Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[gman42]

Especially when you consider some of the crappy battle logic that will cause Werdna to sometimes try to punch you or cast Zilwan (?!) or some nonsense instead of nuking constantly like he should.

In my previous attempts he always nuked me 100% of the time. This time I killed him before he could try anything.

My memory is fuzzy, but IIRC the way the spells work for monsters in the original Wiz games is that after every round there's a 33% chance of their max level cast going down by one, which is how the games basically simulate the monsters running out of spell casts. Tiltowait might be the only lvl7 spell he knows, in which case he'd always cast that until the casting level drops. For whatever reason they gave him Zilwan as one of the two lvl6 spells he knows.

Presumably if you kept him alive long enough just for fun, he'd start casting Halito and Katino at you.

 

[LarryTyphoid]

Do you really need to fight the magic shield every time you want to go down to level 3 in Wizardry 2?

 

[Jvegi]

Why do most walkthroughs to W8 give advice similar to "turn party ai on on Saradush wall"? Should I feel like a sucker for not gaming the skill system? Is it swimming in Balmora and jumping on stairs everywhere in Morrowind all over again? The game is cute, my daughter loves it, I like it, but is it good enough to be worth playing without cheese?

 

[oasis789]

Part of it is the W8 level scaling punishing success and pushing players towards optimality and cheesing systems. Try modding out the scaling and you won't need any of that.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Imagine doing your first playthrough of one of the greatest RPGs of all time with a fucking walkthrough. No, multiple walkthroughs. Goddamn.

 

[LarryTyphoid]

Fuck, man, the original Wizardry trilogy is killing me here. I'm not even halfway through Wizardry 2, but now I hear that you have to have two separate parties for Wizardry 3? For fuck's sake, I'm never gonna get done with these games.

The fact that you basically have to cheat to beat these games really takes out a lot of the luster. Has anybody ever beat Wizardry 2 without cheating by backing up saves? Did SirTec really expect you to play Wizardry 1 all over again whenever you died in Wizardry 2?

 

[notpl]

Why do most walkthroughs to W8 give advice similar to "turn party ai on on Saradush wall"? Should I feel like a sucker for not gaming the skill system? Is it swimming in Balmora and jumping on stairs everywhere in Morrowind all over again? The game is cute, my daughter loves it, I like it, but is it good enough to be worth playing without cheese?

I've never done any of that stuff. Just casting buff spells in schools you want to train while walking around/when you remember to do so is enough for your spellcasters, grinding the physical skills seems insane to me.

 

[The Limper]

Wiz 8 …..DON’T use portals once available. You’ll get all kinds of Extra combat to train your skills/Level up.

 

[octavius]

Fuck, man, the original Wizardry trilogy is killing me here. I'm not even halfway through Wizardry 2, but now I hear that you have to have two separate parties for Wizardry 3? For fuck's sake, I'm never gonna get done with these games.

The fact that you basically have to cheat to beat these games really takes out a lot of the luster. Has anybody ever beat Wizardry 2 without cheating by backing up saves? Did SirTec really expect you to play Wizardry 1 all over again whenever you died in Wizardry 2?

IIRC Wiz 2 is the easiest of all the Wizardry games. It's Wiz 3 that is brutal, partly because all stats on starting characters are capped at 15 (which means the stats could just as well be 4 , since you get no bonuses), and, as you mentioned, you need two (or at least one and a half) parties. And then there's the Priests of ng.

I realized there's really no way to play Wiz 3 Ironman, so I backed up saves shamelessly.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Like I always say: some skills are kinda too easy to cheese to not do it (looking at you, music). But overall - this is completely unnecessary and will very much spoil the game at best and give you brain damage at worst (shit like getting stealth to 100 at monastery or maxing wizardry/earth on vault door in Arnika).

 

[octavius]

To enjoy Wiz8 the most, don't role play Stupid Good by engaging in Rapaxide. Join the Dark Side. The endless fighting against HP sponges in Castle Rapaz really soured my enjoyment of the game.

 

[Jvegi]

Imagine doing your first playthrough of one of the greatest RPGs of all time with a fucking walkthrough. No, multiple walkthroughs. Goddamn.

I did read a bunch of guides, substituting RTFM. As for walkthroughs, I usually use them after exploring an area to make sure I haven't missed anything, or if I get completely stuck. I went through the Monastery without it and it was fun. In Arnika I kind of get the feeling the goal isn't quite clear, I don't want to miss an important trigger and wander aimlessly through random encounters.

So far (lvl 8-9) I have not felt a need to cheese the system, the fights are manageable. They are kind of easy, really (on normal). I usually just throw aoe spells, buffs and press space so my guys auto-attack. The game is charming, I can't say if it's "one of the greatest RPGs of all time" yet.

