World of Darkness Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2 - VTMB sequel from The Chinese Room - coming early 2025

[Semiurge]

He was in this old leaked gameplay.

Old, new, makes no difference. The release version will play exactly the same, probably with the same skating and stuttery animations.

 

[La vie sexuelle]

He was in this old leaked gameplay.

Old, new, makes no difference. The release version will play exactly the same, probably with the same skating and stuttery animations.

Perhaps. But I fell they cut him, with this all Christmass binding.

 

[Skinwalker]

Why hasn't this shit been cancelled yet?

 

[PulsatingBrain]

Why hasn't this shit been cancelled yet?

Because they've already sold it to people. SOMETHING has to release. Same situation as Gotham Knights DLC

 

[Roguey]

They can offer full refunds, they can afford to. I dunno what Paradox is thinking here. Pure hopium?

 

[Harthwain]

They can offer full refunds, they can afford to. I dunno what Paradox is thinking here. Pure hopium?

Could be the sunk cost fallacy. This went too far to merely cut their loses now.

 

[Tyranicon]

They can offer full refunds, they can afford to. I dunno what Paradox is thinking here. Pure hopium?

I think as long as the game isn't a massive technical mess and needs to be refunded, there's a good chance that it'll make more money than THC cost for development.

It's a good business decision.

It's just that the actual game decisions have been horrible. Not sure how much control Paradox has over the direction of the game, but everything we've seen of the game is the opposite of what people actually want. It's kind of impressive.

 

[Roguey]

It's just that the actual game decisions have been horrible. Not sure how much control Paradox has over the direction of the game, but everything we've seen of the game is the opposite of what people actually want. It's kind of impressive.

Full control given their own statement when they announced the new version (in addition to the rumblings from various people that they changed their mind on what kind of game they wanted from Hardsuit mid-development).

"The work that Hardsuit Labs had done got us to a certain point in the project, and while the goals were reasonably aligned, we ultimately had a different vision for the project," said Greaney. "That is why we eventually moved the project to a new team—that's the best way to put it."

 

[Gargaune]

They can offer full refunds, they can afford to. I dunno what Paradox is thinking here. Pure hopium?

Could be the sunk cost fallacy. This went too far to merely cut their loses now.

They'd probably get more shit from shareholders if they canceled it so far into production than if they let it come out and underperform. The latter's short-term ROI would come at the long-term expense of the IP, but let the next CEO deal with that problem.

 

[Skinwalker]

Why the fuck didn't they just let Hirsute Labs finish the game? Did they really think that the walking simulator studio could do a better job than them?

Is it just as simple as "we need this product to be ultra-WOKE at any cost"?

 

[S.torch]

Why the fuck didn't they just let Hirsute Labs finish the game? Did they really think that the walking simulator studio could do a better job than them?

Hardsuit was making an RPG, but suits at Paradox wanted Game of Thrones with the vampire brand slapped on it.

 

[Vincente]

Have we already entered the HSL revisionism state?

 

[Vulpes]

Already? Since Hardsuit got shut down in 2021 people all over the Internet have been pretending that their version with its woke writers, in-game trigger warnings, consensual vampire feeding, ugly female characters and combat that's somehow worse than the original was going to be a diamond in the rough. All because that one-hit wonder Brian Mitsoda (whose impact on Bloodlines 1 has been greatly exaggerated over the years BTW) was involved with its development. Shit, a lot of the criticisms aimed right now at TCR's game applied to the original Bloodlines 2 as well, like the removal of melee and ranged playstyles in favor of discipline-focused combat.

 

[santino27]

There's definitely been some revisionism, but it's also true that you can point at one version and say you wish it had some of the revealed aspects of the other while still admitting both will/would have been some flavor of crap.

 

[gooseman]

"Phyre" is "fire" spelled retardedly. Nothing more.

Or maybe they misspelled "Pyre"?

Maybe it's short for vamphyre

 

[Bulo]

They ought to phyre the person who came up with that one

 

[The President]

Could be the sunk cost fallacy. This went too far to merely cut their loses now.

I would say this is probably the case in most circumstances. As we’ve seen from Paradox lately though, they are unafraid and actually have been cutting games left and right.

 

[Harthwain]

Could be the sunk cost fallacy. This went too far to merely cut their loses now.

