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A problem with RPGs: RPG developers are not well-read in myth and fantasy/sci-fi literature

RaggleFraggle

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To sum it up I'd say that games and writing as well as storytelling just isn't a marriage meant to be. Chess does not need a writer, it wouldn't be improved by one and the writer would be constricted in such a way as to produce low quality writing judged by universal standards.

Late to the discussion but I'd like to respond to this. I find your opinion familiar since it's one that I often think intensely about. I mean, I should. After all, I'm wasting the best years of my life chasing this particular dream.

In all honesty, it probably is a fool's errand to try and pursue any kind of literary excellence or artistic vision in video games. Like, why would any sane person bother to do that? Just make a open-world crafting roguelike and rake in millions.
I always enjoyed the little choices and consequences RPGs had to offer, but with time I found interactive fiction and realized that a normal RPG can never execute a truly intriguing and branching story. The constraints of gameplay and visual elements are simply too limiting. A writer can create spectacular castles and mountains with a stroke of a pen, whereas a visual game has to have artists painstakingly create everything either in 3D or 2D.

It is precisely because developers and their Hebrew overlords seek to create universal consumer products that modern RPGs turn out to be an indistinct grey mass - shit gameplay, shit story, shit visuals, shit audio. One can focus only on one thing if he seeks to perfect it. This universal product alá Skyrim, which supposedly offers a bit of everything, is an abomination.

I came to the conclusion that combatfaggs on Codex are essentially right: developers should stop obsessing over retarded story aspects, romances, and so on in RPGs. Good, branching stories should be left to interactive novels. They can actually do them justice.

Out of all the genres of video games, RPGs suffer from an identity crisis the most.
I try interactive fiction. As with all other genres, 90% of it is crap and finding the gems is so frustrating.

Sure, RPGs have their limitations. So does IF. But what works in one medium doesn’t necessarily work in another and different mediums have different strengths.

Humans are visual creatures. There’s a reason why visual games are much more popular than text games, than actual books, regardless of respective ability to craft worlds: it’s visual.
 
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I try interactive fiction. As with all other genres, 90% of it is crap and finding the gems is so frustrating.

Sure, RPGs have their limitations. So does IF. But what works in one medium doesn’t necessarily work in another and different mediums have different strengths.

Humans are visual creatures. There’s a reason why visual games are much more popular than text games, than actual books, regardless of respective ability to craft worlds: it’s visual.
Finding good interactive fiction is not frustrating at all. Currently, 95% of it is concentrated around Choice of Games and Hosted Games publisher. You just have to read the description and reviews to know what it's about. There's a lot of girly IF, but you can easily find works centered around more solemn themes.
aEOzNkB.png


I am talking about the story aspect of games, and compared to RPGs, IF is basically limitless. If you threw out everything from RPGs and made them into interactive novels, they would be very short. Most of the time in RPGs is spent fighting, looting, crafting, etc., and not engaging with the story, which is the exact opposite of interactive fiction.

And yes, visual media are more popular than books. They are easier to consume. I would like to believe that the average Codexer wants something more than to play the most mainstream and uninteresting games, however.
 

Blutwurstritter

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I encountered a funny example of this yesterday. I read a race description in the character creator of a relatively popular modern RPG. I'm not gonna name names, but the gist of it was this:

There is a tribal race in this fantasy setting that lives in boreal regions.
It is specifically stated that the main hunters of this tribe are women.

Now, of course, I can already hear the social media space bemoan my terribly chauvinist criticism: How dare I make an issue out of such a wonderful and fresh idea?
Well, the reason is that it's complete rubbish. Tribal societies do not send out their childbearing population to fight wild animals.
To anyone with a fleeting interest in ancient history, it should be very obvious why:
A tribe of a hundred men and ten women probably dies within one generation.
A tribe of a hundred women and ten men can theoretically recover and thrive during the same time.
You cannot risk losing women in a small society. In fact, even a slight surplus of men can cause a lot of trouble. But let's not even go that far (if you are interested, see China's current Sex-ration imbalance).

