Inactive [LP CYOA] Overlord

[Storyfag]

B1

 

[Kz3r0]

C.2.

 

[Kz3r0]

...if there is a Prince's double, is there our double as well? Scary thought, that...

Kagemusha not Doppelganger.

 

[Grimgravy]

A1

 

[Esquilax]

As far as the prisoners were concerned, challenges only happened in the upper levels, when they had successfully worked their way to more benefits and less restrictions on their natural abilities.

When we are taking part in these challenges, are we restricted in our abilities while we're doing the challenge, assuming it's a physical altercation? Or are we unshackled (or rather, equally shackled compared to our competitor) for the duration of the time that the challenge is on?

 

[ScubaV]

I think C is attempting too much especially given how little intel we have about the rules of this place and its denizens. I see good arguments for A and B:

A allows us to make some progress while staying under the radar of the upper floors. We can establish a better base and gather more info before making big moves. The downside being that we risk working too slowly and having things slip away from us at Grahferde.

B lets us make a big splash. If successful, people are going to know we're a big (but limp) swinging dick and should immediately earn us a lot of street cred. The downside, of course, is that taking out someone who herself got noticed for rising quickly is going to bring the attention of the Warden as well as our desired minions. He would almost certainly take extra precautions against a similar move on him.

I'm still undecided as to which is better.

As for 1 and 2, I'm personally in favor of 1. Yes, working from the shadows in 2 would be pretty useful right now, but once we bust out of this place I think it's better to have the monsters' loyalty tied directly to us rather than indirectly through Rin, especially if she gets mind controlled again or decides to renege on our deal for whatever reason.

 

[Baltika9]

ScubaV sold me. B1

 

[archaen]

We would have been here for a century if we picked A. We would have had to come up with a spell to split our psyche into two and packed away our real personality. I think A1 is a good start, we get a feel for the type of competition and can scout an easier path for Rin to follow us.

 

[Esquilax]

As for 1 and 2, I'm personally in favor of 1. Yes, working from the shadows in 2 would be pretty useful right now, but once we bust out of this place I think it's better to have the monsters' loyalty tied directly to us rather than indirectly through Rin, especially if she gets mind controlled again or decides to renege on our deal for whatever reason.

Let's worry about one thing at a time - I think it's important to do whatever it takes to get out, first and foremost, and concern ourselves with the loyalty of this prison's denizens once we get to that point. I am undecided, and there is definitely an enticing ego factor to making Erdrick the head honcho of this little rebellion, but perhaps Rin is better suited to the combat aspect that this would entail, which would free us up to doing a little bit of skulduggery on the side and rigging these various challenges in our favour.

As for Rin getting mind-controlled, certainly that could be a concern, but I seriously doubt that she would renege on our deal for any reason.

“Erdrick! There you are! Hah, did you think you could get away from me? We swore an oath and you aren’t getting out of it that easily. Here, I’m going to teleport us back, and… wait, why do I feel weaker all of a sudden? My teleportation magic… it isn’t working! What’s going on, Erdrick?”

If anything, given our absence, Rin probably may have thought that Erdrick was the one who reneged on the oath.

Let's try and think about the situation in reverse - if we're the one taking part in the challenges ourselves, what is Rin doing? She's tough and she's trustworthy, but if our little debacle with Wisteria was any indicator, she's not really much for subtle plotting. Well, I mean, neither is Codex, but we are sure as fuck better than Rin.

I agree that it's tempting to go for it all, but when you take your ego out of it and examine the situation dispassionately, I think that sitting back from the shadows is actually the smarter decision that is better suited to our character's strengths. This guy isn't Xu Jing or Ean - he can fight, sure, and he's not a coward, but he's not above using a bunch of dirty tricks to avoid a fight altogether.

As for which target to go after, I am not sure yet, leaning towards B. I am even contemplating going straight for the Warden while using Rin as our challenger, but I am not drunk enough yet and Baltika9 hasn't made a long enough post to convince me why such an insane/retarded idea is in reality actually brilliant and that we should do it right now.

