Icewind Dale The Icewind Dale Series Thread

[Cael]

I've reached the Severed Hand in IWD2 on Insane, and am surprised by how much I'm enjoying this game. I always liked IWD2, but now I'm starting to think that it's at least equal to BG2.

Most battles have actually been pretty reasonable after the Black Raven Monastery, with only two actually causing me a big headache. Anyone who's played the game will be able to guess which two...

The first was the Guardian. I was able to get him to Near Death before one of my characters was gibbed. I could easily have finished it off and then resurrect my fallen PC, but I didn't like the idea of losing out on all the XP for the deceased character. In the end it just came down to buffing every PC (even the mages) and giving them high enchantment weapons and going to town while kiting.

The second was the Lost Followers. I went for the Holy Avenger as soon as I could get it, which means I was missing some of the better Level 8 spells such as Symbol of Hopelessness. The biggest problem is that the Followers have really high resistance stats, although once you know what they are things get a little bit better. Ironically the Holy Avenger's slashing damage is really good against one of them. But after multiple reloads I stumbled on a godsend of a spell... Otiluke's. Most bosses in this game are immune to stat disabling effects, but Otiluke's will take them out of the battle, which evens the odds.

The Guardian ends with the place collapsing. You have to make a run for it. Not sure if you have time for Resurrection. On top of that, you are thrown into another major fight straight after. A newly rezzed party member might have... difficulties. It is vulnerable to a whole host of save or die effects, though, so a Finger of Death or a Disintegrate is helpful.

I regret not taking a level of monk for my druids and clerics, since evasion is awesome. My Monk 1/Wizard 15 always makes their reflex saves, meaning they never take damage from offensive damage spells.

We just had that conversation. Man, you've just triggered a couple of posters, possibly as many as a dozen.

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

The Lost Followers aren't that hard if you use those entangle arrows on them. Basically, summon undead, then have 1 archer on 24/7 entangle duty. Works well.

 

[the_shadow]

Veni, vidi, vici.

The final battle against the twins was a cakewalk, and was actually easier than the penultimate fight with the half-dragon delegation. I cleaved through the twins bodyguards like butter, and then targeted Isair, who took bonus damage from the lightning of my 2 sparking throwing axes. Funnily enough you only need to get one of the twins to 'Near Death' to win.

I used an all human party and didn't level squat and/or use mule characters to see what level you'd end up at if you squeezed every last bit of XP from quests/optional fights. In the end everyone managed to reach level 16 just before the final fight, which sucks for casters, particularly my multiclassed druid who didn't even manage to get level 8 spells. Not being able to enjoy level 9 spells unless you manipulate the lousy 3E XP system is kind of a bummer, I always feel like a bit of a cheater when I level squat.

 

[Cael]

Veni, vidi, vici.

The final battle against the twins was a cakewalk, and was actually easier than the penultimate fight with the half-dragon delegation. I cleaved through the twins bodyguards like butter, and then targeted Isair, who took bonus damage from the lightning of my 2 sparking throwing axes. Funnily enough you only need to get one of the twins to 'Near Death' to win.

I used an all human party and didn't level squat and/or use mule characters to see what level you'd end up at if you squeezed every last bit of XP from quests/optional fights. In the end everyone managed to reach level 16 just before the final fight, which sucks for casters, particularly my multiclassed druid who didn't even manage to get level 8 spells. Not being able to enjoy level 9 spells unless you manipulate the lousy 3E XP system is kind of a bummer, I always feel like a bit of a cheater when I level squat.

You can't really level squat anyway. After a while you stop gaining XP due to being overleveled for the mobs you were fighting. That is why you play with +LA races because the devs didn't take the LA into account when assigning XP. Even with, say a party of Drow, you will end up around level 16 with them.

The half-dragon fight is bad simply because you start off in a bad position. It is one of the problems with IWD2. It likes to put your characters in bad positions for a fight, like the initial one with the priest of Bane when you start Chapter 5 (i.e., get to Kuldahar). My usual 4th and 5th slot wizard and sorcerer ended up on the front lines instead of being in their usual positions in the middle of the party when stepping off the airship.

 

[the_shadow]

Veni, vidi, vici.

The final battle against the twins was a cakewalk, and was actually easier than the penultimate fight with the half-dragon delegation. I cleaved through the twins bodyguards like butter, and then targeted Isair, who took bonus damage from the lightning of my 2 sparking throwing axes. Funnily enough you only need to get one of the twins to 'Near Death' to win.

