The New DOOM Thread (2016)

[dunno lah]

Aww man, I remember my ears ringing for a bit from that guy's Doom 2 Revenant map.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Anybody doing anything with the editor? Maybe modders can fix this shit.

sure

That ain't much of a fucking editor. This game is hopeless.

 

[lightbane]

Does the game feature working mirrors? Just to know. Thanks for reminding me about how shitty the editor is by the way.

 

[Astral Rag]

nope

Meanwhile in 1996:

dukenukemmirror.bmp

 

[nomask7]

Progress goes backwards because of population level dysgenics. Ugly retards keep procreating and the next thing you know we're back in the stone age and the closest thing to the original Doom game is you and Jill hunting rabbits in the woods.

 

[Siel]

Some revealed Doom 4 footage starting 1:00:



Ok this looked slow as fuck but at least they were taking some serious risks environment-wise compared to D44M.

 

[lightbane]

At this rate, being able to see the player character's own feet will become an actual feature (one already available since Metroid Prime dozens of years ago, perhaps even in earlier FPS/games with FPS elements whose names escapes me right now).

 

[pippin]

The revenant yell must be the best sfx from Doom 2, and the creature itself is one of my favorite enemies of 1+2. I liked how it wasn't really a skeleton, when I was a kid I thought they turned one guy into a "prune" and put him in this war outfit. When you make it look like a real skeleton it loses the effect completely. It's not a thing of graphics, but art direction.

The fatguys always made me laugh.

dukenukemmirror.bmp

correct me if i'm wrong, but i've been told 99% of the games who use mirrors are just projecting images, so it's more like a tv than a real mirror.

 

[Cadmus]

started playing this
first I liked the feeling of the shooting, game runs smooth on high details 60 FPS

secondly, it's starting to get really fucking boring because there's nothing to shoot, only empty giant maps because somebody told them the players like secrets and "map design" whatever the fuck that is but they forgot to put any enemies in.
also it seems pretty easy, I haven't played a proper shooter in years, the game wouldn't let me set the highest difficulty, guess I gotta finish it 7 times first. I died 3-4 times from enemies I think but one was bug where my weapon stopped shooting and got stuck in a reloading animation/mod switch animation, I died more from falling down some hole

the guns seem pretty fun, the upgrades not so much, I got 4 points and dunno where to put them

Meh, I actually got bored and quit after 2 hours.

EDIT: LOL FUCK CHECKPOINTS AND FUCK THE ORANGE MARS

 

[Cadmus]

Also it might be me getting old but I can't really see shit in this game, everything is a blurry orange metal mess, I sometimes don't know what's around me so I gotta stop and slowly walk around to see where the fuck am I.

EDIT: And there's no feedback for getting hit so I have no idea what health I'm on until the shit in the bottom left corner starts blinking.

I turned off the glory (what a fucking name for this awesome button) kill indicators, turned off the compass and all the shit I could find.

Thankfully they let me turn off the motion blur unlike in the demo, so at least that's good.

You know, I think I'd be having good fun if the game had enemies in it.

 

[Cadmus]

Yeah, uhm, bunny hopping doesn't work? Wtf.

 

[Gepeu]

Bunnies are not visceral. It's 2016!

 

[sexbad?]

Yeah, uhm, bunny hopping doesn't work? Wtf.

Instead you get double jump and precise air control upgrades later on.

 

[Mustawd]

Game looks p. cool men. I mean as good as it could get in today's world and still make money. A shame game companies are not Nonprofits.

 

[Durandal]

Game looks p. cool men. I mean as good as it could get in today's world and still make money. A shame game companies are not Nonprofits.

for all the excuses people have been making for nuDoom being at least decent for current year standards, none of them seem to have played Devil Daggers which came out early this year
a FPS which would rival the classics if it were not for its small scale

 

[CreamyBlood]

Typical fucking new faggot kids. What does standing on a dark plane, without a 'level', shooting squids for fifteen minutes have anything to do with any Doom ever made? Unless you're just trolling me but I don't get it. I don't doubt that people are this fucking stupid these days. Are you a squid, squid?

 

[DraQ]

Game looks p. cool men. I mean as good as it could get in today's world and still make money. A shame game companies are not Nonprofits.

for all the excuses people have been making for nuDoom being at least decent for current year standards, none of them seem to have played Devil Daggers which came out early this year
a FPS which would rival the classics if it were not for its small scale

So other than having no levels, scale, interesting arsenal nor visual diversity, it can rival the games famous for their levels, scale, interesting arsenals and visual diversity.