Of course, people will then say: "Oh, so you have no problem with giant flying lizards and old men casting spells, but female hunters, that's too far?"

And the answer is: Yes.
Because those other things were authentically established in the framework of that specific reality. There are so many (often incredibly boring) physical and metaphysical explanations as to why magic works in certain scenarios. But as long as it is not stated otherwise, I have to assume that childbearing follows roughly the same "logistics" as in our reality.
Now if you said: In this specific tribe the women are infertile and the queen bee somehow pops out ten babies every other week - that would be something different.

But like this? I mean I won't drop the game because of it, but it's just silly.
Are you referring to Pillars of Eternity or some other game?
 

Tyranicon

A Memory of Eternity
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When was the last time someone praised Planescape: Torment for being a great game? People are always recommending it thanks to the non-conventional context, in which rats are a high level enemy and succubi are chaste, the ultimate enemy being your own mortality, being somewhat novel in the fantasy RPG genre. They do so with the caveat that the game part of this ordeal isn't very good.

Taking PS:T as an example, the combat and character building is not the only gameplay there is. The ability to change the narrative/c&c is a huge part of cRPGs and a primary gameplay mechanic.

I would probably take this a step further and say that the primary failure of many modern rpgs is not in combat or something else, but in significant impact with regards to c&c because it is a very taxing element. Baldur's Gate 3 did the two branch thing for two acts before it gave up and started railroading the player hard.

Instead of focusing on high-investment branching stories, developers should instead take a look at how other games (grand strategies, 4X, roguelikes, etc) allow the player to craft their own tale.


Games going digital hasn't changed much and it is not a new artform.

As The Wall said, there's very clear differences between video games, which are curated/guided experiences, and traditional games like chess.

This is like comparing theater to film, except I would argue the gap is even wider with games.
 

Bad Sector

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Tribal societies do not send out their childbearing population to fight wild animals.
To anyone with a fleeting interest in ancient history, it should be very obvious why:
A tribe of a hundred men and ten women probably dies within one generation.
A tribe of a hundred women and ten men can theoretically recover and thrive during the same time.
You cannot risk losing women in a small society.

To me that sounded counterintuitive, as the problem isn't how you start with (100 men/10 women vs 100 women/10 men) but how the tribe evolves over time taking into account the chances of death from fighting said wild animals.

And so i decided to try and write a small program simulating that!

The program starts with a small population of 100 people from 20 to 40 ages, equally divided between male and female (i.e there are 50 males and 50 females). Then it "simulates" each day for each one of those people where they can die of old age, die of child mortality (if they are a child), go hunting (if they are of the appropriate sex) and potentially die from that, have sex (if not pregnant) and potentially get pregnant (if female).

The simulation is kinda simplistic of course, with the biggest difference between reality and simulation to be that there are no couples in the simulated society and everyone hunts and fucks all the time: each day everyone has sex with whoever is the first valid partner (above minimum age, opposite sex, not pregnant). However since the concern is survival and growth of the tribe as a whole without caring about individuals much, this provides the most optimal results.

The simulation settings were as such:
  • Initial population size of 100 people
  • 0.02% chance of death during hunt for women, 0.01% chance of death during hunt for men
    • The assumption being here that men being stronger than women leads to half deaths
  • Minimum age one can has sex is 15yo
  • Minimum age one can hunt is 12yo
  • Maximum age is 50yo
  • There is a 50% chance of child mortality, but everyone lives to 50yo after reaching 5yo
  • There is a 0.2465% chance of pregnancy (per day)
I ran the simulation, once using males as hunters and once using females as hunters for 50 years (an entire population replacement) and the results...

tK4pSqx.png


...are basically what i expected. Reason being, a man can have sex with multiple women to make children at the same time (or at least, the next day, as far as the simulation is concerned), but a woman cannot do that, therefore the loss of a man has more of an impact in the population growth - assuming starting from a position where the tribe is already functional - than the loss of a woman (as the other men will "pick up the slack", so to speak) even if women are twice as likely to die than men.