I used an all human party and didn't level squat and/or use mule characters to see what level you'd end up at if you squeezed every last bit of XP from quests/optional fights. In the end everyone managed to reach level 16 just before the final fight, which sucks for casters, particularly my multiclassed druid who didn't even manage to get level 8 spells. Not being able to enjoy level 9 spells unless you manipulate the lousy 3E XP system is kind of a bummer, I always feel like a bit of a cheater when I level squat.

You can't really level squat anyway. After a while you stop gaining XP due to being overleveled for the mobs you were fighting. That is why you play with +LA races because the devs didn't take the LA into account when assigning XP. Even with, say a party of Drow, you will end up around level 16 with them.

The half-dragon fight is bad simply because you start off in a bad position. It is one of the problems with IWD2. It likes to put your characters in bad positions for a fight, like the initial one with the priest of Bane when you start Chapter 5 (i.e., get to Kuldahar). My usual 4th and 5th slot wizard and sorcerer ended up on the front lines instead of being in their usual positions in the middle of the party when stepping off the airship.

I've completed IWD 1+2 and BG 2 multiple times, and have always overlooked Sphere of Invisibility. This time I tried it out, and it became a mainstay spell for dealing with forced ambushes. Being able to reposition yourself during those sort of fights makes life a whole lot easier.

As for level squatting, I find it viable (even on harder difficulties) with decoy/fighter type characters. Having high level fighters isn't too important early-mid game if you hold off on the Battle Square.

 

[Cael]

I've completed IWD 1+2 and BG 2 multiple times, and have always overlooked Sphere of Invisibility. This time I tried it out, and it became a mainstay spell for dealing with forced ambushes. Being able to reposition yourself during those sort of fights makes life a whole lot easier.

As for level squatting, I find it viable (even on harder difficulties) with decoy/fighter type characters. Having high level fighters isn't too important early-mid game if you hold off on the Battle Square.

Otiluke's Sphere is my main go to when ambushed. With two arcane casters, that is basically two of their top guys locked down it is easy street most times.

I don't bother with fighter types. My standard party is 3 clerics (1 with fighter splash, 1 with paladin splash, 1 pure), 1 bard, 1 sorcerer and 1 wizard. With enough buffing, the fighter/cleric is enough to complete the battle square before you even get to the last sister cleric.

 

[Apostle Hand]

I liked Icewind Dale back in the days but now it's unplayable to me cuz you don't have companions.

Found IWD2 too ugly and hard so i haven't finished it.

 

[Citizen]

I liked Icewind Dale back in the days but now it's unplayable to me cuz you don't have companions.

Well, you do. You create the party of companions right in the tavern at the start.

Found IWD2 too ugly and hard so i haven't finished it.

It's somewhat dull and really long, but in no way ugly.

 

[CryptRat]

it's unplayable to me cuz you don't have companions.

 

[Apostle Hand]

But they are not real companions that you meet along the way and can chat with them and stuff.

 

[CryptRat]

Which is a good thing.

 

[Xeon]

Companions in BG1 barely had any dialogues. There is a mod that adds companions but it wasn't that good iirc.

 

[Apostle Hand]

But they still had some echo of personaliy in them.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Whose moron's alt is this?

 

[Apostle Hand]

I'm authentic person. Apostle Hand, Knight of Darkness blessed by unholy demons known throughout the Realms.

 

[Modron]

Whose bitch this is?

FTFY.

 

[the_shadow]

BTW, does anyone have any hints on how to do Chapter 1 (Shaengarne and Horde Fortress) on Insane difficulty without 50 million reloads? I always find that portion of the game brutal simply because you don't really have any decent spells, your PCs die in one or two hits, your decoy doesn't have their main AC boosting spells (Ghost and Spirit armor) and you get mobbed by damage resistant enemies such as wererats and werebadgers. Once I hit the Ice Temple it's smooth sailing, but until then I feel like a pleb.

 

[Cael]

BTW, does anyone have any hints on how to do Chapter 1 (Shaengarne and Horde Fortress) on Insane difficulty without 50 million reloads? I always find that portion of the game brutal simply because you don't really have any decent spells, your PCs die in one or two hits, your decoy doesn't have their main AC boosting spells (Ghost and Spirit armor) and you get mobbed by damage resistant enemies such as wererats and werebadgers. Once I hit the Ice Temple it's smooth sailing, but until then I feel like a pleb.

Magic Weapon spell for your front liners and Snowballs for your mages? I vaguely remember something like that. I believe I used stealth to open up the map a bit, then saturated the area with Snowballs. The melee guys held off what is left while the mages and bard dropped Chromatic Orbs and Magic Missiles on them. I play with a sorcerer, a wizard and a bard, though, so I can get off a pretty big alpha strike and sustain a bombardment for that level.

