What would a REAL Vampire: Bloodlines sequel/successor be like?

[Tyranicon]

If you wanted a real sequel, meaning more of the same, it would have to have been a time capsule from the same era. What we will be getting from Paradox and Sumo is a real sequel in the sense that it is just as much of the time as the original was, with all that comes with that.

Hopefully we get a future where everyone recognizes this period of media (2016-202X) as complete shit and we never return to it ever.

 

[Storyfag]

Bring in the Technocratic Union and some mages

Ahah, even a minor Mage Enlightened Scientist on a mission to Save the Masses(tm), would be a memorable antagonist to say the least. Gimme.

 

[mondblut]

I didn't like it much as an RPG since it was so far removed from the traditional genre, should be expected considering the tabletop game's focus, but it's a great slice of the time period and its ethos. A game like Bloodlines could only ever have been made in the late 90's and early 00's, so while you might say you didn't want this thread to be about how there will be no good games ever again or how current year is bad, there certainly won't be another Bloodlines ever again. At best you'd get pastiche. The weltanschauung that created it simply doesn't exist anymore.

This.

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

 

[Jaesun]

The only thing I can ever hope for is that *some* development team that that knows the current WoD setting very very well (and is actually passionate about it), has actually played many several PnP sessions with the WoD setting and comes up with an interesting story idea from it. And then designs a game utilizing as much mechanics as they can from the PnP sessions, into a game. Good luck.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

I didn't like it much as an RPG since it was so far removed from the traditional genre, should be expected considering the tabletop game's focus, but it's a great slice of the time period and its ethos. A game like Bloodlines could only ever have been made in the late 90's and early 00's, so while you might say you didn't want this thread to be about how there will be no good games ever again or how current year is bad, there certainly won't be another Bloodlines ever again. At best you'd get pastiche. The weltanschauung that created it simply doesn't exist anymore.

This.

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Back in 2004 when White Wolf still existed as an independent company, they did retire it and hard rebooted the IP with a set of original settings loosely inspired by the previous continuity. This gave them the freedom to go in new directions while occasionally including easter egg references to the past continuity. I thought it had a lot of neat ideas, like at one point they introduced a multiverse where the US government was trying to colonize a parallel universe and stuff. The original writers were still writing for it up until Paradox pulled the license a few years ago.

Vampire: The Requiem is very well suited for a video game. It has five clans, five covenants (and more in other books), and around a hundred published bloodlines that you can join after character creation if you meet certain criteria (including conversions from the older continuity). You can start clanless and join a clan later, or play a depowered elder waking up after a long sleep… basically, V5 is a shallow ripoff of that.

Then there’s the other games, like Hunter: The Vigil where you can, among other things, play Damien from The Omen if he was raised by the Vatican to fight demons. There’s an outright multiverse of material to work with.

 

[Old One]

The best way to avoid all of the pozzed modern-day garbage would be to make VTMB2 a prequel, not a sequel. I would place it in Paris during the Belle Époque, or something equally romantic.

Or the '80s. Hell, maybe several periods a'la Redemption. It could even include a dystopian future where, depending on your choices and sect, the vampires may or may not have the upper hand on humanity. Imagine that you could play as a member of Sabbat in such a setting.

The correct time period for a prequel is mentioned multiple times in Bloodlines: the Hollywood silver screen era of the 1930s or 1940s, the previous time the Camarilla tried to take over LA from the anarchs.

Many of the characters from Bloodlines would be around to interact with: Jack, Nines, Isaac Abrams, Gary Golden, Ginger Swan, etc.

 

[S.torch]

Bloodlines 1 was a product of the edgy 2000s era, more than the 90s. It even has that nu-metal music video vibes.

 

[mondblut]

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Back in 2004 when White Wolf still existed as an independent company, they did retire it and hard rebooted the IP with a set of original settings loosely inspired by the previous continuity.

Yes. I used to despise nWoD on principle (and still don't care about it), but Time of Judgment was a ballsy and noble move and it should have remained the end of oWoD. "All good stories should have an ending".

Instead, the end of the world came and went, leaving "rudy's army" in its wake. Truly, you either die a hero, or...

 

[NecroLord]

A VR threesome simulator with Jeanette and VV.

I think you can bang Jeanette if you have Seduction 4 and pick the right dialogue choices.

 

[Zombra]

stuff

None of this answers what your dream vision of a successor would actually be like. What did you like about the original?

 

[RaggleFraggle]

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Back in 2004 when White Wolf still existed as an independent company, they did retire it and hard rebooted the IP with a set of original settings loosely inspired by the previous continuity.

Yes. I used to despise nWoD on principle (and still don't care about it), but Time of Judgment was a ballsy and noble move and it should have remained the end of oWoD. "All good stories should have an ending".

Instead, the end of the world came and went, leaving "rudy's army" in its wake. Truly, you either die a hero, or...

That’s exactly why I support the creation of hard reboots and new IPs. What are they supposed to do after ending it? While I don’t agree with every single creative decision in the 2004 reboot, it was still the product of 13 years tinkering with its predecessors. I think its open-ended design was a better foundation for delaying the rot, even if eventually it would be rebooted again. I appreciate that its creation provided the opportunity for the writers to have new ideas that were otherwise impossible if they were restricted to the previous continuity. I think it’s a tragedy that Paradox decided to dump it all.