B2

 

[treave]

When we are taking part in these challenges, are we restricted in our abilities while we're doing the challenge, assuming it's a physical altercation? Or are we unshackled (or rather, equally shackled compared to our competitor) for the duration of the time that the challenge is on?

The respective restrictions remain, so someone like the Warden would be a lot less restricted than you are during the challenge. Bear in mind that the challenged will get to dictate the nature of the challenge too.

I've been honestly rushed for time to make the recent updates so if there are any details about the prison itself you guys would like to know about and think would help (estimated population, daily schedule, how things work in general, other people of note), feel free to ask.

 

[Esquilax]

One question that comes to mind is: Are we aware of anybody with a lower number than the Warden? (i.e. somebody who's been here longer than him)

 

[ScubaV]

Let's try and think about the situation in reverse - if we're the one taking part in the challenges ourselves, what is Rin doing? She's tough and she's trustworthy, but if our little debacle with Wisteria was any indicator, she's not really much for subtle plotting. Well, I mean, neither is Codex, but we are sure as fuck better than Rin.

I agree that it's tempting to go for it all, but when you take your ego out of it and examine the situation dispassionately, I think that sitting back from the shadows is actually the smarter decision that is better suited to our character's strengths. This guy isn't Xu Jing or Ean - he can fight, sure, and he's not a coward, but he's not above using a bunch of dirty tricks to avoid a fight altogether.

Well, the challenges won't necessarily be strictly combat as treave just stated, but we are at a disadvantage in not getting to pick the challenge. Which is an argument in favor of playing it slow so we can find out what our targets are likely to choose as a challenge and plan accordingly. In this sense, I think Erdrick is better suited because he is more well-rounded and excels at thinking on the fly. You make a good point in asking what is Rin going to be doing if we're taking the lead. I don't know exactly, but I'm sure we can come up with something. Maybe we can play good cop, bad cop. We're the bastard rebel and she's the shining beacon of karma.

I've been honestly rushed for time to make the recent updates so if there are any details about the prison itself you guys would like to know about and think would help (estimated population, daily schedule, how things work in general, other people of note), feel free to ask.

I think Nevill would be well-suited to coming up with an extensive list of questions.

 

[Kipeci]

We would have been here for a century if we picked A. We would have had to come up with a spell to split our psyche into two and packed away our real personality. I think A1 is a good start, we get a feel for the type of competition and can scout an easier path for Rin to follow us.

No, what this has confirmed for me is that A would have been the shortest way out. If you'll allow me to spin a short tale, I'll explain why.

I am rather fond of The Kingdom of Dragon Pass. For those who remain sadly unaware of it, it's an excellent little game in which you essentially act as the decision-maker of a council of nobles heading up a tiny Bronze Age clan in a fantasy setting. The basic unit of wealth in this game is the cow, the most important agricultural critter due to both the abundance it provides and its religious significance. All goods ranging from bushels of barley to chests of foreign coins are tallied in accordance with how many cows they are equivalent to, half the violence in the game is you raiding to steal your neigbors' cattle and counterraids where they aim to lead yours away, among the most ill-regarded of the many evil critters in the game is one that taints your cows into birthing monsters. As such, I decided that I would attempt to acquire as many cows as possible.

It's common in the game to have somewhere in the vicinity of ~800 cows. A substantial herd considering the circumstances of the time, but not really what I was aiming for. I relentlessly raided my neighbors, one at a time, letting up only when they accepted the peace that they would return to me a tribute of 40 cows every year. Generally they found that exhausting, so they would attempt to quit paying and I would continue to plunder quantities greatly in excess of 40 cows every year, for decades on end. I entirely ditched the main plot, I devoted nearly all of the clan's magical reserves to rituals that would either improve the fertility of the cattle or the valor of my warriors to acquire more. I prospered, acquiring many thousands of cattle.

