Codex Interview RPG Codex Interview: The Banner Saga, 2D Turn-Based Strategy RPG

[Infinitron]

Whoops, wrong link there. Fixed it.

Xerophyte and his Grandia II review

 

[Burning Bridges]

I mean seriously Chewbot why'd you even give these fuckfaces the time of day? They're not even worth the olive branch you extended (which got spat on and people wishing your funding would go down due to the superior might of the Codex

and/or you guys being homeless and destitute).​

The Codex made these guys. I reckon most of them are just butthurt about the Codex because at one point in the past they posted some moronic shit here that didn't qualify them for the cognitive elite.

I wouldn't read anything into what they say.

Well actually sometimes even they say the right things.

Hey, who the fuck is Xerophyte? http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...based-strategy-rpg.70392/page-15#post-2059422

Yeah, I don't think anything short of Tim Cain descending from the heavens in a chariot of fire, with a host of angels bearing the holy gifts of Arcanum 2 and Fallout 3 (the Bethesda games never happened!) could actually make the Codex happy at this point.

This is actually, quite correct. After I've seen these games were possible 10 years ago, I want only Arcanum 2, Jagged Alliance 3, Fallout 3, or new games of the same class. Without the moronic bullshit about angels and chariots of fire.

What I don't want are Apple Store games for the PC, with orchestra soundtracks, courtesy of the gullible people of the web.

I definitely wouldn't read anything into their rabid anti-console knee-jerking or read their forums in general.

[ Disclaimer: I was one of the original Codex site staff. Primary contributions: coming up with the name RPG Codex (runner up: RPG Elysium), producing a terribly written Grandia II review. I was young, ok? Don't judge me...

]

Who the hell is this futile prick who once founded RPGCodex and is speaking like that today (i.e. "wouldn't read RPGCodex forums in general")? This merits some further investigation. It's really sad how some people degrade when they get older. I wish I could go back in time and shove "his" RPGCodex into his anus, when it was still just his idea.

 

[Infinitron]

Xerophyte was a hero of the RPGCodex! But look at him now...justice knows every man's user ID.
He has committed a terrible sacrilege, and he will pay for it with his life! As will every man here who contributes to the decline.

Trolls and shitposters will be flogged. Spammers will be strangled. Deserters will be crucified!

 

[Burning Bridges]

Whoops, wrong link there. Fixed it.

Xerophyte and his Grandia II review

Console-styled RPGs aren't exactly common on the PC. Sure, we get the odd Final Fantasy port and the occasional native game like Anachronox or Septerra Core, but hardly the selection our gamepadedly gifted brethren with Playstations are blessed with. I, unlike most everyone else working on this site, find this to be far too little. I like these linear, childish creations a great deal and it was with no small amount of expectation that I bought the PC port of Grandia II, developed by the veterans of Game Arts and supposedly one of the best games for the Dreamcast and one of the best console RPGs in recent memory.

written in 2002 A.D. by the founder of RPGCodex
A man out of his time and a visionary mind if I ever saw one.
This is just too unbearably funny, that I find this out after contributing six years to this man's idea ..

 

[Infinitron]

We can only be thankful most of the old guard has fallen to attrition. Even DU seems to be slowly fading away as Saint Proverbius did, and the other day VD admitted being wrong to something! In the fullness of time this place may even become normal and rational aside from the ever expanding assortment of trannies, but that seems to be the case everywhere and they do no harm.

We even have some new RPGs to get excited about. What the heck is the world coming to?

IMO, DU showed he still has what it takes when he debated VD on the merits of AoD's dialogue system. It was very

EDIT: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...adence-march-update.70771/page-5#post-2031232

 

[Achilles]

It's sad to see how fast money corrupts people. Just a few weeks ago mr. Thomas gave an interview to this site and promoted thier game, chewbot (is he thomas?) answered questions and patiently explained the basic game concept. He even reacted quite calmly when he was hit with the standard codexian verbal abuse and I genuinely liked him as a result.

Now they have their money and already the first signs of arrogance are there for everyone to see. In just a few short days we've gone from "hey guys, let me explain our game concept which is influenced by this and that old-school RPG" to "that's the game we're making and if you don't like it you can fuck off". You may feel like you're on the top of the world now but remember that you got there through the good will of the people who gave you their money. That good will can be lost as easily as it was generated.

