Incline GRIDMONGER — a new free & open-source cRPG mapping tool

[Jermu]

Been using this for 6 hours now and it is quite easy to use and pleasing to the eye. There are few things I would like to see such as seeing all notes as mentioned and having arrow icons which are handy for dungeons that are continuous.

Thanks for Gridmonger would not mind even paying for this

 

[GentlemanCthulhu]

Oh wow it's in Nim too. Good job mate.

 

[Rincewind]

Gridmonger v1.0.0 has been released, get it from here! Big thanks to 7h30n for his contributions!

New features

• Add preferences option to enable movement wrap-around
• Allow multiple source links for teleporters (7h30n)
• New Werdna theme (designed for the PC/CGA version of Wizardry 1-5)

Fixes

• Fix "Draw Wall Repeat" modifier handling on Linux
• Fix cursor jump when cursor is close to the level edges (7h30n)

And here's the new Werdna theme in action!

 

[Rincewind]

Update for Mac users: now the downloadable app bundle is a universal binary and it supports both Intel and M1 Macs (previously, I only provided an Intel binary).

 

[rusty_shackleford]

*ahem*

the disclaimer you have provided and the license are not compatible, the disclaimer would make it non-FOSS

It is free and open-source software, the full source code is available at GitHub. You can do whatever you want with it for your own shady nefarious purposes, I don't really care — as long as you don't use it to somehow gruesomely murder kittens, or turn everybody into Jehova's Witnesses, avid unicyclists, or Mall Santa Impersonators, or something equally reprehensible. And if by some inexplicable glitch on the tailmost end of the (im)probability curve it gets you filthy rich, be so nice and at least send me a postcard!

so-called ethical licenses, which this is leaning towards, are not FOSS compatible. And yes, this is a serious detail.
https://opensource.org/osd

6. No Discrimination Against Fields of Endeavor
The license must not restrict anyone from making use of the program in a specific field of endeavor. For example, it may not restrict the program from being used in a business, or from being used for genetic research.

for an example of a real world issue caused by this, look at GLM's so-called 'Happy Bunny License' which caused it to be removed from some linux package managers due to the license being non-free.

 

[Rincewind]

*ahem*

the disclaimer you have provided and the license are not compatible, the disclaimer would make it non-FOSS

It is free and open-source software, the full source code is available at GitHub. You can do whatever you want with it for your own shady nefarious purposes, I don't really care — as long as you don't use it to somehow gruesomely murder kittens, or turn everybody into Jehova's Witnesses, avid unicyclists, or Mall Santa Impersonators, or something equally reprehensible. And if by some inexplicable glitch on the tailmost end of the (im)probability curve it gets you filthy rich, be so nice and at least send me a postcard!

so-called ethical licenses, which this is leaning towards, are not FOSS compatible. And yes, this is a serious detail.
https://opensource.org/osd

6. No Discrimination Against Fields of Endeavor
The license must not restrict anyone from making use of the program in a specific field of endeavor. For example, it may not restrict the program from being used in a business, or from being used for genetic research.

for an example of a real world issue caused by this, look at GLM's so-called 'Happy Bunny License' which caused it to be removed from some linux package managers due to the license being non-free.

*ummm*

It's a joke, Rusty...

I don't give much fuck about licenses, hence it's "officially" released under the Do What The Fuck You Want To Public License.

If that joke causes problems for some people who interpret everything literally--so be it.

Remember, I don't give a fuck

 

[Rincewind]

On a more serious note, I'm not big on intellectual property laws, patents, copyrights, and people litigating the shit out of each other, American style...

As I see it, once the cat is out of the bag, technically people can use your code for whatever, no matter what you put in your little README or LICENSE file. Yeah you can take them to court... *theoretically*... if you find out... if you have unlimited time... if you have money to pay the lawyers... and so on. So personally, it's either 100% free open source, or obfuscated, encrypted, etc. closed-source binary releases for me.