There are actually a number of mechanisms in the game intended to discourage you from depending too heavily on war. Your demographics get warped by the (mostly) men's elevated rates of death even if you're winning the bulk of the time, your less important freemen with only sheep to raise get sulky about all the attention and prestige focused on those who do battle, and as one of the more important features you can have severe problems with starvation if you don't plan out the timing of your raids. If you launch martial adventures in the planting or harvesting seasons, you have a greatly diminished crop and can look forward to harder times come the winter that will wither men who were invincible on the fields of battle. The thing is, I ended up acquiring enough cows that this didn't actually matter; some small fraction of the animals are being slaughtered all the time to provide meat and there's production of milk and cheese going on continuously for food sources that don't eliminate the cattle, and I actually had enough that my clan was able to just disregard farming in general. We became divorced from the rhythm of the seasons, raining blood on our hated neighbors regardless of the conventional need for seasons of peace.

My people were easily the most filthy rich of any Orlanthi within Dragon Pass. The clan numbered nearly 1500, but the cows? They were past the thousands; there were two dozen thousands of them, and more to spare! When I did the math on that one, it turned out that there were about 16 or 17 cows to correspond to each person. That's grossly in excess of Australia, beyond that of Argentina; even the US state of South Dakota only has a cow-to-person ratio of 4.32. The people proudly surveyed the thickly pattied graze-lands, the bounty handed down from their ancestors from the pens of the neighbors, all guarded by two hundred hardened weaponthanes in gleaming armor easily capable of smiting any two-bit gang of cattle rustlers.

The clan broke up two days later.

On the first day of the disaster, the pastures appeared empty. Where the mooing of many thousands had once been inescapable, all was gone. In their place were six hundred entities of a great malevolence, bringing ill-fortune and pain to all who drew near; that is to say, they were anti-cows. Felled by no army, stricken with no regular pestilence, the cows that formed the foundation of the clan were gone. Not only gone, departed so desperately that six-hundred cows would need to be sacrificed to please the gods to restore the land to the point where it would be suitable for any further development of cows.

So, what does this have to do with Erd, you might ask? Developers of a system may have certain limitations in mind when they develop it. It may be possible to approach one end of a scale so enthusiastically that you simply loop to the other side entirely; the developers did not anticipate someone being so stupid as to cast aside the obvious, clearly stated goals to constantly and vigorously do entirely the wrong thing, so there is no counter-measure. But can you imagine that, rather than putting in the effort to acquire dozens of thousands of cows through in-game decades of raiding, how simple would it have been if one could just collect a few hundred anti-cattle? Not so great a task were it possible, and then you have the wealth that even great kings would dream for.

With Erd fully dedicated to doing the right thing, we could have had him acquire such vast quantities of negative karma in such an unprecedentedly short time that I have full confidence that he'd have ended up at the top of the tower before the month was out. Now we'll be sabotaging ourselves by building up somewhere so that the negative karma accumulation will constantly drag against us rather than driving us to our destination.

 

[archaen]

Kipeci Hoping for "short int Karma" instead of "long long Karma" is one strategy I suppose.

Also, cool story bro.

 

[lightbane]

I've been honestly rushed for time to make the recent updates so if there are any details about the prison itself you guys would like to know about and think would help (estimated population, daily schedule, how things work in general, other people of note), feel free to ask.

Ok. What happens to our Karma whenever we challenge someone and win? Does it reset to meet the defeated one's own karma?
Would have it been possible to fly away without being fried by the magical defense system?
What happens with prisoners that die here (be it of old age or other methods)? Perhaps this is related to the kitchen and is something we do not really wish to know.

With Erd fully dedicated to doing the right thing, we could have had him acquire such vast quantities of negative karma in such an unprecedentedly short time that I have full confidence that he'd have ended up at the top of the tower before the month was out. Now we'll be sabotaging ourselves by building up somewhere so that the negative karma accumulation will constantly drag against us rather than driving us to our destination.

So, your strategy for Erd was to get a score so low it breaks the system and flops to the "best" score then. Sounds funny and likely, but chances are the other prisoners and guards would attempt to manhandle us once they noticed what we are doing.

