NWN Neverwinter Nights (NWN & NWN2) Modules Thread

[calgary.alberta]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

 

[MerchantKing]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

Anything with red dragon

 

[rogueknight333]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

You would probably have the easiest time with a Cleric build.

 

[notpl]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

Wizard/rogue (note: you will be punching holes in your wall in chapter 1 and probably 2 as well), fighter/blackguard/weaponmaster, pure cleric

 

[Ramnozack]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

18 Wiz/2 Fighter throw in a couple rogue levels at epic levels for skill dumps into tumble etc. Can do everything in swordflight pretty easily with this build, I can guarantee that. Be sure to play with PNP Tensers to make it even better. Play it melee mage style with a greatsword and buffs for a lot of chap 1, 2, and some parts of 3.

 

[Gargaune]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

Trick question. The only build that can save your wall from Swordflight is a rebuild. Of the wall.

 

[Maculo]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

Paladin imo for Chapter 1, maybe less so by Chapter 3.

 

[d1nolore]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

Paladin, shield and hammer

 

[KainenMorden]

Any suggestions for a build on sword fight that won't results me punching an hole into my wall?

18 Wiz/2 Fighter throw in a couple rogue levels at epic levels for skill dumps into tumble etc. Can do everything in swordflight pretty easily with this build, I can guarantee that. Be sure to play with PNP Tensers to make it even better. Play it melee mage style with a greatsword and buffs for a lot of chap 1, 2, and some parts of 3.

I've played a similar build, you can get away with just 1 Fighter lvl and dump dex, wear heavy armor and take the Expertise feats and use them to protect yourself while casting True Strike as well though it's a bit cheesy. Epic Mage Armor and Epic Warding are debatable but I made good use of them. Of course you get access to armor +shield that have no spell failure eventually in Ch2.

The other key tactic is to use Darkness/Sunburst to blind enemies though this causes them to bug out often and not attack at all so some players might want to avoid them. Personally, I reloaded quite frequently at times because I'm a bit obsessive about not cheesing encounters. Moving forward, I wouldn't use these spells unless absolutely necessary and they are probably not absolutely necessary for any encounters depending on build.

Great sword can work for sure and I've played that way but I'm not certain that's necessarily better than scimitar or for more consistent damage but less crits, dwarven axe plus shield.

I've played Pal/Sorc before, that's also a good one. Especially if you want to make use of Tenser's. I don't think there's any need to modify Tenser's, I didn't and still found it effective especially with Pal/Sorc and divine might/shield. You don't need to use Tenser's either but it can be helpful in many encounters. The drawback of charisma casters and charisma based combat feats is that you can randomly gain/lose uses upon reload. I found this annoying enough to not play Cha casters again though it probably wouldn't bother many players.

I'd also note that summons are helpful as they would be for any caster, Gate is especially helpful though is arguably a bit OP and comes with alignment change towards Evil though you can get by without summons. You could "solo" most if not all encounters probably until about ch 5. You're also right about dipping rogue or alternatively assassin for tumble and UMD. Any item that gives you divine power is helpful though perhaps not absolutely necessary.

Though I've never played one, from what I know about SF/NWN in general, I think a Cleric would be more straightforward/easier to play.

 

[d1nolore]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

 

[d1nolore]

If you’re struggling with SF: Paladin
Full HP, Full AB, Fullplate, charisma to saves
Lvl 1: immunity to disease
Lvl 2: immunity to fear
Lvl 4-6(Wis): Bless weapon, deafening clang
Max heal; healing kits best healing in game.
Use of divine scrolls.
Etc

 

[Ramnozack]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

 

[d1nolore]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

 

[Ramnozack]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon (Early levels you can also scribe scrolls of flame weapon to get instant access to lvl 15 flame weapon for even more ridiculous damage (1d4+10) for a long duration) are all buffs you can apply to yourself and your familiar and can cut through most of the dungeon while they are still up.

