Review The Witcher 2: Assassins of Kings Review

[Drakron]

The Witcher is still a better game that Divinity ...

Its funny how Larian is getting a free pass were your FUCKING GENDER IS NOT EVEN SET IN STONE AND CAN BE CHANGED AT WILL.

 

[Rivmusique]

Rivmusique: It's a bug, you have to drop all nekker hearts/eyes so the game registers that you have brought the pig organs (which will trick the wraith)

Just did what you said on my fourth playthrough (dropped the nekker hearts/eyes before I talked to Rupert and Gridley so that the game wouldn't immediately go to the deliver to ghost phase). Though even with the Pigs eyes/hearts it still resulted in the same dialogue ("Fool who knows not the dead cant be decieved"...or something like that). The Witcher wiki also suggests this is the only way things will play out, so I think you are indeed giving the game too much credit in the options department

 

[Roguey]

The Witcher is still a better game that Divinity ...

Its funny how Larian is getting a free pass were your FUCKING GENDER IS NOT EVEN SET IN STONE AND CAN BE CHANGED AT WILL.

I don't see the problem here. Imagine if one could do that in real life. Just imagine...

 

[MicoSelva]

Good review, Brother None, very informative. I am now actually tempted to play the game a second time to see the alternate path - and I wasn't very on to it after finishing the first playthrough.

 

[Azrael the cat]

The Witcher is still a better game that Divinity ...

Its funny how Larian is getting a free pass were your FUCKING GENDER IS NOT EVEN SET IN STONE AND CAN BE CHANGED AT WILL.

I don't see the problem here. Imagine if one could do that in real life. Just imagine...

I think that NoMask has done enough fantasising about SMA for the whole Codex, for the time being.

 

[Darth Roxor]

I am utterly disgusted by all of you misspelling the word 'flavour'

 

[Brother None]

Right. Sorry, you simply brought back a 60-page debate, which split the Codex into two camps.

I realize that, hence my pre-emptive warning, thanks for understanding. This debate is simply too dichotomic for me, because...

Um, no. No, no, no.

Yes yes yes. My point is: this debate seems to split either between real C&C and flavor choices. Between non-linearity and linear as fuck. I don't see how reality can be that simple. There are points between both extremes that TW2 hits at various times.

Many choices in TW2 have minor consequences, I noted that in my review, but that doesn't mean they have no consequences or only flavor consequences, though many other choices do. Similarly, it is for the most part a linear game, returning you to a set of nodes, but is it "linear as fuck"? When you say linear as fuck, that indicates to me that this is amongst the most linear games recently released. And that's just not true. Of "recent" games that pop into my head, the likes of The River of Time (which was also mostly praised on the Codex), Avadon and Mass Effect 2 are all more linear than TW2. It is a story-driven game and should not be praised for non-linearity (which is why I didn't in my review), but nor should it be put in the stockade for being the worst example of linearity in RPG history.

I realize I'm stepping into an ongoing debate but I'd invite you and VOD, especially if either of you is writing a review, to step back and consider how to present your opinion. I always dig the Codex but it does tend to divide people between two sides who then blow up their opinion beyond the rational. TW2 shouldn't be praised for being the champion of C&C, nor should it be criticized for sucking at it. Yes, it utilizes writing to replace meaty gameplay choices many times, but it's also not afraid to cut off options when you make certain choices. I know it's a testament of the times that I feel that's noteworthy, but it is. It's no New Vegas, but it's no Mass Effect either.

This takes me back to a debate you and I had ages ago, VD, where you told me I shouldn't hold up games to non-existent, idealized standards. I took said advice to heart, and now I have to shoot back the same advice to you. If we're trying to present TW2 as a noteworthy example of linearity or bad C&C I think that'd be exaggerating the case quite a bit. Nor is it a noteworthy example of non-linearity, and when it comes to C&C the scope of the big choice should be noted, and while many other choices have small consequences they at least have real consequences. I don't know any RPG where every choice has major consequences, I don't know how it could exist.

