Fallout 76 - online Fallout spinoff from Bethesda - now on Steam with Wastelanders NPC expansion

[Cael]

Laughing this hard about a Bethesturd game ought to have a health warning attached. Bethesturd should be arrested for attempted murder via comedy.

 

[Mud']

Nah fuck that. If you want to have "player skill" take precedence then make a shooter or fighting game. When you try to do the player skill shit in a game which has some form of RPG mechanics you get real garbage that doesn't flow right. I can't be the only one that cannot stand all this "player skill" stuff which really translates to twitchy skill 720 no scope reactionZ. It also attracts the most vile and most greasy of the unwashed masses. The type of person that loves Twitch clip montages set to EDM tracks and likely types emotes as words or says them out loud.

If you're giving me PVP in an RPG then I better get EVAPORATED by that fat, repugnant sack of trash who spent 1,000 hours within a month. I want to get my shit stomped because that's kind of why PVP in some games like MMORPGs can be fun. It was the opportunity to get a big scary weapon and your first want, your first immediate action is to go and obliterate some lesser geared scrub and make them your new e-girlfriend until they decide to log off. If everyone has a fair chance, then the RPG portion shouldn't exist since it's all just fluff at that point.

You need to understand, if I'm level 50 and you're level 10, I don't want there to be some behind-the-scenes scaling technique to make the game enjoyable for you. I want to destroy you. I want to show you what you could become one day if you work hard at it and grind like I did. There should be no comparison in our abilities because my character is so above yours that hitting you once sends you offline because of the immense power I wield.

In fact, I should be able to kill your character with such unmitigated power and with such force that you have that moment in your mind where you think I am actually some sort of sociopath IRL and likely abuse my poor mother by forgetting to arrange her medication. Or maybe you think I am such a lowdown scumsucking cunt that I must, I must have the smallest dick and the face of a gnoll so nobody will ever fuck me.

So pretty much FOnline PVP?

 

[Risewild]

So when announcing the game he calls it softcore survival,

No, when announcing the game he called it a "Open World Survival". I even posted the video of him on E3 (when he announced the game) saying those exact same words. So no, he didn't announced it as a softcore survival, he announced it as a survival game. Probably only after his developers told him that it wouldn't be survival, he came back and called it "softcore survival", which is still survival. Then after he probably actually saw what the game looked like, he was "stop calling it survival".
It's his own words, not mine. backpedaling is so Todd, he does it all the time. Say one thing on E3, then come back later pretending he never said anything, then we get the game and it is totally different from whatever he said before.

I think softcore survival is a good way of describing the game but I don't blame them from backing off from the word because lots of people see 'survival' and immediately associate the game with hardcore survival games, which is totally not what this game is.

Softcore survival doesn't exist though. The Survival genre can never be softcore, it is a paradox. Or it is a survival game (harsh, hard, usually involving micromanaging and where death penalizes you a lot) or it is not. What Todd should have said about Fallout 76 is that it is a softcore shooter with needs, or something silly like that.
He uses a word that is an entire genre of games without even knowing what it means, and then gets butthurt when the gamers start associating the game with all the other games of that genre he mentions. Then he makes up a "softcore survival", which still calls it a survival game, and then realizes that Fallout 76 is not a survival game and then he has to come and tell everyone that it is not a survival game after all, so people shouldn't call it that... After he was all over the place calling it already.

Ok but FO76 is going to be WAAAAAY more popular than rust/arc/conan and one of the reasons is because of things like this, where you don't get punished for logging out and having a life outside the game.

That remains to be seen. It might be more popular, it might be the same or it might not be popular at all. As far as I know no one can see the future.
But I can tell you one thing, people used to play Fallout for a few reasons: interesting characters, interesting quests, character building, exploration, feel like a god after leveling up a few levels. Now from all of those Fallout 76 only has exploration. Most Fallout fans will get disappointed or bored after several hours of playing the game.
Fallout 76 is the kind of online game that I call "a chore game" where when you play you realize you're just doing a boring chore over and over and over. In this case it is "collect junk, use junk to craft, collect more junk, use junk to craft". I have no doubt that there are people that will enjoy doing this over and over, but I also have no doubt many will not.

I think this is just something we disagree on. Feeling impossibly behind someone who no-lifes a game is a huge turn off to me. I don't want my chance of winning a fight to be overwhelmingly determined by the number of hours I've sunk into the game. I'm sure armor and weapon quality will give you a nice boost in power but it shouldn't be like WoW or something where better gear or higher level literally determines the outcome in 100% of fights.