 

[NecroLord]

a real Bloodline sequel should have lots of sewer levels and lootable crates

Even better, a long sewer linear sewer level with no loot just like in the original.

Truly the worst area of VTMB.

 

[v1c70r14]

Fashion is underrated in RPGs, especially ones that emphasize the social elements like VtM. I'd want characters to react to it like they did on rare occasions in Alpha Protocol since pure combat buffs don't make sense if you're a Toreador trying to look your best.

That's what I was hoping from Cyberpunk 2077 with how they emphasized it,


Alas, they didn't do it justice.

Same, I was so disappointed to find out they went for Diablo style loot that not only didn't matter in terms of style or cool but you had to dress like a hobo if you wanted to play optimally when the game was released, mixing and matching whatever you find or craft. Added insult to injury, at least in Bloodlines you had cohesive outfits. Really takes you out of the game when it is trying to depict a society of late stage liberalism where not only is there a focus on style with consumerist identities being rampant, but also a return to a more visible class system. Where the guys in sleek and stylish kevlar reinforced suits aren't going to hang out with proles dressed in rags, but also where everyone is competing for attention within their class in this future society of hyper-spectacle.

Missed opportunity, and it wouldn't even have taken that much to sell the illusion.

None of this answers what your dream vision of a successor would actually be like. What did you like about the original?

Yes it does, I liked it as a 00's mood piece; the dialogue, the scenery, the characters, the tone, the music, the fashion. Forever Knight with the attitude of 00's gamers. All the things that would now be passed off as cringe, or problematic, I even find the horny edgelordery authentic to the tabletop game and with its own unique charm. My ideal sequel would be another game made by Troika, the same team, in the same period. I couldn't tell you more than that because we're in 2024 now, soon 2025, and whatever else I'd come up with beyond that would be an attempt at being retro and not true to the spirit the original was developed under. I'm not a sexually frustrated Brian Mitsoda in 2003, I don't own a pair of fingerless gloves, and the general cultural scene they were plugged into is now gone.

The Brians of game development now have appropriated female pronouns and wear dresses and chokers, it wouldn't be the same. Not even the actual Brian Mitsoda is the same person he was back then.

 

[Skinwalker]

Bring in the Technocratic Union and some mages

Ahah, even a minor Mage Enlightened Scientist on a mission to Save the Masses(tm), would be a memorable antagonist to say the least. Gimme.

Imagine a division of the Technocracy trying to study/exploit vampires to solve the problem of mortality... essentially re-treading the path of the Tremere, but now from the side of science and technology! In the process, they accidentally awaken dark forces from Stygia that feed on human death and can't let the Technocrats synthesize an anti-dying solution, and the vampires of the city are caught in the middle of this infernal battle.

There are so many good stories that can be set in the WoD.

 

[scytheavatar]

I didn't like it much as an RPG since it was so far removed from the traditional genre, should be expected considering the tabletop game's focus, but it's a great slice of the time period and its ethos. A game like Bloodlines could only ever have been made in the late 90's and early 00's, so while you might say you didn't want this thread to be about how there will be no good games ever again or how current year is bad, there certainly won't be another Bloodlines ever again. At best you'd get pastiche. The weltanschauung that created it simply doesn't exist anymore.

This.

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Back in 2004 when White Wolf still existed as an independent company, they did retire it and hard rebooted the IP with a set of original settings loosely inspired by the previous continuity. This gave them the freedom to go in new directions while occasionally including easter egg references to the past continuity. I thought it had a lot of neat ideas, like at one point they introduced a multiverse where the US government was trying to colonize a parallel universe and stuff. The original writers were still writing for it up until Paradox pulled the license a few years ago.

Vampire: The Requiem is very well suited for a video game. It has five clans, five covenants (and more in other books), and around a hundred published bloodlines that you can join after character creation if you meet certain criteria (including conversions from the older continuity). You can start clanless and join a clan later, or play a depowered elder waking up after a long sleep… basically, V5 is a shallow ripoff of that.

Then there’s the other games, like Hunter: The Vigil where you can, among other things, play Damien from The Omen if he was raised by the Vatican to fight demons. There’s an outright multiverse of material to work with.

VTR was never anywhere as popular and successful as VTM, not even 1/10th of VTM's lowest point. Something about VTM's vampire politics and being trampled by the older generation resonated with people the way a generic vampire story wasn't able to. VTM is in the same boat as Star Wars, people want to pretend it's a waste to limit Star Wars with Jedi shit but then you release shit like Solo and Outlaws that no one cares about.

 

[Skinwalker]

VTR was never anywhere as popular and successful as VTM, not even 1/10th of VTM's lowest point.

True, and the same is true of the werewolf and mage reboots. They preserved the trappings of the stories, trashed most of the lore, and rebalanced everything in an even, bland, sawyerian way.

