Mass Effect New Mass Effect confirmed

[taxalot]

The biggest problem I had with the Mass Effect story was how it felt disjointed from game to game because of internal issues at Bioware.

First game was a RPG setting up a new universe.
Second game was an action game that felt it should have had a connection to 1 and 3 but pretty much hadn't. It's almost a spinoff or a sidequel. It's good but it doesn't matter.
Third game was the story moment we all waited for, what are they going to do ? Well it turns out at the very instant this shit begins they find the solution from the very start of the game, a solution that was never heard from the beginning or hinted at. They also find z guy from the ancient mysterious civilization because it's cool.

It feels like a story that was indeed written from the very start but kept being retouched by other people as teams changed. It feels like good music played by an orchestra that suddenly decides to improvise one third into the partition.

 

[Assisted Living Godzilla]

The first Mass Effect is very much an action game too. It’s not all that good of one, in fact it’s a pretty terrible one, but it is one. Although it’s trying to do some more interesting things than the second game was. The main problem with Mass Effect 2 is the team looked at all the problems of the first game, and instead of fixing them, they dropped them...which was a very boring direct to go. They did make combat a bit better, but it also became a bit more standard, and they dropped the bigger outdoors areas with larger enemies that were a bit more fun. But let’s not get things mixed up, Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2 are both action games.

 

[tritosine2k]

Mass Effect 1 does not have an avant-garde soundtrack. It’s an electronic soundtrack meant to sound like ‘80s (and ‘90s) sci-fi movies with electronic soundtracks that came out in 2007. The game even came out while the whole synthwave thing was gearing up...which is why it was so weird that Mass Effect moved away from synth as synth was getting more popular.

Sadly around that time you had those 80gigabyte orchestra sample banks. And apparently they just aren't near as good as top electronic producers to even supplant sample.
Then they went all in on sampled orchestra and later that piano stuff when ME2 is already much worse.
Some of their electronic stuff even sounds like television quiz shows woo so much suspense.
It's all over the place mostly bad.

 

[Silverfish]

After taking down Saren and Sovereign, saving the Citadel and gaining the everlasting favor of the council (preferably by replacing it entirely) there's really nothing they could do with Spectres without going down further the Reaper rabbit hole that would seem as interesting as a follow-up.

I disagree, that's like saying "Well, you can't do anything interesting with James Bond after taking down Goldfinger". The ideal scenario would have been each game focusing on some kind of mission handed down by the council and then getting enveloped in twists and turns along the way. Basically Alpha Protocol, but with each region fleshed out into its own game.

 

[Assisted Living Godzilla]

Yeah, the idea there was nowhere to go besides the Reapers after the first game is dumb. The Specters are basically just Space Double 0 Agents. You’re like a CIA agent that’s set up somewhere and given autonomy to basically act as your own agency to get the mission done.

Taking down Saren isn’t even like getting Goldfinger. Saren is just a rogue agent. It’s like saying a Bond movie can’t do anything after GoldenEye or Skyfall.

 

[GamerCat_]

I was with you until ME2 worldbuilding. Chris L'Etoile mostly wrote the ME2 lore and did a great job. I like Karpyshyn's ME1 optimistic world way more but L'Etoile gave us a realistic and grounded portrayal of the ME universe, showing the sordid underside of the galaxy. The Omega station and Purgatory provide a far more cynical view of the noblebright galaxy from ME1. The ME3 soundtrack is excellent too.

Realistic and grounded? Do you also think that Age of Decadence is realistic you tool? Gritty underside city is infinitely more of a buttgenre fiction trope than anything Mass Effect 1 was doing. And it's also absurdly fucking boring. Oh, there's a tough no nonsense boss of freeside who needs me to do some jobs before I get the information I want? Wow. Stunning and brave. I can hardly handle this face to face encounter with the depths of human nature.