But then, if the game does not reward the time you put into it, what's the point? Why play a game where you spent sweat, blood and tears to make a character, and then a nobody can just defeat you? What is the point in even leveling up or getting equipment then? It's not like it is fun to just go around kill stuff, collect junk and craft equipment, so why do it? Why not just run around with a knife... The point of playing games is to feel rewarded by the time you invest in it. Some people might have fun leveling their characters and making them strong and then anyone and their grandmother can defeat them, but I bet most won't.
Also, by that previous video, PvP is really bad. Which is understandable, since the game is using an engine that was never designed for players trying to hit other players, or for fast, mobile combat. And VATS seems also useless for PvP like the guy on the video commented, since VATS only auto target, if the other player moves, VATS will not be able to keep up in real time, so you will miss while using VATS.

I never said that

So, you reply to what I said:

Look, this is how you should post in a thread about something you will LOVE but others don't seem to:

• Post about good aspects of the game.
• Post about what you plan to do with your friends in the game.

With:

Exploring is always good in these games, lots of enemy variety, the shooting is fun, weapons are cool, building gives you something to work on long term, map is like 4x bigger than FO4, graphics are great, there are built in PVP systems, they're striking a nice balance between 'hardcore full loot' style pvp and 'totally carebear casual', there's proximity chat so I can scream into my mic while chopping an unsuspecting player up with an axe

You also say right away that you can scream into your mic while chopping another player (as if that is one of the things about what you plan to do in-game). That sounded to me that it was things you wanted to do in game.
Not to mention it was one of the good things you think about the game, but then on your next reply, you say it is not important after all. So which one is it?

IDK I guess you won't be able to trick them into fighting, but you can still harass them by following around and shooting at them which is just as fun. If they really get annoyed I think they can block you. Do I like that? Not really, but it's probably a good thing to keep assholes like me from totally ruining the game for people.

Sounds like you're a griefer. Having fun at harassing others by shooting at them?
Also, I remember reading a very recent experience from a player of Fallout 76, the anti-griefing system just doesn't work, it is just as I had said in this thread from the start. People can still kill you even if you don't accept the duel, they can still kill you even with pacifist mode (which prevents you from accepting a duel) and people can still grief you. And it will happen. Which will kill the fun for a good chunk of players, because the ywill be playing this game because it was advertised as a snowflake game, with good anti-griefing systems.
Link to the guy getting griefed.

They've stated that taking a workshop automatically turns pacifist off if you have it on and flags you for PVP. As for chances of running into other players, I guess that depends on how rare the resources are from each workshop and how scarce the workshops are in the world. I would imagine there's more demand for fusion cell or meds workshops and those would be often contested, maybe less so for cereal box workshops or whatever. Also the workshop builds stuff on an hourly basis so you need to hold it for some time. You can't just take it then log off 5 minutes later.

So, if I understand this. You take over a workshop and have to stay online for at least an hour to get some goodies? I also heard that "monsters" can take the workshop back. So what are the chances you can take over a workshop, and keep it to be actually useful for you, unless you are playing for several hours without logging out, and have to keep coming back to defend it (which means you will lose resources like ammo, food, healing, etc)?
It seems like a lot of work for little gain. Specially since like I mentioned before, if the attacker dies, they can just respawn around the corner and keep continuously attacking until the defender falls. Which, I will be honest, sounds boring, specially for the defender.

PVP is always extremely popular, especially in games like this. People are 100% going to be using this mode.

Some will, but what about all the people who are saying that Fallout 76 will be great for them, because they are sick and tired of PvP? The main point of Fallout 76 is that they say griefing will not exist in Fallout 76, that they implemented lots of systems to make griefing not appealing, that Fallout 76 will be focused on player cooperation. I bet the majority of players will not want PvP, and by the stuff I read all the time on gaming communities and stuff like reddit and Steam, people are buying the game because they don't like PvP.
Since the servers will only allow less than 40 people per server, what are the chances of having more than 2 or 3 people that will want PvP at the same time?

BTW I think the player limit on a sever is more in the 30-40 range.

You're right, I have seen people say it is 24-36 limit. I noticed my mistake later but the Codex didn't let me edit my post anymore.

I'm sure the lore breaks are stupid but again people who play Beth games largely don't care about lore/story and the ones that do are really fucking stupid. Expecting consistent lore or good story out of bethesda is insane.

I totally agree with expecting good lore from Bethesda is insane. But there is a difference between making good lore and breaking good lore that already exists for no good reason.
That is what fans are rolling their eyes at. I already mentioned before that Bethesda didn't need to break the lore at all. There is no reason to do it. But they did, and they're getting a lot more backlash for it than I had expected. They were even forced by the fan complaints to come up with quick explanations for their lore breaks.
This is Bethesda we're talking about, they explicitly said they don't care about what fans want, they do whatever they want. And yet, after getting swarmed on social media about "why is this happening?", "it makes no sense!" and other stuff like that, they went and made some farfetched explanation for those lore breaks.
If no one cared about lore, there wouldn't have been such a big backlash. So big it forced a company (that said they don't care about what fans think, that they do what they want) to quickly make up a reason.