I'm not saying to not criticize TW2 for stuff it does wrong, because it does a lot of stuff wrong, just don't criticize it especially because it has some unreasonable fanboys. Every major title does, it just is what it is.

You know, "reviewers" really should start adding "in my personal, completely subjective opinion" at the start of each such statement.

Why?

* Repetitive, twitch-based, clunky and unbalanced combat is how "evolved" RPGs, like W2, should do it? Fuck yeah!

Is this still not clear? I was mocking the Hunted guy who was claiming RPGs always wanted to be action games, and I criticized the combat in the very same conclusion. Reading can't be that hard.

 

[Stereotypical Villain]

I suppose that the official Codex title is: "Twitcher 2: Asscracks of Kings"

Yes/no?

 

[Esquilax]

Moar like Turd 2: Turd of Turds amirite?!

 

[Stereotypical Villain]

Nah, my name is much more creative since it follows in the footsteps of the nickname Skyway bestowed upon the first game... so many years ago today.

 

[MicoSelva]

You want an example of a gameplay affecting choice in the Witcher's context? How about:

If you trigger the pogrom, your dwarven buddy will die unless you manage to save him. There. Not some meaningless no-name non-human scum, but a key-fucking-character with whom you have a relationship and whose death will actually affect at least one quest.

CDProjekt RED would not survive if they designed this part of the game like that. Enraged Twitcher/Sapkowski fanboys would storm their HQ in Warsaw, or wherever it is, and burn everything to the ground.

I know it for sure, because I would probably be among the storming crowd.

 

[toro]

@Vod, VD: Common sense is not so common.

Triss, the dwarf and Dandelion are not easy "killable". They are a integral part of the story, the entire story will be different without them and they bring some humanity to Geralt's character. Therefore, I accept the fact that they are "flavour" characters: they cannot die, they appear in some point of the story to help the hero or to allow some exposition, and so on. And I really hate Dandelion, but I still accept this "limitation" as necessary in order to keep some consistency to the series. Therefore, is a little dishonest to say that the game has no C&C because these characters cannot be killed.

Anyway, I found this edited summary of the important npcs [http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/975399-/59436791]:

ZOLTAN/DANDELION/TRISS: They cannot die. Zoltan even survives ch2 if you go with Henselt.

ARYAN: Can be spared or not. Just a player choice.

FOLTEST: Obviously, you can't save him.

ROCHE: I don't know if he can die.

VES: Like Roche, I assume she always lives?

IORVETH: I think if you're on Roche's route (or possibly Iorveth-Triss?) he can be abandoned to his effective death. Not perfect, but it works. Presumably this means he can always be saved.

LETHO: You can kill him or not at the end of every route.

LOREDO: He dies automatically if you go with Roche. If you go with Iorveth, it's possible for him to live (if you choose to save the elven women rather than pursue him). Not that he deserves to live, but this is the only way he will. Going Iorveth also means you never meet (and therefore kill) his mother.

HENSELT: You can choose to let Roche kill him in Roche's ch2. Otherwise I don't think there's any opportunity to kill him and get away with it.

STENNIS: He's easy to kill; either declare him guilty in Royal Blood in Iorveth's route or just go to Roche's ch2 where he dies automatically when the mist appears at the beginning of the chapter (Henselt and Geralt will chat about it as you're passing through the mist with Dethmold).

RADOVID: As far as I know, Radovid cannot die at all.

NATALIS: Natalis can't die either, I don't believe.

SASKIA: You always have the option to kill or spare Saskia UNLESS you go on the Iorveth-Phillipa route, where it appears Geralt spares her automatically.

SHILARD: He'll die if you go after Triss, otherwise it seems he's guaranteed to live.

SILE: She can be saved or left to die at the end of the game regardless of route.

PHILLIPA: I could be wrong, but I don't think she can die at all. You can leave her to go after Triss on Iorveth's path, but it seems to be implied that she's able to escape regardless of what happens in the chaos caused by the dragon.