I would say this is probably the case in most circumstances. As we’ve seen from Paradox lately though, they are unafraid and actually have been cutting games left and right.

If I recall correctly, the games they cut were mostly not known IPs, which could be a vital factor.

 

[Raghar]

Are they using that team that replaced the team with crazed females who got rid of Mitsoda, or is it a NEW team aka 3rd team developing the same game?

 

[ind33d]

They should have used VTMB's original engine to save development costs and market it as a retro game

 

[santino27]

Are they using that team that replaced the team with crazed females who got rid of Mitsoda, or is it a NEW team aka 3rd team developing the same game?

The former. TCR replaced Hardsuit as developers of the game a fair bit after all the Mitsoda stuff happened.

 

[S.torch]

Already? Since Hardsuit got shut down in 2021 people all over the Internet have been pretending that their version with its woke writers, in-game trigger warnings, consensual vampire feeding, ugly female characters and combat that's somehow worse than the original was going to be a diamond in the rough. All because that one-hit wonder Brian Mitsoda (whose impact on Bloodlines 1 has been greatly exaggerated over the years BTW) was involved with its development. Shit, a lot of the criticisms aimed right now at TCR's game applied to the original Bloodlines 2 as well, like the removal of melee and ranged playstyles in favor of discipline-focused combat.

Both statements can be true without being contradictory. Hardsuit version could be crappy and bad, yet TCR's seems worse.

Take Star Wars prequels and Disney Star Wars as a popular example. When they came out many people criticized the prequels for following a nonsensical storyline filled with plotholes that didn't align with the stablished rules of the universe in the original trilogy. But others said that even with their flaws, the prequels were enjoyable because of the good parts like fights, music and characterization.

Then Disney movies came and shat the bed so bad they were universally hated, making many who despised the prequels reevaluate their opinion about them.

Kind of a similar situation is happening here now, although in a much smaller scale:

- Hardsuit version: You're a thinblood running around Seattle doing errand for the big boys. You have to climb the ladder if you want to survive.
- TCR version: You're an epic elder running around Seattle asking questions to the big boys. You have to regain your ancient superpowers.

Hardsuit version is typical RPG wankery, but at least being a thinblood is coherent with being a nobody and living in an unimportant city like Seattle.
TCR premise on the other hand is harder to compele from the get-go. Elders don't have an inmediate reason to look for things themselves instead of having someone else do it for them. Add to that the whole why this gal lost her powers, voice in head, looking for the responsible, and talking to the top dogs from the start and you're basically setting yourself for mystery meat and expecting a gourment meal or a dry turd with flies. No in-between.

 

[Roguey]

Why the fuck didn't they just let Hirsute Labs finish the game? Did they really think that the walking simulator studio could do a better job than them?

Is it just as simple as "we need this product to be ultra-WOKE at any cost"?

It was already ultra-woke. Paradox only cared about gameplay. The Ubisoft finisher told them they couldn't Frankenstein HSL's into the kind of game they wanted, so they started over.

All because that one-hit wonder Brian Mitsoda (whose impact on Bloodlines 1 has been greatly exaggerated over the years BTW)

Eh, he did write the majority of characters which is what people remember about it the most.

They should have used VTMB's original engine to save development costs and market it as a retro game

I've been told that version of Source wouldn't even pass certification these days.

 

[Bad Sector]

Both statements can be true without being contradictory. Hardsuit version could be crappy and bad, yet TCR's seems worse.

Not everyone can deal with morality systems more complex than what Bioware had in KOTOR :-P.

Elders don't have an inmediate reason to look for things themselves instead of having someone else do it for them.

Official lore aside (i only know of VtM from the games), but wasn't that basically what happened in VtM Redemption? Of course you're an elder there on a technicality but i think it'd still count as being an elder running around with the youngsters to look for things :-P.

I've been told that version of Source wouldn't even pass certification these days.

I know it was meant as a joke, but TBH i think hiring a competent programmer or two would have addressed that, though you'd need to find people who are not allergic to touching others' code.

 

[Wesp5]

It was already ultra-woke.

We don't know that. Yes, they talked a lot of woke things in interviews, but maybe because the game at the time wasn't woke enough and they wanted to appease Paradox.

I've been told that version of Source wouldn't even pass certification these days.

Certainly. But it would have been much easier to switch to Source 2, which looks like a slightly updated Source engine to me anyway.