Oh, the Moonsword/blade helped a lot.

 

[the_shadow]

Yeah, maybe I should use Snilloc's more. I'm loathe to select it for my sorcerers because it becomes redundant later in the game.

 

[Cael]

Yeah, maybe I should use Snilloc's more. I'm loathe to select it for my sorcerers because it becomes redundant later in the game.

No AoE spells become redundant. I was using the snowballs all the way to the Hand.

There is also a good reason why traditionally there are no AoE damage spells like snowball at spell level 2 in DnD. At best they do 1d8 damage and 10ft radius. Never damage scaling by level nor greater than 10ft radius. They are really overpowered for that level.

 

[laclongquan]

You can buy the braeg potions from the Dock which give you +3 str for 3 hours which is waaaaay better than other methods at the time. You only need the potions for the Prologue before your cleric level up to where they could cast strength. Cleric's Aid is very much helpful in keeping your melee alive, and your Clerics can give enough Aids before braeg portion expired. Ditto with Druid's Barkskin.

You can buy various fire damage potions and can use them tactically. They are good until middle game.

Use your money on the said potions, because other than some very few unreplaceable items you must buy, you can do without spending money on equipments.

You can use level 1 and 2 summons as fodder to help your melee fighters.

Druids, Clerics, Bards and Sorcerers can give you pretty good buffs and disable spells without buying scrolls: grease, engtangle, sleep...

I know I do, because in my current runs I save loots until chapter 1 to sell to the elf gal all at once. And buy not much but potions. Too many braeg, as it turned out, but the rest get spent like a drunken sailor on whorehouse.

 

[the_shadow]

Yeah, maybe I should use Snilloc's more. I'm loathe to select it for my sorcerers because it becomes redundant later in the game.

No AoE spells become redundant. I was using the snowballs all the way to the Hand.

There is also a good reason why traditionally there are no AoE damage spells like snowball at spell level 2 in DnD. At best they do 1d8 damage and 10ft radius. Never damage scaling by level nor greater than 10ft radius. They are really overpowered for that level.

I've been using Snowballs through Chapter 1 now, and they are decent. There is one place they really shine, and that is those damn war drums outside the Horde Fortress. I used the AoE to destroy one which was out of my archer's range across a chasm, without aggroing the enemies nearby.

 

[the_shadow]

Discovered something else I never really thought of. I've always known that the Ice Golem Champions in the Ice Temple were vulnerable to ice (+10 fire damage from any fire attacks) but had really high spell resistance, meaning that the only way to really do fire damage was from a weapon which had ancillary fire damage, which turned battles into a kiting micromanage fest. But lamp oil and burning oil work great, bypassing spell resistance and giving that extra damage. If you give each PC a lamp oil/burning oil, you can take down one of the golem's in one or two rounds with absolutely no risk to your PCs. Don't know why I didn't think of this in my previous dozen playthroughs.

 

[laclongquan]

The innate resistance to spend money on consumable weapons? It's prevalent in BG series and IWD1. But IWD2 goes counter to that trend and subtly reward players for spending money like water: fight and kill targets waaaaay out of their level range.

IT's basically a side effect of squatting levels and fight enemy of many levels above. By using lamp oils, magic ammo, you can do that and reap greater XP than if you level up and fight while saving money.

(note: throwing 6 lamp oil pots onto an Ice Golem Champion is very much indeedy burning money like mad)

 

[the_shadow]

A couple of other minor things I never really knew:

- After you fix Oswald's ship, he says he will fly on ahead of you. I never really noticed him do this, until my current game. If you fix his ship and then bring down the ice wall, the airship disappears and he leaves you a note + a potion which gives a minor (but permanent) boost to damage resistance. I like that the designers actually thought about this and made the game world reactive with the plot.

- 95% of friendly NPCs in the game are 'expendable', in that they can be killed without immediately ending the game. Some of them have decent items, but one that stands out in some grandmaster gloves (+1 attack, +2 damage!) you can 'acquire' from one of the named NPCs in Malavon's camp in the Underdark.

- You can buy an electric +2 returning throwing hammer in the Underdark that makes the Apocalyptic Boneguards in the Battle Square easy to beat, since they receive an extra +10 blugeoning damage. Better yet, the throwing hammer has a good range (about as far as a sling), unlike throwing daggers and axes.

- Mordenkainen's sword is my new favourite Level 7 spells. It hits everything you need to, and makes some of the hardest encounters in the game (the Guardian, Iron Golems) a piece of cake. Strength doesn't add to its damage, but Power Attack does. And since the sword gains a whopping bonus to THACO, you have no reason not to use power attack.