 

[treave]

One question that comes to mind is: Are we aware of anybody with a lower number than the Warden? (i.e. somebody who's been here longer than him)

Not that you know of. If there are any, you would be likely to find them on the seventh floor. It is said that no one has managed to accumulate enough karma to reach the seventh floor ever since the current Warden took his place.

If we can egg someone with higher karma into challenging us first, rather than our challenging them, would we get their rank if they were defeated?

The result should be the same regardless of who makes the challenge. It is however very difficult to gain her notice at the moment, since you are unable to do anything that influences her from your position on the lowest floor. It's pretty much impossible without making a direct challenge of your own. Taking a room on the second floor by beating Salamander first will open up more options on that front.

Ok. What happens to our Karma whenever we challenge someone and win? Does it reset to meet the defeated one's own karma?

Your karma values undergo a mutual exchange. This is something that can be exploited, at least psychologically.

Would have it been possible to fly away without being fried by the magical defense system?

You would have fallen into the ocean and washed up ashore somewhere else.

What happens with prisoners that die here (be it of old age or other methods)? Perhaps this is related to the kitchen and is something we do not really wish to know.

Their bodies are taken back to their room and then mysteriously vanish while no one is looking.

 

[Nevill]

Hm, Prisoner 24601. Les Miserables reference?

The clause’s presence itself feels strange to you; why would a place purportedly aimed at the rehabilitation of its prisoners have an option for a shortcut?

Tinfoil-hat time! This is actually a facility to train monster supersoldiers. Only the most cunning and vicious would be allowed out, the rest get stuck here earning virtual points karma.

Even if it is not so, it still makes sense to have a shortcut - you are making those who are bright to serve as the guards for the rest. As long as they do not outsmart the Overseer, they are furthering the cause.

The Warden aside, all of the guards that patrolled the lower levels have had their numbers concealed.

How do you conceal your number? It's not like you get a tag or something, and the guards' numbers are called out when they are assigned to 5th floor... So who is privy to this information? I would assume the denizens of the 4th floor are (it's the natural place to get the guards from).

Spoiler

The Reformatory – that is what they call this place. From what you could figure out, it is an institution located in the Sea of Von Braun, in the midst of the most dangerous waters in the world. You have no idea where the exact location is, and all that you know is that you are a long, long way from Grahferde, though thankfully still in the same world.

According to the island’s inhabitants, this has long been a place for various non-human kingdoms to exile their undesirables. Most don’t survive the entrance procedure – a really long fall from the sky – and those powerful enough to do so find themselves powerless to escape. Once here, they find themselves under the rule of the prison itself. The guards are drawn from the ranks of the prisoners, from those who have followed the rules and the teachings well enough to distinguish themselves. Within the tower, each of the seven floors offered different levels of comfort and quality of life for its inmates. The bottom floor was, as usual, the worst of the lot, while the higher floors boasted of better facilities, such as a real bed. Floor five was reserved for guards, floor six for more distinguished personnel amongst those guards – though from the way you hear it, they rarely leave their luxurious quarters to mingle with the rabble – and no one in the courtyard has any idea who resides on floor seven.

The assignment of rooms itself was a strange process; a disembodied voice would call out their number – everyone was given a number here – and they would find themselves being granted a room. This changed from time to time according to the mysterious Karma they accrued for practicing a lifestyle in accordance with the Reformatory’s rules. Guards were selected via the same procedure; their number would be called out along with a congratulatory message and they would be assigned a room on the fifth floor. The magical security within the tower is said to be even more extensive and there are horror stories told of the fate of former residents attempting to force their way to the upper floors.

“To become a Worthy Reformed and leave the island, one must transcend floor seven,” said one of the older guards, a withered, aged demon with the texture and smell of a rotting prune. Considering how the demon race is more long-lived than humans, you wonder how long he has been here. The guard himself doesn’t remember; now, the only thing he remembers is his number and the rules.

All right.