DETHMOLD: He's executed on Iorveth's path. Killed in chapter 3 and he escapes if you go after Triss in chp 3.

First glance, it's a mixed bag of consequences, but the ratio is 7 non-killable main characters versus 11 killable main characters. In other words, the game has consequences for more than 50% of the main characters. Which is good.

At this point, is pretty hard for a sane person to argue that the game is linear and without any choices. But it still could argue that these choices are fake, because simply killing a character without impacting the world is indeed a fake choice. But this is the point where TW2 manages to do something special: the game doesn't just allow a player to kill some npc, but it actually takes in consideration those events and the story unfolds according to the new context. By doing this, it actually closes the ring of C&C.

Unfortunately, the implementation is not stellar, because of the following things:
1) A lot of choices are made in the later chapters, which means that they can be considered fake. The game simply doesn't last enough to see the impact of those choices. This sucks.
2) There is no clear delimitation between "flavour" choices and real choices. The designers did not really have some hard stance on this issue and this is reflected in the game.

At this point, I have to repeat myself, is pretty hard for any sane person to argue that the game doesn't offer any consequences to the player's actions. Valid complains can be made, but the game at least tries. Please give credit when it's deserved.

As related to Codex biased opinion, I think is normal. Pretty much, a lot of people from the Codex are just sick of corporate blabbering and blatant lies. And they are also desperate for real C&C in games or at least games that are challenging. Compared to the older title, it's true that maybe TW2 is not deserving all the latest praise, but when you compare it to DAO and the rest of the new shit, it's like seeing "the light at the end of a tunnel". It's not perfect, is not what it should have been, but it is definitely a step in the right direction. With some fixes, I definitely want more of this.

Regarding you, I read the entire thread and you sound more and more disappointing. BN at least tried to appeal to reason and my impression is that you have some wrong motives for bashing this game. But I don't want to discuss this.

@BN: Good review. The "evolved" part sounds like shit, even if it's a joke. Probably will become a local meme.

I didn't see if you mentioned the Little Sister quest, where failing it is actually more rewarding than solving it. It was a nice surprise.
Also the coin quest can be played in at least 4 ways, maybe because the devs wanted to be sure that any idiot can solved that quest. It was a little overkill.

ps. sorry for grammar mistakes

 

[Teepo]

Who is this brother none guy? He sounds like a bethesda shill.



Brother none is the man.

That guy who called BN an Oblivion fanboi was just... perfect. Perfect newfaggotry.

Hey guys. Oblivion sucks! Amirite?

 

[Drakron]

Well but this is the problem. you cannot design a game with infinite paths and so things are always on a rails since it will only respond to what been programmed to respond.

Its hard to justify having 50% of content being locked away on first playthrough, the more paths that are added the more content is locked away and today that is not cheap, that is why Dragon Age 2 is a example of "cost effective" C&C, you get some variant on the path that always lead to the same direction with a world that barely responds to your choices because the story forces those "world changing events" on the player.

I think the Witcher by being a story driven RPG always ends up being somewhat linear because there is no way around it and I dont think its fair to say late chapter C&C is fake, it depends on how the player view it ... Fallout ending sliders are that type of C&C and I did felt frustrated that siding with the elves in Witcher 1 ended up achieving nothing.

 

[Rivmusique]

Who is this brother none guy? He sounds like a bethesda shill.



Brother none is the man.

That guy who called BN an Oblivion fanboi was just... perfect. Perfect newfaggotry.

Hey guys. Oblivion sucks! Amirite?

Who was that?

 

[Teepo]

Some idiot named Rivmusique.

He's a huge fag.

Could you explain to me what means, fellow newfriend?

 

[Rivmusique]

Some idiot named Rivmusique.

He's a huge fag.

Could you explain to me what means, fellow newfriend?

Yeah sure no problem sir! It doesn't actually mean anything it is just a little birdie you can add to your posts to pretty them up to make it easy on the eyes of the reader! It is no big deal they confuse many people LAWL BUT dey is just eyecandi!

And I did not call this Brother None guy an Oblivion fanboi, I would never insult someone like that.