That "legal notice" of mine is just a mockery of all the silly legal nonsense that accompanies open source projects lately... Seriously, how can anyone use a simple tool used to map old computer games for *E*V*U*L*? Create some fake Wizardry maps with it or something and distribute it as email spam? Hello?

If I wanted to pick a serious license, it would be either MIT or BSD. For now, I'm quite happy with the tongue-in-cheek WTFPL, which is actually considered to be a valid license.

This pretty much sums up the spirit behind it (it's like the drunk variant of the BSD-guy):

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

SMD last panel?

 

[Rincewind]

Released v1.0.1 which contains some bugfixes (one for a really obscure bug that can actually result in corrupted map files under *very* specific conditions when the auto-save kicks in). Details in the changelog, it's highly recommended to upgrade.

Btw, if anyone experiences serious issues (e.g. you cannot load some of your maps anymore), I'm here to help. The chances for data-corruption are very low, though, but I don't want anyone to lose their progress, so I'll fix up your map files in that eventuality, FREE OF CHARGE!

 

[unseeingeye]

Rincewind​

That Werdna theme is awesome! I know you included me in a message about it a while back but I unfortunately wasn't frequenting this site or playing games much at all over the past few months, but I'm coming back to them recently and this is seriously cool! I do own Grid Cartographer but I would rather use this purely on principle and because I "know" you through the Codex, and I've been considering doing a Might & Magic 1 through 8 mega playthrough recently, so I am definitely going to try this with the earlier games. But seeing that Wizardry theme.. man, now I'm wanting to play it with your mapping tool. Thank you very much!

 

[Rincewind]

But seeing that Wizardry theme.. man, now I'm wanting to play it with your mapping tool. Thank you very much!

Glad you like it! Happy Gridmongering, mate!
I'm playing the C64 version of Wizardry 1 right now, btw.

I've been considering doing a Might & Magic 1 through 8 mega playthrough

That's on my list too. I'm personally seriously considering a Mac-only playthrough of 1 through 5. This guy on lparchive.org makes some very good points about the Mac versions being the definitive and best versions of these games, especially if you want to do a complete walkthrough of the series on the same platform (e.g. the DOS port of MM 1 just looks like garbage; the Amiga port of 2 is good but 3 not so much; then the MT-32 support is totally broken in the DOS version of World of Xeen, keeps crashing in DOSBox and on real hardware too, plus the Mac version contains a lot more voiced dialogs that have been cut from the DOS version because they couldn't figure out how to compress them effectively...)

https://lparchive.org/Might-and-Magic/
https://lparchive.org/Might-and-Magic-II/
https://lparchive.org/Might-Magic-III-Isles-of-Terra/
https://lparchive.org/Might-Magic-World-of-Xeen/

 

[flyingjohn]

his guy on lparchive.org makes some very good points about the Mac versions being the definitive and best versions of these games

"I'm not playing a CRPG that doesn't have mouse support."
Mouse in that era was slower then keyboard significantly. That is one of the points i agree with the crpg addict when it comes to early mouse implementations in games.
"It has black and white graphics, but trust me when I say that most of the graphics aren't really improved by the addition of color."
COLOR SUCKS,LOL.
Seriously, black and white Mac games look sterile compared to even Apple II. Colors adds a lot to the graphics.
Edit: If you want a proper retro experience go for 1-2 on the apple or commodore and past then you have the amiga/dos versions.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

More voiced dialog? Fascinating!

With Might & Magics I now an curious if you could run all three mappers at once and compare? I might attempt that.