Chewbot, mr Thomas or anyone else from the developers who might be reading, I would like to know this: How much money will you spend on porting the game to XBL/PSN? If it is $50k or less, ie the amount of money that was gathered after you set the $650k goal, then I'm absolutely fine with it. If porting the game will cost much more than that and you will have to use a chunk of the money people gave you before that announcement, then you have misled us into giving you money under falce pretenses. Plain and simple.

 

[Burning Bridges]

We even have some new RPGs to get excited about. What the heck is the world coming to?

Yeah, about a 50% chance that either WL2 or SRR will be great RPGs, by around 2014. I already have a massive hard-on.

 

[Kz3r0]

They kind of did address this,

But I don't really feel like defending them.


EDIT: I see now that it had already been pointed out earlier.

He didn't, the point is that if you really want to do the game you jump at the possibility when is given, this further shows that the game is not the priority, the episodes formula was understandable when they weren't sure if the game would be funded, sticking to it now is just greed, of course they can do what they want, but not pretend of not being called out on it.

I'm sure you will all be happy to know that according to kicktraq ( http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/stoic/the-banner-saga/ ), with that big announcement they attracted far more backers and more money than in any single day before that, even with the Codex pulling out. They now have a core audience that is very contrary to what the Codex represents. It is for the best that we do not contribute to the pre-funding of this game now. Consider a purchase post-release if you must

Correlation is not causation, hurr durr, all the Kickstarter projects until now got a spike at the end, especially the most successful ones, and this is what makes announcing ports at the last minute such a sleazy move.

 

[Volrath]

Chewbot, if you're reading this.

On your original kickstarter page you mention the following:
-Porting to more devices. OUR FIRST RELEASE will be on PC and Mac, but funding would allow us to convert the game to iOS, Kindle fire, consoles like XBLA and PSN and etc...

This gives us the impression that the porting would have been an afterthought. Something that may or may not have happened after the game was released. What you're doing now, using these funds to develop all versions at the same time will inevitably lead to compromises. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt now and believe you when you say that this won't be the case, but you'll soon find out it will be.

If I was a malicious person I'd call this duplicitous marketing, something which BioWare has been known to do repeatedly in the past. Apple doesn't fall too far from the tree and all.

 

[Kz3r0]

If I was a malicious person I'd call this duplicitous marketing, something which BioWare has been known to do repeatedly in the past. Apple doesn't fall too far from the tree and all.

Kickstarter really tamed the Codex, come on guys, he has come here to promote his game appealing at all this site appreciate, now that he is awash in cash suddenly the Codex doesn't suit his tastes, how quaint.

 

[Johannes]

I'm sure you will all be happy to know that according to kicktraq ( http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/stoic/the-banner-saga/ ), with that big announcement they attracted far more backers and more money than in any single day before that, even with the Codex pulling out. They now have a core audience that is very contrary to what the Codex represents. It is for the best that we do not contribute to the pre-funding of this game now. Consider a purchase post-release if you must

Just about any KS project will experience a surge in money when the time's running out.




But about the console ports, I'm not really worried about the affect it'd have on gameplay, but just the cost and practicality of it. It takes money, but hopefully make more money in return. But why does that money to port it have to come from the Kickstarter, where what's being offered is "A copy of THE BANNER SAGA with all the Chapter 1 content, along with all the big upgrades we're planning to add to the multiplayer, distributed digitally on PC or Mac." there? PC and Mac versions, if someone who wants this shit on console donates, he won't even get that! Instead having to buy the game twice. So why not use all efforts on PC version now and then, possibly make a console port with the profits if you want? With the funds gotten now going towards the core game, even if that includes silly moneysinks like orchestra.


And is this town thing supposed to be a multiplayer thing, as somebody said? Or continuation of the nomad caravan thingy which was the game they originally pitched... It's just too damn vague. Sucks either way since I like the caravan traveling idea better, and hate persistent things like that in MP, rather play 1-off matches than grow some persistent city I have to level up before I can fight those tactical 1-off battles on even ground with people.


