Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Infinitron]

I just did and it didn't make sense because:

and if you want to have the game pause whenever a party member can perform a new action, you can do that

Apparently actions must have cooldowns in order to end! EVERYTHING HAS A COOLDOWN!!

Oh, but right; I'm a troll anyway. Just keep waiting. Is the stone getting any warmer, yet? Your blood will pour and fill the goblets of liars and they will gorge on your meat.

Tell me, can a caster in Baldur's Gate cast two spells at the same time? Yes or no?

If the answer is "no", when can he cast a second spell after casting the first? Hint: NOT AFTER A COOLDOWN.

 

[villain of the story]

Strawman argument. In Baldur's Gate, "new actions" can be performed anytime, overriding and thus cancelling the previous action in progress. You can interrupt your caster's casting for another spell or the waiting time between rounds between casting/fighting/whatevering to move your characters. Therefore, going by the example of Baldur's Gate, you would need a pause condition "when the current action is performed to completion", not "when a new action can be performed" because characters could perform any action at any given time, at various costs (lost rounds or wasted spells etc.). For a context where "a new action that can be performed" to arise, you first need "the new actions" in question to be disabled for an undisclosed amount of time. Now, this might be because certain actions can not be "cancelled" and *must* be completed before anything else can be done but then again, this would not be because "new actions" can be performed at a specific time.

In an attempt to be more reasonable, I'll admit to the fact that they might go after a more versatile and sensible option, such as having stamina/mana/whatever pools which the certain actions would drain and thus become unavailable when not enough stamina/mana is present but even then, I would doubt they would balance it properly to escape the metagamist shackles of the cool-down syndrome. In fact, I think it's more likely that they would do that and additional cool-downs and fuck it up all over the place.

 

[Infinitron]

Strawman argument. In Baldur's Gate, "new actions" can be performed anytime, overriding and thus cancelling the previous action in progress.

So what? The autopause doesn't have to support that option. Spell casting finished? Autopause. You cancelled spell-casting in mid-cast? No autopause necessary.

 

[villain of the story]

There is quite a bit of difference between "Autopuse when you complete the current action" and "Autopause when you can perform a new action". The former doesn't say anything regarding the nature of the other actions. The latter kind of does.

Semantics, I guess.

 

[Executer]

I don't think many people backing Obsidian are expecting much from the combat, have they ever done great combat? If I get another MOTB I'll be happy.

 

[toro]

To be honest, they say a lot of good things, but they show too little. It's teasing done in a bad way. I mean: if Obsidian was a girl, the only end for this story would be a rape.

What do you think they have that they haven't shown at all (or are saving for future updates)?

TBH I don't know, but I was expecting more. At least some very appealing artworks or anything else than just words. But I don't want to repeat myself ...

 

[Infinitron]

There is quite a bit of difference between "Autopuse when you complete the current action" and "Autopause when you can perform a new action". The former doesn't say anything regarding the nature of the other actions. The latter kind of does.

Semantics, I guess.

Yes, but it's easier to describe the functional purpose of the autopause that way. You want it to pause so you know when to give your character new orders.

 

[Infinitron]

Expert Mode features poll: http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/60776-optional-expert-mode-features/

"How shitty should the graphics be?" http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/60806-lower-graphics-for-bigger-game/

 

[clemens]

To be honest, they say a lot of good things, but they show too little. It's teasing done in a bad way. I mean: if Obsidian was a girl, the only end for this story would be a rape.

What do you think they have that they haven't shown at all (or are saving for future updates)?

TBH I don't know, but I was expecting more. At least some very appealing artworks or anything else than just words. But I don't want to repeat myself ...

Indeed... At one point, it would be great to see that they thought this through. For now, it seems they just threw some ideas on a napkin, drinking beers and went yeaahhhh kicksterteeerr yeaaahhh.

 

[villain of the story]

I think Obsidian needs to be asked these:

- What kind of health/damage system do you intend to have? Straight Hit/Health Points ala IE games?
- Will there be instant-restoration of stats (eg. healing) through commonly available items eg. potions, scrolls?

Will you or do you intend to do or have:

- any layer of social interaction other than talking in dialogue trees?
- unique item descriptions and perhaps art? Descriptions, yes. Art, not sure ATM :
http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/378702272181336199

- environments and environmental objects have descriptions and interactivity similar to Fallout?
- a periodic management of some of the basic needs eg. hunger, thirst, need to sleep, dressing according to warmth and cold and if yes, to what extend do you intend for these conditions to effect the characters?
- any sort of "physiological" resource management to combat, eg. dealing with mana, fatigue, concentration pools?
- any sort of "tactical" customisation in combat, eg. adjusting an offense vs. defence pool or stacking actions for combos with their own bonuses and penalties or similar stuff that are prevalent in PnP RPGs?
- cool-downs for abilities or actions?
- formations that impose bonuses and penalties in combat?
- damage types and thresholds (eg. you just can't cut through plate. you can stick through openings though you need to be very accurate or deal blunt damage though you need to be very strong)
- authentic and tactical depiction of armour and weapons where there will be no one weapon that can do everything in every situation?
- Item maintenance eg. item deterioration, repairs, upgrades and enhancements?
- Crafting and if yes, to what extent?
- Diminishing returns of experience the types of enemy that has been killed one too many times?

Suggestions?

 

[Grimlorn]

I think you guys expect to much. This is basically a pitch. This is what developers go to publishers with to try and get them to invest in the game. I think expecting some screenshots or in game footage when they've just selected an engine is crazy.

