Revisiting VtM: Bloodlines

[Excidium II]

I don't find it so bad. It's an infant third party FPS engine so naturally guns will feel better than 3rd person melee brawling.

 

[DeepOcean]

It is Tremere with Bloodboil and lots of guns for me on Bloodlines, melee Brujah is overpowered but boring as fuck.

 

[Excidium II]

I enjoy the practical approach of solving every problem with my fists.

 

[Gondolin]

Yo.

32 ounces of Kobe beef. Yeah!

 

[Lhynn]

Played it 3 times as a ventrue, all 3 times were fucking amazing, watching as the enemy is helpless to do anything to defend themselves, unable to even scratch me with their best efforts, while i feed of them like they were merely packs of blood waiting to sate my thirst.
Too bad the game fucks you over if you are even a bit ambitious.

 

[Excidium II]

Yeah, the game needs a 4th ending.

 

[Xor]

Yeah, the game needs a 4th ending.

There are five. Side with the Anarchs, side with the Camerilla, side with the tentacle monster, side with LaCroix, or just stay independent. Six if you count choosing to opening the sarcophagus on any of the paths as an ending.

 

[Excidium II]

Right I forgot kuei jin ending. Was saving that for Malk, because who else would side with them?

What's this independent ending?

 

[Zero Credibility]

I always thought the Camarilla ending is a nice ending for ambitious up-and-comer neonate. You probably get a position in the new court under a reasonable and grateful prince, are shown as a neonate role model for your sect, if you played 100% of the game and didn't go out of your way to piss people off you also have a shitload of contacts and favours among the movers in the city, what's not too like? Trying to get more is just greedy, and quite reasonably blows up in your face. You are powerful, sure, but you are still a very young monsters among elders with much more experience at beating down younger ambitious pricks like yourself.

 

[Lhynn]

What's this independent ending?

You give the middle finger to nines and go do your own thing. Its what i did, as being a camarilla lap dog wasnt my idea of ambition and the anarchs were a bunch of retards..

 

[Excidium II]

I always thought the Camarilla ending is a nice ending for ambitious up-and-comer neonate. You probably get a position in the new court under a reasonable and grateful prince, are shown as a neonate role model for your sect, if you played 100% of the game and didn't go out of your way to piss people off you also have a shitload of contacts and favours among the movers in the city, what's not too like? Trying to get more is just greedy, and quite reasonably blows up in your face. You are powerful, sure, but you are still a very young monsters among elders with much more experience at beating down younger ambitious pricks like yourself.

But at the rate your powers grow, in another week you can just take over the domain by yourself.

Also with Strauss being the most influential force, LA doesn't sound like a good place to be in any case.

 

[Lhynn]

But at the rate your powers grow, in another week you can just take over the domain by yourself.

Eh, the exp you get is increased to be able to have a build beyond character creation. Exp rates at PnP are much much lower (too low for my taste tbh).

 

[Excidium II]

Would be low in a from zero to hero game, but you already start very competent.

 

[grotsnik]

One area where the writing in Bloodlines actually fails is in characterizing the player character. You don't really get a sense of who the person you're playing was before they became a vampire, and unless you're playing a malkavian the dialog options don't really show much personality.

Yeah, I think it's mostly just the result of a very imposing NPC cast and a very limited voiceover, which makes a lot of the non-skill dialogue linear. So more often than not, the PC's dialogue lines just feel like they're lamely prompting the next paragraph from the NPC, or making a random quip which is usually ignored (there's that 'movie script' quest with V where she talks about a film idea that features a secret society of evil beings, and you're given one sincere answer and three lame cracks about how that must be a reference to the gaming industry / the Bush administration / Care Bears. They're all the same joke!)

Don't get me wrong; I think the light touch of the writing and relatively little angst in Bloodlines is really welcome. But at its worst, it can make the PC come across as a bit of a snickering ass.

There's a particular line I hate right at the start, about 10 minutes after you've been transformed into an undead monster, witnessed a gruesome death, just escaped a similar fate, and drank human blood for the first time. 'Great! When do I get to pick my cape? Can I choose the colour?' It's so goofy that I can't imagine a real human being ever saying it, it's totally deaf to the context of the conversation, and it's only 1 of 2 options. Terrible.

But I'm a big fan of that one sequence in Hollywood, with an old friend who comes running out to plead with you to come home. You've never met with her before, it's a very short scene - but it works. For the first time in the game, you actually get the sense of a real shift from who you were (especially if you then use your developed vampiric powers to drive her away), and a sense of loss and melancholy in what you've become. It's a really solid emotional moment, without dragging things out or trying too hard.

 

[Lhynn]

Putting points into thinggies and watching your character progress is fun.

 

[Zero Credibility]

But at the rate your powers grow, in another week you can just take over the domain by yourself.

Also with Strauss being the most influential force, LA doesn't sound like a good place to be in any case.