These give you great AC, great damage, good AB, good damage soak against basically everything early levels. And you get all of these spells at level 3. And you can apply these buffs(except shield I suppose) to other party members and summons as well. I'm not saying it will be stronger than a paladin or whatever in melee, but it is more than powerful enough to cut through everything in Swordflight with ease (and pretty much every other module I've played in).

It only gets better at higher levels with Improved Invisibility, Greater Magic Weapon, Stoneskin, Haste, Premonition, Tensers, Hound Archon, Shadow Shield etc. And you are still mainly a Wizard and can do everything a wizard can do (IGMS, Timestop, Wail etc) so you can easily deal with pretty much any enemy in the game in a variety of ways. The only trouble I encountered in the chapters I've played was in CH 4 with the Beholder nest, everything else I breezed through.

 

[luj1]

18 Wiz/2 Fighter throw in a couple rogue levels at epic levels for skill dumps into tumble etc. Can do everything in swordflight pretty easily with this build, I can guarantee that.

I doubt that

shit HP, shit AC, shit AB... what exactly are you going to do in early game when 3 dire spiders drop from the ceiling and surround you

 

[luj1]

If you’re struggling with SF: Paladin
Full HP, Full AB, Fullplate, charisma to saves
Lvl 1: immunity to disease
Lvl 2: immunity to fear
Lvl 4-6(Wis): Bless weapon, deafening clang
Max heal; healing kits best healing in game.
Use of divine scrolls.
Etc

the best suggestion here

 

[luj1]

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon

and u need to rest at every corner and maxbuff urself to survive almost every fight.... rinse repeat

 

[d1nolore]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon (Early levels you can also scribe scrolls of flame weapon to get instant access to lvl 15 flame weapon for even more ridiculous damage (1d4+10) for a long duration) are all buffs you can apply to yourself and your familiar and can cut through most of the dungeon while they are still up.

These give you great AC, great damage, good AB, good damage soak against basically everything early levels. And you get all of these spells at level 3. And you can apply these buffs(except shield I suppose) to other party members and summons as well. I'm not saying it will be stronger than a paladin or whatever in melee, but it is more than powerful enough to cut through everything in Swordflight with ease (and pretty much every other module I've played in).

It only gets better at higher levels with Improved Invisibility, Greater Magic Weapon, Stoneskin, Haste, Premonition, Tensers, Hound Archon, Shadow Shield etc. And you are still mainly a Wizard and can do everything a wizard can do (IGMS, Timestop, Wail etc) so you can easily deal with pretty much any enemy in the game in a variety of ways. The only trouble I encountered in the chapters I've played was in CH 4 with the Beholder nest, everything else I breezed through.

That’s kind of the point you are just leaning on wizard strengths the melee aspect with fighter lvls is completely unnecessary when you can just use polymorph. I was more responding to the post suggesting heavy armour and a greatsword at first. If you are not saying take fighter lvls early? That’s even worse because you’ll have such low hp. The spiders and poison will eat your hp so fast even with ghostly visage.. hide behind your summons and familiar? Then just play a wizard!

If someone is struggling they are obviously not an expert, why suggest a melee wizard? They’ll need just the right feats, use a specific spell sequence, play specific tactics, and rest every 5 minutes for the first chapter. It’s a super high maintenance build early on.

Paladin will have double hp, hit more, hit harder, and resist effects better, bless weapon will give you such a boon in chapter 1 helping to get up to easier levels.

 

[Ramnozack]

18 Wiz/2 Fighter throw in a couple rogue levels at epic levels for skill dumps into tumble etc. Can do everything in swordflight pretty easily with this build, I can guarantee that.

I doubt that

shit HP, shit AC, shit AB... what exactly are you going to do in early game when 3 dire spiders drop from the ceiling and surround you

Playstyle has literally been around for decades and you can find it online easily from people who have been playing the game longer than you for sure. Just google melee mage nwn and Im sure you'll find it.

 

[luj1]

I played TT before, its OP in OC but in SF its hard early. Unless you are buffed you can get oneshot. And rest restrictions complicate that

 

[Ramnozack]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon (Early levels you can also scribe scrolls of flame weapon to get instant access to lvl 15 flame weapon for even more ridiculous damage (1d4+10) for a long duration) are all buffs you can apply to yourself and your familiar and can cut through most of the dungeon while they are still up.