 

[unseeingeye]

That's on my list too. I'm personally seriously considering a Mac-only playthrough of 1 through 5. This guy on lparchive.org makes some very good points about the Mac versions being the definitive and best versions of these games, especially if you want to do a complete walkthrough of the series on the same platform (e.g. the DOS port of MM 1 just looks like garbage; the Amiga port of 2 is good but 3 not so much; then the MT-32 support is totally broken in the DOS version of World of Xeen, keeps crashing in DOSBox and on real hardware too, plus the Mac version contains a lot more voiced dialogs that have been cut from the DOS version because they couldn't figure out how to compress them effectively...)

https://lparchive.org/Might-and-Magic/
https://lparchive.org/Might-and-Magic-II/
https://lparchive.org/Might-Magic-III-Isles-of-Terra/
https://lparchive.org/Might-Magic-World-of-Xeen/

You know, I've always wanted to try the Mac versions of Might and Magic, but never have been able to. It has been over a year since I last attempted it, but from what I can recall I managed to download the games but I couldn't figure something out with the emulators I tried, and ultimately I suppose I just gave up and moved on to other projects. I've only ever seriously played the DOS version of Might and Magic 3, but I own a boxed copy of the Amiga version and have played that version (just haven't gotten to far with it yet). I've also messed around with the TurboGrafx-CF version, the Japanese PC-98 and FM Towns versions (just to see what they were like), and the Super Nintendo version. But the Mac version I am DYING to try! I absolutely love the black and white mouse-driven GUI of the early Mac computers but like I said I couldn't figure something out to run the Might and Magic games. I have I think two different emulators for Mac, and I downloaded like a whole bunch of different OS versions, but I don't know how to accurately set it up. Would you perhaps be able to point me in the right direction with a guide or something, just to get it up and running?

I do agree with the previous poster that the color really makes the games beautiful, especially in Isles of Terra and the Xeen games, they are so bright and vibrant and the graphics have held up remarkably well compared to what was to become the dominant approach not long afterwards. But something about the Mac games with their unique ports and GUI has always appealed to me, even back in the day when I mostly only ever saw pictures of the games. I did know one person as a kid who had a Mac and some games for it, but I don't remember even what they were, unfortunately.

Also I didn't know the MT-32 support is busted.. I don't suppose it has General MIDI or SC-55 support? I think it came out in 1991 so right about the same time, maybe that one was too early?

EDIT - I see now that on the link for the LP there is a guide at the bottom of the detailing of the first game for setting up the Mac version. Both emulators mentioned are the two I already have downloaded at home, so I'll give those instructions a try. I'm excited, I've been curious to try them myself for so long now!

 

[unseeingeye]

Oh by the way, speaking of the DOS version of Might and Magic 1, have you seen the graphics mod that somebody put together for it? It isn't revolutionary by any means but it certainly is significant enough to warrant trying! I only just learned of it recently.

https://www.dungeoncrawlers.org/post/might-magic-1-graphics-overhaul-mod/

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Everytime I try to get a MAC emulator running I end up wanting to dash my head into a concrete wall.

 

[flyingjohn]

Everytime I try to get a MAC emulator running I end up wanting to dash my head into a concrete wall.

Let me explain why:
-In order to get the "full experience" of 1988-1995,which were the golden years of mac ports, you need multiple os and multiple emulators since you are dealing with different architectures.
Add to this, that newer os do not play well with older games, and you have a recipe for disaster in terms of compatibility. So you have to maintain round 2-3 emulators to get the "full experience".
-Proprietary file format which literally breaks if you dare to do anything with it outside the emulated mac system.

I did upload files and instructions in the stickied emu thread if anybody want to try. Just look for mac and my username.

 

[unseeingeye]

Everytime I try to get a MAC emulator running I end up wanting to dash my head into a concrete wall.

Same, but yet on my shitty work computer, I somehow just figured out how to get it working (at least for the first three games), after having been mystified by the process for so long. Between my post and right now I got all three games up and running, it really isn't much more esoteric than emulating the different Amiga versions.

 

[unseeingeye]

Let me explain why:
-In order to get the "full experience" of 1988-1995,which were the golden years of mac ports, you need multiple os and multiple emulators since you are dealing with different architectures.
Add to this, that newer os do not play well with older games, and you have a recipe for disaster in terms of compatibility. So you have to maintain round 2-3 emulators to get the "full experience".
-Proprietary file format which literally breaks if you dare to do anything with it outside the emulated mac system.

I did upload files and instructions in the stickied emu thread if anybody want to try. Just look for mac and my username.