 

[Darth Roxor]

I did read a bunch of guides (...) As for walkthroughs, I usually use them after exploring an area to make sure I haven't missed anything

So in other words you outsourced the best parts of the game (party building, exploration, replayability) to someone else and now you are left with a 'charming game that is kind of easy'. This is actually downright upsetting to me.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Why would you even feel the need to substitute RTFM when TFM is right there?

 

[Butter]

Why would you even need something to make the easiest game in the series even easier?

 

[Jvegi]

Why would you even feel the need to substitute RTFM when TFM is right there?

Gosh, guys. If I'd have known you would get so upset, I'd have read the entire pdf manual. My eyes would bleed, but at least you wouldn't get upset. I now realize understanding the character creation system before committing myself to a 100h playthrough is not worth your tears.

 

[Strange Fellow]

Why would you even feel the need to substitute RTFM when TFM is right there?

Gosh, guys. If I'd have known you would get so upset, I'd have read the entire pdf manual. My eyes would bleed, but at least you wouldn't get upset. I now realize understanding the character creation system before committing myself to a 100h playthrough is not worth your tears.

That doesn't answer my question, because the manual explains the character creation system. There are also handy in-game tootips for almost everything, which you can bring up by right-clicking.

 

[Jvegi]

That doesn't answer my question, because the manual explains the character creation system.

I don't like reading pdf manuals. I'd love to have a physical copy, or at least a handy e-reader, but I don't. The tooltips are appreciated, but they do not explain the math and are historically prone to giving bad advice. I've checked the basic mechanics and recommendations on which stats to invest in. I have not made a powergaming party, I'm choosing my spells based on my feels. I have made quite a few small errors, but I don't mind them. I don't know what the high level spells are, I don't know what gear I can expect. I don't have a bard, I don't have a gadget guy.

Also... For like a week before playing, I found reading about the game more alluring than actually trying to sit down and start playing it. Starting a new game is usually hard for me and I tend to procrastinate. Again, sorry for making you cry, it was never my intention.

 

[BruceVC]

All I know when I finally get around to playing Wizardry I will definitely get advice and tips from people on this thread

I dont want to play a game for hours and realize I selected the "wrong " class and the game becomes unnecessarily hard and frustrating

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

eh, that's all the fun when you start a new RPG. Wizardry is fun but the Bard's Tale leveling and stat PROGRESSION tainted my taste on stat loss. I couldn't and still can't stand it. Mobs perm taking shit away is one thing I can take but being virtually penalized for leveling up makes me grit my teeth in annoyance. WELL, FUCK THIS DUDE! He's near lowest stats possible now. (Albeit you can still complete the game with shit for stats). I just say that is shit design and I wonder:

Where did that originate from? What was the inspiration for stat loss upon leveling as that is not canon D&D at all. Shit, stats don't raise at all upon leveling in old school pnp D&D. So where? Why?

Did ALL versions of the first wizardries do this?

Were any patches/mods developed for each?

Transferring was a bit terrible too. Some games allowed cross game trandsfers (notably into Bard's Tales Games - EA including Dragon Wars). It was interesting to see what gear transferred if any.

MM 1-2 was a meh transfer (but a trainer could probably remedy that if you really wanted a different experience.

Ultima had odd transfers but the rules kept changing in hp, damage, and certain effects. I don't recall if you could transfer like this: 4-5-6-7-7si-8-9?

Probably NOT. Again, leave it to BT to fuck up my mind of Transferring characters game to game. I could say Phantasie also or Wizard's Crown to Eternal Dagger but I get a bit fuzzy on the minutiae of the details.

Old thoughts looked at multiple times but still thought upon. I can't be the only one who thinks "Damn! I'd like a much better clean transfer of my characters."

But it probably breaks certain games. Maybe it breaks all games.

 

[Humbaba]

Imagine doing your first playthrough of one of the greatest RPGs of all time with a fucking walkthrough. No, multiple walkthroughs. Goddamn.

Absolutely no shame in using a guide for games that were purposefully designed to be obtuse.

 

[Darth Roxor]

good that wiz8 is not such a game then you fucking pleb

 

[Reader]

Where did that originate from? What was the inspiration for stat loss upon leveling as that is not canon D&D at all. Shit, stats don't raise at all upon leveling in old school pnp D&D. So where? Why?

You said yourself that the game can be completed with shit stats. Probably devs didn't see any gamebreaking effect.

As for where it comes from i can only guess that it's a way to add a little discomfort to the player.
M&M too has stat loss due to aging.

 

[Reader]

games that were purposefully designed to be obtuse.

I can't imagine Bradley sitting down and like "hmmm i need to make an obtuse game".
It's modern dev's motto.

And Wiz series is fantastic and still holds up well. I played Wiz6 first time...I think it was about three or so years ago.

 

[Old Hans]

Where did that originate from? What was the inspiration for stat loss upon leveling as that is not canon D&D at all

modern man cannot even BEGIN to comprehend the thought process of the early rpg developer.