Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Pre-Release Thread [ALPHA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Infinitron]

Might as well make this thread now.

I don't think this was posted on the Codex: http://www.formspring.me/ksaun/q/401371844898213114

So, are you and Colin McComb involved in the pre-production of the same project? Having you two on the same team would be ... very interesting.

Yes, Colin is the creative lead on my project. And there’s an interesting (to me, anyway =) ) serendipity because our common link to inXile is Chris Avellone. Chris referred me to Brian Fargo specifically for this position – and I know that his recommendation played a significant role in inXile’s decision to make me an offer. (In fact, Chris also made the decision to hire me at Obsidian – almost a decade ago – to work for him as a senior designer on Star Wars: Knight of the Old Republic 2 (KOTOR2). So I have him to thank for two job opportunities (and much more). =) ) And it was also Chris who referred Colin to inXile to write for Wasteland 2!

Colin and I first met only recently, but we immediately “clicked” professionally. So I’m very excited we’re collaborating on this game. Actually, I was seriously considering an offer at a very different company instead, but the stars were so well aligned (not that I believe in such things =) ). Combined with the appeal of Brian’s mission and the compelling nature of the project – I knew I had to be a part of it.

 

[Ulminati]

Tentative

Not many details to go on though. Except it won't be a continuation of the story (TNOs story is complete), use the same mechanics (2e hopelessly outdated and inXile doesn't have the rights to use DND) or the same setting (ditto).

Still, let's get as many new wave RPGs out there. Better chances one of them won't be awful!

 

[Whisky]

It's probably good that it's not going to be a direct successor, but name-dropping Planescape: Torment is going to really get people's expectations up.

 

[sea]

Yeah if it's not a continuation of the brand, story, ruleset or characters, it basically can't have anything to do with Planescape other than maybe some thematic similarities. Anyone want to ask inXile exactly how they plan to pull that off?

 

[Crooked Bee]

So we're going the way of megathreads now? I approve.

Not many details to go on though. Except it won't be a continuation of the story (TNOs story is complete), use the same mechanics (2e hopelessly outdated and inXile doesn't have the rights to use DND) or the same setting (ditto).

Well, as long as it follows a similar set of themes and narrative principles, I guess it can be justified in being called a spiritual successor. It's not like they call it a sequel anyway.

Having a setting with multiple planes/dimensions would be a good start.

 

[Jaesun]

A successor would be retarded. A new game, with all new characters in the world of Sigil whatever the cities name is would be cool.

 

[Ulminati]

So we're going the way of megathreads now? I approve.

It's just infinitron hoping to harvest more brofists by having the OP in a megathread.

A successor would be retarded. A new game, with all new characters in the world of Sigil whatever the cities name is would be cool.

Pretty sure WOTC/Hasbro haven't given inXile the rights to use the Planescape IP. They just go tthe rights to the Torment name or smth.

 

[Infinitron]

So we're going the way of megathreads now? I approve.

Yes, "CrookedB" would say that. When are you becoming a staff member on SA?

A successor would be retarded. A new game, with all new characters in the world of Sigil whatever the cities name is would be cool.

Oh please. Rename the thread to "inXile Torment Spiritual Successor Thread" then.

 

[Merkwürdigliebe]

Just how much do we know about this? Or is still just the speculations posted a few weeks ago? I guess with what is known it can be a successor in spirit only. Not that I complain I would love to play such a game, but it makes little sense to name such a game Torment.

 

[Alex]

(...snip) (2e hopelessly outdated and inXile doesn't have the rights to use DND) or the same setting (ditto).(snip...)

 

[Infinitron]

Just how much do we know about this? Or is still just the speculations posted a few weeks ago? I guess with what is known it can be a successor in spirit only. Not that I complain I would love to play such a game, but it makes little sense to name such a game Torment.

Speculations? It's basically confirmed.

We haven't learned anything new yet though, no.

About the name Torment, you'll have to ask Colin McComb.

http://colinmccomb.com/?p=157

I have a lot of ideas about what to put into a new Torment game, but my primary goal would be to help the player tell a story that was evocative of the original Torment without aping it. To be faithful to the odyssey of the Nameless One, and to recognize that it has ended, and that stories of Torment are ongoing.

 

[Ulminati]

You heard me. 2e is an obsolete system and there are dozens of better alternatives out there!

 

[Alex]

You heard me. 2e is an obsolete system and there are dozens of better alternatives out there!

I would agree with there being better alternatives if I didn't think you meant stuff like Pathfinder.

 

[Infinitron]

Josh Sawyer supports the notion of a non-Planescape Torment: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...rid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=318#post410706378

The details that made Torment so interesting, IMO, had to do with the unique characters, locations, and ideas developed for it. Sigil is a cool setting with cool factions, but the Nameless One, Morte, Annah, et al. didn't come from TSR.

 

[Jaesun]

Exactly.