 

[wormix]

If a game has optional 'harder' difficulty options, is the game balanced around them being on or off? In my view, these toggle options should be to disable these options, with the game balanced around the fact that they are on by default, not the other way around.

If people want to play with "easy" options, then sure add them to the game. Just don't let them pretend they're still playing a hard game by selecting "normal" difficulty.

 

[jewboy]

Could be nice, but I almost think it should be implemented in a later patch or DLC. Because it sounds like they want you to play the game solo, recruiting different party members that they write specifically for to make important to the story. Or perhaps only unlock it after beating the game once. That could work.

Huh? What would be the point of implementing the feature and then locking it? Why prevent people from playing the way they want? It wouldn't work anyway. How would you know on a fresh install whether that person has already played the game 100 times before?

 

[jewboy]

It's just a pitch, but it's a good pitch. If you don't trust MCA and Cain to make a good game (and after Alpha Brotocol there is some reason to distrust Avellone) then don't donate. If it turns out well you can buy it when it's done.

 

[Grimlorn]

Could be nice, but I almost think it should be implemented in a later patch or DLC. Because it sounds like they want you to play the game solo, recruiting different party members that they write specifically for to make important to the story. Or perhaps only unlock it after beating the game once. That could work.

Huh? What would be the point of implementing the feature and then locking it? Why prevent people from playing the way they want? It wouldn't work anyway. How would you know on a fresh install whether that person has already played the game 100 times before?

Because the game is meant to be played with a single created character while recruiting your party through the story. Think about PST, you went through a lot of that game without a full party. Starting a new game with 6 created characters might change the balance and stuff. Not to mention the story and background elements you'll probably miss out on. You should play the game the right way first. Then afterward you can try creating a full party and playing through it that way if you want.

You can always load up a save and beat the game real quick or perhaps the game could read your saves that beat the game. I'm sure there also might be a cheat to unlock it too.

 

[FeelTheRads]

If I get another MOTB I'll be happy.

Well, then I'd say you don't have very high expectations.

But, regardless, if they can do MotB with publishers, then... what's the benefit of going without publishers?

So what can Obsidian do without publishers? Just the same thing they can do with them? "Just as good as MotB" confirmed as the new excuse for Obsidian when they release their next piece of shit.

 

[Infinitron]

If I get another MOTB I'll be happy.

Well, then I'd say you don't have very high expectations.

But, regardless, if they can do MotB with publishers, then... what's the benefit of going without publishers?

So what can Obsidian do without publishers? Just the same thing they can do with them? "Just as good as MotB" confirmed as the new excuse for Obsidian when they release their next piece of shit.

They could publish MotB with publishers 5 years ago. Not today.

 

[Executer]

Feeltherads , I'll pay $20 for potentially good (by my standards, no apologies there)... besides you couldn't do MOTB with AAA publishers now (and it hasn't even been very long). If there's an RPG Renaissance and the market is saturated with great products I'll raise my standards (for what I'm willing to pay for).

 

[Data4]

Bros, here's one we need to monitor. http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/60813-the-lbgt-agenda/

Keep the hazmat suits at the ready.

 

[Murk]

I'm all for them pushing whatever agenda they want, maybe it will get them some easy money from the LGBTQ (seriously, how many letters in the acronym do you people need?) crowd, which in turn means more NPCs and regions and shit for me.

 

[Jaesun]

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/60817-t-shirt-size/



All we need is Andharias Bra Size post.

 

[villain of the story]

Oh boy, I have only just noticed the Sawyer interview where he said:

For Project Eternity, I’d like to keep the overall feeling of pacing and management, but we don’t need to be bound by rounds or the timing rules of the AD&D games. This should allow the characters to feel more responsive to commands and to have more flexible timing windows for the use of abilities.

That pretty much seals the deal. Lack of rounds + mention of abilities in a time-bound context + what Tim Cain said about actions becoming available to perform = twitchfest next gen shit complete with KOOL-downs for the next gen kids. There is no mistaking it.

 

[tuluse]

If I get another MOTB I'll be happy.

Well, then I'd say you don't have very high expectations.

But, regardless, if they can do MotB with publishers, then... what's the benefit of going without publishers?

So what can Obsidian do without publishers? Just the same thing they can do with them? "Just as good as MotB" confirmed as the new excuse for Obsidian when they release their next piece of shit.

They could MotB with publishers 5 years ago. Not today.

I actually understand this, but their whole pitch has been "going back to the 90s." Which I find perplexing. Do they want to go back to 2008, 1998, or do they want to do something really independent? I get the impression that the answer to that is 1998. Which I find disappointing. They don't actually sound like they want artistic freedom, but rather want the same limits that Interplay set on them 15 years ago.

I've still contributed because 1998 was better, but I wish I got more of a artistic vibe from them.

 

[Infinitron]

Oh boy, I have only just noticed the Sawyer interview where he said:



That pretty much seals the deal. Lack of rounds + mention of abilities in a time-bound context + what Tim Cain said about actions becoming available to perform = twitchfest next gen shit complete with KOOL-downs for the next gen kids. There is no mistaking it.

Oh no, no six second wait before drinking a potion because my round is out of sync! WHAT IS THIS DUMBED DOWN SHIT.

If you think about it, that wait was kind of like a form of cooldown. So they've actually removed cooldowns even more.

 

[villain of the story]

You know I am right, though.



Enjoy your popamole. Only a matter of time now before they reveal their cover mechanics -a first in a RTwP RPG!