Mechanics in ME1 are a trainwreck (here are some examples: http://gamedesignreviews.com/reviews/mass-effect-massive-interface-fail-part-ii/ ) and most of its planet exploration is insultingly bad. Basically you must skip most of the side missions to make the game enjoyable.

Mass Effect 1 handles very strangely, but I mostly find it quaint. I actually like not entirely understanding video games. The UI looks brilliant if you ask me. Is it functional? Eh, I finished the game so it can't be that bad. But I love the colours and fancy layouts.

 

[Talby]

The Mass Effect series works pretty well as an IQ test. If someone says anything but the first game is the best one, you can be assured their IQ is in the double digits and probably 70 or lower.

This is how I judge any "best ever" lists I see. If anyone pick 2 or 3 over 1 I instantly recognize their gaming opinion as retarded.

I mean, they removed a ton of good stuff like all the armors, extra dialogue choices and added pointless shit like ammo and global power cooldowns too. But how anyone can prefer that fucking mining mini-game over ACTUALLY EXPLORING PLANETS is fucking mind-boggling.

Sure, the controls on the Mako weren't great, but at least I was getting what I signed up for...some actual interplanetary space exploration. Seeing the completely absence of that from the latter 2 games was just mind-boggling.

Not to mention the whole atmosphere and style of the games are completely different. ME1 is more about the world and exploring it, learning about the different alien races and solving their dilemmas in a Star Trek style with Kirk-esque moral choices. (They weren't always the best written, but that's just BioWare) The Reaper threat wasn't even the real focus, that was just an excuse to get out into the Galaxy and explore, meet people and do quests.

ME2 threw all that in the trash and decided it's just a space action game about the coolest most powerful badass dude in the Galaxy who has to shoot dudes and save the day. The plot is focused on humans and how important and special they are, to the point that even the Reapers take a special interest in Shepard specifically. This was never a theme in ME1, humans were the new kids on the block and fairly unimportant, which was a refreshing change from a lot of sci-fi where humans are at the centre of everything. Sure, Shepard was a decorated veteran in ME1, but the only people who really took you seriously were the other human characters. Everybody else treats you like a country bumpkin from the ass end of the galaxy. Suddenly, the series went from being about the world to being about the hero. I blame EA.

 

[BosanskiSeljak]

It's also important to note that, while Shepard was already at a top level in human ranks, thats all he was. No special, chosen one world saver, not the absolute best in any area, etc. Due to a bunch of coincidences and being at the right place at the wrong time which granted him a unique ability no one but Saren had. But even then, he needed others to help (Garrus giving him leads, Tali giving him proof and the nature of the Geth, Liara with her mind fucks).

The first few seconds of ME2 has none of Shepards actual strengths that make him unique. It's literally just because he's a badass Hollywood star, literally.

 

[Hellraiser]

I disagree, that's like saying "Well, you can't do anything interesting with James Bond after taking down Goldfinger".

No it is not, you're missing the problem of open plot threads and the level of the threat/stakes. This would be closer to something like James Bond killing Cthulhu while knowing all too well the rest of the elder gods wants to come back and eat everyone anyway, with a ton of ancient mystery and questions unanswered left open. And then James Bond being relegated to chase relatively (compared to the cosmic level of threat the elder gods pose) small fish as Goldfinger. Shepard going from savior of the galaxy from a millions year old threat to all intelligent life, to whacking the occasional terrorist/corporate/political megalomaniac mole that pops up every few years with some coup or get rich scheme conspiracy would be underwhelming (again, ME2 already feels underwhelming with the missing colonists hook), and feel like a waste of a perfectly good plot (that was anyway stolen from a certain book series, but still...).

Either you commit to finishing the arc by at least ending the threat permanently (as in no more reapers, dead), or you're going to get disappointment and blue balls from the fanbase. Sure, they wrote themselves into a corner and lacked the chops to pull it off, in hindsight this is plain obvious. I'm not disagreeing with that part. The first game raised the threat bar too high, likewise the revelations about the relays and citadel etc. would have been better for the final game or maybe second one. But they started the trilogy with a bang and then had a dud, which was then followed by a half-assed conclusion to the arc.

