Romance in cRPGs - is it ever good?

[laclongquan]

You obviously never play VTM Bloodlines. Our MC got played by Velvet Velour (aka Susan) like a lovesicked puppy. We got sent out to do the quests WITHOUT pay. The rewards are only a few sappy letter and love poem. We, the mercenary and calculating players?!! Even now in our heart of hearts we hope that is just VV's tough love not that we noobie neonate got manipulated by an older vamp~

No rewards? You can steal at least $250 from the jerkoff theater where the target works, and you get XP for killing her. But the real romance interest (if you could call it that) is Jeanette.

I don't mind a little sex in RPGs as long as it doesn't feel like a dating sim or softporn. Most leave it out, but that doesn't seem right either. Logically, it should be a major motivation behind NPCs' actions. I just don't want to get into the details.

That's side benefit, not the pay.

I also doesnt mind offscreen sex. If I want porn I would go to porn. But I'd like a formal acknowledgement from game devs about the possibility.

 

[purpleblob]

Again, if I ask myself why I play RPGs, it's certainly not some weird ass desire to get romantically involved with an NPC with a few set of dialogue options.

Romances add to a story, they can bring lightheartedness to a dark story, they can bring tragedy, they can bring humor, they are a tool to get the player to engage with the characters. Romances arent alone in this, friendships, rivalries and other kinds of relationship can add just as much, but claiming that it isnt a good thing or that a game would be better without them comes off as someone completely deluded and ignorant would say.

I agree with Lhynn. This is why I like party based RPGs with good companions (yes, BG2). Unlike majority, I actually like Anomen romance a lot for this reason, really liked how his character developed more through romance with PC.

 

[Neanderthal]

Thought Ravel an Kreia were pretty good depictions o broken, one sided an harmful relationships, gotta admit I thought best un were Bloody Baron an his missus though: Two folk who know each other so well, an exactly how to hurt each other, an have grown to regard that relationship as normal. In most games it always feels mawkish, overwrought an too mechanical an clean, not messy an fucked up enough. Think it'd be an interestin experiment to have a married or betrothed proganist, limitations, expectations an how player reacs to em etc, devs'd probably cock it up though as most on em are young wi no real life experience.

 

[Prime Junta]

Mask of the Betrayer's Safiya Romance

 

[Jason Liang]

Maybe it hasn't been done right in a CRPG yet, but we have a clear example of romance working in an epic fantasy story:

Up there with the most romantic love stories in cinema.

I think tragic romances are best for storytelling. The problem is most companion romances aren't tragic- the game writers are too chicken to slot off companions midway through the game. I suppose BG2 did give it the best try except you got to bring them back. Which is kind of epic and romantic...

There's plenty of good adventure games built around romantic relationships, if that counts. I'm sure there's probably a few jrpgs that have made romance work too.

 

[gaussgunner]

Again, if I ask myself why I play RPGs, it's certainly not some weird ass desire to get romantically involved with an NPC with a few set of dialogue options.

Romances add to a story, they can bring lightheartedness to a dark story, they can bring tragedy, they can bring humor, they are a tool to get the player to engage with the characters. Romances arent alone in this, friendships, rivalries and other kinds of relationship can add just as much, but claiming that it isnt a good thing or that a game would be better without them comes off as someone completely deluded and ignorant would say.

I agree with Lhynn. This is why I like party based RPGs with good companions (yes, BG2). Unlike majority, I actually like Anomen romance a lot for this reason, really liked how his character developed more through romance with PC.

Do you guys like Larian's relationship simulators? (Divinity: Original Sin and probably some of their previous sequels)

 

[Parabalus]

I seem to remember that Vicionia and Morrigan from DA:O weren't that bad, because they were easy to fail and the women would readily backstab you for personal gain, kinda like in life.

Worst one was Ahnassi in Morrowind, she gave a ton of cool quests only for male chars, lowered replayability if you didn't mod the check out .

 

[ilitarist]

It's always bad when the character is not pre-existing, player created. You know that your character is appreciated not for his specific qualities but usually for several right choices in dialogues. Your character is usually a black slate with little personality, how much romance can there be?

Another problem is your character is always the initiator. Feels like you are in a harem where everyone just waits for you to hit on them.

I liked some parts of it in Dragon Age Inquisition. There was one character, an experienced master of intrigued, who you could try to hit on. She always said something like "oh, it's adorable you're trying to go for someone so obviously out of your league". In other cases it was a classic powerfantasy though, whole romance was reduced to selecting heart options in couple of dialogues.

 

[gaussgunner]

I think tragic romances are best for storytelling. The problem is most companion romances aren't tragic- the game writers are too chicken to slot off companions midway through the game. I suppose BG2 did give it the best try except you got to bring them back. Which is kind of epic and romantic...

Jagged Alliance 2? My first time, I had Hitman (cheap starter merc) then I got Raven and her hubby Raider who turned out to be a real pussy. Hitman was cucking him all the time. Ultimately I got tired of reloading every time Raven got killed. Hitman wouldn't stop crying. I fired him 'cause he never could learn how to shoot anyway, and Raider for being a super cuck. Can't say I cared about any of them though... only Buns.

Seriously though... in a proper RPG, losing a party member is usually game over, time to reload.