1) Where is this institution located, compared to our last known location? What monster nations are there, and how far? What's the situation in the world? We have only seen the human side of the politics so far, but I'd like to see how the monsterbros fare. I am trying to determine if we should go home after our hopefully daring escape, or if we should try and make something out of our unexpected excursion to the other side of the world.

That's mostly a lore question that hardly has a relation to our immediate situation. Still, some of us were dying to meet the monsterbros, and this might be our chance.

I am also a bit puzzled by the presence of humans here. I wonder how they live with monsters in the other parts of the world.

2) How come that new arrivals enter the facility through the sky? Is there a portal up there? Is the existence of the place widely known, enough to have several kingdoms dump their garbage here all at once?

3) What qualifies as being an undesireable who warrants being sent to this place? 24K inmates sound like a really small amount, considering how long the facility has been operational. What particular crimes are the inmates here for?

4) What are the rules in the facility? Karma system seems pretty much intuitive, but they would not have put guards here through natural selection if it did the job all by itself. What is strictly disallowed and causes the guards to interfere?

5) What about Barbatos, are his abilities diminished here as well? Does he even know of the facility, its purpose, or its creators?

6) How long was it since Queen Bee was imprisoned here? She is only 600 numbers below us. How did she went to the floor 4, what's the reason for her rise? Did she challenge someone?

7) What are the horror stories of the magical security? I suppose the lower floor denizens would not know much about that... or maybe they are exactly the ones who would, having lost karma for attempting or assisting the attempts to bypass the system.

8) About the 'estimated population'... it probably should be clear from the numbers assigned. It must be something bekow 24603 people, probably close since no one leaving the place anymore after a change in the management. But how are those spread between the floors, do we have any idea?

9) Are there any gangs running the place in the lower floors? What are principles they from their groups by? Are there any inter-floor gangs, whose influence stretches beyond one floor?

 

[lightbane]

You would have fallen into the ocean and washed up ashore somewhere else.

Somewhere else outside of this island? Too bad, too late to do so anyway. I have another question:
- Does this island have a library of some sort? I assume it is restricted by karma like everything else, but the quest for more spells is one without end.
- What about a gym? Same as the previous question.
- Does someone know if have there been other Angels like us before our arrival? And why do people here avoid looking at our wings by the way? They also seem to not to fear us too much (but that must be because of the system's wards, which they do affect us).

I wonder what did Erd eat with the gobbos if it was better than the thing he's being served here.

Tinfoil-hat time! This is actually a facility to train monster supersoldiers. Only the most cunning and vicious would be allowed out, the rest get stuck here earning virtual points karma.

Ah, the classic 90's plot. This world is so bizarre it might even be the actual case. Too bad that there's already a race of monstrous supersoldiers: the Angels. Unfortunately, they were too effective at their jobs, so I guess this is the redux version.

 

[treave]

How do you conceal your number? It's not like you get a tag or something, and the guards' numbers are called out when they are assigned to 5th floor... So who is privy to this information? I would assume the denizens of the 4th floor are (it's the natural place to get the guards from).

The voice isn't particularly loud. There might be some people who obsessively record the number of every person they have ever known. Outside of that, there are too many numbers to care about each and every one. The fourth floor would be the best place to find people who know the numbers of the guards.

1) Where is this institution located, compared to our last known location? What monster nations are there, and how far? What's the situation in the world? We have only seen the human side of the politics so far, but I'd like to see how the monsterbros fare. I am trying to determine if we should go home after our hopefully daring escape, or if we should try and make something out of our unexpected excursion to the other side of the world.

The human kingdoms are to the west. The Sea of Von Braun is to the north of the major landmass where the non-human kingdoms are. You haven't found anyone talkative enough to infodump yet. Your wings are making it hard for people to hold long periods of conversation with you.

2) How come that new arrivals enter the facility through the sky? Is there a portal up there? Is the existence of the place widely known, enough to have several kingdoms dump their garbage here all at once?

No one is certain how they arrived. Usually when they wake up they are already free-falling.

3) What qualifies as being an undesireable who warrants being sent to this place? 24K inmates sound like a really small amount, considering how long the facility has been operational. What particular crimes are the inmates here for?

