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Game News Wasteland 2 Kickstarter Update #23: Gameplay Video!

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,986
"wtf."

In real life, everyone I speak to speak in full sentences - even it is with broken english. In that video, the PC is basically saying 1 or 2 'key words'; at a time. That's loserville. Someone spoke to me like that in RL, I'd fukkin' ignore them.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff Member
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Jan 28, 2011
Messages
99,662
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
i got the impression that maybe the guard's cone was narrow because it was nighttime. He really couldn't see shit.

Oh wait

image-210117-full.jpg
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
36,743
Brute force skill. Seriously, why not just use strength?
I've already answered this itt.
Or weapon skill if you are pounding a door with a melee weapon?
Because then you have a skill that makes you great at combat and great at breaking locked objects. Though that very well may be the case with demolitions/AT weapons.

Hopefully you are wrong and this is just the result of someone trying out an idea that didn't quite work out.
What makes you think this isn't working out other than your kneejerk reaction to not liking the idea of breaking things as a skill?

Roguey given your votes for worst RPGs of all time, can I assume that "mediocre" is actually extremely high praise or is it mediocre in a relative sense?
Relative. This is going to be added to the list just like all the others.
 

ohWOW

Sucking on dicks and being proud of it
Dumbfuck Queued
Joined
Nov 15, 2011
Messages
2,449
Spiritus Sanctus on guns.


GOD, this game will be shit!
 

Hobz

Savant
Joined
Apr 17, 2012
Messages
337
Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
I don't get the point of the progression bar though, it seams to slow the game down and for now it was pretty ugly (might be placeholder of course).
 

Wizfall

Cipher
Joined
Oct 3, 2012
Messages
816
"wtf."

In real life, everyone I speak to speak in full sentences - even it is with broken english. In that video, the PC is basically saying 1 or 2 'key words'; at a time. That's loserville. Someone spoke to me like that in RL, I'd fukkin' ignore them.
It's an abstraction like many other things in a cRPG.
Are you unable to imagine your part of the dialogue that you need someone to put words in your mouth ? Especially in a party based cRPG where it makes much more sense to do it this way ?
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,986
It doesn't make sense. You lack imagination if youa ctually think this is the best way to do dialogue. It isn't. It's the lazy way. Abstraction can be sueful when it makes sense. This don't make sense.
 
Self-Ejected

Excidium

P. banal
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
13,696
Location
Third World
It doesn't make sense. You lack imagination if youa ctually think this is the best way to do dialogue. It isn't. It's the lazy way. Abstraction can be sueful when it makes sense. This don't make sense.
Makes more sense than putting words in my character's mouth.
 

TwinkieGorilla

does a good job.
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Oct 19, 2007
Messages
5,480
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pathfinder: Wrath
"wtf."

In real life, everyone I speak to speak in full sentences - even it is with broken english. In that video, the PC is basically saying 1 or 2 'key words'; at a time. That's loserville. Someone spoke to me like that in RL, I'd fukkin' ignore them.

In real life do people pause after you initiate a fight with them and wait until you've had your turn?
 

Country_Gravy

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
Messages
3,407
Location
Up Yours
Wasteland 2
They did mention gunfire attracts enemies, so the cone is only their line of sight. How could perception not be used for this. You would have to be perceptive to know if someone was able to detect you or not. I guess Volly just thinks Bio does it better with...what skill checks do they use again?
 

Alex

Arcane
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
9,244
Location
São Paulo - Brasil
I'll agree with that. I did think it a bit strange that the only sense that poor guard had was that limited cone in front of him. Will they detect proximity I wonder? Was that mentioned in the video? Sorry, watched early with coffee.

They mentioned noise attracting monsters, so I think so.

(...snip)
What makes you think this isn't working out other than your kneejerk reaction to not liking the idea of breaking things as a skill?
(snip...)

Well, it is pretty clear that breaking down the door in the example should be directly linked to the character's strength. I mean, how do you train the ability of breaking down stuff separate from strength.? I would much rather have only a few attributes useable in the gameworld, possibly breaking symmetry, than have a skill that makes no sense. Of course, this is far from a deal breaker, but it still doesn't make sense.

I don't get the point of the progression bar though, it seams to slow the game down and for now it was pretty ugly (might be placeholder of course).

