Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Lacrymas]

No, don't add more classes. Make the base game as good as possible while fleshing out all the mythic paths. Nobody wants an undercooked mythic path, while I'm sure some of them are going to be. Then add all other extraneous shit in a DLC. This is an RPG after all, and the RPG part should have most of the attention. I suspect Angel and Gold Dragon being essentially the same path, maybe with reskinned NPCs, for example. Same with Trickster and Azata. If they really undercook it, maybe Lich and Demon too. Hell, let's add Swarm to the mix. So from 8 paths, we are down to 4: Evil (Swarm, Demon, Lich), Chaotic (Azata, Trickster), Good (Angel, Gold Dragon), and Lawful (Aeon). You also have legendary mortal for the neutral path, which doesn't require even reskins.

Now that I think about it, there's no way they are going to satisfactorily pull this off with amount of bullshit they want to add. Even if they do the bare minimum for the crusade and HoMM system, it's still going to take concentration and programming time away from the actual damn game.

 

[Desiderius]

There's a tiny little button in P:K/WotR under the portraits in character creation. Press that and you can figure things out from there.

 

[Cryomancer]

Please OwlCat. Don't nerf the succubus companion stats.

One thing that i particularly like about kingmaker is that they din't butchered anything. They made sneak attack far better than on P&P. They made kineticist better than P&P due the fact that fly can't ignore Deadly Earth and AI is poor, they made animal companions stronger than on P&P, made spells like animate dead create 4~6 CR 7 skeletons without requiring corpses, and so on. NWN1/2 in other hands destroyed so many things on their adaptation. Warlocks that has invocations that lasts nothing and doesn't scale, pale masters that doesn't get caster level and can only have a single summon that die in one round, arcane archers that can only imbue fire(the most resisted element), not cold or electricity, I prefer a more P&P experience, but between overpowering suff and underpowering stuff that only cause frustration, i rather having the OP stuff.

Gold Dragon being essentially the same path, maybe with reskinned NPCs, for example. Same with Trickster and Azata

Trickster = Chaotic Neutral.
Azata = Chaotic Good.

Golden Dragon and Angels are completely different things despite both being lawful good.

, maybe Lich and Demon too

Liches are neutral/lawful evil. Demons chaotic evil. And joining in demons in a game about demon invasion will gonna be extremely different than just being a dickless skeleton.

 

[Efe]

you should look at how pink shills for monks and learn from him a bit.
if you repeat "warlock - nerfed in nwn - black tendrils felt cold ohhh" like this you wont get any traction.

 

[Cryomancer]

you should look at how pink shills for monks and learn from him a bit.

But he is right. Monks are also extremely nerfed and should be powerful.

PS : I din't mentioned only WLKs. I mentioned a lot of different classes, including arcane archers

 

[Desiderius]

Monks nerfed in P:K?

What are you smokin’?

 

[Cryomancer]

Monks nerfed in P:K?

Not on kingmaker, but in other games. I was praising that Owlcat doesn't butcher classes and i love the lack of Sawyerism on their games

 

[jf8350143]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

 

[Haba]

Monks nerfed in P:K?

Not on kingmaker, but in other games. I was praising that Owlcat doesn't butcher classes and i love the lack of Sawyerism on their games

Single player games need balance like women needs suffrage.

 

[Nm6k]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

It's not in yet

 

[Lacrymas]

Trickster = Chaotic Neutral.
Azata = Chaotic Good.

Golden Dragon and Angels are completely different things despite both being lawful good.

, maybe Lich and Demon too

Liches are neutral/lawful evil. Demons chaotic evil. And joining in demons in a game about demon invasion will gonna be extremely different than just being a dickless skeleton.

Yeap, like I said in the next sentence, Azata and Trickster are now bundled in the chaotic path, all the evil ones in the evil path, and Angel and Dragon in the good path. We can go a step further and combine all the good ones into a good path, all the neutrals incl. legendary mortal into neutral, and the evils into evil. Enjoy your HoMM battles and crusade system. Even without those it was a tall order to create 8 (9) distinct paths.

 

[guestposting]

Trickster = Chaotic Neutral.
Azata = Chaotic Good.

Golden Dragon and Angels are completely different things despite both being lawful good.

, maybe Lich and Demon too

Liches are neutral/lawful evil. Demons chaotic evil. And joining in demons in a game about demon invasion will gonna be extremely different than just being a dickless skeleton.