Of course the above is for a tribe that optimizes for sustainability and population growth, all else be damned, if the simulator also took into account couple formation and break up in the case of the death of a member with potential formation of a new couple down the line, depending on the remaining member, then the numbers most likely wouldn't be as different but i'd still expect the loss of a woman to have less impact.

Out of curiosity i also tried to limit the number of pregnancies a woman can have to 5 children:

bY8woBC.png


As expected the population doesn't grow as much and there is more variance in the population numbers over time, but overall the end result is the same. Note that changing the limit affects the variance but the overall look of the graph doesn't change.

Now of course the simulation is really a case of a spherical cow, but i think the ballpark results show that -at least unless i missed something very blatant- having a tribe with female hunters wont cause it to go extinct at all due to the women being exposed to wild life deaths, regardless of what ancient cultures did in our past.

If you want to try out yourself, the Free Pascal code is here.
 

Iucounu

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Yes, that's the solution. The only reason we hear about these lunatics is because Social Media companies boost their visibility artificially, while others give them undeserved attention.
nigga u wot. they already won this culture war thingy and just doing victory laps while twerking in your face. you hear about these things because there is literally nothing you can do about it now. it's ritual humiliation.
All you have to do is stay away from compromised products. We already know most new AAA games are woke and mediocre, so why the constant surprise and disappointment? Why keep giving them attention in their forum threads? I assume paid shills help fanning the flames in those threads, don't fall for their trolling.

For example, one way to actually punish Starfield for its staring eyes bug might be to point out what a racist depiction of non-white characters it is. But instead gamers complain about the game containing too many non-white characters, which is a total fail since it both makes these gamers come across as racists (that can be ignored or banned) and helps pushing Starfield threads higher up on forums. Why would a game developer stop being woke under such circumstances?

Discussing the general problem is a different issue, that can certainly be done in order to find solutions. But even then people need to be wary of internet bubbles and anti-woke news commenters that make a living from creating outrage about the latest woke atrocity. It's a symbiotic relationship for woke and anti-woke activists alike, both need each other as enemies to give meaning to their own group's existence. So look for solutions, but don't let the lunatics rule your life.
 

RaggleFraggle

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Currently, 95% of it is concentrated around Choice of Games and Hosted Games publisher.
That's a huge red flag right there. Monopolies are bad because they foster mediocrity. I've tried those guys and gave up fast because they suck ass. At this point I'm just gonna make my own fucking games because I can't trust these woke illiterate fuckwits to get fuck all right.
 

Iucounu

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Messages
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Tribal societies do not send out their childbearing population to fight wild animals.
Setting traps for small animals or birds should be safe enough, unlike say hunting bovines with spears. Safety aside, this writer also acknowledges that females are sometimes too busy with small children to be effective hunters:
https://theconversation.com/women-w...ing-beliefs-about-ancient-gender-roles-153772

That's not to say it never happened, but I also expect today's researchers and journalists to overreact in the other (feminist) direction, so as usual one needs to be wary:
https://www.newscientist.com/articl...t-while-women-stay-at-home-is-entirely-wrong/

A tribe of a hundred men and ten women probably dies within one generation.
Not if the surplus men would kidnap more women from neighboring tribes...
 
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Messages
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Currently, 95% of it is concentrated around Choice of Games and Hosted Games publisher.
That's a huge red flag right there. Monopolies are bad because they foster mediocrity. I've tried those guys and gave up fast because they suck ass. At this point I'm just gonna make my own fucking games because I can't trust these woke illiterate fuckwits to get fuck all right.
Yeah, they have a monopoly. And it isn't right to say all their games suck ass. I posted a screenshot of my CoG and HG games. Have you played the Infinity saga (Sabers of Infinity etc.)? It's HG and really good.

There is an independent tool for IF called Twine, but I haven't seen a Twine game on par with CoG / HG titles, unfortunately.
 

