Thief: The Dark Project vs. Gold

[Manjuice Nutella]

A few months ago I was forced to install Thief Gold, as I couldn't find the Dark Project anyway (I should still have it on an old CD somewhere in parents' home), and"Gold2Dark" mod broke the game. So I had no choice but to play Thief Gold.

I played until I reached Thieves Guild, played a bit and ditched this fucking playthrough. What kind of retard would include such horribly designed level is beyond me. It also fucks up the pacing.

I looked at all the changes made, like in Bonehoard, Lost City, those idiotic fire shadows, some easter egg in The Sword, fuck this shit. Dark Project is a perfect game, and perfectly paced as well, and if this is the exact thing they wanted to do with Thief 2 Gold I'm almost glad they fucking disbanded.

FUCK THIEF GOLD IN THE ASS

 

[Darth Roxor]

A few months ago I was forced to install Thief Gold, as I couldn't find the Dark Project anyway (I should still have it on an old CD somewhere in parents' home), and"Gold2Dark" mod broke the game. So I had no choice but to play Thief Gold.

I played until I reached Thieves Guild, played a bit and ditched this fucking playthrough. What kind of retard would include such horribly designed level is beyond me. It also fucks up the pacing.

I looked at all the changes made, like in Bonehoard, Lost City, those idiotic fire shadows, some easter egg in The Sword, fuck this shit. Dark Project is a perfect game, and perfectly paced as well, and if this is the exact thing they wanted to do with Thief 2 Gold I'm almost glad they fucking disbanded.

FUCK THIEF GOLD IN THE ASS

 

[Chippy]

Thief Gold did drag on a bit didn't it... I agree that the thief guild mission, and the lost city were testing my patience. Haven't played in ten years now.

 

[Exhuminator]

Back in 2001 I played through Thief: The Dark Project, and it became my all time favorite video game. It still is 18 years later. However I've never played through Thief Gold. I'm almost afraid too, due to such controversial opinions as shown in this thread. All the same Looking Glass has said that Thief Gold is the game they wanted to ship, but couldn't due to time constraints imposed by their publisher. Perhaps the answer is to play Thief Gold, but if you find the new missions too annoying, just skip them with a code* and move on.

*To automatically end a level, press Ctrl + Alt + Shift + End.

 

[Nano]

Back in 2001 I played through Thief: The Dark Project, and it became my all time favorite video game. It still is 18 years later. However I've never played through Thief Gold. I'm almost afraid too, due to such controversial opinions as shown in this thread. All the same Looking Glass has said that Thief Gold is the game they wanted to ship, but couldn't due to time constraints imposed by their publisher. Perhaps the answer is to play Thief Gold, but if you find the new missions too annoying, just skip them with a code* and move on.

*To automatically end a level, press Ctrl + Alt + Shift + End.

Dude just play it and decide for yourself which is better, what's the worst that can happen?

 

[Exhuminator]

Dude just play it and decide for yourself which is better, what's the worst that can happen?

I agree with you, I should play it myself, and with an open mind.

Worst that could happen? Probably this:

Spoiler

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

Back in 2001 I played through Thief: The Dark Project, and it became my all time favorite video game. It still is 18 years later. However I've never played through Thief Gold. I'm almost afraid too, due to such controversial opinions as shown in this thread. All the same Looking Glass has said that Thief Gold is the game they wanted to ship, but couldn't due to time constraints imposed by their publisher. Perhaps the answer is to play Thief Gold, but if you find the new missions too annoying, just skip them with a code* and move on.

Yeah, no, it's clearly an afterthought that they couldn't be possibly thinking about when designing the original. It's much more likely they simply meant "we wanted to ship a game with 1 level for each talisman". One post on the previous page regarding pacing describes it in an amazing way.

Fun fact: The almost universally hated Thieves Guild level was designed by the same level designer as The Sword. Talk about an uneven creative output.

*To automatically end a level, press Ctrl + Alt + Shift + End.

Yeah but then you get no money to spend on the equipment, and even though it's not perhaps super hard to do without, I just like using all the moss/gas/water arrows I can. Plus it doesn't feel right to just console command your way out. Either way, the perfect pacing & flow of Bafford-Cragsleft-Bonehoard-Assassins-The Sword is disrupted. Damage is already done.

