Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Game of the Year Edition

[Desiderius]

Persuasion 3 is ranks

its not actually. only persuasion 2 is based on ranks.

Lol, they think sneaking in brokenness is good marketing (although prob an oversight). They might even be right given all the MMOers. Worse game tho.

EDIT: looks like they’re counting on the Fort Save. Eats a full action?

 

[Delterius]

Persuasion 3 is ranks

its not actually. only persuasion 2 is based on ranks.

Lol, they think sneaking in brokenness is good marketing (although prob an oversight). They might even be right given all the MMOers. Worse game tho.

EDIT: looks like they’re counting on the Fort Save. Eats a full action?

Fort save can't compete because the one doing the coup de grace is the enemy themselves. Their attack and strength bonuses likely supercede their saves by far. And it should only get worse on unfair.

 

[Daidre]

lol, they think sneaking in brokenness is good marketing (although prob an oversight).

Probably not an oversight. It was working on ranks until 1.2 and they have actually patched in the current behavior - scaling from your skill.

• Persuasion 3 rank for Mythic Trickster didn’t work correctly – fixed;

Would be weird on any other Mythic but building around sneaked in brokenness is like Trickster's main theme.

 

[Delterius]

The funny thing is that since persuasion 2 has a low DC what this means is that only certain enemies end up being too scared to kill themselves.

 

[Desiderius]

Persuasion 3 is ranks

its not actually. only persuasion 2 is based on ranks.

Lol, they think sneaking in brokenness is good marketing (although prob an oversight). They might even be right given all the MMOers. Worse game tho.

EDIT: looks like they’re counting on the Fort Save. Eats a full action?

Fort save can't compete because the one doing the coup de grace is the enemy themselves. Their attack and strength bonuses likely supercede their saves by far. And it should only get worse on unfair.

Looks like he’s only what 25% chance there? It’s a nice design since they’re in control of both parameters. I’d think save would go up too for Unfair?

Big opportunity cost to get too since Persuasion 2 is ranks (not great) and have to forgo the other game-breaking Greater Tricks.

 

[The Jester]

Where's the post game DLC you fucking faggowls?

 

[LabRat]

I've been playing this low lvl DLC, and I'm about to commit heresy:

It sort-of reminds me of Dark Souls. The struggle to bring light through darkness. Using the environment to kill undesirables. Exploration is loops on the map. NPCs that can be swayed a bit with positivity and music?

So far it's... charming. I haven't beaten it yet, but... it may look like something you wanna buy. I'm almost dreading the moment I will see Paizo's hand in it. Hopefully they don't care enough to with DLCs.

DLC2 is supposed to be the prologue to the core game.

 

[Humbaba]

Where's the post game DLC you fucking faggowls?

In season pass 2, if they're smart.

 

[Grotesque]

Can someone answer me this.

When the game came out, I wanted to play the armoured battlemage subclass but its abilities/mechanics were bugged.
Waited for several patches but the class was still not fixed.

Is this class fixed?

 

[razvedchiki]

whats so intriguing of that class?

 

[Sarathiour]

The base magus class is not even correctly working at this point, and you want to play the worst subclass of the archetype, and a contender for the worst archetype of all class ?

 

[Desiderius]

It's not the worst. There is no worst, they all have a niche.

Two-handers were the most powerful melee class in P:K (focusing on Standard Actions and AoOs so don't need to land iteratives/more mobile) and you add on Spellsrike to that you'll pack a massive wallop. Again all about the metamagic for Magi.

Keen Fauchard doubling up Maximized, Empowered, Bolstered Touch spells.

 

[Pathfinder: Kingmaker]

Is this game good?

 

[Grotesque]

whats so intriguing of that class?

nothing in particular but I promised to myself not to touch this game ever again until this class is fixed

 

[Delterius]

Is this game good?

it depends. how much are you willing to pay for a name change.