RaggleFraggle

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Currently, 95% of it is concentrated around Choice of Games and Hosted Games publisher.
That's a huge red flag right there. Monopolies are bad because they foster mediocrity. I've tried those guys and gave up fast because they suck ass. At this point I'm just gonna make my own fucking games because I can't trust these woke illiterate fuckwits to get fuck all right.
Yeah, they have a monopoly. And it isn't right to say all their games suck ass. I posted a screenshot of my CoG and HG games. Have you played the Infinity saga (Sabers of Infinity etc.)? It's HG and really good.

There is an independent tool for IF called Twine, but I haven't seen a Twine game on par with CoG / HG titles, unfortunately.
I spent twenty non-consecutive hours waiting for just one game to get good (it never did). I not wasting my time on worthless garbage again.
 

Blutwurstritter

Scholar
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Messages
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Location
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Tribal societies do not send out their childbearing population to fight wild animals.
To anyone with a fleeting interest in ancient history, it should be very obvious why:
A tribe of a hundred men and ten women probably dies within one generation.
A tribe of a hundred women and ten men can theoretically recover and thrive during the same time.
You cannot risk losing women in a small society.

To me that sounded counterintuitive, as the problem isn't how you start with (100 men/10 women vs 100 women/10 men) but how the tribe evolves over time taking into account the chances of death from fighting said wild animals.

And so i decided to try and write a small program simulating that!

The program starts with a small population of 100 people from 20 to 40 ages, equally divided between male and female (i.e there are 50 males and 50 females). Then it "simulates" each day for each one of those people where they can die of old age, die of child mortality (if they are a child), go hunting (if they are of the appropriate sex) and potentially die from that, have sex (if not pregnant) and potentially get pregnant (if female).

The simulation is kinda simplistic of course, with the biggest difference between reality and simulation to be that there are no couples in the simulated society and everyone hunts and fucks all the time: each day everyone has sex with whoever is the first valid partner (above minimum age, opposite sex, not pregnant). However since the concern is survival and growth of the tribe as a whole without caring about individuals much, this provides the most optimal results.

The simulation settings were as such:
  • Initial population size of 100 people
  • 0.02% chance of death during hunt for women, 0.01% chance of death during hunt for men
    • The assumption being here that men being stronger than women leads to half deaths
  • Minimum age one can has sex is 15yo
  • Minimum age one can hunt is 12yo
  • Maximum age is 50yo
  • There is a 50% chance of child mortality, but everyone lives to 50yo after reaching 5yo
  • There is a 0.2465% chance of pregnancy (per day)
I ran the simulation, once using males as hunters and once using females as hunters for 50 years (an entire population replacement) and the results...

tK4pSqx.png


...are basically what i expected. Reason being, a man can have sex with multiple women to make children at the same time (or at least, the next day, as far as the simulation is concerned), but a woman cannot do that, therefore the loss of a man has more of an impact in the population growth - assuming starting from a position where the tribe is already functional - than the loss of a woman (as the other men will "pick up the slack", so to speak) even if women are twice as likely to die than men.

Of course the above is for a tribe that optimizes for sustainability and population growth, all else be damned, if the simulator also took into account couple formation and break up in the case of the death of a member with potential formation of a new couple down the line, depending on the remaining member, then the numbers most likely wouldn't be as different but i'd still expect the loss of a woman to have less impact.

Out of curiosity i also tried to limit the number of pregnancies a woman can have to 5 children:

bY8woBC.png


As expected the population doesn't grow as much and there is more variance in the population numbers over time, but overall the end result is the same. Note that changing the limit affects the variance but the overall look of the graph doesn't change.

Now of course the simulation is really a case of a spherical cow, but i think the ballpark results show that -at least unless i missed something very blatant- having a tribe with female hunters wont cause it to go extinct at all due to the women being exposed to wild life deaths, regardless of what ancient cultures did in our past.

If you want to try out yourself, the Free Pascal code is here.

Does your model include child and maternal mortality? A men can impregnate much more woman than a woman can carry children so I would have expected an overabundance of men, while women constitute the limiting factor to growth. I'm a bit surprised by the results to be honest, but I haven't looked at the model in detail yet. My intuition was that the population with more females, or a lower mortality rate of females, would grow faster and thus the male hunter society would end up with a larger population.

