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Totally Not Corrupt Professional Objective Gaming Journalism DRAMA

Grunker

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I think I see the problem here.

Technically, the majority of American and European adults are educated. Technically.

Joking (or half-joking) aside, I'd wager there are plenty of genuinely well-educated adults who mindlessly consume biased gibberish, and that's the real problem.

I dunno. There are plenty of those in the world of films and books, and for all their problems, I think we can agree that their sphere of criticism is both more mature and more important to those who produce film and books.

I still think the problem lies with the actual critics, their age and their entire approach to their "craft." As well as the skewered balance of power between them and the people they're supposed to be critiquing, obviously.
 

Curious_Tongue

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Unbiased journalism flourished in a select few geographical areas of the civilized West for a relatively short period of time, but appears to have died off completely in the middle to late 1990s.

I blame the consumer for this. It's the responsibility of educated people to be critical of what they see and hear.

Blame the victim.
 

Blaine

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Blame the victim.

Yes, those poor people—cruelly forced to subscribe to newspapers and magazines, to pay for cable television and watch specific news stations, and there are no doubt agents of oppression operating their computer mice to ensure they visit intellectually bankrupt news outlets.

Give me a fucking break. The "victims" you speak of are giving those hacks money and ad revenue of their own free will.
 

Curious_Tongue

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Blame the victim.

Yes, those poor people—cruelly forced to subscribe to newspapers and magazines, to pay for cable television and watch specific news stations, and there are no doubt agents of oppression operating their computer mice to ensure they visit intellectually bankrupt news outlets.

Give me a fucking break. The "victims" you speak of are giving those hacks money and ad revenue of their own free will.

I see no evidence of human beings having free will.

I don't believe in personal responsibility either, but that's a long discussion.

To put it simply, I see no leaders, and without leaders people will flock to whoever tells them what they want to hear.
 
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Blaine

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I see no evidence of human beings having free will.

I don't believe in personal responsibility either, but that's a long discussion.

To put it simply, I see no leaders, and without leaders people will flock to whoever tells them what they hear.

Neat, another insane Codexer. I don't mean that as an insult in the usual sense—I mean you're actually not fully sane. Even in you take offense, I trust you'll shift the blame to some amorphous force beyond my control rather than me personally. No doubt I've been brainwashed by the patriarchy to insult seditionists.

That's cool. Insane Codexers are entertaining.
 

Curious_Tongue

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I see no evidence of human beings having free will.

I don't believe in personal responsibility either, but that's a long discussion.

To put it simply, I see no leaders, and without leaders people will flock to whoever tells them what they hear.

Neat, another insane Codexer. I don't mean that as an insult in the usual sense—I mean you're actually not fully sane. Even in you take offense, I trust you'll shift the blame to some amorphous force beyond my control rather than me personally. No doubt I've been brainwashed by the patriarchy to insult seditionists.

That's cool. Insane Codexers are entertaining.

"people will flock to whoever tells them what they want to hear"

I fucked that up.
 

Curious_Tongue

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Anyway, I challenge you to find me a sample of free will to analyze. Even a picture would be a good start.

As for responsibility, that's a long discussion, and you really can't have that discussion without removing the idea of free will.
 

Blaine

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Anyway, I challenge you to find me a sample of free will to analyze. Even a picture would be a good start.

I'll first need to know how you choose to define "free will." It's obvious you're confident that a proper sample doesn't exist, so all I'll really be doing if I accept your challenge is fetching a talking point for you. I'm not an errand boy.
 
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I'm not sure what his point is, either.

If you don't think the distinction is worth mentioning then good for you, but I highly disagree. Just one of the reasons it is massively different: the "journalists" don't feel like they're doing anything wrong.

You don't need slick willy in a suit to hand you a briefcase full of $100's to know that accepting favors [dinners, helicopter rides, invitations to parties, cash bonuses, offer of being hired at their company etc] from companies, that you're supposed to be inherently critical to as a journalist is bad, and will create a conflict of interest. The whole reason why gaming journalism is fucked up is because the journalists themselves are early 20 somethings, with no money, no life experience, and no real education in how to properly conduct themselves as an interviewer or journalist, and publishers are more than happy and within the confines of the law to out and out bribe them. Until there is actual government regulation, nothing will change. Even with Forbes, its gaming news section is alright and better than 95%, but it's still not the best, and it's still not the market standard anyway.
 