In the game I'm prototyping now, party members can be captured and rescued. It's going to be a prominent mechanic, one that rewards you for playing through instead of reloading. I hadn't really thought about the romance angle. Not keen on intra-party romance; they're blank slate characters, you can pretend if you want. PC-NPC romance could be interesting though. PC gets captured, NPC helps rescue them, turns against the offending NPC(s), possibly triggering a major plot twist.

 

[duanth123]

No romance until game devs can prove their competence in nearly ever other area of RPG design.

Otherwise, it just serves as a crutch by comparison - seeing as how low are the standards that most people, especially the *current year* people, have for romance in games.

It's like an "Easy" button for an increased playerbase that, once pushed, can quickly lead to uncontrollable consequences.

And next thing you know you'll be pondering the molecular composition of lady sweat for a future romance pack DLC.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

In VtM you could also "romance" Romero, a ghoul in a cemetery. Brian Mitsoda just had to make that self-insert.


Also my favourite one was probably PST's Annah. Always preffered her. Oh, and Witcher's Triss, I liked her more than Yennifer from the time I had read the series in Russian, long before the game though.
In BG2 the only good vanilla romance was Viconia, at least the first half of her romance.
Bioware couldn't write male love interests for shit though, Anomen was one of the worst NPCs ever, and the only Carth's redeeming quality was that you could order Bastila to kill him. Obsidian did good with both Atton and Gann, although both games were kinda unfinished in all aspects.

All and all, I think the romance can be done right, if it's not the focal point of the game, and if it's tied to overall narrative, quests and mechanics organically (and not in idiotic gifts mini-games sense, if you go down that road at least make all wymminz Chinese than, ffs).

 

[gaussgunner]

Another problem is your character is always the initiator. Feels like you are in a harem where everyone just waits for you to hit on them.

Damn that's lame. Some games literally add whorehouse and call it a day (Pillars of Eternity, Divine Divinity...)

In mine, the NPCs always initiate. They're basically degenerates who want to fuck everything that moves. I need to make sure it's in the player's interest to rebuff at least half of them.

 

[Grauken]

Next up, potty breaks for your characters, has it ever been done well in CRPGs and how can we elevate it from a niche-fetish to mainstream gameplay element for the whole family

 

[gaussgunner]

Let's see, in addition to HP, stamina, mana, and wahtever, we'll add a piss bar, a shit bar, a jizz bar for male characters, a period bar for prime-age female characters, PMS, ovulation, pregnancy, childbirth, oh, a breast milk bar...

 

[HansDampf]

Not sure if you can count the two possible sexual encounters in VtMB as romances. Especially Jeanette who would let anybody in. The only romance in that game would be Heather, and it's a tragic one, no matter how you deal with her. As a Malk you can get the option to rape her mind and make her forget. But even then she has already thrown her life away at that point.
No sex. No happy ending.

 

[Reinhardt]

Unless there is an actual carrot to be had from the romance, like say inheriting wealth from their family to enrich your treasury or getting a dowry that includes some bad ass enchanted armor or weaponry

ToEE.

 

[laclongquan]

Not sure if you can count the two possible sexual encounters in VtMB as romances. Especially Jeanette who would let anybody in. The only romance in that game would be Heather, and it's a tragic one, no matter how you deal with her. As a Malk you can get the option to rape her mind and make her forget. But even then she has already thrown her life away at that point.
No sex. No happy ending.

Like I said, when the fucks kill OUR ghoul in that hotel, the fight become personal.

 

[gaussgunner]

Yeah, Jeanette is only 'romance' in the sense that you have to work for it.

Romero is literally like "Say... you're a fine piece of ass. If you were a male or nosferatu I'd ask you to shoot zombies for me while I buy some beer bang a whore, but since you're here, wanna save me a trip?" I love the Malk option "okay, i'll lube up my parts with blood and you thrust up against my corpse".. hahaha

 

[*-*/\--/\~]

No, keep that plague away from my games. They have already suffered enough, don't turn them into e-Twilight.

 

[A horse of course]

Japs have a pretty good compromise: Make the chicks hot and single, but don't actually have formal romances. This way the player can easily LARP their romance fantasies and we get quality SFM porn, without the extra work or worrying about mawkish writing. Pretty much everybody wins.

Except Obshitian, who are too self-consciously insecure these days about being perceived as pandering to FUCKING WHITE MALES to write any kind of romance that doesn't end in being cucked (F:NV) or depicting a "conventionally" attractive female character.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

How about romance in Archmage Rises? http://store.steampowered.com/app/506480/

According to the video on steam, MC can seduce a noble's daughter and sell her into slavery. If sandboxy stuff like this is implemented decently,

 

[Lhynn]

This way the player can easily LARP their romance fantasies.

 

[A horse of course]

HentaiWriter should contribute

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Since we are talking about RPGs and romance, I'd play the hell out of a proper Romance of the Three Kingdoms RPG.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Let's see, in addition to HP, stamina, mana, and wahtever, we'll add a piss bar, a shit bar, a jizz bar for male characters, a period bar for prime-age female characters, PMS, ovulation, pregnancy, childbirth, oh, a breast milk bar...

I think that there are some Japangese porn-RPGs that have these, not sure if there's one with all of them at once though.