Yeap, like I said in the next sentence, Azata and Trickster are now bundled in the chaotic path, all the evil ones in the evil path, and Angel and Dragon in the good path. We can go a step further and combine all the good ones into a good path, all the neutrals incl. legendary mortal into neutral, and the evils into evil. Enjoy your HoMM battles and crusade system. Even without those it was a tall order to create 8 (9) distinct paths.

This is not how it works in the alpha. The paths aren’t just gated by your alignment. You can’t become an Azata just by making chaotic choices, you have to do the Azata side quest for the church of Desna. You can’t become a lich just by being evil, you have to find a magic artifact and be taught the secrets of undeath. Pretty sure Aeon requires you to take a specific approach to the first big choice in the main quest. Trickster seems to require that you actually trick at least one particular group of people.

On the alpha forum they’re saying Golden Dragon, Swarm-that-walks and possibly Legend are all advanced mythic classes that you can potentially switch to later.

Like Kingmaker, the big plot points are the same regardless of your alignment, but the smaller stuff looks like it will vary a lot depending on which mythic path you take.

 

[Lacrymas]

You can certainly choose what path to go down on and have different prerequisites, but the narrative beats let's say will be the same, and they will be separated into evil, neutral, and good. You'll just get reskins and new spells/abilities depending on what specific creature you've chosen. 3 distinct narrative paths is still more than most RPGs. Or maybe we won't even get that and everything will be a reskin while following essentially the same story with no alterations. Who knows. It was never really all that clear what the mythic paths will change anyway.

 

[NJClaw]

You can certainly choose what path to go down on and have different prerequisites, but the narrative beats let's say will be the same, and they will be separated into evil, neutral, and good. You'll just get reskins and new spells/abilities depending on what specific creature you've chosen. 3 distinct narrative paths is still more than most RPGs. Or maybe we won't even get that and everything will be a reskin. Who knows. It was never really all that clear what the mythic paths will change anyway.

Has Owlcat ever made a statement about distinct narrative paths? Because I took for granted from the first moment that we were going to get only minor reskins.

 

[Lacrymas]

Yeah, that's what I mean. I was under the false impression it was going to be more than reskins for some reason, but now that I think about it they never said what exactly will change story-wise. In that context, HoMM-style battles and crusade system make more sense because reskins and adding abilities doesn't take as much time as whole different story beats. I still prefer not to add them until a DLC, though.

 

[ChildInTime]

Shit's getting wild in that thread on /vg/, if you don't want some late game spoilers I suggest not to look. There is a lot of things Owlcat forgot to cut from those alpha files, it seems.

 

[guestposting]

Yeah, that's what I mean. I was under the false impression it was going to be more than reskins for some reason, but now that I think about it they never said what exactly will change story-wise.

I don’t know, the main story beats will be mostly the same because they’re adapting a fairly linear adventure path, but you have some major choices in the first two chapters that did not exist in the pen & paper version. Huge, world altering choices.

 

[Lacrymas]

Huge, world altering choices.

Which is always a bad move. Maybe start locally?

 

[Ontopoly]

I feel like expecting anything more than some different ending slides, a side quest line, different units for the homm clone, new abilities,and some unique dialogue options/references is kind of ridiculous. A quest about stopping a demon invasion isn't going to suddenly turn into Pathfinder: lich adventures. The things I listed are what I'm expecting and unless those aren't I'm going to be very happy with them.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

Not in Alpha yet.

And there is really no strict mechanical alignment restriction, from the previous interviews. It is just to become one of the mythic path (and fully convert to it) you would require to do certain actions that will change your alignment towards one axis or another.

 

[ChildInTime]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

Seriously don't read if you don't want to spoil yourself.

Spoiler

Swarm is so fucking evil, that even a demon lord looks at you in disgust.

>Your voice rings like the wings of a myriad of insects. The world breaks into pieces, reflected in the countless facets of countless eyes. Your body trembles, ready to decay into many small bodies, but still retains its shape - for the time being. The goddess and demon lord are looking at you - so different, but now they look at you with the same thing: disgust with a touch of horror. {/ N} "

>Iomedae: "You took from the Abyss the gift of power - but surpassed your donors in wickedness! Listen to me, disgusting creature. You have started on the path that will bring Golarion to disaster, uncountable, like the larvae that swarm in your black heart. I would destroy you right now - but for the time being I will hold my hand so as not to make it worse. Know: when this crusade is over, a new one will follow. You will crush the hordes of demons-but you will not stand against the angels!"

