thread but then gets triggered when people give their answer.

 

[PorkBarrellGuy]

I love that the OP gets the answer to the question he asks in the title of the thread but then gets triggered when people give their answer.

I don't know what he thought was going to happen.

 

[Fargus]

I love that the OP gets the answer to the question he asks in the title of the thread but then gets triggered when people give their answer.

I don't know what he thought was going to happen.

I guess he strives for a "village idiot" or "dumb fuck" label. Or thinks his "trolling" would actually get someone butthurt here, when in reality nobody gives a shit or would just chuckle at his idiocy and move on.

 

[mfkndggrfll]

Alkarl More than just the death, its also where the series lost its soul. Morrowind drastically changed genre of game TES were. It was due to technical limitations, but it still happened. Its where the series started caring about the looks and other gimmicks rather than relevant stuff. Its also where the series started being more Teen and less Mature.

Oblivion brought back the feeling of a huge world by having a much bigger map. When you think about it, Oblivion has the largest map of all modern ES games, which makes it feel closer to DF.
Oblivion made dungeons dangerous once again by adding physics based traps and stuff, they were also larger than Morrowind's.
Oblivion managed to deliver a classic ES intro and involve the player in the MQ without making him feel like a special snowflake.
Oblivion brought back complex sidequests with evolving objectives.

...The thief guild's questline alone is worthy of a Thief game...

You can't be serious about this!! The Thief (1,2,3) games are the pinnacle of stealth games. Even most other stealth games look like shit compared to them. This is just wrong!!!

The Thief games are a product of their time. First person stealth is garbage. The early Splinter Cell games are the pinnacle of stealth games. Metal Gear Solid would be the runner up.

 

[Okagron]

Oblivion made dungeons dangerous once again by adding physics based traps and stuff, they were also larger than Morrowind's.

Ahahahahahaha. The traps in the dungeons barely do any damage and the dungeons all look the same. The cave dungeons all look the same and the ayleid ruins all look the same. Plus most of them have this convenient switch at the end of the dungeon to open a path to the beginning of it.

Oblivion managed to deliver a classic ES intro and involve the player in the MQ without making him feel like a special snowflake.

But you are a special snoflake. The Emperor had a dream specifically about you and how you would save the world.

Oblivion brought back complex sidequests with evolving objectives.

Most of the quests in Oblivion are simple fetch quest as in, kill this or bring this. I can probably count with my two hands how many quests that don't involve these.

 

[Dustin542]

Morrowind isnt the most 'declined', it simply is the worst game. Worst =/= most declined. Morrowind simply aged like milk.

Ok, let me phrase this a different way: If Morrowind is the start of the series decline as you say, would this not make Oblivion more declined? Because logic.

I guess its all this codex bullshit about incline/decline getting in my head. Morrowind marks the death of the series to me. Oblivion is an attempt at reviving it.

As opposed to the games that got them to near bankruptcy since they wren't well recieved?

 

[mfkndggrfll]

Oblivion made dungeons dangerous once again by adding physics based traps and stuff, they were also larger than Morrowind's.

Ahahahahahaha. The traps in the dungeons barely do any damage and the dungeons all look the same. The cave dungeons all look the same and the ayleid ruins all look the same. Plus most of them have this convenient switch at the end of the dungeon to open a path to the beginning of it.

Oblivion managed to deliver a classic ES intro and involve the player in the MQ without making him feel like a special snowflake.

But you are a special snoflake. The Emperor had a dream specifically about you and how you would save the world.

Oblivion brought back complex sidequests with evolving objectives.

Most of the quests in Oblivion are simple fetch quest as in, kill this or bring this. I can probably count with my two hands how many quests that don't involve these.

Barely do any damage? You can easily kill yourself by interacting with hanging spiky balls, or by just walking on a rolling log. Traps often do massive amounts of damage...

By now it should be clear that the Emperor's dream wasnt specifically about you, but about a person which happens to be in that cell. Its all a coincidence.

Same for Daggerfall and Morrowind. Your point?

 

[Alkarl]

More than just the death, its also where the series lost its soul. Morrowind drastically changed genre of game TES were. It was due to technical limitations, but it still happened. Its where the series started caring about the looks and other gimmicks rather than relevant stuff. Its also where the series started being more Teen and less Mature.

I'm not sure I follow. Give me some examples for how:

Morrowind was more about looks
Morrowind was gimmicky
Morrowind was less mature

What are some of the relevant things you mention that are in Daggerfall and Oblivion, but not Morrowind.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

My main point thought was to try and explain to you that Oblivion was objectively a more mainstream, console-focused game that mostly got praise and attention for succeeding in those areas.

When someone asks me if they should buy Morrowind for PC or Xbox, I tell them to get the Xbox game--I know it'll work perfectly.

It did play great on the original Xbox.

It looked great as well. On the computer it looked like everything was made of polygons, but on the Xbox all the sharp corners were removed.

 

[SmoothPimp]

Wasnt Lord of the Rings generic fantasy as well? Wasnt Baldur's gate generic fantasy too?

Yeah, all these elves, magicians, orcs are just uninventive derivative of AD&D novels and campaign settings. Never understood all the buzz about Tolkien.

 

[mfkndggrfll]

More than just the death, its also where the series lost its soul. Morrowind drastically changed genre of game TES were. It was due to technical limitations, but it still happened. Its where the series started caring about the looks and other gimmicks rather than relevant stuff. Its also where the series started being more Teen and less Mature.

I'm not sure I follow. Give me some examples for how:

Morrowind was more about looks
Morrowind was gimmicky
Morrowind was less mature

What are some of the relevant things you mention that are in Daggerfall and Oblivion, but not Morrowind.

Morrowind traded the larger scale for a smaller world with better graphics.

Level of maturity took a hit with the writing and quest design.

Quality of the MQ is in DF and Oblivion. Dangerous dungeons. Larger scale. More engaging combat. Side quests with evolving objectives (havent seen any in Morrowind).

 

[Micormic]

I always disliked TES games ever since Daggerfall(never played arena). They got progressively worse, never played skyrim.



For oblivion specifically it was how easy it was combined with the worst level scaling I've ever seen in a game personally. The dialogue was retarded but if there was no level scaling I probably could of lived with it for the lulz factor and enjoyed the game a bit. It is a nice open world afterall populated by people with downs.



I mean Daggerfall had level scaling aswell, not sure if Morrowind did.

 

[Serus]

More than just the death, its also where the series lost its soul. Morrowind drastically changed genre of game TES were. It was due to technical limitations, but it still happened. Its where the series started caring about the looks and other gimmicks rather than relevant stuff. Its also where the series started being more Teen and less Mature.

I'm not sure I follow. Give me some examples for how:

Morrowind was more about looks
Morrowind was gimmicky
Morrowind was less mature

What are some of the relevant things you mention that are in Daggerfall and Oblivion, but not Morrowind.

Morrowind traded the larger scale for a smaller world with better graphics.

Level of maturity took a hit with the writing and quest design.

Quality of the MQ is in DF and Oblivion. Dangerous dungeons. Larger scale. More engaging combat. Side quests with evolving objectives (havent seen any in Morrowind).

In short:

- Game X was less mature than game Y and more gimmicky
- How so ?
- It's level of maturity "took a hit"

Yep, sounds like a typical exchange of "arguments" with mfkndggrfll - by repetition of unfounded opinions over and over again without backing it with any actual arguments even when asked directly to do so. The only reaction is a change of wording of the opinion in question.

This time I skipped 4 pages, I'll visit again around page 12 to check if anything has changed, not worth to read more than 1 in every 4 or 5 pages it seems.