I think it might make sense in situations where you are at risk of initiating combat. If a more skilled character can do the job more quickly, you may be able to avoid resources and ammo waste.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
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Messages
36,743
(...snip)
What makes you think this isn't working out other than your kneejerk reaction to not liking the idea of breaking things as a skill?
(snip...)

Well, it is pretty clear that breaking down the door in the example should be directly linked to the character's strength. I mean, how do you train the ability of breaking down stuff separate from strength.? I would much rather have only a few attributes useable in the gameworld, possibly breaking symmetry, than have a skill that makes no sense. Of course, this is far from a deal breaker, but it still doesn't make sense.
Hittin' it the right way. "Strength" isn't really a sense-making thing either; I'm not particularly strong, but given the right tools and enough time I could break down a door. They're not going full-sim, nor would very many people even want a full-sim.
 

MisterStone

Arcane
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Messages
9,422
I have had a vision. The release of this game will precipitate a holy war in the Codex.

The bro-therhood of true righteousness will champion Wasteland 2 for its use of a large text window full of evocative written descriptions, skill-based interactions with the game world, realistic and fun tactical combat and intelligent quest design.

The other side will be an alliance of degenerate infidels variously upset by camera rotation and insignificant UI design choices, drab color palettes, having to type in dialogue prompts, lack of a sympathetic white supremacist faction, misrepresenting the actual clip-size of an obscure Czech knockoff of a Soviet Block submachine gun, and any other banal shit they can think of to complain about.

In the end, the infidels will purged from the Codex and cast into a sub-forum on a shitty Polish warez site, where they shall languish for at least two independent game project development cycles, and for a time peace will reign in Codexia.
 

MisterStone

Arcane
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Messages
9,422
Seriously though, game looks great to me so far. Anyone who complains about the dialogue system should be kicked in the balls. Typed dialogue prompts are the fucking pinnacle of awesome. :obviously:
 

Alex

Arcane
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
9,244
Location
São Paulo - Brasil
Hittin' it the right way.

That would be better represented by another skill or attribute check. Like
Code:
int <10? TotalStrength = Strength/2 : TotalStrength = Strength;
construction > 3? TotalStrength = TotalStrength * 2 : TotalStrength = TotalStrength;

That, however, may be a bit too much detail for this game. Thing it, you don't get steadily better at breaking down things with your bare hands. Either ou have an idea of where to better hit it (which depnds on you knowing what you are dealing with), or you don't. There is some skill as to how you use strength, such as putting pressure on your back, on your shoulders, putting your hip to it. But your overall capacity to break down something is still governed by your strength.

"Strength" isn't really a sense-making thing either; I'm not particularly strong, but given the right tools and enough time I could break down a door.

Well, I can see they allowing you to use a crowbar with this skill. But still, someone stronger would still be able to get a sturdier door down then.

They're not going full-sim, nor would very many people even want a full-sim.

The question isn't "full-sim". The question is whether they create a sense of reality you can use to make assumptions, plans and guesses on. If they manage to do this, you can challenge the player with their understanding of the world to come up with plans. Stuff like "Gee, I can usemy strength to tear down doors, I guess I could use strength on the windows too. Oh, look, it woks!", or "Well, that toxic gloop is covering the way, but I was able to synthetize an antidote to one of the sick people back in town. Maybe I can synthetize a lot and clear up the way instead of dealing with the radscorpions in the other path".

This stuff is as gamist as they come, but it is the gamism of the 70s and early 80s, not the modern games that are built to have a self contained logic you need to use to find an optimal solution.
 

SoupNazi

Guest
I didn't believe in this at all, and now I'm kind of sad I didn't back it. Looking pretty swell.
 

tuluse

Arcane
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
11,400
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
That, however, may be a bit too much detail for this game. Thing it, you don't get steadily better at breaking down things with your bare hands. Either ou have an idea of where to better hit it (which depnds on you knowing what you are dealing with), or you don't.
How many skills in RPGs would you actually get steadily better at in real life?

Look at repair in Fallout. It's amazingly abstracted and realism breaking. Either you know how a specific machine works or you don't. Maybe you have some additional knowledge about how to improvise parts, but that doesn't translate into how repair works at all in Fallout. I don't see people complaining about that.
 

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