>Sosiel: "You're like a living insult to Shelyn, embodied ugliness. Evil that even demons despise. I no longer want to have anything to do with you! \ ""

>Wolfjif turns pale. {/ N} \" Commander? Hey commander! It's me! And ... and don’t lay eggs in me."

>Greybor retains an unflappable voice, but a grimace of disgust appears on a whitened face. {/ N} \" Ahem ... It was necessary to include the right to termination in the contract if the tenant turned into a damned monster \ "."

 

[Cyberarmy]

I'm liking the alpha so far, it's quite the bug hunt (I can't even log on their forums :D ) but that was expeceted.
Large city map is fresh air for me after all those wilderness in Kingmaker. And both NPCs and party members seem much more colourful.
As usual wasted 2 hours on character creation and somehow created exact character like that gnome deathknight (only as a dwarf)

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

Seriously don't read if you don't want to spoil yourself.

Spoiler

Swarm is so fucking evil, that even a demon lord looks at you in disgust.

>Your voice rings like the wings of a myriad of insects. The world breaks into pieces, reflected in the countless facets of countless eyes. Your body trembles, ready to decay into many small bodies, but still retains its shape - for the time being. The goddess and demon lord are looking at you - so different, but now they look at you with the same thing: disgust with a touch of horror. {/ N} "

>Iomedae: "You took from the Abyss the gift of power - but surpassed your donors in wickedness! Listen to me, disgusting creature. You have started on the path that will bring Golarion to disaster, uncountable, like the larvae that swarm in your black heart. I would destroy you right now - but for the time being I will hold my hand so as not to make it worse. Know: when this crusade is over, a new one will follow. You will crush the hordes of demons-but you will not stand against the angels!"

>Sosiel: "You're like a living insult to Shelyn, embodied ugliness. Evil that even demons despise. I no longer want to have anything to do with you! \ ""

>Wolfjif turns pale. {/ N} \" Commander? Hey commander! It's me! And ... and don’t lay eggs in me."

>Greybor retains an unflappable voice, but a grimace of disgust appears on a whitened face. {/ N} \" Ahem ... It was necessary to include the right to termination in the contract if the tenant turned into a damned monster \ "."

Spoiler

Huh I honestly was expecting that Swarm will be more "neutral" than Demon or Lich. The KS description seems to make it that the Swarm will be revenge(?) based from the "Golarion failed you". It seems that it might be the evilest instead.

 

[ChildInTime]

Did the swarm path has any alignment restriction?

Or is it not in the alpha yet?

Seriously don't read if you don't want to spoil yourself.

Spoiler

Swarm is so fucking evil, that even a demon lord looks at you in disgust.

>Your voice rings like the wings of a myriad of insects. The world breaks into pieces, reflected in the countless facets of countless eyes. Your body trembles, ready to decay into many small bodies, but still retains its shape - for the time being. The goddess and demon lord are looking at you - so different, but now they look at you with the same thing: disgust with a touch of horror. {/ N} "

>Iomedae: "You took from the Abyss the gift of power - but surpassed your donors in wickedness! Listen to me, disgusting creature. You have started on the path that will bring Golarion to disaster, uncountable, like the larvae that swarm in your black heart. I would destroy you right now - but for the time being I will hold my hand so as not to make it worse. Know: when this crusade is over, a new one will follow. You will crush the hordes of demons-but you will not stand against the angels!"

>Sosiel: "You're like a living insult to Shelyn, embodied ugliness. Evil that even demons despise. I no longer want to have anything to do with you! \ ""

>Wolfjif turns pale. {/ N} \" Commander? Hey commander! It's me! And ... and don’t lay eggs in me."

>Greybor retains an unflappable voice, but a grimace of disgust appears on a whitened face. {/ N} \" Ahem ... It was necessary to include the right to termination in the contract if the tenant turned into a damned monster \ "."

Spoiler

Huh I honestly was expecting that Swarm will be more "neutral" than Demon or Lich. The KS description seems to make it that the Swarm will be revenge(?) based from the "Golarion failed you". It seems that it might be the evilest instead.

Spoiler

It seems that demon and lich can go either way - noble "use the enemy powers against them" to "I want MORE power and don't care where it's from". Swarm on the other hand is just vile.

Also the golden dragon is here too -

>A golden glow envelops you. Metal scales come out on your fingers, flames burst from your nostrils. With a cry, Nocticula closes her eyes. Even Iomedae, looking at you, squints a little. {/ N}"

 

[LannTheStupid]

Another attempt at Infinitroning: