Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

[Volrath]

If you don't like Kingmaker, you're a faggot. It's really that simple.

 

[Safav Hamon]

90% of this game's players are faggots then, seeing as only 10% make it past Chapter 3.

Even most of the people in this thread have abandoned the game halfway through.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

People don't finish it because it's too hard. I know, I screwed up my first run something fierce because I didn't understand everything had timers and my kingdom crumbled. Once I LEARNED the game, which most are unwilling to do (casuals, at least), I learned how to play and get further and the game became much easier. The later chapters and kingdom management probably overwhelm casuals and that's why it doesn't get finished, not to mention that it's absolutely enormous and has tons of content. I've played 484 hours according to Steam on 2 playthroughs, and I'm only in Chapter 5. I'm not surprised at all it doesn't get finished much.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Dark Souls is hard, and the completion rate is 20x higher than Kingmaker and it has 90% positive reviews on steam.

 

[2house2fly]

Negative Steam reviews are the lowest of the low. Just go look at some Lords of Xulima reviews. They complain it's unbalanced because they can't kill the ogre near the starting town. You know, the one that says it's IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL RIGHT ABOVE IT"S FUCKING HEAD. Yeah, that's the level of a Steam negative review. They are beyond garbage, and trust me, I've read enough of them to know.

This is the fabled "audience" to whom a game must pander or die. Nobody ever said the audience was smart

Reminder that only 1% of people have finished the game. The worst completion rate of any CRPG on steam.

You don't have to misrepresent it, man. 2% (the actual completion figure with rounding) is still very bad

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

And that audience has been attracted to Kingmaker, which makes the review scores plummet. Also, the game is enormous, not many people finish such huge games especially when they are a struggle, difficulty-wise, later in the game. It's easy to see for anyone with a brain why the numbers are what they are. If you've played the game you know it's CRPG Christ resurrected and we should celebrate its release date like we do Christ's birthday in December.

 

[Sharpedge]

I think this thread needs to be split, this "PoE vs Pathfinder" crap is offtopic and is polluting this thread.

 

[2house2fly]

It sounds like a hell of a game, if even the lowest difficulty mode is too punishingly hard for 98% of all humans.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Kingmaker has an incredibly niche audience. Cuphead sold millions and has a 95% positive review score.

 

[Lyre Mors]

Every post by Safav about this game is bait, and every negative response to these bait posts gives him enjoyment. Stop feeding him.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Of course it's niche, that's the point. Yet looking like PoE (which is more mainstream) it attracted mindless gamers who don't know how to play a proper CRPG. Do you now see what I'm saying? They expected Easy Street and they got Hard Road and left negative reviews.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Gregz wanted me to weigh in, because he is perma-triggered by fluent. As an objective observer, I can say without the least trace of bias that Kingmaker is a fairly crappy game. I kinda get why the people who like it do (and also Crispy), it feels more organic and less formulaic than other recent iso-RPGs (e.g PoE, D:OS, etc). It feels more like a labor of love than a by the book rehash from has-beens. But with that said, it's just not very good.

The game consists of a ton of unnecessary overhead to gameplay. The endless loading screens, the 2 hour rest sessions, the dull overworld map traveling, even the overhead of having to put up with slow walking speed when you carry any weight. The quality of maps of which the actual game consists of varies wildly, with many just being tiny underwhelming affairs in the Neverwinter Nights style. The combat alternates between trash mob fights and ridiculous difficulty curve spikes that will leave you having to reroll and start over, or rely on RNG. The story is pretty meh. A lot of class/kit design is very underwhelming as well. For example, look at the Duelist class, which is a prestige class, and ought to be pretty powerful. But if you actually look at abilities, it is way weaker than many standard melee classes. Or how about the sword saint kit, which is supposed to be a master swordsman, but in this game is actually some kind of a magic user. Yes, I know, these are Pathfinder issues, but if you make a game based on it, feel free to adjust things for the benefit of gameplay and/or coolness. Oh, and the whole kingdom thing just feels like a giant hassle for the most part. Constantly having to deal with some bs popping up, that's not why I play these kinds of games.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Gregz likes me, he just won't admit it, as well as won't admit that Kingmaker is the best CRPG to release in a long time. But it's okay Gregz, I still <3 you.

 

[Safav Hamon]

It sounds like a hell of a game, if even the lowest difficulty mode is too punishingly hard for 98% of all humans.

It's not difficult, however many fights are impossible without very good rolls. It's poor design, but not the sole reason this game is being trashed.