At first the project seemed interesting, hinting at types of gameplay that I enjoy, but as the campaign progressed I never saw any further details that'd made it more clear what kind of game it will exactly be. You have tactical battles, cool, that part is mostly covered I guess though remains to be seen how good it'll be of course. Then you travel around and different things can happen, ok, what does this mean in action? Is there an overland map to roam freely? Is it a linear path, but XP and monies gotten in missions can vary? Is it a linear path but with C&C to choose between junctions? Or something else? Who the fuck knows, really.
And now this city thing... WTF is it even, compared to the rest of the content.
All the PR seems to just be focused on superfluous stuff like music, instead of detailing the game. Which is important too, but the core game needs to be worth playing for me before those things matter at all. To me it shows something about the priorities of the devs too.

Still I hope the game'll be good, will be judged when it comes out. As of this time, with the info we've gotten, that's impossible to say.

 

[felipepepe]

If I was a malicious person I'd call this duplicitous marketing, something which BioWare has been known to do repeatedly in the past. Apple doesn't fall too far from the tree and all.

Kickstarter really tamed the Codex, come on guys, he has come here to promote his game appealing at all this site appreciate, now that he is awash in cash suddenly the Codex doesn't suit his tastes, how quaint.

It was a good, and perhaps needed, wake-up call, and those who disaproved were able to remove their pledge in time. More projects are bound to come in the following months, and definetly we will see more developers at the Codex showing their ideas, so it's good that we remain alert and learn from bad experiences.

That said, Banner Saga it's still going to happen, so if it turn out good we can just buy it. Only loses from all this was some pre-orders and (cool) posters, and a little bit of innocence on both sides.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Sure if Banner Saga turns out a great game which caters to much more than just the most primitive gameplay I will be the first to walk on my knees to Stoic's garage, apologize, and buy a copy.

But right now I am saying: you have 10h left to pull out of another side scrolling casual game with a bit of primitive dialog and turn based combat in between, and I would recommend every one to do it quickly, after what we've heard and seen. It won't even hurt the project very much, they got much more money than they need obviously, and start spending it for rubbish already.

 

[Stinger]

I'm sure you will all be happy to know that according to kicktraq ( http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/stoic/the-banner-saga/ ), with that big announcement they attracted far more backers and more money than in any single day before that, even with the Codex pulling out. They now have a core audience that is very contrary to what the Codex represents. It is for the best that we do not contribute to the pre-funding of this game now. Consider a purchase post-release if you must

It's more likely that it's because it's the final 24 hours of Banner Saga, so donations naturally go up by a lot regardless. But that said the donations in this case seem a bit slower. Wasteland got a lot of cash in its final 24 hours as did DFA. Banner Saga got $25 k, which isn't as strong, even proportionally as WL2 and DFA.

Either way, yeah it sounds like Banner Saga isn't turning out to be the game I'd hoped for.

Unless the codexers who maintained some level of donation say that it's actually pretty good after it comes out or all 3 episodes are out for <$5 on Steam, I'm not getting this.

EDIT: Oh fuck me why haven't I been reading this thread properly...I need to take a rest

 

[Ulminati]

Sure if Banner Saga turns out a great game which caters to much more than just the most primitive gameplay I will be the first to walk on my knees to Stoic's garage, apologize, and buy a copy.

But right now I am saying: you have 10h left to pull out of another side scrolling casual game with a bit of primitive dialog and turn based combat in between, and I would recommend every one to do it quickly, after what we've heard and seen. It won't even hurt the project very much, they got much more money than they need obviously, and start spending it for rubbish already.

I didn't pull out per se, but I did reduce my pledge to $10 since I can do without digital artbook, soundtrack etc. I also made the greivous error of posting my reasonings for doing so (in far more civilized turns of phrase than I would have used in our prestigious magazine). It's curious to see just how offended some people can get that I would have the audacity to remove money which clearly are not mine by right from a project just because I happen to dislike the direction it is taking. Internet's gonna internet I guess. Still, to be fair, an equal amount of posters were generally BRO about it. I think sans a few retarded trolls, me and rest of the backers have agreed to disagree. So a bit like the codex then, except without trannies.

 

[Infinitron]

Sure if Banner Saga turns out a great game which caters to much more than just the most primitive gameplay I will be the first to walk on my knees to Stoic's garage, apologize, and buy a copy.

But right now I am saying: you have 10h left to pull out of another side scrolling casual game with a bit of primitive dialog and turn based combat in between, and I would recommend every one to do it quickly, after what we've heard and seen. It won't even hurt the project very much, they got much more money than they need obviously, and start spending it for rubbish already.