But that is all a very simplified view. Hunter/gatherer societies lacked high vocational specialization. Every member did basically a bit of everything that was required for survival, and I don't think it was ever only men or only woman that did hunting or gathering. That might have been true for big game or dangerous game, but most hunting was small animals or involved simple traps, which could be done by men and women alike. I also doubt that the gender of the hunters would have had a large impact on the population, external factors like availability of food and fresh water, the weather, diseases, wars/conflicts, etc, appear to be more important.
 

Bad Sector

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Does your model include child and maternal mortality?

It does include child mortality but not maternal mortality. I did a quick test by introducing a chance for both the mother and child to die during childbirth with a 2% chance (from a quick search it seems a common approximation used for ancient times, at least around Europe, was between 1% and 3% so i used 2%) and it didn't really change much:

QPk6eP7.png


And TBH i kinda expect this as these do not affect much. Removing the incestuous approach to sex partner picking would probably have a larger effect, but even then i don't expect massive changes (might try it at some point but it'll be a bit more involved than adding an extra mortality check).

A men can impregnate much more woman than a woman can carry children so I would have expected an overabundance of men, while women constitute the limiting factor to growth.

This might be an issue if the population is at a breaking limit as it is an extreme case, however if there are both enough women and men around the situation flips. If you think the case in terms of very lopsided situations like 2 men 10 women and 2 woman 10 men, yes losing the women can have a worse effect, but the assumption here is that the tribe is already at a situation where there isn't such an imbalance.

But that is all a very simplified view. Hunter/gatherer societies lacked high vocational specialization. Every member did basically a bit of everything that was required for survival, and I don't think it was ever only men or only woman that did hunting or gathering.

Yes, indeed, my original comment was about the very specific question of how having hunter women vs hunter men would affect a tribe's population. In reality chances are both did some hunting based on their needs and they did all sorts of different things the model doesn't capture. Out of curiosity, again, i also changed the code a little to see what would happen if *both* hunted:

DUaPHkW.png


And as expected the population is the worst of all cases as this time both sexes are exposed to danger. And this is probably the most realistic scenario because in a way the "hunt" in this model really represent the "work" someone might do, so even if women or men don't hunt, they still might do other things that cause them to die (in the "only men/women hunt" versions the those that do not hunt just wait in their homes doing nothing aside from waiting their partner to come home and have sex :-P).
 

just

Liturgist
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Messages
1,348
man comes with graphs and simulations
patriarchy does it once again. there would be TRILLIONS of us now and we'd live in space if we let women hunt
go and apologize on twitter now fellow would be gatherers
 

The Wall

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If women are pregnant all the time, or half of their time while they are in their physical prime, and take min: 2 years to raise and breast-feed per child, how the fuck they hunt all the time?

One more missing variable: women are shitty hunters. Average woman is a prey, not a hunter. They would easily get killed or get other men killed trying to save stupid Stone Age Hoe from her abusive ex-boyfriend - SaberToothTiger

Perfect simulation of this scenario has been run for thousands of years. Every single time, same result: Patriahical society destroys Matriarhical or Matriarhical implodes, because all women wanna fuck the same guy, leading to constant Civil War over who'll be the guy that women wanna fuck

Women are naturally retarded and weak. I'd say that as alient humanologist studying our funny species
 

The Wall

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Societies troubled with survival did only one thing: that which gives best performance with limited resources. If women were strong, smart and capable, NOTHING would have stopped them from achieving their goals. Their goals, yeah. You forget that women DON'T FUCKING WANT to hunt, on top of all other things said

Man, people are desperate to justify their feminist programming in any way. Kinda hilarious, once you mentally disconnect from Clown Society, and stop worrying about its future
 

The Wall

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Your hunting variable should be a function that gives different value based on fact whether man or woman is received as an argument. Instead you have hunting as simple variable that is either true or false
 

v1c70r14

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As @The Wall said, there's very clear differences between video games, which are curated/guided experiences, and traditional games like chess.

