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New Arc Line - Arcanum-inspired, modern Party-Based RPG - now available on Early Access

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They’re a niche then, and still now. That’s the problem.
Agreed, but it feels different now than it did then. Back then, it was almost like anyone that developed something because there were so few developers and publishers, it got "published". There really wasn't a AAA studio/publisher versus indie. There were bugs and such, but nothing like Cyberpunk 2077's release. The quality back then seemed more uniform.
The quality was more consistent. First, the technological limitations were pretty uniform across the industry. It put a cap on what could be attempted, innovated, and what presentation was possible. Second, QA was more efficient and effective. The smaller scope of games and greater necessity to have something ship intact reinforced this consistency.
 

Grampy_Bone

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Not disputing what you wrote but that is not what I meant.

I meant that *creating emotional engagement* (e.g. "poor family", "romances", "persecuted immigrants", etc.) performs WORSE than just making good gameplay

We didn't enjoy Diablo, Morrowind, Fallout because of some sad story or other emotional BS.
True, but the creators of modern entertainment are not making an honest mistake about what the audience wants. They think they can dictate what the audience wants.

If emotional games sell worse than gameplay-first games, that just means the audience is wrong and needs to be "educated." When their companies fail, they need subsidization. The Message is too important.

They really think they can dictate what the audience should like. That's why there's this cycle of "Movie/Game/Show/Comic isn't FOR you, we don't want you as our audience, you're bad people," followed by sales bombing, and then "Why didn't you racist pieces of shit buy our product? This proves we are needed more than ever!"
 

Harthwain

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Modern writing is cringe shit cynically attempting to program your brain. They don't care if you enjoy it, they only view it as a vehicle for The Message.
Most writing is supposed to have "The Message" of some kind. That's the whole point of communication. The real problem is The Message™ in this case is shit and a mark of a terrible writer. Because a good (or even a decent) one would know how to send The Message™ while keeping the audience entertained.

If emotional games sell worse than gameplay-first games, that just means the audience is wrong and needs to be "educated." When their companies fail, they need subsidization. The Message is too important.
It is hard to subsidize in capitalism, where making money is the name of the game though.

They really think they can dictate what the audience should like. That's why there's this cycle of "Movie/Game/Show/Comic isn't FOR you, we don't want you as our audience, you're bad people," followed by sales bombing, and then "Why didn't you racist pieces of shit buy our product? This proves we are needed more than ever!"
But it is not that simple. In order for propaganda to sell (any kind of propaganda) you need to wrap it in a way that is at least acceptable/passable for people. Keep bombing enough and I doubt you will be left standing. After all, the money is the bedrock of everything, so you have to be successful in order to function (or, at the very least, break even to keep operating).
 

Zombra

An iron rock in the river of blood and evil
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Make the Codex Great Again! RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Modern writing is cringe shit cynically attempting to program your brain. They don't care if you enjoy it, they only view it as a vehicle for The Message. This has been obvious for some time even while certain persons stubbornly tell you to ignore your lying eyes.
Yeah, not like when we were kids. No one back then was writing stories about a plucky rebel force fighting an oppressive empire!
 
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Lord_Potato

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Wish it didn't look like Overwatch.
Look for an excellent buttplug as remedy for that butthurt. If that doesn't help, travel to Paris and get fucked by niggers to death. Now return to your life of being obediant tax govedo goyim. They'll call you up soon, dying for Ukraine is coming for ya, don't worry
You're not really helping your non-schizo case there.
This ship has sailed a long, long time ago.
 

Lord_Potato

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I'm surprised anyone would even pick up steampunk today. After all, it's super problematic to enjoy an art style based off a period of exploitative capitalism, colonialist racism against BIPOCs, sexism, and environmental destruction that directly started ciswhitehetmale-created climate change! It's so problematic that I'm sweating the green dye out of my hair!
It's picked up surprisingly often today. Sovereign Syndicate, New Arc Line, Clockwork Revolution. Obviously people feel the era of exploative capitalism and environmental destruction tells a story of quite an importance for us today. Makes you think, huh?
 