These give you great AC, great damage, good AB, good damage soak against basically everything early levels. And you get all of these spells at level 3. And you can apply these buffs(except shield I suppose) to other party members and summons as well. I'm not saying it will be stronger than a paladin or whatever in melee, but it is more than powerful enough to cut through everything in Swordflight with ease (and pretty much every other module I've played in).

It only gets better at higher levels with Improved Invisibility, Greater Magic Weapon, Stoneskin, Haste, Premonition, Tensers, Hound Archon, Shadow Shield etc. And you are still mainly a Wizard and can do everything a wizard can do (IGMS, Timestop, Wail etc) so you can easily deal with pretty much any enemy in the game in a variety of ways. The only trouble I encountered in the chapters I've played was in CH 4 with the Beholder nest, everything else I breezed through.

That’s kind of the point you are just leaning on wizard strengths the melee aspect with fighter lvls is completely unnecessary when you can just use polymorph. I was more responding to the post suggesting heavy armour and a greatsword at first. If you are not saying take fighter lvls early? That’s even worse because you’ll have such low hp. The spiders and poison will eat your hp so fast even with ghostly visage.. hide behind your summons and familiar? Then just play a wizard!

If someone is struggling they are obviously not an expert, why suggest a melee wizard? They’ll need just the right feats, use a specific spell sequence, play specific tactics, and rest every 5 minutes for the first chapter. It’s a super high maintenance build early on.

Paladin will have double hp, hit more, hit harder, and resist effects better, bless weapon will give you such a boon in chapter 1 helping to get up to easier levels.

Its not even specific tactics or anything hard. Its literally just buff yourself and your familiar with wizard buffs and smack everything. And again, no, you don't need to rest that often, the buffs last long enough that that isn't a concern. I mean the entire playstyle was designed to save spells and be as efficient as possible in clearing trash mobs so you could save all your most powerful spells for the boss.

And why would you take 2 fighter levels early on? That would actually be terrible. Delaying the fuck out of your spell progression for some meaningless +1 BAB and some negligible amount of HP that you can make up for with spells anyway. You just want 1 fighter level early on for all the profs and the free feat and another fighter level at 20 to get you 11 BAB and another combat feat as a bonus. And no polymorph isn't as good as a replacement, you won't get enhancement bonuses on your weapon, flame weapon only applies to the main natural attack so even less damage there, you won't get bonuses from items, and you cant cast spells while polymorphed.

Early on, with the fighter level, you can simply buff yourself up and then put on full plate for even more AC. You'd have even more AC at that point than a paladin at a similar level and better protection spells on top of that. Spiders were never a problem because I was playing a wizard, they couldn't even touch me, throw on an ironguts spell for extra saves vs poison and honestly I casually stroll threw the spider caves in CH1. Paladin won't really hit harder at early levels because of flame weapon, especially a scroll of flame weapon (cast at level 15 caster level because thats how the game works) which would give you 1d4+10 out of the gate for 30 minutes, even bless weapon can't compete with it, and it only works against undead.

 

[d1nolore]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon (Early levels you can also scribe scrolls of flame weapon to get instant access to lvl 15 flame weapon for even more ridiculous damage (1d4+10) for a long duration) are all buffs you can apply to yourself and your familiar and can cut through most of the dungeon while they are still up.

These give you great AC, great damage, good AB, good damage soak against basically everything early levels. And you get all of these spells at level 3. And you can apply these buffs(except shield I suppose) to other party members and summons as well. I'm not saying it will be stronger than a paladin or whatever in melee, but it is more than powerful enough to cut through everything in Swordflight with ease (and pretty much every other module I've played in).