No one cares about five generic vampires clans evenly spread across five generic covenants, with unknown origins and no particular significance to their generations or origin stories. Elders periodically get depowered, neonates eventually become elders, memories are forgotten, blah blah blah. The ability to endlessly generate bloodlines out of these five clans using a generic process also doesn't help.

The Cainite stuff, the thirteen clans plus a very limited number of bloodlines, the fact that there's only two proper covenants/sects, plus a half-baked one, and tons of nuisances and histories surrounding all of these basic details (two of the thirteen clans today are not the same as a thousand years ago, but there's a unique story behind each replacement) is what makes VtM come to life, no pun intended.

What these retards did to Mage: the Ascension is simply beyond description. No council of mystic traditions, no technocracy, no coincidental vs vulgar magic, none of the lore about creativity/stasis/destruction? NOTHING? Just yet another five generic societies with vague origins. No wonder it failed.

 

[mondblut]

VTR was never anywhere as popular and successful as VTM, not even 1/10th of VTM's lowest point. Something about VTM's vampire politics and being trampled by the older generation resonated with people the way a generic vampire story wasn't able to.

True. In hindisight, we shouldn't have complained and lamented over VTM "cancellation". See where it got us. Be careful what you wish for *...

* - applies to every other dead franchise in existence. If you love 'em, let 'em go, lest they rise from the grave as a grotesque mockery of everything you held dear.

 

[Jaesun]

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Completely disagree. With governments now knowing about vampires, and vampire organizations now have to rely on couriers (because governments can tap conversations) something from a government agent angle could be a great opening for a game. For example. The current setting is ripe for some creative people to do something with it. It's all there...

 

[mondblut]

The whole oWoD should've stayed dead after the original Gehenna. Instead we got retarded garbage called V5

Completely disagree. With governments now knowing about vampires, and vampire organizations now have to rely on couriers (because governments can tap conversations) something from a government agent angle could be a great opening for a game. For example. The current setting is ripe for some creative people to do something with it. It's all there...

OK zoomer. I'll stick with the Final Nights, tyvm.

 

[Jaesun]

OK zoomer. I'll stick with the Final Nights, tyvm.

What do you not like about V5 setting?

 

[mondblut]

OK zoomer. I'll stick with the Final Nights, tyvm.

What do you not like about V5 setting?

If you have to ask...

 

[Herumor]

people want to pretend it's a waste to limit Star Wars with Jedi shit but then you release shit like Solo and Outlaws that no one cares about.

What about Andor then? No Jedi in sight and people still look at it very favorably.

 

[Storyfag]

people want to pretend it's a waste to limit Star Wars with Jedi shit but then you release shit like Solo and Outlaws that no one cares about.

What about Andor then? No Jedi in sight and people still look at it very favorably.

Rare fluke. Sadly, you can't rely on such things being produced consistently.

 

[Storyfag]

OK zoomer. I'll stick with the Final Nights, tyvm.

What do you not like about V5 setting?

If you have to ask...

Add the heavy handed disposal of the Elders through the Beckoning. The atrocious treatment the Sabbat got. The focus on the oppressed thinbloods.

A good Storyteller can still work with all of those things, downplaying this, ignoring that, but as written, the setting has declined badly.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Fashion is underrated in RPGs, especially ones that emphasize the social elements like VtM. I'd want characters to react to it like they did on rare occasions in Alpha Protocol since pure combat buffs don't make sense if you're a Toreador trying to look your best.

That's what I was hoping from Cyberpunk 2077 with how they emphasized it,


Alas, they didn't do it justice.

Same, I was so disappointed to find out they went for Diablo style loot that not only didn't matter in terms of style or cool but you had to dress like a hobo if you wanted to play optimally when the game was released, mixing and matching whatever you find or craft. Added insult to injury, at least in Bloodlines you had cohesive outfits. Really takes you out of the game when it is trying to depict a society of late stage liberalism where not only is there a focus on style with consumerist identities being rampant, but also a return to a more visible class system. Where the guys in sleek and stylish kevlar reinforced suits aren't going to hang out with proles dressed in rags, but also where everyone is competing for attention within their class in this future society of hyper-spectacle.

Missed opportunity, and it wouldn't even have taken that much to sell the illusion.

None of this answers what your dream vision of a successor would actually be like. What did you like about the original?

Yes it does, I liked it as a 00's mood piece; the dialogue, the scenery, the characters, the tone, the music, the fashion. Forever Knight with the attitude of 00's gamers. All the things that would now be passed off as cringe, or problematic, I even find the horny edgelordery authentic to the tabletop game and with its own unique charm. My ideal sequel would be another game made by Troika, the same team, in the same period. I couldn't tell you more than that because we're in 2024 now, soon 2025, and whatever else I'd come up with beyond that would be an attempt at being retro and not true to the spirit the original was developed under. I'm not a sexually frustrated Brian Mitsoda in 2003, I don't own a pair of fingerless gloves, and the general cultural scene they were plugged into is now gone.

The Brians of game development now have appropriated female pronouns and wear dresses and chokers, it wouldn't be the same. Not even the actual Brian Mitsoda is the same person he was back then.

You are a quality poster.