 

[Teepo]

Umad?

The butthurt is palpable from here. You did imply that he is a bethesda loving hack reviewer. Very well done there.

BUT OBVIOUSLY IT'S NOT THE SAME THING.

DAMN THESE SYNONYMS. THEY ARE SO CONFUSING.

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

* Repetitive, twitch-based, clunky and unbalanced combat is how "evolved" RPGs, like W2, should do it? Fuck yeah!

Is this still not clear? I was mocking the Hunted guy who was claiming RPGs always wanted to be action games, and I criticized the combat in the very same conclusion. Reading can't be that hard.

If you've mentioned that in the review, then okay, I must've missed that.
If you've had to explain it somewhere else, then good for you, but you can't expect the readers to search for your review DLCs.
Going by the latter, I'd thought the combat criticism was barely hitting it with a teddy bear, instead of a shovel you're planning to bury it with. I'm glad that's not the case.
Moving on, then.

You know, "reviewers" really should start adding "in my personal, completely subjective opinion" at the start of each such statement.

Why?

To make them sound more like they're talking out of their asses when they actually do, why else? Don't take it too personal, it's a general idea.

 

[Rivmusique]

Umad?

The butthurt is palpable from here. You did imply that he is a bethesda loving hack reviewer. Very well done there.

BUT OBVIOUSLY IT'S NOT THE SAME THING.

DAMN THESE SYNONYMS. THEY ARE SO CONFUSING.

I just meant to imply that the standards for quality cRPG are similar to that of Bethesda (i.e. Twitcher 2 2 mouse button hack'n'slash vs. Oblivion 1 mouse button hack'n'slash).

And I did address that I did not know who the internet superhero known as Brother None is (in fact I still don't). But I sure hope he did something very spectacular to earn this rabid white knight fan base.

 

[Kz3r0]

The Witcher is still a better game that Divinity ...

Its funny how Larian is getting a free pass were your FUCKING GENDER IS NOT EVEN SET IN STONE AND CAN BE CHANGED AT WILL.

The answer you are searching for is in your own post.

 

[Teepo]

"Of course it is, those gods of RPG development Bethesda haven't given you their offering yet Rolleyes"

LOL!!! BN is a shitty review hack!

How do you fail to grasp the implications of your own post?

I am sorry my post hurt your feelings.

Friends?

 

[Teepo]

Also, dude.

I've been on here for less then 2 days and I know who Brother None is. I don't even know what means.

Yes, anyone who points out YOUR stupidity is a rabid whiteknight fan of Brother None.

It totally has everything to do with Brother None, and nothing to do with your faggotry.

And who is this Vaultdweller faggot? Who does he think he is? Another internet superhero? HOW DARE HE ARGUE WITH BROTHER NONE.

Do you know what lurk more means dude?

 

[Rivmusique]

"Of course it is, those gods of RPG development Bethesda haven't given you their offering yet Rolleyes"

LOL!!! BN is a shitty review hack!

How do you fail to grasp the implications of your own post?

I am sorry my post hurt your feelings.

Friends?

Dude I am sorry for "insulting" (I already told you what I meant to imply) your idol. I really mean nothing by it, he may be a very cool dude. I just think his review is worth little more than most reviews, because they are all (assuming no GAEM JOURNALIZM corruption) just the writers opinions. No more no less. No need to worry though, my feelings are not hurt

Yes, anyone who points out YOUR stupidity is a rabid whiteknight fan of Brother None.

It totally has everything to do with Brother None, and nothing to do with your faggotry.

It makes me stupid not to know about this guy? I'm sure the most brilliant minds on earth all know who Brother None is indeed. Again though, I have nothing against this person I don't know, but it is quite amusing at how mad the fanboi's get over people not hearing about their messiah I personally think quite highly of, say, Greek Mythology, but I do not get butthurt when people don't get a random reference I throw out. In short, ease up big fella.

 

[Radisshu]

But isn't the Witcher 2 basically an action/adventure game with some stats? Arrghh