It only gets better at higher levels with Improved Invisibility, Greater Magic Weapon, Stoneskin, Haste, Premonition, Tensers, Hound Archon, Shadow Shield etc. And you are still mainly a Wizard and can do everything a wizard can do (IGMS, Timestop, Wail etc) so you can easily deal with pretty much any enemy in the game in a variety of ways. The only trouble I encountered in the chapters I've played was in CH 4 with the Beholder nest, everything else I breezed through.

That’s kind of the point you are just leaning on wizard strengths the melee aspect with fighter lvls is completely unnecessary when you can just use polymorph. I was more responding to the post suggesting heavy armour and a greatsword at first. If you are not saying take fighter lvls early? That’s even worse because you’ll have such low hp. The spiders and poison will eat your hp so fast even with ghostly visage.. hide behind your summons and familiar? Then just play a wizard!

If someone is struggling they are obviously not an expert, why suggest a melee wizard? They’ll need just the right feats, use a specific spell sequence, play specific tactics, and rest every 5 minutes for the first chapter. It’s a super high maintenance build early on.

Paladin will have double hp, hit more, hit harder, and resist effects better, bless weapon will give you such a boon in chapter 1 helping to get up to easier levels.

Its not even specific tactics or anything hard. Its literally just buff yourself and your familiar with wizard buffs and smack everything. And again, no, you don't need to rest that often, the buffs last long enough that that isn't a concern. I mean the entire playstyle was designed to save spells and be as efficient as possible in clearing trash mobs so you could save all your most powerful spells for the boss.

And why would you take 2 fighter levels early on? That would actually be terrible. Delaying the fuck out of your spell progression for some meaningless +1 BAB and some negligible amount of HP that you can make up for with spells anyway. You just want 1 fighter level early on for all the profs and the free feat and another fighter level at 20 to get you 11 BAB and another combat feat as a bonus. And no polymorph isn't as good as a replacement, you won't get enhancement bonuses on your weapon, flame weapon only applies to the main natural attack so even less damage there, you won't get bonuses from items, and you cant cast spells while polymorphed.

Early on, with the fighter level, you can simply buff yourself up and then put on full plate for even more AC. You'd have even more AC at that point than a paladin at a similar level and better protection spells on top of that. Spiders were never a problem because I was playing a wizard, they couldn't even touch me, throw on an ironguts spell for extra saves vs poison and honestly I casually stroll threw the spider caves in CH1. Paladin won't really hit harder at early levels because of flame weapon, especially a scroll of flame weapon (cast at level 15 caster level because thats how the game works) which would give you 1d4+10 out of the gate for 30 minutes, even bless weapon can't compete with it, and it only works against undead.

Is it really your first pick for a novice tackling SF? It’s very tedious early on and you will have to rest all the time since your turn/level spells will expire. Tedious with low ab, divine magic has all the ab spells. Little room for error early on with low hp.

Polymorph is good because you use it on top of standard wizard play so don’t need the constant maintenance, troll will give you dr and regen so hard to go wrong.

And what’s the point later on when you have high area of effect damage spells for trash mobs and timestop + gate.

 

[Ramnozack]

2fighter/wiz is a terrible build. Why have fighter lvls? Why melee as a wiz? Terrible hp and ab. If you want to melee a wizard just wait for polymorph, you don’t need fighter levels for that and armour is a complete waste of time.

That build will be terrible for the early-mid lvls and of course high lvl wizard is powerful. Highly recommend anyone struggling avoid that build.

I mean, it isn't a terrible build at all. At low levels HP and BAB mean nothing between classes pretty much, and as a wiz you have a lot of powerful buffs early on such as flame weapon, mage armor, shield, magic weapon, ghostly visage, stat spells etc that turn you into a very powerful melee combatant, you can also cast these spells on a familiar and a summon, pixie especially because she has a dagger you can use flame weapon & magic weapon on to turn her into a beast as well. Mid levels you shore up the differences between you and a fighter using your spells and you can fight more than adequately, and you also get access to planar binding, and the hound archon is amazing when buffed up. 2 Fighter levels is to get you to 11 BAB and thus 3 base attacks as well as more combat feats and proficiencies, you don't use armor. I typically take 1 fighter level at level 2 and another at level 20.