I didn't pull out per se, but I did reduce my pledge to $10 since I can do without digital artbook, soundtrack etc. I also made the greivous error of posting my reasonings for doing so (in far more civilized turns of phrase than I would have used in our prestigious magazine). It's curious to see just how offended some people can get that I would have the audacity to remove money which clearly are not mine by right from a project just because I happen to dislike the direction it is taking. Internet's gonna internet I guess. Still, to be fair, an equal amount of posters were generally BRO about it. I think sans a few retarded trolls, me and rest of the backers have agreed to disagree. So a bit like the codex then, except without trannies.

Posting where? Kickstarter comments?

 

[Excommunicator]

Correlation is not causation, hurr durr, all the Kickstarter projects until now got a spike at the end, especially the most successful ones, and this is what makes announcing ports at the last minute such a sleazy move.

No, only Double Fine had a similar spike (one that is much larger at the end than at any other point). Wasteland did not. Either way, it is being made for console and with console in mind, that's a new audience. Doesn't matter about the graph correlation. What does matter is lack of reaction elsewhere, including in the money, the comments and other websites. It is not a good sign

 

[Ulminati]

Infinitron
Yeah. The posts to look out for are the ones by Ulminati (me), just jase yeah (troll #1), Michael Matzat (butthurt battalion), Peter stanton (Pretty BRO but prefers consolized emotional engagement), Inge Olaisen (Somewhat BRO but does not appreciate that catering to consoles will at some point become a concern when deciding whether or not to implement/simplify a feature), Erich Lichnoch (Pretty BRO and seems to have a solid grasp on what's going on) and Tobias Becker (possible KKKodex plant). I may have missed a few but the convo spans the last 3-4 pages.


I do think people were overly harsh against Chewbot in this thread, even by Codex standards. But meh. Codexers are mostly trolls with assburgers so I guess I shouldn't be surprised. A pity really 'cause there's still a bunch of stuff I'd love to ask/discuss with the devs to assuage my fears. But there are too few hours left on the kickstarter and no direct line to him to do so.

 

[Infinitron]

No, only Double Fine had a similar spike (one that is much larger at the end than at any other point). Wasteland did not.

 

[Burning Bridges]

I do think people were overly harsh against Chewbot in this thread, even by Codex standards.

Why? He got a lot of praise for coming here and for his great artwork. What else should he get praised for? In my opinion there is nothing else.

P.S. Sorry, I edited my post.

 

[Excommunicator]

Infinitron

(previous values, before the green line, filled in manually from Facebook, Forum and Kickstarter comments)<--- that is from the ruined kingdoms page.


http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/inxile/wasteland-2/
http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/stoic/the-banner-saga/
http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/66710809/double-fine-adventure/
There is possibly some data being cut off just from scanning over that. I can't confirm it though since there is nowhere else I know of keeping this data.

 

[Ulminati]

Burning Bridges
Well, the rage in the last couple of pages seemed disproportionate considering they did mention console ports from the start, albeit not as a major feature. The games they referenced for inspiration were originally console games etc. I'm not saying that all the harsh words following the last update were unwarranted, just disproportionate to the amount of butthurt that should reasonably have been generated.

 

[Crooked Bee]

Gosh, all this ado about a console port... of a Final Fantasy Tactics/Shining Force-inspired game?

Now this game might not turn out to be as complex as FFT, but what the hell. This is as retarded as it gets.

 

[Infinitron]

Infinitron

(previous values, before the green line, filled in manually from Facebook, Forum and Kickstarter comments)<--- that is from the ruined kingdoms page.


http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/inxile/wasteland-2/
http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/stoic/the-banner-saga/
http://www.kicktraq.com/projects/66710809/double-fine-adventure/

I stand corrected.

EDIT: Although the fact that the Double Fine graph starts from Feb 24th inflates the relative magnitude of its final spike.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Ya'll got took in by pretty pictures and ignored that this had the stink of casual all over it from the very start.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Burning Bridges
Well, the rage in the last couple of pages seemed disproportionate considering they did mention console ports from the start, albeit not as a major feature. The games they referenced for inspiration were originally console games etc. I'm not saying that all the harsh words following the last update were unwarranted, just disproportionate to the amount of butthurt that should reasonably have been generated.

You surely have a point but
1. it's not butthurt at all - just the post mortem of a project that looked promising 4 weeks ago
2. it's not disproportionate to the amount of confusion about what Banner Saga is and the lack of time to pull out