I'm not saying that what it does have is not nice, I'm saying that what it does have is orders of magnitude too little to matter.

 

[Durandal]

Game looks p. cool men. I mean as good as it could get in today's world and still make money. A shame game companies are not Nonprofits.

for all the excuses people have been making for nuDoom being at least decent for current year standards, none of them seem to have played Devil Daggers which came out early this year
a FPS which would rival the classics if it were not for its small scale

So other than having no levels, scale, interesting arsenal nor visual diversity, it can rival the games famous for their levels, scale, interesting arsenals and visual diversity.
I'm not saying that what it does have is not nice, I'm saying that what it does have is orders of magnitude too little to matter.

that's pretty much what I was saying

the reason I believe Devil Daggers has a strong concept and execution is because it establishes a higher sense of unity and coherence than most games released this year
with that I mean that the sound, visuals, atmosphere, controls and gameplay all strive together to achieve something unique, take one away and the entire package is ruined
it's still a Serious Sam first-person mobile tower defense game at heart, meaning it's more about crowd control and methodical movement, yet circlestrafing and infinite backstepping won't help you survive for long
Because it's a first-person game about crowd control, the sound design serves to give you a good indication of what is happening in the other 250 degrees around you, with each monster type emitting its own unique sound, yet all of them are designed in such a way you can even tell one apart from the other in the hottest of situations. The overall sounds are subtle yet discernible, meaning it's unlikely that your ears will get overwhelmed until the very last moment when you fucked up.

The visual designs also achieve a good sense of variety while fitting in with the atmosphere, with each enemy being able to stand out from the other through use of shape and color. There's also red crystals, which serve as both weak points for the enemies and are the main means through which you can power yourself up. You either collect them through walking over them, or by simply not shooting, which will cause all nearby red crystals to be pulled towards you like magnets. Yet pausing to shoot stuff just so you can grab crystals can be risky considering the enemies are generally faster than you, as you'll have to find the right moment to do so. Every tier of twenty crystals or so your shot is powered-up, while the next tier will earn you homing daggers and later ones cause you to temporarily enter a bullet time state so you can create some more breathing room, so in general there is some risk and reward present. The enemies also come in great variety and are USED in great variety (*cough* Painkiller *cough*), from massive worms which prevent you from seeing the entire field, bugs which suck up the aforementioned red crystals, different kinds of spawners, and so on. Unlike most first-person mobile tower defense games, accuracy is not a given. You don't have a crosshair, and you need to learn how to lead your shots, on top of knowing when to fire your shotgun blast and when to use your homing daggers (there's a limit to how many can be active at once, and it's a bad idea to use them against resistant enemies with small weakpoints). The enemies actually make you aim up and down unlike most shooters, so there's that. Movement and gaining speed is also important in order to outrun the dangerous hordes, and there's a skill ceiling involved to a lot of this.

Now, a lot of what I described is not new or innovative at all, and it's not some grand savior of the FPS genre nor what all future shooters should aspire to be. It takes an existing concept and executes it greatly while putting its own unique spin on things, and voila, you have a good game which manages to be unique on its own. Quake's gameplay mostly comes down to basic moving and shooting, but it's executed well thanks to its levels. Descent is pretty much Doom in full 3D space but it stand out on its own because it takes great advantage of its freedom of movement. However, that does not mean Quake-style or Descent-style levels are the end-all-be-all design style for every other FPS. The keyword here is execution, as in realizing the concept in many different ways. That's what level design in FPS is largely for, but level design is more than elaborate layouts. For all the shit Serious Sam gets for not having real levels, those criticisms were answered in the first half of Serious Sam 3 where you were fighting traditional Serious Sam enemies in small and tight environments, which turned out to be really easy for the most part because you were only fighting a handful of enemies at once given the small amount of free space. Halfway through it goes back to its roots by pitting you against hundreds of enemies at a time, and it becomes more interesting as a result, while still not entirely abandoning layout and physical obstacles. The point being, the levels should serve the gameplay, not the other way around. Else you end up with Super Turrican 2.