There are a number of different strategies you can take to kill opponents with this build/playstyle, you can run a damage shield strat against hard to kill opponents while polymorphed as a iron golem, if you have PNP Tensers can use Tensers to blender opponents with strong MR, can spam IGMS to nuke enemies, etc.

I have beaten CH1-4 with this build easily, this is quite the old build/playstyle for NWN that has been around for decades and used on modules as well as PWs to great effect. I recommend anyone struggling with the module to try this build, it is effective and much more fun and engaging than playing something like a straight fighter.

Let’s compare lvl 6
Minimum: Paladin 60hp, ab 8/3, AC 22, saves +5 +2 +2 (+ cha modifier)

Wizard/2fighter: 36hp, ab 6, 20-22AC, saves +4 +1 +4 (+1/5 Spellcraft vs spells)

Flame weapon is 1d4+1 per level
Bless weapon is +1 enchantment and 2d6 vs undead
Deafening clang is +1 attack +3 sonic and deafen on hit

Ability enhancements are rather equal considering the potions and buffs available in SF. And these stats are not even including the higher ability scores from a paladin not having to have dex and int. These differences make a big difference early on until you can get your wizard lvls high enough to compensate with spells. Ab and hp difference will grow with lvls since the early fighter lvls give you an early boost.

Can’t go wrong with paladin one of the highest ab in the game even without multiclassing.

Any wizard will be powerful at high lvls but that build will be painful at low lvls in SF until you get stoneskin, and you’re going to have to constantly rest otherwise you’ll be squashed.

You don't take 2 fighter levels in this build at level 6, at that point you'd be 5 Wizard/1 Fighter with lvl 3 spells. Also kind of glossing over all the other buffs there. Ghostly Visage, Mage Armor, Shield, Stat Buffs (Can be empowered to provide a +7, so not equal really, at least not for long), Magic Weapon, Flame Weapon (Early levels you can also scribe scrolls of flame weapon to get instant access to lvl 15 flame weapon for even more ridiculous damage (1d4+10) for a long duration) are all buffs you can apply to yourself and your familiar and can cut through most of the dungeon while they are still up.

These give you great AC, great damage, good AB, good damage soak against basically everything early levels. And you get all of these spells at level 3. And you can apply these buffs(except shield I suppose) to other party members and summons as well. I'm not saying it will be stronger than a paladin or whatever in melee, but it is more than powerful enough to cut through everything in Swordflight with ease (and pretty much every other module I've played in).

It only gets better at higher levels with Improved Invisibility, Greater Magic Weapon, Stoneskin, Haste, Premonition, Tensers, Hound Archon, Shadow Shield etc. And you are still mainly a Wizard and can do everything a wizard can do (IGMS, Timestop, Wail etc) so you can easily deal with pretty much any enemy in the game in a variety of ways. The only trouble I encountered in the chapters I've played was in CH 4 with the Beholder nest, everything else I breezed through.

That’s kind of the point you are just leaning on wizard strengths the melee aspect with fighter lvls is completely unnecessary when you can just use polymorph. I was more responding to the post suggesting heavy armour and a greatsword at first. If you are not saying take fighter lvls early? That’s even worse because you’ll have such low hp. The spiders and poison will eat your hp so fast even with ghostly visage.. hide behind your summons and familiar? Then just play a wizard!

If someone is struggling they are obviously not an expert, why suggest a melee wizard? They’ll need just the right feats, use a specific spell sequence, play specific tactics, and rest every 5 minutes for the first chapter. It’s a super high maintenance build early on.

Paladin will have double hp, hit more, hit harder, and resist effects better, bless weapon will give you such a boon in chapter 1 helping to get up to easier levels.

Its not even specific tactics or anything hard. Its literally just buff yourself and your familiar with wizard buffs and smack everything. And again, no, you don't need to rest that often, the buffs last long enough that that isn't a concern. I mean the entire playstyle was designed to save spells and be as efficient as possible in clearing trash mobs so you could save all your most powerful spells for the boss.