Dude just play it and decide for yourself which is better, what's the worst that can happen?

He'll be raging at the very memory of playing Thief with this bullshit just like I am.

I wouldn't be triggered that much if those changes were either optional, or even if simply The Dark Project would be a bit more available, without digging through the bowels of the internet.

 

[Katana1000S]

Gold

Every time, why would you play a lesser version? Gold has everything original has + some, like the blooper mission if you get bored.

If you really hate the few newer gold missions, they are easy skipped, this is a bloody stupid poll.

Please cudgel the OP about the head several times.

 

[DalekFlay]

I haven't played the original version since Gold came out. Don't really have an opinion then I guess, but chiming in to say... Gold is a great game. Thanks.

 

[Master]

Back in 2001 I played through Thief: The Dark Project, and it became my all time favorite video game. It still is 18 years later. However I've never played through Thief Gold. I'm almost afraid too, due to such controversial opinions as shown in this thread. All the same Looking Glass has said that Thief Gold is the game they wanted to ship, but couldn't due to time constraints imposed by their publisher. Perhaps the answer is to play Thief Gold, but if you find the new missions too annoying, just skip them with a code* and move on.

Yeah, no, it's clearly an afterthought that they couldn't be possibly thinking about when designing the original. It's much more likely they simply meant "we wanted to ship a game with 1 level for each talisman". One post on the previous page regarding pacing describes it in an amazing way.

Fun fact: The almost universally hated Thieves Guild level was designed by the same level designer as The Sword. Talk about an uneven creative output.

*To automatically end a level, press Ctrl + Alt + Shift + End.

Yeah but then you get no money to spend on the equipment, and even though it's not perhaps super hard to do without, I just like using all the moss/gas/water arrows I can. Plus it doesn't feel right to just console command your way out. Either way, the perfect pacing & flow of Bafford-Cragsleft-Bonehoard-Assassins-The Sword is disrupted. Damage is already done.

Dude just play it and decide for yourself which is better, what's the worst that can happen?

He'll be raging at the very memory of playing Thief with this bullshit just like I am.

I wouldn't be triggered that much if those changes were either optional, or even if simply The Dark Project would be a bit more available, without digging through the bowels of the internet.

I understand why Thieves Guild isn't liked, but its frustrating moments kind of fit the underground, not easy to navigate hideout setting. And, more and more i appreciate when a game just bitch slaps you for a bit instead of blowing your dick at every step.

 

[Morgoth]

The Thieves Guild was fun. Anyone who disagrees with this is a lousy taffer.

Also lets not forget this cool stone engraving:

 

[flyingjohn]

Jesus. This was the bad part. Thieves just being bad guys who steal and not robin hood edgy farkwits was the realism I needed. This is right out of Thiaf.

Yup.
Reminds me of a fan mod for the darkmod where you steal some stuff and a very condescending ghost comes in and lectures you about morality.

 

[Maggot]

Thieves' Guild is nowhere near as mazelike as people make it out to be. Just use the compass since every area is mapped out.

 

[Exhuminator]

Thieves' Guild is nowhere near as mazelike as people make it out to be. Just use the compass since every area is mapped out.

This reminds me of the stigma surrounding the Water Temple from Ocarina of Time. For years I'd read the Water Temple was this terribly confusing, horrendously difficult to navigate torturous dungeon. I personally knew a player who said it took him an entire weekend to figure out. Well when I finally got around to playing OoT, and hit the Water Temple, I was ready for some serious hell. Two hours later I was done with the dungeon, wondering WTF. (No I did not use a walkthrough.) The sad truth is, based on the IQ bell curve, most people have average intelligence. Thus when challenging 3D environments are designed, they are done so geared in a manner that tasks average intelligence. Which means the majority of people are going to find the experience difficult, and since there's grossly more of that type of player talking about the experience, the vocal consensus surmises "this is a very hard thing in this game". When in reality if you are above average intelligence, it is likely you will not find yourself nearly as taken aback while solving the "hard thing". Such as using a compass to navigate maps for fuck's sake.

 

[Master]

"I tell you dear, i i finished that dungeon in 2 hours! Where the common man would need weeks! Ha! Haha!"