Ok I'm going to go check out your instructions in that thread after work, because I'd like to play the color version of World of Xeen and so far have only managed to get 6.0.8 running in Mini vMac.

I assume I'm going to need a later OS version and a different emulator for this?

 

[Tse Tse Fly]

Hello, can you rotate the copied/cut-out rectangle area? Also I couldn't find a way to change the size of the map after creation, is it possible?

 

[flyingjohn]

I assume I'm going to need a later OS version and a different emulator for this?

You should be fine with system 7 stuff, try 7.5 first. You can always try system 9 as well, but no real guarantee it will work well.
Basilisk is the proffered emu for that era.

 

[Rincewind]

I absolutely love the black and white mouse-driven GUI of the early Mac computers but like I said I couldn't figure something out to run the Might and Magic games. I have I think two different emulators for Mac, and I downloaded like a whole bunch of different OS versions, but I don't know how to accurately set it up. Would you perhaps be able to point me in the right direction with a guide or something, just to get it up and running?

I too adore the look of those black & white early Mac games; those run perfectly fine on Mini vMac. For later titles that were designed with colour displays in mind, though, there's no reason to play the derived B&W fallback variants.

I've been able to run MM2 and World of Xeen in colour on System 7.5.5. From memory, I think Macintosh Garden hosts a separate colour version of MM2. For the OS, I think I used some HDD image with the OS pre-installed; Morpheus Kitami pointed me in the right direction about that.

As you can see, MM2 offers both colour & black-and-white variants after installation:

The colour version works fine on this setup; the only problem is that the text scaling is a bit off, but only in some dialogs. Any tips how to resolve this flyingjohn?

In other games, the text looks 100% crisp with no scaling issues:

For World of Xeen, you need to get hold of the *.ati CD-ROM image, then mount it with VirtualCD Imager (the Mac equivalent of Daemon Tools, more or less):

Here's how the game looks in full colour with recorded MIDI music (off a Roland MT-32) and full voice acting:

 

[Rincewind]

Hello, can you rotate the copied/cut-out rectangle area?

Not yet. I'm planning to add it at some point.

Also I couldn't find a way to change the size of the map after creation, is it possible?

https://gridmonger.johnnovak.net/manual/advanced-editing.html#resize-level

Another way is to crop the level with Ctrl+R once you've made a selection in Mark Mode (search for crop on this page).

You can always just do a search on the Keyboard shortcuts page of the manual, or hit "?" (Shift+/) while using the program to display the "quick help".

 

[flyingjohn]

Any tips how to resolve this @flyingjohn?

Sorry, never had that issue. The only tips i have is try messing with the game/emu color/resolution settings.

 

[Rincewind]

More voiced dialog? Fascinating!

I'm too of the opinion that voice acting is often unnecessary and annoying, especially in more modern games. However, in this particular case my understanding is that they recorded full voice acting for the CD-ROM version of World of Xeen which they included in the Mac version (there is OS level support for the speech compression they used in Mac OS).

Then when it came to the DOS release, however, they had to cut content because of ineptitude, basically — they were not able to implement a similar speech compression scheme for DOS, and they did not want to ship the game on multiple CDs with uncompressed speech samples.

Similarly, the MT-32 driver in World of Xeen is bugged beyond recognition; it crashes the game left right center after a few minutes. That's not a DOSBox problem as the exact same behaviour is present on real hardware; it's a result of bad coding and/or insufficient testing.

In contrast, the Mac CD-ROM release contains audio recordings of the MIDI music played on a Roland MT-32 (the MIDI device the soundtrack was composed on). Admittedly, it's a little bit noisy, but it kinda adds to the atmosphere

I can't manage to dig up the Vogons (?) thread where this was discussed in detail, but basically these are the justifications for nominating the Mac release as the best version for World of Xeen (as in closest to the developers' intentions).

Of course, just playing the floppy DOS versions with AdLib sound and no speech is an equally valid choice, either for nostalgic or whatever other reasons.