From gameplay vids the FO76 weapons look fine to me but I guess we've only seen things like rifles/knives/pistols. This is like a minor subjective complaint tho

I wouldn't call it a minor thing though.
Like I mentioned, many Fallout 4 players really hate the aesthetics of the weapons in the game. Lot's of complaints about it everywhere on the internet. Luckily, there were modders who quickly made Classic Fallout Weapon mods and real world weapon mods. Those mods are overwhelmingly popular.
If the guns on a shooter game look bad, it puts off some people from even trying the game in the first place.

No it didn't lol that has the plastic look of a PS3 era game like modern warfare 3 or something. It was impressive for the time but they cut a lot of corners to make it work and it just doesn't compare to modern graphic quality.

Yes it did.
Didn't you even watch the video I posted? It looks better than any Fallout 76 video I watched. And this Crysis video max res is 720p HD, while some Fallout 76 videos were 1080p HD. Fallout 4 had no real grass or real shadows, while Crysis had those since the first game. Fallout 4 doesn't even have real reflections, like on puddles or shiny surfaces, guess what Crysis has?

The graphical engine of Fallout 76 is a more polished Fallout 4 one (increased distance view mostly). It was outdated when Fallout 4 was released and it is outdated today. Crysis graphics look better, have more detail, the textures are beautiful and the effects like, reflections, shadows, grass, light, smoke and dust are better too. This on a game that came up 11 years ago. Crysis graphical engine also requires less power from your computer too, and it still shows better details, effects and textures.
Back when Fallout 4 was relevant, there were plenty of comparisons about the graphics on it and the graphics on other older games like STALKER for example. Anyone knows that Bethesda doesn't keep up with the graphical times.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Risewild]

this releasing of 2 games under same engine must be taxing. When will they fuse fallout and skyrim?

I made this joke pic years ago when people kept asking us about making a project like that:

 

[Cael]

this releasing of 2 games under same engine must be taxing. When will they fuse fallout and skyrim?

I made this joke pic years ago when people kept asking us about making a project like that:

Well, like Trump, the joke's on yoooouuuuu!!!!

:D:D:D

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Squid]

Btw did anyone even enjoy weapons in Fallout 4? (this as well?) I don’t know what’s the fun in a game that’s a shooter, to have only some weird makeshift pipe weapons. Especially after the weaponry pornfest that was New Vegas.

I have no idea how anyone could. The weapon customization was lackluster as hell too. New barrel, better barrel, best barrel.

 

[Wunderbar]

There was no depth in weapon upgrading in F4, it was all about dps.

 

[Risewild]

There was no depth in weapon upgrading in F4, it was all about dps.

Same with most "Perks".

 

[Squid]

There was no depth in weapon upgrading in F4, it was all about dps.

Same with most "Perks".

I like that perk problem video someone made.


I can see how the perks could have worked like one youtuber mentioned before we saw how it actually worked but it obviously failed.

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

No, when announcing the game he called it a "Open World Survival". I even posted the video of him on E3 (when he announced the game) saying those exact same words.

bro in the vid u posted, like 10 seconds later he calls it softcore survival

Softcore survival doesn't exist though.

Needing to eat/drink/manage conditions are survival elements but they're not super harsh here hence softcore. I guess he could say "It's a shooter but u gotta eat/drink/watch out for broken limbs/manage status effects/build shit but that's long winded.

people used to play Fallout for a few reasons: interesting characters, interesting quests, character building, exploration, feel like a god after leveling up a few levels. Now from all of those Fallout 76 only has exploration. Most Fallout fans will get disappointed or bored after several hours of playing the game.

Even if it were a single player game made by beth it wouldn't have: interesting characters, interesting quests, character building.. so all you're missing is feeling like a god but that's when the game gets boring for me so I'm ok w/ that.

Fallout 76 is the kind of online game that I call "a chore game" where when you play you realize you're just doing a boring chore over and over and over. In this case it is "collect junk, use junk to craft, collect more junk, use junk to craft". I have no doubt that there are people that will enjoy doing this over and over, but I also have no doubt many will not.

...
But then, if the game does not reward the time you put into it, what's the point? Why play a game where you spent sweat, blood and tears to make a character, and then a nobody can just defeat you? What is the point in even leveling up or getting equipment then? It's not like it is fun to just go around kill stuff, collect junk and craft equipment, so why do it? Why not just run around with a knife... The point of playing games is to feel rewarded by the time you invest in it. Some people might have fun leveling their characters and making them strong and then anyone and their grandmother can defeat them, but I bet most won't.