And that brings us to Devil Daggers and what it isn't, or what it could've been. Which leads me to ask the following: is it fair to criticize a game for what you think it should've done rather than what it did? Is it fair to criticize the lack of of stage hazards in Touhou as lacking level design or criticize the lack of interesting bullet patterns in Gradius as lacking level design? Is it fair to criticize an arcade game for its lack of content? Is it fair to criticize dungeon crawlers for not having enough C&C as it is for cRPGs having shoddy dungeon designs? Is it fair to criticize dogs for not being cats?
To iterate again, Devil Daggers is not a game for everyone. It is a short game where you are expected to get good, replay a 5-minute game for 15 hours until you've mastered it, and chase highscores, a concept completely foreign to many role-playing game players and most Western players in general (I'm not being condescending here, I'm actually rather depressed about this). It doesn't abide to the Golden Standards, it does nothing with its layout and prefers to spawn in enemies at random at an increasing rate, it has no unique weapon arsenal, no singleplayer campaign, and quite frankly, why should it? Why are we assuming that Quake and Doom should be the core of every future not-serious FPS when so many have deviated to create something interesting on their own? It's a limiting way of thinking, and one that forgoes experimentation. If you want to see the results of this mentality, look no further than the arena shooter genre. A genre dead save for the games that kickstarted it into popularity, whereas new entries in the genre are only clones with superficial differences which barely offer anything new which Quake 3 and UT don't.

There's a lot more things Devil Daggers could have done, but whether those things like more weapons and different arena layouts would be an actual improvement to the present core gameplay is not something easy to predict considering Devil Daggers is designed around what little it has. If you were to add shit like more weapons, it'd upset the existing balance at which point the base game is changed rather than improved. It's not necessarily a bad change, but MOAR WEAPONS in itself is not necessarily a good change either. Could there have been different arenas with differing layouts without too many problems? Yeah, sure. Would it improve the game? Not noticeably, considering the amount of playtime a game like Devil Daggers can offer you depends on how much effort you decide to put into it, because you can never truly win, only be better than others by beating their records.

Devil Daggers is one of my favourite games released this year because it sets out to do something and does it well while being solid in terms of design and being unique enough on its own. It explores its own concept well enough even if some factors are not taken into consideration, which is more than I can say about the majority of games released this year or past years.

 

[Lyric Suite]

You went the wrong way advertising this shit bro. You bitched about people praising nuDoom for being closer to traditional shooters than the rest of the shit out today (while remaining a pile of shit undeserving of praise) only to shill for some indie game that at face value has almost nothing in common with the traditional shooters in question. I'm not going to say that the game is shit since i haven't tried it, but whether it is good or not is besides the point. Our general grievance here is that nobody seems to be able to replicate or even understand the original formula, it isn't just a question of whether a given FPS is bad or not. I think Serious Sam can be quite fun, but i don't consider it a traditional shooter and it pisses me off so many people believe it is. We are all quite beyond exasperated by the fact nobody can deliver on the things that made games like Doom great and you are just begging to get shit on for advertising a game that seems to have more in common with Serious Sam than Doom, precisely.

 

[Durandal]

You went the wrong way advertising this shit bro. You bitched about people praising nuDoom for being closer to traditional shooters than the rest of the shit out today (while remaining a pile of shit undeserving of praise) only to shill for some indie game that at face value has almost nothing in common with the traditional shooters in question. I'm not going to say that the game is shit since i haven't tried it, but whether it is good or not is besides the point. Our general grievance here is that nobody seems to be able to replicate or even understand the original formula, it isn't just a question of whether a given FPS is bad or not. I think Serious Sam can be quite fun, but i don't consider it a traditional shooter and it pisses me off so many people believe it is. We are all quite beyond exasperated by the fact nobody can deliver on the things that made games like Doom great and you are just begging to get shit on for advertising a game that seems to have more in common with Serious Sam than Doom, precisely.

ah fuck, I meant to say 'rivaled in terms of QUALITY'
my bad

 

[LESS T_T]

This NuDoom documentary shows some gameplay footage of the unreleased Call of Doom:

 

[adrix89]

This NuDoom documentary shows some gameplay footage of the unreleased Call of Doom:

I am conflicted . Should I praise them for aborting this abomination or damn them for ever considering it? Either way:

 

[dunno lah]

Dat revenant model in the thumbnail for the video. Now that is how I like my revvies.

 

[Morgoth]

Call of Doom would have been better than nuDoom.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Those Call of Doom scenes look hilariously terrible