Harthwain

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Oh yeah, because Arcanum, the very game this one tries to emulate, totally wasn't political at all
:hmmm:
It certainly was political, but it didn't feel like someone was injecting modern politics for virtue signaling purposes. It was more of a mash of industrial era politics and fantasy, which was very appropriate in the context of Arcanum's own setting, where magic had a certain impact on technology and vice-versa. That's what made it a non-issue, despite being political in nature.
 

Lord_Potato

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Oh yeah, because Arcanum, the very game this one tries to emulate, totally wasn't political at all
:hmmm:
It certainly was political, but it didn't feel like someone was injecting modern politics for virtue signaling purposes. It was more of a mash of industrial era politics and fantasy, which was very appropriate in the context of Arcanum's own setting, where magic had a certain impact on technology and vice-versa. That's what made it a non-issue, despite being political in nature.
Also, people from both sides of the political spectrum were less delicate snowflakes back then.
 

Taka-Haradin puolipeikko

Filthy Kalinite
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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Bubbles In Memoria
I'm surprised anyone would even pick up steampunk today. After all, it's super problematic to enjoy an art style based off a period of exploitative capitalism, colonialist racism against BIPOCs, sexism, and environmental destruction that directly started ciswhitehetmale-created climate change! It's so problematic that I'm sweating the green dye out of my hair!
It's picked up surprisingly often today. Sovereign Syndicate, New Arc Line, Clockwork Revolution. Obviously people feel the era of exploative capitalism and environmental destruction tells a story of quite an importance for us today. Makes you think, huh?
Not really, no.
 

Lord_Potato

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I'm surprised anyone would even pick up steampunk today. After all, it's super problematic to enjoy an art style based off a period of exploitative capitalism, colonialist racism against BIPOCs, sexism, and environmental destruction that directly started ciswhitehetmale-created climate change! It's so problematic that I'm sweating the green dye out of my hair!
It's picked up surprisingly often today. Sovereign Syndicate, New Arc Line, Clockwork Revolution. Obviously people feel the era of exploative capitalism and environmental destruction tells a story of quite an importance for us today. Makes you think, huh?
Not really, no.
shrug.gif
 

Harthwain

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Also, people from both sides of the political spectrum were less delicate snowflakes back then.
I don't think this is just about people becoming more snowflake-y. The narratives are way more hamfisted than they were before, too (because most writers are hacks who can't handle what they're doing properly). They are also very often 1:1 parallels to our MODERN times, even if the setting is completely inappropriate for that. Of course, this caused people to become much more sensitive to any kind of "strong woman" or "diversity" occurrences, but this is to be expected - when you try to shove that kind of crap everywhere, people are bound to get more prone to seeing it everywhere. Even in rare examples when it is not the case or where it wasn't a problem before (such as fantasy games). So this is more of the "cause and effect" more than anything else.
 

Lord_Potato

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Also, people from both sides of the political spectrum were less delicate snowflakes back then.
I don't think this is just about people becoming more snowflake-y. The narratives are way more hamfisted than they were before, too (because most writers are hacks who can't handle what they're doing properly). They are also very often 1:1 parallels to our MODERN times, even if the setting is completely inappropriate for that. Of course, this caused people to become much more sensitive to any kind of "strong woman" or "diversity" occurrences, but this is to be expected - when you try to shove that kind of crap everywhere, people are bound to get more prone to seeing it everywhere. Even in rare examples when it is not the case or where it wasn't a problem before (such as fantasy games). So this is more of the "cause and effect" more than anything else.
yeah, that's the problem too. Both sides doubled down.

That's internet culture for ya. It infuses everyone with a culture of tribalism, exterminates any subtlety and makes us hate each other much more than we did before.
 