There's a degree of reward for crafting or finding better armor/weapons.. I'm sure a naked level 1 with a knife won't do so hot against a high level with power armor and a minigun but the low level can probably knock him out if he's afk for an hour. The big thing to me is that it seems like a high level who's played for 1000 hours won't be an impossible fight for a high level who's played 50 hours because it'll largely come down to skill once you've maxed out perk cards or whatever.

People like this kind of balance btw, hence popularity of... basically every popular multiplayer FPS/moba. Also people like collecting junk, hence popularity of cosmetics in like every game and costume/pet farming in mmos. I'm sure collecting flowers or party hats or whatever crap for their camp will be popular with a lot of people.

Also, by that previous video, PvP is really bad. Which is understandable, since the game is using an engine that was never designed for players trying to hit other players, or for fast, mobile combat. And VATS seems also useless for PvP like the guy on the video commented, since VATS only auto target, if the other player moves, VATS will not be able to keep up in real time, so you will miss while using VATS.

Yeah vats is retarded and shouldn't even be in this game.

Not to mention it was one of the good things you think about the game, but then on your next reply, you say it is not important after all. So which one is it?

I meant that FO is somewhere between hardcore full-loot type of game and total carebear type game like...

EVE --------------------- FO76 ---------------------- WOW

or something like that, falling in between the two

So, if I understand this. You take over a workshop and have to stay online for at least an hour to get some goodies? I also heard that "monsters" can take the workshop back. So what are the chances you can take over a workshop, and keep it to be actually useful for you, unless you are playing for several hours without logging out, and have to keep coming back to defend it (which means you will lose resources like ammo, food, healing, etc)?
It seems like a lot of work for little gain. Specially since like I mentioned before, if the attacker dies, they can just respawn around the corner and keep continuously attacking until the defender falls. Which, I will be honest, sounds boring, specially for the defender.

I'm not defending the ability to respawn right where you die, that's reallly stupid. I would hope that they're smart enough to not let that happen around PVP hubs like this. Anyway I think the idea is that holding a workshop will be a waaaaaay better way of getting things per time spent compared to just roaming and looting houses so there's incentive.

Since the servers will only allow less than 40 people per server, what are the chances of having more than 2 or 3 people that will want PvP at the same time?

Not sure, maybe when you turn that mode on they send you to a server with others who have the mode on or something.. Or maybe there will just be enough people with the mode on that they won't need to do that.

Anyone knows that Bethesda doesn't keep up with the graphical times.

Yea I think they make like one engine per console generation and just stick with it until the next gen. Can't blame them though, because if they spent a bunch of money making a new engine current consoles wouldn't even be able to run it. They seem to barely be able to handle FO76 as it is. I don't think it's an optimization issue either as much as a limitation of current consoles.

They do offer way better graphics for PC though so it's probably best to see PC footage before judging especially since there's no way in hell I'd ever play a shooter on console lolloll

 

[Makabb]

preloading beta

 

[Makabb]

Bethesda just went full retard mode

 

[Edija]

Ahhh... *sips monster* the final step where Bethesda drops any illusion that anything they do should be taken seriously in any regard.

 

[TheImplodingVoice]

I want to get FO76. But after everything I've seen so far I can't help but feel like Bethesda literally wants to destroy the the Fallout franchise or maybe I just realised that the last decent game Bethesda made was Morrowind.

 

[taxalot]

I am starting to have a bad feeling about Bethesda acquiring the Fallout IP.

 

[Astral Rag]

Meanwhile on RPS:

Fallout 3 is ten years old, let's remember its best stories and quests

A megaton of memories

 

[Vincente]

This legit looks like a $20 DLC for Fallout 4, holy hell lol.

 

[Black]

Bethesda just went full retard mode

My idea is to explore more of the world and more of the ethics of a post-nuclear world, not to make a better plasma gun.

- TimCain

 

[Gerrard]

Crysis graphical engine also requires less power from your computer too, and it still shows better details, effects and textures.

The Cryengine in first Crysis is so shit you can't even get 60FPS in some places on a modern top of the line PC.

E: fixed timestamp

 

[BlackGoat]

Yeesh, that live action vid is pure cringe

Must be using the same marketing team that came up with this shit

 

[Turjan]

this releasing of 2 games under same engine must be taxing. When will they fuse fallout and skyrim?

They are already close. You don't learn dragon shouts from scorchbeasts but partial nuclear launch codes, but otherwise, the games are on their way of fusing.

 

[Squid]

I am starting to have a bad feeling about Bethesda acquiring the Fallout IP.

It took you this long to start? I would have figured most people would have stopped feeling bad about it and started feeling apathetic towards it.

But I guess we are on page 90

 

[Big Wrangle]

Fallout started dying ever since the Brotherhood of Steel PS2 game, no surprise here.