 

[Maggot]

Jesus. This was the bad part. Thieves just being bad guys who steal and not robin hood edgy farkwits was the realism I needed. This is right out of Thiaf.

The former describes the thieves guild more accurately based on the logs and dialogue in the mission. You even get guards complaining about "going union" like it's a mafia.

 

[RoSoDude]

I finally got around to playing Thief for the first time with the Gold version last month (pls no bully), so I figured I'd throw in my two cents.

I actually thought the Thieves' Guild was pretty cool. I like the layered design with the restaurant, casino, and hideout, and the interconnected sewers beneath the mansions was cool to explore and map out in my head. I'd maybe agree it was a tad too horizontal and restrictive at parts, and maybe it screws with the pacing (I couldn't judge, only played Gold), but not a bad level on the whole. I didn't find it any more confusing on average, at least not in any way that registered as a negative.

The Mage Towers is a bit of a drag, though. The central tower is fun and interesting, but the symmetric layout of the level makes exploring the four towers feel super repetitive, since the shortcut bridges to the top of the central tower require that you go all the way back down to the courtyard entrance of each tower anyway. While I like most of the challenges in each of the elemental towers, all of them (except the water tower) feature one lame sneaking challenge in the form of an open circular room up some stairs from the entrance which, due to the angle of the stairs, is a nearly blind approach for the player while offering a great view for the two guards patrolling inside. I think I particularly dislike it because the geometry at the top of the stairs feels sloppy, as it's just tall enough that you generally have to jump/mantle to get up. These minor annoyances compound when repeated thrice.

I looked through some of Gold's changes to the original missions and a few are definitely disappointments in retrospect (particularly the loss of the Craymen in The Lost City -- they're underutilized in Gold and I genuinely preferred the spooky horror-themed missions to the more standard sneaking missions). I'd still tentatively say that I prefer having one mission for each Talisman, as it just feels like a more complete experience and probably what they intended from the start, blemishes aside.

 

[Wunderbar]

I finally got around to playing Thief for the first time with the Gold version last month (pls no bully)

 

[Nano]

particularly the loss of the Craymen in The Lost City -- they're underutilized in Gold and I genuinely preferred the spooky horror-themed missions to the more standard sneaking missions

YMMV. The Lost City is one of my favorite levels and I think it works better not being a horror level. It would sort of put a damper on the whole archeological vibe.

Also, I'm thinking the devs were probably okay with removing the Craymen from this level because they added them to the Gold-exclusive Song of the Caverns instead.

 

[DalekFlay]

YMMV. The Lost City is one of my favorite levels and I think it works better not being a horror level. It would sort of put a damper on the whole archeological vibe.

In general I prefer when Thief (and games like it) have creepy atmosphere but stop short of trying to be actual horror.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Also, I'm thinking the devs were probably okay with removing the Craymen from this level because they added them to the Gold-exclusive Song of the Caverns instead.

There's also Craymen down in the sewers in "The Haunted Cathedral", but I'll admit I can't say for certain whether they were always there or just added in Thief Gold.

 

[Mikeal]

There's also Craymen down in the sewers in "The Haunted Cathedral", but I'll admit I can't say for certain whether they were always there or just added in Thief Gold.

Always.

 

[RoSoDude]

I heard them clicking along in the sewers in The Haunted Cathedral and was too creeped out to take that path

I guess it depends on where you draw the line for "actual horror", but Down in the Bonehoard was probably my favorite level if it means anything. I definitely liked The Lost City in Gold and the presence of the mages was interesting and appropriate, I just imagine that I would have enjoyed getting ambushed by some creepy Craymen more. I ended up straight brawling the ones in The Song of the Caverns, so their creep factor went down sharply in my mind where I don't think the same would have happened in the original version of The Lost City.

 

[Nano]

I ended up straight brawling the ones in The Song of the Caverns, so their creep factor went down sharply in my mind

You had an easier time than me. I killed those Craymen too, but I still was terrified for every moment of it. It was a big relief when I reached the opera house.

I don't think the same would have happened in the original version of The Lost City.

You could try it for yourself if you want: https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=140679

 

[Morgoth]