Harthwain

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That's internet culture for ya. It infuses everyone with a culture of tribalism, exterminates any subtlety and makes us hate each other much more than we did before.
Not just internet culture. I knew gaming before internet became what it is now. I blame the social media. It allows any schmuck to express any opinion and create an illusion it is larger than it is, and developers/publishers fear that so they try to be as safe as possible. Polarization of the audience is another byproduct of the social media. Keep in mind that people who are in the middle are usually never heard, it is always the extremes that get their voices amplified, for one reason or another. Ultimately the majority is only seen in one place: the sales.
 

Lord_Potato

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And now people trained by social media are writing games and doing gaming journalism. Of course people trained by social media are also doing the commenting online. We're all part of this downward spiral. I guess the only solution is a global cataclysm taking down internet itself.

That or abolishing social media, but no government, including the Chinese one, is strong enough to pull it off.

Hence, solar flare taking out electricity seems the way to go.
 

n0denz

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Present Day, Present Time
Also, people from both sides of the political spectrum were less delicate snowflakes back then.
I don't think this is just about people becoming more snowflake-y. The narratives are way more hamfisted than they were before, too (because most writers are hacks who can't handle what they're doing properly). They are also very often 1:1 parallels to our MODERN times, even if the setting is completely inappropriate for that. Of course, this caused people to become much more sensitive to any kind of "strong woman" or "diversity" occurrences, but this is to be expected - when you try to shove that kind of crap everywhere, people are bound to get more prone to seeing it everywhere. Even in rare examples when it is not the case or where it wasn't a problem before (such as fantasy games). So this is more of the "cause and effect" more than anything else.
yeah, that's the problem too. Both sides doubled down.

That's internet culture for ya. It infuses everyone with a culture of tribalism, exterminates any subtlety and makes us hate each other much more than we did before.
Implying that both sides are the same.
 

Saint_Proverbius

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The quality was more consistent. First, the technological limitations were pretty uniform across the industry. It put a cap on what could be attempted, innovated, and what presentation was possible. Second, QA was more efficient and effective. The smaller scope of games and greater necessity to have something ship intact reinforced this consistency.
It was more consistent and the teams were smaller. Star Command(SSI, 1988) was made by two people. Also, the tech limitations weren't that uniform considering you had multiple platforms back then which has recently reared it's head again with consoles. Even with consoles, though, the power of them is on par with a lot of the PCs these days. Back then, you had Amigas and AtariSTs along side CGA/EGA PC clones, computers like the MSX or the BBC Micro or ZX Spectrum and so on, all having different ways of putting graphics on the screen. The amount of sprites each system could display was different, the size of them, and so on. The number of colors per view mode wasn't consistent, some systems were 8bit and others were 16bit. Each computer had it's own set of languages that primary development was done on. OpenGL didn't start development until 1991 and was primarily just for high end workstations.

They really think they can dictate what the audience should like. That's why there's this cycle of "Movie/Game/Show/Comic isn't FOR you, we don't want you as our audience, you're bad people," followed by sales bombing, and then "Why didn't you racist pieces of shit buy our product? This proves we are needed more than ever!"
Anyone remember that old, old interview with Michael Jordan when they asked him why he didn't talk about politics? His answer was, "Because the other side buys shoes too." There was a time that people and companies understood this. And oddly enough, things were much, much less polarized than they are now. Now that things have gotten polarized, companies and the people within those companies can't help themselves from spewing their politics whenever they can, even if it's not relevant to the discussion at hand. And let's face it, typically the side that always pushes this shit is no limit on the amount of crazy shit they're willing to push. They've adopted things that would have been considered universally crazy ten years ago as though they're not crazy today.