This is like comparing theater to film, except I would argue the gap is even wider with games.
Oh dear, despite my best efforts it seems we are talking past one another. When I talk about games I talk about games, not multimedia and not "experiences", and in their purest form you can find them in something as simple as hide and seek. There are rules, win conditions and you can either win or lose, this is what a game is. It's not music, it's not the box cover, it's not graphics, it's not voice acting, it's not a story, it's not writing.

Yes, after a while a lot was built up around the game part, electronic sound allowed for not just sound effects but also music, the representations became more elaborate, from something resembling pieces of a tabletop game to more realistic representations of what previously was abstracted. At some point gaming journalists didn't just get uncomfortable being pretentious twats spending their best years writing about the digital version of something as unserious as trivial pursuit or boardgames, but being very bad at games and finding that they had become more like movies they then lead the bold charge into the realm of art.

Welcome to like 2009 or something. Gamers don't need to be your audience, walking sims are the new hotness, and you should have played The Path (2009), Dear Esther (2009), Depression Quest (2013) and Gone Home (2013) to be in the cooler fart huffing circles in the industry. Video games as a medium sure is exciting, isn't it? Except these aren't games.

Yeah, whatever, your visual novels are heckin valid novels, weebs are all very cultured, Fate/stay night is the equal of Divina Commedia, The Decameron and The Canterbury Tales. Walking sims are brilliant masterpieces of an art never seen before with massive potential, sure, if you say so. But the fucking point I've been making for the last couple of pages isn't about that. It's the role of writing in regards to games, you know the rules and what you actually do, scoring points, interactivity, gameplay?

This entire thread is like someone taking a glance at a deck of cards and ask, this is art on here, why can't we get a deck of cards that is like the painting of a master, why can't we have a deck like that of Rembrandt's paintings? Theoretically there's nothing stopping you from blowing the cards up, painting them as elaborate and detailed portraits, oil on canvas. They'd be very awkward to shuffle and it'd be absurd to play with. Would this improve the game? It wouldn't. A good game can be enriched by atmospheric soundscapes and music, a good context for it, giving it a mood, sure. I never said this wasn't the case.

This will be my last post in this thread, but I hope that I at least clarified my position. I'm not talking about those consumer products that may or may not contain a game part, I've enjoyed the odd David Cage kino myself, but writing belongs in the background for games, providing context and little else to the game part, unless you want to end up with a bad game, or something else with a half-formed quasi-game stapled to it, like Disco Elysium.
 

RatTower

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476
Now that's a proper derailment if I've ever caused one :-D

Tribal societies do not send out their childbearing population to fight wild animals.
Setting traps for small animals or birds should be safe enough, unlike say hunting bovines with spears. Safety aside, this writer also acknowledges that females are sometimes too busy with small children to be effective hunters:
https://theconversation.com/women-w...ing-beliefs-about-ancient-gender-roles-153772

That's not to say it never happened, but I also expect today's researchers and journalists to overreact in the other (feminist) direction, so as usual one needs to be wary:
https://www.newscientist.com/articl...t-while-women-stay-at-home-is-entirely-wrong/

A tribe of a hundred men and ten women probably dies within one generation.
Not if the surplus men would kidnap more women from neighboring tribes...

Oh, I have no doubt that in pragmatically organized tribes women will take part in animal trapping and hunting small game. That certainly makes sense, since that doesn't necessarily involve the same amount of danger (thinking about it, the main dangers were maybe not even the animals, but something like stepping on a sharp rock and cutting your foot - the more risky the hunt, the more likely such situations would probably occur and of course, an infection might then kill you)
But that's beside the point because the character description specifically stated that women are the "main" hunters. That is what I do not find believable. Sending the childbearing population out to hunt big game.