 

[2house2fly]

Of course it's niche, that's the point. Yet looking like PoE (which is more mainstream) it attracted mindless gamers who don't know how to play a proper CRPG. Do you now see what I'm saying? They expected Easy Street and they got Hard Road and left negative reviews.

Most people crow about this game outselling Deadfire; it's refreshing to see someone admit that this game owes its success entirely to Pillars Of Eternity's presence in the marketplace.

 

[Gregz]

Gregz likes me, he just won't admit it, as well as won't admit that Kingmaker is the best CRPG to release in a long time. But it's okay Gregz, I still <3 you.

I like you, and I admit it, but that doesn't mean we have to agree on everything.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Most people crow about this game outselling Deadfire; it's refreshing to see someone admit that this game owes its success entirely to Pillars Of Eternity's presence in the marketplace.

It's really kind of true. They saw "isometric, open-ish world CRPG" and figured it would be a Pillars clone. What they got was a game you have to learn to succeed, is a bit obtuse and hard to play at first. So the flood of negatives probably comes from Pillars fans.

 

[Sharpedge]

It sounds like a hell of a game, if even the lowest difficulty mode is too punishingly hard for 98% of all humans.

It's not difficult, however many fights are impossible without very good rolls. This is poor design, but not the only reason this game is being trashed.

This is not true, I have finished the game on solo hard, on party unfair and I am working on solo unfair now and no, if you have brain cells the game does *not* require lots of good rolls, with the EXCEPTION of the tutorial area for some classes and ONLY on unfair.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Of course it's niche, that's the point. Yet looking like PoE (which is more mainstream) it attracted mindless gamers who don't know how to play a proper CRPG. Do you now see what I'm saying? They expected Easy Street and they got Hard Road and left negative reviews.

I find this extremely ironic, considering in 2017 you used to shill for Pillars on the steam forums.

Are you going to 180 on this game too when Black Geysers comes out?

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Hey, I enjoyed Pillars, but I admit that Kingmaker blows it out of the water in every way. And it took a lot to open my eyes to a lot of things. I was a different person back then. And I think you have your years wrong. I reviewed and posted about Pillars in 2015 or so if I recall. Either way, I was a way different person back then.

 

[Gregz]

It sounds like a hell of a game, if even the lowest difficulty mode is too punishingly hard for 98% of all humans.

It's not difficult, however many fights are impossible without very good rolls. This is poor design, but not the only reason this game is being trashed.

This is not true, I have finished the game on solo hard, on party unfair and I am working on solo unfair now and no, if you have brain cells the game does *not* require lots of good rolls, with the EXCEPTION of the tutorial area for some classes and ONLY on unfair.

Combat difficulty is hardly ever mentioned in the negative reviews. It's a completely false narrative that this is why people are quitting the game.

People are giving up because of the quest and kingdom management bugs, and blind failure conditions, that people are falling prey to. This was unheard of in any of the IE games, and I assume the PoE games.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Are you going to 180 on this game too when Black Geysers comes out?

Nah bud. Kingmaker to me is a long-lasting CRPG I'll continually go back to, just like I still play Baldur's Gate or Icewind Dale to this day. Pillars, I might do a PotD playthrough sometime, but I've already forgotten most of it and don't really care much to go back to it.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Combat difficulty is hardly ever mentioned in the negative reviews. It's a completely false narrative that this is why people are quitting the game.

Have to disagree there. A lot of the reviews I read started with "it's unbalanced!" and then proceeded to explain a tough encounter they got steamrolled in and proceeded to ragequit to write their review. That is basically complaining in a roundabout way of combat difficulty. They don't understand a hand-placed world where tough encounters exist that you need to come back to later.

 

[Safav Hamon]

I just skimmed through the last 20 negative reviews, and the only person that complained about difficulty finished the game.

Gregz is right. This is a false narrative being used to justify the pathetically low reviews and completion rate.

 

[Gregz]

Combat difficulty is hardly ever mentioned in the negative reviews. It's a completely false narrative that this is why people are quitting the game.

Have to disagree there. A lot of the reviews I read started with "it's unbalanced!" and then proceeded to explain a tough encounter they got steamrolled in and proceeded to ragequit to write their review. That is basically complaining in a roundabout way of combat difficulty. They don't understand a hand-placed world where tough encounters exist that you need to come back to later.

You're just cherry-picking to perk up your ego bro. You've spent 400+ hours learning how to think like a twisted russian developer, that doesn't make you smarter than anyone else.