 

[Captain Shrek]

I think, all it is, is good storytelling. How does it matter where it takes place?

All it requires is MCA.

 

[Ulminati]

You heard me. 2e is an obsolete system and there are dozens of better alternatives out there!

I would agree with there being better alternatives if I didn't think you meant stuff like Pathfinder.

SR4E, SR3E, Burning Wheel. Heck, even the WoD stuff is decentish crunch-wise, even if I hold the fluff in contempt. For a dungeon-crawlery experience, 4E would be ok. But I'd honestly rather have my game skill-based rather than class-based as this allows a more seamless integration of non-combat obstacles. SR4 mechanics would probably be the ideal, since it's easy to grasp how basic/opposed/extended tests work, it's easy to understand exactly how modifiers will impact your chances of success and you can (somewhat) easily retool the setting from sci-fi to fantasy by replacing skill names and changing cyberware to magic items. Although for a tormenty game, a duel of wits system a la BW could be kind of neat...

But to be honest, basing a CRPG on a pen&paper system kind of wastes the potential you get when a computer tracks all the numbers for you.

Pathfinder is superior to 2e, 3e, 3.5e and 4e, no doubt there. But it is by no means my favourite P&P system. It's just the system it's easiest to find players for around here.

 

[Brother None]

Just how much do we know about this?

I know pretty much everything. I just thought I'd remind people of that. coz I like being a dick.

Yeah if it's not a continuation of the brand, story, ruleset or characters, it basically can't have anything to do with Planescape other than maybe some thematic similarities. Anyone want to ask inXile exactly how they plan to pull that off?

By making it a thematic sequel in an envisioned thematic franchise. It hasn't been done in gaming before but it's a concept that exists in other media. Besides, what other options are there? You either do it like this or just let the Torment name die. Which is also an option, true. Matter of preference. I like the idea of a thematic franchise.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Yeah if it's not a continuation of the brand, story, ruleset or characters, it basically can't have anything to do with Planescape other than maybe some thematic similarities. Anyone want to ask inXile exactly how they plan to pull that off?

It could be on a tangent from the first game.

For example, even though Yxunomei and Belhifet were killed/banished in Icewind Dale, Black Isle still managed to continue Icewind Dale 2 on the track of what happened with all the half-human aberrations that were born from women kidnapped as breeders by the Yuan-ti and the servants of Belhifet. In the second game, the cambions and the half-human, half-yuan-ti formed a violent resistance against the "hypocritical mundanes" that rejected them from their society.

Similarly, there are multiple tangents that could be taken from the first game.

1. The Fortress of Regrets and the possibility of someone exploiting it for his sinister purpose.
2. An organization formed by the Greater Shadows that once haunted the fortress, who now extend their influence in the Prime Material Plane.
3. An expedition to retrace the Nameless One's steps after his legendary travels across the planes, by a person or a group of people also seeking immortality, but without the dire consequences that happened to the Nameless One.

And so on and so forth.

 

[Gragt]

Before clicking, I knew this would be an Infinitron thread.

 

[Stabwound]

Hey inXile, let's see Wasteland 2 before you start jumping on things like this.

 

[Alex]

I still stand by that Planescape was a great source of ideas for the project, and that the mechanics in AD&D 2e helped the game. Not in the combat part, but by giving them material to work with. Sure, a lot of that work was subverting the material, or by building on it, but still, I saw Torment as very related to Planescape. Of course, maybe MCA doesn't need it to make a good game, but to say Planescape or AD&D 2e weren't an important part of that game is just wrong, I think.

Ulminati

Of the games you mentioned, the only one that plays a little like AD&D 2e (at least, given how I play them) is Shadowrun. I suppose that Burning thac0 thing for BW could work too, though I never tried it. Still the Rim of the Wheel is a bit too inflexible for my tastes there. Shadowrun, like old school D&D, is a lot about finding creative solutions for problems, and having those change how things resolve. The game doesn't try to give you a lot of simple elements that have a predefined way of interacting with each other, like 3e and its spawn do. Instead, you get a bunch of different elements, like cyberware, spells, matrix programs and what not, and guidelines as to how deal with them. That is the kind of thing I want to see in this kind of game. Still, if Shadowrun has a lot of interesting ideas as to how to deal with skills and dice rolls, I like the spells (if not the spell system) in AD&D a whole lot more. I also would say AD&D by default deals better with much larger than life characters.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Hey inXile, let's see Wasteland 2 before you start jumping on things like this.

Yeah, particularly since this is inXile's past record:

As a studio, they have not produced anything that is substantially impressive, so they inspire very very little confidence of becoming worthy developers of a new Planescape: Torment.

 

[Jaesun]

meh they are just doing the same thing Obsidian does to survive. Granted cRPG wise Obsidian is vastly superior in this aspect over the one cRPG inXile has made.

 

[Surf Solar]

From what I've seen and read so far on Wasteland, I can only assume the worst on this one.