 

[Desiderius]

whats so intriguing of that class?

nothing in particular but I promised to myself not to touch this game ever again until this class is fixed

I’ll test tonight and see where it’s at.

 

[Sarathiour]

It's not the worst. There is no worst, they all have a niche

You can have a niche roll and still be comparatively worst.

Trading offense for defense is rarely a good thing in pathfinder rule. Armored BM is already not a very good archetype in PnP, the main appeal is to be an armored arcane caster relatively early on, which have is niche on low point buy character who are not dex based.
Wrath is definitely not the definition of a "low-level, low buy point" campaign.

Maximized, Empowered, Bolstered Touch spells.

Sure would be nice IF WE COULD ACTUALLY DO IT.

meta on touch spell is still not possible, you have to rely on mod and pray for nothing to broke on patch update.

 

[Desiderius]

Those are two different issues.

Not working doesn’t equal worst class, not working means Owlcat is poorly run.

There is no worst class because it’s a multi-variate game. Magi are all about positioning and earlier access to Med/Heavy Armor with the spells/abilities to alleviate the downsides (Expeditious Retreat - a relatively rare ability for Heavy classes - and Armor Training to keep Stealth viable/use full DEX bonus) opens up positions not available to other Magi. Would be more of an advantage if you hit the good Heavies earlier I’ll admit, but it does let you use Breastplate and Ram Armor on time.

It is absolutely not true that offense beats defense full stop. By far the biggest challenge I ran into on Unfair was avoiding the attax of regular mobs I took for granted on lower difficulties. Battlemage gets you there by itself on Hard in a way other Magi don’t.

Dips are expensive. Mythics are expensive. DEX-based is expensive. Battlemage doesn’t have to mess with any of that.

The subtle thing it does is forces you to play the class in a way that few have even tried (Spellstrike w/ no Spell Combat, Meta Arcana over Wep Enchant) by taking away the popular options.

Arrowsong Minstrel in CotW did this to me and it turned out to be pretty good. A lot of Magi turns end up being Move + Spellstrike (with -2 Spell Combat malus unless you’re micro-ing) anyway. Battlemage does it with a 2-hander and no malus.

 

[Cryomancer]

Is this game good?

Worse than PF:KM but better than any 5E game aka Solasta/BG3.

 

[Desiderius]

KotC2 has better AI (than anything).

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Where's the post game DLC you fucking faggowls?

In season pass 2, if they're smart.

What do you guys even want from post game DLC? Game is already loaded with progression and DLC 1 shows that it become overly unfun to play another 12 hours without any level progression. If you really just want to play with high level character you can go with DLC 1 altho DLC 1 is kinda... unfun to say the least.

Or you mean some sort of sequel where you start with other characters from low level?

 

[Desiderius]

Findings on Armored Battlemage:

(1) Armor Training does nothing lol. Just unbelievable. Mostly redundant with Effortless Armor anyway.

(2) You can Maximize and Empower Force Punch (your main spell for much of the game), but can't Bolster it.

(3) You can't meta Shocking Grasp at all (!). That much utter incompetence shouldn't be possible.

(4) Late game go to Vampiric Touch (it goes up to 10d6) also can't be meta'ed

(5) I used a Trickster save to retrain and found interesting interaction: Stealth 3 gives you Spell Resistance = Stealth -10, AB can enchant it's armor with Greater Shadow (+15 Stealth), Armor Training means Heavy + Stealth is fine. So that's a thing.

(6) Trickster also lets you get Falchion to 11-20 crit range* so you can double up your touch spells pretty consistently. Shield of Dawn + Vampiric Shadow Shield + Meta'ed up, critted Vampiric Touch would be cool play pattern. Not sure if insta-death on Touch of Mercy would proc before the spell or after.

(7) Armor enchant can give you Fortification up to 75% which is a nice, rare, ability to have.