Blaine

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AngryEddy

I could have actually believed that these talentless hack "journalists" were too naïve to realize how compromised they are—except that when they're confronted in the wake of a scandal, when people blatantly point out to them why they're biased, they get on Twitter and Facebook and build a virtual hugbox for each other, vehemently insisting that they're not really biased and that the fact that their paychecks and favors come almost entirely from major publishers doesn't compromise their integrity in any way.

A that point it becomes obvious that they're either delusional to the point of being mentally ill, or bullshitting the public in hopes that most of the stupids will believe them (and unfortunately, they do).
 
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AngryEddy

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AngryEddy



A that point it becomes obvious that they're either delusional to the point of being mentally ill, or bullshitting the public in hopes that most of the stupids will believe them (and unfortunately, they do).

Well, it doesn't help that most these clowns are from California or NYC, where they're all used to a society built on being soft, compliant, conformist, and are all wanna be VICE shitheads.
 

J_C

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If you're a hobbyist reviewing aspects of your hobby, then nothing I've said applies to you in any way.

If you're a hack trying to make a career out of a hobby with little or no background in the history and particulars of that hobby, no relevant higher education pertaining to it (or related industries thereof), and no integrity or meaningful professional oversight, then as far as I'm concerned, you can fellate the muzzle of a shotgun. These people are worse than middlemen. They've sidled into the void left by their worthy predecessors of decades past (because some gaming mags were good, once, though it's hard to pin down why), except that they're completely incapable of filling those shoes. They just want to scrape a living feeding biased nonsense to clueless teenagers, and people who want to scrape a living while helping to fuck up something I'm personally nostalgic about really rub me the wrong way.
Well I do this as a second job, just to make a little extra, because there are people who are paying me for writing my opinion of a game. I don't want to make a career of it, never want to be a garme journalist. I don't know which category this puts me in.

Still I don't agree to condemn everybody who wants to make a career of this. But I agree that there are these hacks who don't know enough about games, game history, and suck up to publishers and make biased reviews and opinions.
 

Machocruz

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No money need exchange hands, no favors need be offered. As long as the game companies themselves are the sole means of getting news, thus hits, thus business, game "journalism" will remain compromised like no other. At least a place like Forbes doesn't depend on video game coverage to subsist. Problem there, though, is that whole expertise thing I mentioned. They are easily impressed over there.
 

J1M

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This thread's conclusions are something I suspect most of us have felt for a very long time and have known with certainty almost as long.

As amusing as the corrupt failures of journalism are, the real question is what to do as a result of this knowledge. Do we continue ignoring gaming news sites and only being aware of products other Codexers mention? Do you start your own game review site to get free vacations? etc.
 

Blaine

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As amusing as the corrupt failures of journalism are, the real question is what to do as a result of this knowledge. Do we continue ignoring gaming news sites and only being aware of products other Codexers mention? Do you start your own game review site to get free vacations? etc.

As far as awareness of games goes, I use lists/aggregators. It's not difficult to keep track of AAA releases. In the case of "indie" games, I keep sites such as TIGSource bookmarked, and will read three months' worth of entries once per quarter to keep apprised of what's out there. Lately, Steam Greenlight has been a fairly good way to discover the existence of obscure games. Kickstarter is one to keep an eye on obviously, and I use the Codex thread for that.

If something piques my interest, having learned of its existence, I'll search the Codex (or post in/start a thread) and a few other sources I consider reliable for information about how it plays.
 

Machocruz

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The one useful thing about Game Informer magazine was that they used to have a release schedule in the back of the mag. I never read their reviews (a person who thinks Super Mario Sunshine was a better game than Metroid Prime is about he easiest person for me to dismiss), but they were decent for keeping me abreast of future releases. And magazines don't have a comment section for every preview for retards to spoil, so there is that.
 

Machocruz

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(a person who thinks Super Mario Sunshine was a better game than Metroid Prime is about he easiest person for me to dismiss)

Hey what beef do you have against Super Mario Sunshine?

Besides the setting being a misfire, lame fruity characters, and general drawbacks of 3D platformers, I have no beef. But MP was something on the order of a milestone of its generation, superior in almost every way.
 

DragoFireheart

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(a person who thinks Super Mario Sunshine was a better game than Metroid Prime is about he easiest person for me to dismiss)

Hey what beef do you have against Super Mario Sunshine?