The crimes range from political dissidence to murder to thievery. Almost as if they picked the names out of a bag.

4) What are the rules in the facility? Karma system seems pretty much intuitive, but they would not have put guards here through natural selection if it did the job all by itself. What is strictly disallowed and causes the guards to interfere?

The guards interfere only in the case of violence or an attempt to escape, although the system itself is already perfectly capable of delivering punishment when karma goes too low. In that respect Erdrick theorizes that the guards serve more as a failsafe and as a more recognizable face for enforcing the system's will rather than leaving everything fully to a disembodied voice. They might not actually be required.

Although on the surface it might seem simple: accrue karma and get promoted, in actuality there are numerous ways to prevent someone from getting karma, and plenty of ways to manipulate them into getting negative karma. Since space in the tower is finite, someone on the upper floors who falls behind on gathering karma can be bumped down and his place naturally taken by someone from the lower floors without a challenge. Think of it like a scoreboard that is continually active, with the thresholds being raised depending on what everyone else does. At the point of your arrival, however, the system has been in place long enough and gamed long enough that the karma gap between each level is difficult to surpass without taking extraordinary action.

5) What about Barbatos, are his abilities diminished here as well? Does he even know of the facility, its purpose, or its creators?

He has not spoken since you arrived, just like in the temple at Yuiria.

6) How long was it since Queen Bee was imprisoned here? She is only 600 numbers below us. How did she went to the floor 4, what's the reason for her rise? Did she challenge someone?

About six years or so. After working her way to floor two, she formed a gang and challenged someone on floor three, and news trickling down from above says that she has recently reached floor four. Details are scarce beyond that.

7) What are the horror stories of the magical security? I suppose the lower floor denizens would not know much about that... or maybe they are exactly the ones who would, having lost karma for attempting or assisting the attempts to bypass the system.

Disintegration is the most popular trick.

8) About the 'estimated population'... it probably should be clear from the numbers assigned. It must be something bekow 24603 people, probably close since no one leaving the place anymore after a change in the management. But how are those spread between the floors, do we have any idea?

You have no idea. But the estimated population is actually probably a lot less than 20,000 people.

9) Are there any gangs running the place in the lower floors? What are principles they from their groups by? Are there any inter-floor gangs, whose influence stretches beyond one floor?

There are no actual factions in floors one and two. The denizens of these floors aren't noticed until they demonstrate an ability to rise above the rabble and reach the upper floors.

- Does this island have a library of some sort? I assume it is restricted by karma like everything else, but the quest for more spells is one without end.
- What about a gym? Same as the previous question.

There is a library on the fourth floor, but there is no gym.

- Does someone know if have there been other Angels like us before our arrival? And why do people here avoid looking at our wings by the way? They also seem to not to fear us too much (but that must be because of the system's wards, which they do affect us).

It seems to Erdrick that here, the first rule about talking to an angel is that you don't talk about angels.

 

[Nevill]

Let's try and think about the situation in reverse - if we're the one taking part in the challenges ourselves, what is Rin doing?

Rin is doing 'sitting tight and waiting for Erdrick to pick her an opponent and give her his number so that she could challenge him' routine.

We can't do all the challenges ourselves, our success alone does nothing to help her climb the ladder. But we can still scout ahead and find her a match she won't fuck up. She tends to outsmart herself even more than we do.

I am more worried about how we intend to get the princess out. There aren't many people you can challenge in a catatonic state. Perhaps our best option is to get to the top and then open the gates for everyone...

 

[Tigranes]

Who cares about getting the princess out, if she's just a body double?

 

[Nevill]

Does no one read 'The Prince and The Pauper' anymore?

Obviously, the real prince has to go.

 

[lightbane]

The crimes range from political dissidence to murder to thievery. Almost as if they picked the names out of a bag.

This sounds familiar...

Spoiler

 

[TOME]

B2.

 

[ScubaV]

I think I'll vote B1 in the absence of further discussion.