 

[Silverfish]

Either you commit to finishing the arc by at least ending the threat permanently (as in no more reapers, dead), or you're going to get disappointment and blue balls from the fanbase.

Crossed wires. My point was that the reapers were a bad concept to begin with and limited what the series could do from the beginning. In retrospect, I think using Spectre work as the premise would have been better.

 

[Iucounu]

Mechanics in ME1 are a trainwreck (here are some examples: http://gamedesignreviews.com/reviews/mass-effect-massive-interface-fail-part-ii/ ) and most of its planet exploration is insultingly bad. Basically you must skip most of the side missions to make the game enjoyable.

Mass Effect 1 handles very strangely, but I mostly find it quaint. I actually like not entirely understanding video games. The UI looks brilliant if you ask me. Is it functional? Eh, I finished the game so it can't be that bad. But I love the colours and fancy layouts.

I can agree with that, as long as using the UI does not become a chore. But not only is comparing the performance of various looted items in ME1 tedious, most of it only gives you negligible improvement over what you already have. Of course eventually you realize that the only worthwhile improvements come from the gear you buy from the merchant on your own ship, whose merchandize only improves after each new main mission, and then looting becomes completely meaningless. In addition to that, most side quests take place in the same copy-pasted environments, making exploration meaningless as well.

 

[Iucounu]

I disagree, that's like saying "Well, you can't do anything interesting with James Bond after taking down Goldfinger".

No it is not, you're missing the problem of open plot threads and the level of the threat/stakes. This would be closer to something like James Bond killing Cthulhu while knowing all too well the rest of the elder gods wants to come back and eat everyone anyway, with a ton of ancient mystery and questions unanswered left open. And then James Bond being relegated to chase relatively (compared to the cosmic level of threat the elder gods pose) small fish as Goldfinger. Shepard going from savior of the galaxy from a millions year old threat to all intelligent life, to whacking the occasional terrorist/corporate/political megalomaniac mole that pops up every few years with some coup or get rich scheme conspiracy would be underwhelming

Indeed this is exactly what Miranda says in the beginning of ME2, complaining that Shepard is just sent around fighting Geth, that are not the real threat. So I'd say ME2's writers were aware of the problem...

 

[GamerCat_]

Mechanics in ME1 are a trainwreck (here are some examples: http://gamedesignreviews.com/reviews/mass-effect-massive-interface-fail-part-ii/ ) and most of its planet exploration is insultingly bad. Basically you must skip most of the side missions to make the game enjoyable.

Mass Effect 1 handles very strangely, but I mostly find it quaint. I actually like not entirely understanding video games. The UI looks brilliant if you ask me. Is it functional? Eh, I finished the game so it can't be that bad. But I love the colours and fancy layouts.

I can agree with that, as long as using the UI does not become a chore. But not only is comparing the performance of various looted items in ME1 tedious, most of it only gives you negligible improvement over what you already have. Of course eventually you realize that the only worthwhile improvements come from the gear you buy from the merchant on your own ship, whose merchandize only improves after each new main mission, and then looting becomes completely meaningless.

I don't remember noticing that. I do remember the main jumps in quality being from purchases. But I don't remember doing this with any kind of systematic understanding.

In addition to that, most side quests take place in the same copy-pasted environments, making exploration meaningless as well.

I loved the Mass Effect planets. Going on weird tangents to procedural generated bumpy texture land in the tank-buggy. Taking some guys down to look at a space-bunker and tick off some vaguely interesting job from the list. If it's pretty enough and handles well I don't care about much else. Empty may have been a mistake but I always thought it was the strongest potential use of space. It's a distinct experience. These big, empty worlds. Going there from a place where you're fighting or the citadel is a great contrast, but also there's thematic and aesthetic continuity. There's a tasteful simplicity to the presentation of uncultivated world and the interiors of the citadel, the way your ship looks, your armour. Quiet, sparse, enough.