That whole 100/10 scenario is just an overly simplified example to show the negative effects of a Sex-ratio imbalance. You don't even have to go that far to feel these effects. China, for example, is struggling with that problem and it has a 104m/100f ratio.
Now the real question is the step in between. Can the occupation as the "main" hunters raise female mortality rates to a point where a Sex-ratio imbalance would occur and then from that demographic problems start to arise? Now the simulation from above says no and I am sure a tribe can be relatively robust, given the right circumstances. But then you gotta ask: Why did our ancestors not send out women as the main hunters?
And there we get into the area of modern-day academic bickering. There are (new) studies that suggest that women went out to hunt big game. Now I will ignore the fact, that these studies often make assumptions on the basis of neolithic burial sites (which I personally find insane - we don't even understand the Sumerian bar joke (which we have word-by-word) and these studies are trying to interpret burial rituals that are more than twice as old).
But even if you acknowledge those findings, then you gotta ask, why do modern African tribes not do that (at least not to any significant extent)?

And then everyone looks around awkwardly until someone says "But I saw the Woman King in movie theaters" :-D
I think a lot of these studies are very questionable. Imagine it's the year 11000 and someone finds a "Dicks out for Harambe" meme.

Anyway, to get back to writing, I just don't find it very believable, unless a good reason is provided. The first and foremost question people will ask about world-building is "Why?"
There are matters where you can get away with more vague answers, but I don't think societal organization is (generally speaking) one of those matters.
 
Last edited:

RaggleFraggle

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If I ever write about Amazons, then I’ll make sure to mention that they’re genetically altered compared to Earthling women. Happy now?

Anyway, to get back on topic:

An audiovisual medium obviously can never rival what you can imagine in your head based on text description, nothing can rival imaginary expectations like that, but that’s a silly reason to discount trying to write better stories for audiovisual mediums.

What we need is something to inspire people. The only reason why pseudo-medieval fantasy is big right now is because of the initial success of the LotR and GoT screen adaptations in 2000 and 2010, respectively. Do something like that for another genre, and you’ll get a corresponding explosion of content.

Can you think of any novel series that would provide sufficient source material?
 

Iucounu

Educated
Joined
Jul 4, 2023
Messages
959
Now that's a proper derailment if I've ever caused one :-D
:incline:
Anyway, to get back to writing, I just don't find it very believable, unless a good reason is provided. The first and foremost question people will ask about world-building is "Why?"
There are matters where you can get away with more vague answers, but I don't think societal organization is (generally speaking) one of those matters.
Yes, what were the men doing in the meantime? Maybe it could make sense if the men travelled far away, say for warfare or trading.

Or maybe the female hunter society we are seeing is slowly collapsing before our eyes. Perhaps all the men have recently become drunkards, and now the women must hunt to avoid starvation. If you'd arrived there a decade earlier, maybe the men were still sober and hunting; and if you'd return a decade later the population would be diminishing fast.

In either case it's is a mystery that should make visitors curious, and thus be mentioned in the writing. An exception might be a collection of stories about intentionally absurd situations or traditions, where the absurdity is the whole point.
 

RaggleFraggle

Ask me about VTM
Joined
Mar 23, 2022
Messages
1,438
Is a story about an evil mage causing ruckus in the kingdom not good enough these days?
It’s a cliché at this point. It would need a really good execution. Ultimately I prefer something that is, if not fresh and original, an underutilized plot. I’m tired of D&D fantasy
 

Sunri

Liturgist
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Messages
2,902
Location
Poland
Is a story about an evil mage causing ruckus in the kingdom not good enough these days?
It’s a cliché at this point. It would need a really good execution. Ultimately I prefer something that is, if not fresh and original, an underutilized plot. I’m tired of D&D fantasy
Maybe some alien plot wist at the end like in mm with laser weapon hehe
 

RaggleFraggle

Ask me about VTM
Joined
Mar 23, 2022
Messages
1,438
Is a story about an evil mage causing ruckus in the kingdom not good enough these days?
It’s a cliché at this point. It would need a really good execution. Ultimately I prefer something that is, if not fresh and original, an underutilized plot. I’m tired of D&D fantasy
Maybe some alien plot wist at the end like in mm with laser weapon hehe
Uh...
https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/wiki/Space_travel
 

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