Besides the setting being a misfire, lame fruity characters, and general drawbacks of 3D platformers, I have no beef. But MP was something on the order of a milestone of its generation, superior in almost every way.

Alright, fair enough.
 

Spectacle

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This thread's conclusions are something I suspect most of us have felt for a very long time and have known with certainty almost as long.

As amusing as the corrupt failures of journalism are, the real question is what to do as a result of this knowledge. Do we continue ignoring gaming news sites and only being aware of products other Codexers mention? Do you start your own game review site to get free vacations? etc.
For hardcore gamers like us this isn't really a direct problem, I'm sure we all have our ways to figure out what games are worth playing.

The real issue is how the lack of quality game critique distorts the mass market, since regular casual gamers end up poorly equipped for making informed purchase decisions.
 

J1M

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This thread's conclusions are something I suspect most of us have felt for a very long time and have known with certainty almost as long.

As amusing as the corrupt failures of journalism are, the real question is what to do as a result of this knowledge. Do we continue ignoring gaming news sites and only being aware of products other Codexers mention? Do you start your own game review site to get free vacations? etc.
For hardcore gamers like us this isn't really a direct problem, I'm sure we all have our ways to figure out what games are worth playing.

The real issue is how the lack of quality game critique distorts the mass market, since regular casual gamers end up poorly equipped for making informed purchase decisions.
Hopefully the mass market gets milked out of their money and stops buying games. Mass market is the worst thing that ever happened to the industry.
 

Volrath

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Meanwhile on /v/

I am one of the reviewers being affected by this

i will not give out my name or which review site i work for, because i don't want to risk getting found out

Essentially, what the problem is, is that the big devs for next gen consoles are adopting a new policy (and by "big devs" i mean almost every dev for the new consoles at launch)

Essentially, the policy does two things. First, if we want to make a review, we have to send it to the company of the game being reviewed and get the review accepted before we can publish it without it being taken down. Secondly, it makes it so that we have to sign terms with companies before reviewing their games.

The reason this is only affecting SOME of us, is because we are assigned games each, and some of us have to go out and sign these policies with the publishers before we can do a review. The problem here, is that some publishers (Such as EA and Ubisoft) are making us play their games in their studios, under their supervision, and on their consoles. One dev required that I had to go to the studio and watch one of the developers play the game while i watched and took notes which would then be published as a review (that would have to be accepted by the dev first.)

The reason Sessler is upset, is because he doesn't think this is Morally acceptable. He wants to review games how he likes, but since developers are making us do silly thiungs like watch them play, he's upset and doesn't wanna be a part of this big "scandal" (as Sessler told me) that they are putting on, which would essentially turn "Reviews" into "Advertisements".

you could say he's overreacting and being childish, but as someone who has worked with him before, i can really understand why he's so angry. I'm angry too, you know.

ca9o6
 

Jick Magger

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If I had a penny for every person who's gone on /v/ and made a "I work for developer/games journalist outfit X and I'm gonna spill everything because I wanna stick it to the man!" thread, I'd be able to end world hunger overnight.

Not saying it isn't true, but take everything you read there that doesn't have a timestamp or proof with a grain of salt. They had some guy pretending to be a CryTek employee who's shit everyone ate up, until it turned out it was just some guy from NeoGAF fucking with them.
 

J_C

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If I had a penny for every person who's gone on /v/ and made a "I work for developer/games journalist outfit X and I'm gonna spill everything because I wanna stick it to the man!" thread, I'd be able to end world hunger overnight.

Not saying it isn't true, but take everything you read there that doesn't have a timestamp or proof with a grain of salt. They had some guy pretending to be a CryTek employee who's shit everyone ate up, until it turned out it was just some guy from NeoGAF fucking with them.
Pretty much this. Actually there are a lot of people who has a crazy theory (even if this particular story is true), and make up something like "i am a dev/journalist" so people will take him/her more seriously.
 

Volrath

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If I had a penny for every person who's gone on /v/ and made a "I work for developer/games journalist outfit X and I'm gonna spill everything because I wanna stick it to the man!" thread, I'd be able to end world hunger overnight.

Not saying it isn't true, but take everything you read there that doesn't have a timestamp or proof with a grain of salt. They had some guy pretending to be a CryTek employee who's shit everyone ate up, until it turned out it was just some guy from NeoGAF fucking with them.
Well duh.
 

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