Compare that to Mass Effect 2. So noisy. Afraid you'll get bored if everything isn't loud and glowing.

 

[Iucounu]

In addition to that, most side quests take place in the same copy-pasted environments, making exploration meaningless as well.

I loved the Mass Effect planets. Going on weird tangents to procedural generated bumpy texture land in the tank-buggy. Taking some guys down to look at a space-bunker and tick off some vaguely interesting job from the list. If it's pretty enough and handles well I don't care about much else. Empty may have been a mistake but I always thought it was the strongest potential use of space. It's a distinct experience. These big, empty worlds. Going there from a place where you're fighting or the citadel is a great contrast, but also there's thematic and aesthetic continuity. There's a tasteful simplicity to the presentation of uncultivated world and the interiors of the citadel, the way your ship looks, your armour. Quiet, sparse, enough.

I don't think the locations were procedurally generated back then, in fact even some caves were identical clones. Maybe one cave contained a different kind of storage boxes then another. Many times I wondered if I hadn't already been at the same location before.

Empty/lifeless worlds might work, if surviving the harsh environment by itself is a challenge, like in Subnautica or The Long Dark. But in ME1's side quests I recall the environment can't damage the vehicle at all, no matter how much it bounces down the impossibly steep cliffs like a little toy (maybe the lava streams in the main quests were a minor threat). Andromeda isn't much better, even if you intentionally drive into abysses on the destroyed world H-047c the game just helps you back up again instead of at least killing you, or even better give you a minigame of climbing back up on foot and get help (too much to ask for, granted). Also they removed the vehicle cannon in Andromeda, making it even more useless even on worlds with enemies.

Compare that to Mass Effect 2. So noisy. Afraid you'll get bored if everything isn't loud and glowing.

I recall there were some similar side quests in ME2 too: one with fake parkour on a spaceship wreck, one fighting hostile mechs in a sandstorm, one fighting bugs in some misty swamp. And you didn't have to drive a terrible vehicle, fortunately. There's also a ME2 DLC where you drive a hovercraft over lava streams and shoot Geth, but I thought it was mostly boring. Vehicles are always an annoyance, unless the main purpose of the game is using a vehicle, like in spaceship dog fights or racing games.

 

[MerchantKing]

Will this be as gay as BG3?

 

[Zeriel]

No, no, just fucking no.

All the new tracks by that Requiem for a Dream guy (IIRC it was his work, and him much hyped before release as a replacement for Jack Wall) are bland half-assed unmemorable movie shit, ridiculous decline over even ME2 (which had a few memorable bangers on par with the best ME1 themes). Seriously the whole thing sounds phoned-in.

Some videos

Yo those are exactly what's wrong with the ME3 soundtrack!

Compare to these classics:





On the one hand, the generic orchestral/piano slop of ME2 and ME3. Your first one sounds like a good fit for a WWII epic, and your second one could go well with a 19th century period romance piece. It's bland, it's trite, it's shit.

On the other hand, ME1's soundtrack -- so unusual and unique that it doesn't even have a genre. (Seriously, are there even people who make more music like that Noveria track? Most "ambient" stuff like CryoChamber, Cyclic Law, etc., is too sparse -- and most non-ambient electronic music is too beat-focused.)

I think that's actually a type of music that is inherent to gaming. Or at least was back in the glory days of gaming in the 90s and early 2000's; melody-focused to be catchy, but not so much so that it overrides the gameplay itself and distracts you. Some games could be way more distracting (see: C&C) because there was not a lot of spoken dialogue or something very cerebral it would distract you from, but yeah. Overall I'd say the theme holds. A lot of game composers used to be people who worked on music for ads & cinema, but their approach to games was somewhat different because they work in tandem with the devs to some degree. I find that gaming music has hugely declined in recent years as it has largely become just part of the "orchestral noise" space that also infects most tv shows & movies and is considered a fetish or aesthetic flourish associated with high budget.