(8) You get Medium Armor and extra +4 Concentration right away, which makes AB much less painful at early levels compared to other Magi, in addition to not having the -2 malus from Spell Combat. Shield spell is also a nice perk for a two-hander, as is of course Mirror Image.

* - Force Punch and Vampiric are no save on the damage so don't need Spell Focus and you're only taking one whack a round so don't really need Shatter (no iteratives) so have room for some extra Feats.

 

[Daidre]

It is absolutely not true that offense beats defense full stop. By far the biggest challenge I ran into on Unfair was avoiding the attax of regular mobs I took for granted on lower difficulties. Battlemage gets you there by itself on Hard in a way other Magi don’t.

Quite opposite to my Unfair experience - I've found any attempts of stacking defense on anyone but designed melee units, in my case MC pure Oracle and couple of pets, absolutely, utterly worthless. You'd just cripple combat effectivity of your backline archers/mages if you'd try to get their AC high enough to soak some hits from high-AB mobs on Unfair. And even Oracle with the dog was mostly ignoring AC (never went higher that ~50-55) and had tanked 4/5 of the game with the mix of Displacement + Mirror Image + Seamantle + everything else.

From my experience, at least one character with godly 30+ initiative to provide surprise round is much more useful, since most hard fights are done before they even start properly, with generous application of archery, Illusion CC/Wierd and Hellfire Rays. Not the case in early chapters, but those are really easy to overlevel with some soloing.

 

[Desiderius]

It is absolutely not true that offense beats defense full stop. By far the biggest challenge I ran into on Unfair was avoiding the attax of regular mobs I took for granted on lower difficulties. Battlemage gets you there by itself on Hard in a way other Magi don’t.

Quite opposite to my Unfair experience - I've found any attempts of stacking defense on anyone but designed melee units, in my case MC pure Oracle and couple of pets, absolutely, utterly worthless. You'd just cripple combat effectivity of your backline archers/mages if you'd try to get their AC high enough to soak some hits from high-AB mobs on Unfair. And even Oracle with the dog was mostly ignoring AC (never went higher that ~50-55) and had tanked 4/5 of the game with the mix of Displacement + Mirror Image + Seamantle + everything else.

From my experience, at least one character with godly 30+ initiative to provide surprise round is much more useful, since most hard fights are done before they even start properly, with generous application of archery, Illusion CC/Wierd and Hellfire Rays. Not the case in early chapters, but those are really easy to overlevel with some soloing.

Well I do zergs so everyone gets surprise and I stack initiative on everybody but I am talking about melee for the AC.

I generally don't tank bosses but get enough to handle (avoid hits outside nat 20s) everyone else on melee. That's three or four characters and a pet - enough to set up regular crit chains and control the flow of battle/trigger leading strikes, etc...

A fight like Nulk you can get him down fast but the Ghoul Rogues can one shot you during that first round. You can get enough AC to avoid that but it takes some planning and certain group compositions. For Hard you can get there just by playing well and choosing melee classes that have the tools to handle themselves. Armored Battlemage does that a lot better than other Magi without burning dips, mythics, or messing around with DEX-based.

Eventually I get there with the backline too thanks to the high level spells but that's not a high priority.

 

[Daidre]

A fight like Nulk you can get him down fast but the Ghoul Rogues can one shot you during that first round. You can get enough AC to avoid that but it takes some planning and certain group compositions.

I usually do Nulk in RTwP and I start the fight with some summons from Azata's Tankard + Animate Dead and send one of the pets in that direction too. Ghouls are easily distracted with extra bodies nearby so everyone else could ignore them and rush to Nulk and beat him in the face. Biggest problem here imho is having Freedom of Movement, at least from the scrolls, on all characters I need functional for this fight.

Bunch of Azatas with Mirror Images from the tankard are so busted they could give you at least 2-3 rounds even against nastiest enemies in the game and Angels/Demons from summoning book in the Lich dungeon also nothing to sneeze at.