Oh yeah, because Arcanum, the very game this one tries to emulate, totally wasn't political at all
This is kind of like how people point to Star Trek today and say that Star Trek was always political. It was, but there's a HUGE difference between the way they handled it back then versus today. Not to mention the writers were a heck of a lot better then than they are today.
I don't think this is just about people becoming more snowflake-y. The narratives are way more hamfisted than they were before, too (because most writers are hacks who can't handle what they're doing properly). They are also very often 1:1 parallels to our MODERN times, even if the setting is completely inappropriate for that. Of course, this caused people to become much more sensitive to any kind of "strong woman" or "diversity" occurrences, but this is to be expected - when you try to shove that kind of crap everywhere, people are bound to get more prone to seeing it everywhere.
Since I mentioned Star Trek, I watched half of the first episode of the second season since it was free on YouTube. I stopped watching it in a scene where they had four people, each in their individual pods, flying through an asteroid field at full speed. In the middle of this, the Strong Female Character decides to argue with the white guy over what he was doing. So, tense, deadly situation, and she picks a fight with him and in the middle of the argument as it's getting heated, he hits one of the asteroids and gets killed. I'm sure the writers were going for, "The black woman is smarter than the white man who died due to mansplaining" angle, but it honestly came off to me as the stupid bitch couldn't help herself, distracted the white dude in a critical situation and he died because of it.

The writers probably patted themselves on the back over this, but I'm pretty sure that in a real world situation in a serious universe, the investigation would have concluded that her argument with him during this was at least part of the reason there was a fatal accident during this mission that resulted not only in the loss of an officer, but the loss of that pod and the equipment it contained.
 

Harthwain

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Since I mentioned Star Trek, I watched half of the first episode of the second season since it was free on YouTube. I stopped watching it in a scene where they had four people, each in their individual pods, flying through an asteroid field at full speed. In the middle of this, the Strong Female Character decides to argue with the white guy over what he was doing. So, tense, deadly situation, and she picks a fight with him and in the middle of the argument as it's getting heated, he hits one of the asteroids and gets killed. I'm sure the writers were going for, "The black woman is smarter than the white man who died due to mansplaining" angle, but it honestly came off to me as the stupid bitch couldn't help herself, distracted the white dude in a critical situation and he died because of it.

The writers probably patted themselves on the back over this, but I'm pretty sure that in a real world situation in a serious universe, the investigation would have concluded that her argument with him during this was at least part of the reason there was a fatal accident during this mission that resulted not only in the loss of an officer, but the loss of that pod and the equipment it contained.
Huh.

You reminded me of this:



Timestamped at 1:47.
 

Saint_Proverbius

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Behind you.
Huh.

You reminded me of this:
That's the thing about leftists these days. They claim they're the compassionate side, but most of them are bitter and nasty people as well as power hungry authoritarians. It's why they think they can preach down to people and get upset when people don't fully accept their preaching. You can tell that by the comparison of those two scenes. Once again, in a real world situation and serious universe, there's no way that chick would have ever made officer or at least a high ranking officer. There's also no way that her career would have survived that inquiry.

There was a Trump Rally in the city where I used to live, and I was walking around downtown. There was this leftist chick with a frown on her face, most likely her permanent expression and probably worked for the university, carrying a sign that said, "Make America Kind Again". So, when I got close to her, I said, "Good evening! How are you tonight?" She just glared at me and scowled. That thing about certain people having no internal monologue is 100% true because she was probably completely unaware and lacked the introspection to understand the irony of the situation.
 

AndrewCC

Educated
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RO
Yikes, Codex been skipping on the schizo meds for a while, it seems.
Game seems interesting. Concept is good, 3D models and artstyle seem pretty good, animation is B tier, didn't expect anything else from lower budget title, voiceovers sadly also seem kinda off, about on par with stuff like The Thaumaturge, but that was acted by all polish talent (I imagine, I doubt they had the balls to go with native english speakers doing polish accents).
 

Lyric Suite

Converting to Islam
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Mar 23, 2006
Messages
58,288
Lmao the fuck are you on about dude looks like complete trash on ever level.
 

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