David Arkenstone & Klepacki's work on Land of Lore 3 is a strong example of the combination of a game composer a new age composer who worked in another industry coming together and making something special... but you just know if they made Lands of Lore 4 now they'd hire some nameless orchestral composer to put in a droning wall of nothing.

 

[Hellraiser]

Another reason for the decline of music in AAA besides aping Hollywood crap (has there been even one fucking instance when games improved because they aped Hollywood/movie making?), and this is also visible in ME2 when you poke inside the game files (FYI I ripped some of the better ones today), is that due to increased storage space game music engines became more than just "play track" and you got innovations of dubious merit such as dynamic track selection or dynamic layer mixing based on game context (number of enemies, player damage etc.).

It's just musical lego at this point, so it's no wonder you don't get distinctive memorable themes anymore. You just get mass produced loops churned out to meet some checklist.

David Arkenstone & Klepacki's work on Land of Lore 3 is a strong example of the combination of a game composer a new age composer who worked in another industry coming together and making something special... but you just know if they made Lands of Lore 4 now they'd hire some nameless orchestral composer to put in a droning wall of nothing.

I have nothing but the utmost respect for Arkenstone, out of nowhere he managed to upstage Klepacki on Emperor: Battle for Dune with tracks like the below despite having no published works even close to regular metal or industrial:



You can hear the guy really understood what he was working on, had good ideas and was not afraid to go outside of his usual style. The exact fucking opposite of what-his-name did for ME3. The whole Harkonnen soundtrack Arkenstone did is a fucking masterpiece, not even 1 meh track on it, it is insane, even Klepacki was never that consistent on C&C games.

 

[GrainWetski]

View attachment 48082

 

[Iucounu]

Will this be as gay as BG3?

That's not enough to stand out, you must surpass the competition:

- Add a hot romanceable girl, revealed to be trans at the end of the game (too predictable?).

- Let siblings romance each other. If this is considered taboo, start with half-siblings.

- Let Liara bring Shepard's dead body back to life in an extended sex cutscene. If this is considered taboo, soften the impact with spiritual mumbo-jumbo about Shepard's living soul, implants still being "alive", etc.

 

[La vie sexuelle]

Patrick Weekes is also Bioware veteran. And? That's make Dreadwolf better?

 

[Orud]

Patrick Weekes is also Bioware veteran. And? That's make Dreadwolf better?

Of course it does. Haven't you read his twitter BIO? He's FURIOUSLY happy.

 

[La vie sexuelle]

Patrick Weekes is also Bioware veteran. And? That's make Dreadwolf better?

Of course it does. Haven't you read his twitter BIO? He's FURIOUSLY happy.

Furiously happy...Is like masturbate furiously?

 

[Cat Headed Eagle]

Will this be as gay as BG3?

DA:I is less gay than BG3, but also more boring.

 

[Caim]

Will this be as gay as BG3?

That's not enough to stand out, you must surpass the competition:

- Add a hot romanceable girl, revealed to be trans at the end of the game (too predictable?).

- Let siblings romance each other. If this is considered taboo, start with half-siblings.

- Let Liara bring Shepard's dead body back to life in an extended sex cutscene. If this is considered taboo, soften the impact with spiritual mumbo-jumbo about Shepard's living soul, implants still being "alive", etc.

One of your romance options is Liara's daughter, which she got from her canonically raping Shepard right before the final run to the ending.

Oh yeah, Shep/Liara is now canon.

 

[La vie sexuelle]

Will this be as gay as BG3?

DA:I is less gay than BG3, but also more boring.

Also, don't forget how effeminate the men were in this game. I even remember that you could come across a hut where it was very carefully emphasized that it was the man who was spinning.