Theories over how a fresh neonate can get so strong so fast aside (Cain, low-gen sire, diablerie, someone feeding you powerful blood, whatever), this is just standard crpg stuff. I wouldn't say that it means you can keep it up indefinitely. Also, what do you have against Strauss? As vamp elders go he is a really good guy. Reasonable and civil, treats you with respect, gives you compensation for stuff he asks from you instead of just pushing you around, never lies to you (that you notice anyway). What more can you ask for in a elder? So he's a blood warlock, nobody's perfect.

 

[Zero Credibility]

But I'm a big fan of that one sequence in Hollywood, with an old friend who comes running out to plead with you to come home. You've never met with her before, it's a very short scene - but it works. For the first time in the game, you actually get the sense of a real shift from who you were (especially if you then use your developed vampiric powers to drive her away), and a sense of loss and melancholy in what you've become. It's a really solid emotional moment, without dragging things out or trying too hard.

Not a fan of angst, but yeah, that's a good scene.

 

[Excidium II]

But at the rate your powers grow, in another week you can just take over the domain by yourself.

Also with Strauss being the most influential force, LA doesn't sound like a good place to be in any case.

Theories over how a fresh neonate can get so strong so fast aside (Cain, low-gen sire, diablerie, someone feeding you powerful blood, whatever), this is just standard crpg stuff. I wouldn't say that it means you can keep it up indefinitely. Also, what do you have against Strauss? As vamp elders go he is a really good guy. Reasonable and civil, treats you with respect, gives you compensation for stuff he asks from you instead of just pushing you around, never lies to you (that you notice anyway). What more can you ask for in a elder? So he's a blood warlock, nobody's perfect.

Seeming reasonable and respectful only makes him more suspicious to me.

Putting points into thinggies and watching your character progress is fun.

Sure but it loses the value if it happens too frequently, and it messes with the feel of the game.

 

[Xor]

What's this independent ending?

In the taxi ride you can tell the driver that you don't want to side with anyone. You go through the temple and LaCroix's tower just like with the Anarch and Camerilla endings, but there's a small scene at the end where the Anarchs want you to go with them and you tell them to go fuck themselves and walk away into the sunset.

But I'm a big fan of that one sequence in Hollywood, with an old friend who comes running out to plead with you to come home. You've never met with her before, it's a very short scene - but it works. For the first time in the game, you actually get the sense of a real shift from who you were (especially if you then use your developed vampiric powers to drive her away), and a sense of loss and melancholy in what you've become. It's a really solid emotional moment, without dragging things out or trying too hard.

Not a fan of angst, but yeah, that's a good scene.

Yeah, I had forgotten about that bit when I was thinking about player dialog. It's an excellent scene.

 

[Excidium II]

What's this independent ending?

In the taxi ride you can tell the driver that you don't want to side with anyone. You go through the temple and LaCroix's tower just like with the Anarch and Camerilla endings, but there's a small scene at the end where the Anarchs want you to go with them and you tell them to go fuck themselves and walk away into the sunset.

Dang that sounds like the best ending. I guess I'll get that one with the Gangrel.

 

[Lhynn]

Sure but it loses the value if it happens too frequently, and it messes with the feel of the game.

Not on a game of this length it doesnt. Sides, they dont have the time to show all the stories and experiences it would take from taking on junkies to taking on the most powerful vampires on a big city.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Side with the tentacle monster ending is ridiculously stupid, never considered it a legit choice.

You are powerful, sure, but you are still a very young monsters among elders with much more experience at beating down younger ambitious pricks like yourself.

Except that the PC inexplicably gets so powerful over the course of few weeks that he can single-handedly clean out whole groups of vampires and take on even vampire elders, by the end of the game PC is easily one of the most powerful kindred in the city who prevailed over beings that should normally have little trouble beating a few weeks old fledgling to a pulp. It's one of the things the game acknowledges (when most RPGs actually don't, zero to hero progress is just considered a staple of the genre) but doesn't provide an actual answer as to why you grow so much in power over such a short period, it's left to the player's imagination (similar to the whole Elizabeth Dane thing).

 

[Popiel]

Except that the PC inexplicably gets so powerful over the course of few weeks that he can single-handedly clean out whole groups of vampires and take on even vampire elders, by the end of the game PC is easily one of the most powerful kindred in the city who prevailed over beings that should normally have little trouble beating a few weeks old fledgling to a pulp. It's one of the things the game acknowledges (when most RPGs actually don't, zero to hero progress is just considered a staple of the genre) but doesn't provide an actual answer as to why you grow so much in power over such a short period, it's left to the player's imagination (similar to the whole Elizabeth Dane thing).

Game most directly address this issue when PC talks with Andrei (Tzimisce fleshcrafter from Hollywood). Andrei mentions that we, as PC, cannot tell how powerful our blood truly is, and that it's in the end wasted on us. I always interpreted facts in the game as hints towards our sire being much lower generation than is usually thought, perhaps 6th or even 5th.

 

[Roguey]

Yeah, Andrei outright states your blood smells different the second time around and the Prince's failed attempt to dominate you in the final scene shocks him.

 

[Excidium II]

That's a whole damn lot of larpin'

I find it easier to accept the devs just didn't think much. Though this much conspiracy is fitting.