And why would you take 2 fighter levels early on? That would actually be terrible. Delaying the fuck out of your spell progression for some meaningless +1 BAB and some negligible amount of HP that you can make up for with spells anyway. You just want 1 fighter level early on for all the profs and the free feat and another fighter level at 20 to get you 11 BAB and another combat feat as a bonus. And no polymorph isn't as good as a replacement, you won't get enhancement bonuses on your weapon, flame weapon only applies to the main natural attack so even less damage there, you won't get bonuses from items, and you cant cast spells while polymorphed.

Early on, with the fighter level, you can simply buff yourself up and then put on full plate for even more AC. You'd have even more AC at that point than a paladin at a similar level and better protection spells on top of that. Spiders were never a problem because I was playing a wizard, they couldn't even touch me, throw on an ironguts spell for extra saves vs poison and honestly I casually stroll threw the spider caves in CH1. Paladin won't really hit harder at early levels because of flame weapon, especially a scroll of flame weapon (cast at level 15 caster level because thats how the game works) which would give you 1d4+10 out of the gate for 30 minutes, even bless weapon can't compete with it, and it only works against undead.

Is it really your first pick for a novice tackling SF? It’s very tedious early on and you will have to rest all the time since your turn/level spells will expire. Tedious with low ab, divine magic has all the ab spells. Little room for error early on with low hp.

Polymorph is good because you use it on top of standard wizard play so don’t need the constant maintenance, troll will give you dr and regen so hard to go wrong.

And what’s the point later on when you have high area of effect damage spells for trash mobs and timestop + gate.

It isn't a hard playstyle, like I said before its just buff and attack. Doesn't really require a lot of brain power. Arcane has the vast majority of the powerful buff spells, GMW, Haste, Improved Invis, Shadow Shield, Stoneskin/premonition, Tensers, Stat spells, damage shields, etc. Later on when dipping rogue you can get UMD to use divine spell scrolls for whatever buffs you can't get (which isn't that much). You get enough of these at low levels to more than make your AB good enough to hit anything you need to hit combined with good stat distribution. AC as I described before is not even an issue, its better than actual Fighters/Paladins and has stuff like ghostly visage stacked on top, makes you very sturdy. Health can be enhanced with Endurance and toughness feat, it really isn't an issue.

Polymorph is really not that great of a spell overall. Its good in niche situations, but the drawbacks far outweigh the benefits most times. Buffed up with a hasted greatsword will do far more damage and be more durable than any polymorph from the lvl 4 spell.

The point is to waste as few spells on trash mobs as possible and save those timestops and gates for the actual hard encounters, and to not waste valuable spell slots on damage spells as they are not very efficient. This reduces the amount of times you have to rest which is very helpful in modules like SF especially.

Though if a player is brand new to DnD AND nwn, then sure play something straight-forward like a fighter or something, then again, should you be playing Swordflight if you are a novice at the game? Should probably play some easier modules first

 

[Maculo]

18 Wiz/2 Fighter throw in a couple rogue levels at epic levels for skill dumps into tumble etc. Can do everything in swordflight pretty easily with this build, I can guarantee that.

I doubt that

shit HP, shit AC, shit AB... what exactly are you going to do in early game when 3 dire spiders drop from the ceiling and surround you

Months (years?) ago, I played a melee wizard to Chapter 3 of SF. I spammed grease so much that I jokingly called it a grease wizard. For harder fights or bosses, I spammed Isaac’s missiles.

It did okay, but the fire giants outside of the city in Chapter 3 gave me a beat down.

 

[KainenMorden]

It did okay, but the fire giants outside of the city in Chapter 3 gave me a beat down.

IMHO that's one of the toughest fights in the series up to that point for any build I've ever tried. I actually never used Grease, that might be a tactic to try in a future playthrough.

Id say again, melee mage is definitely viable and not weak at low lvl it just may not be as straightforward as other builds. Many of the perceived drawbacks can be overcome with the right tactics but that's probably not that clear to players that are not that familiar with the play style.