Elite: Dangerous

[dbx]

The claims of 'all the processing' being done in the 'cloud' so it wouldn't work on the client still don't work for me.

They don't work because that statement is pure bullshit. For a client-server architecture to be worth it's salt (and the money poured into it) a single server must at the least process hundreds of concurrent players in real time, otherwise you are losing money faster than a drunk midget in a stripjoint. And if a single server cun process a hundred peoples, than sure as hell my PC can do everything for just une player, me.

 

[dbx]

Do we know what form the online connection will take in this game by the way? I mean during singleplayer. You will need a constant connection, and the game will kick you out if your internet fails? Or it will only check it in certain interwalls, and if your connection is not up at the moment, you can continue playing, and the game will check later and sync the data?

Edit: Got it:

Galaxy, story, missions, have to match, and it does mean the single player has to connect to the server from time to time,

So you fuckers with third worldian internet connection can shut up. The game doesn't need a constant connection, it will only check it from time to time. So if your connection is down at a moment, you can continue playing I assume.

Judging from the current beta and my shitty conenction, in solo mode, unless you are just cruising in a system and doing nothing, everything else requires a connection. Also it does check every 30/40 seconds for a server connection, which causes an exit to main menu in caso of lost connection.

 

[Ulminati]

Was going to buy, but guess I'll just pirate it now. That kind of bullshit shouldn't be rewarded.

Did they ever manage to crack Diablo 3? It could be the always-online is there as DRM

 

[shihonage]

Was going to buy, but guess I'll just pirate it now. That kind of bullshit shouldn't be rewarded.

Did they ever manage to crack Diablo 3? It could be the always-online is there as DRM

We have 100% functional WoW emulation servers now, some of which emulate Burning Crusade and even beyond. Nobody cares to emulate Diablo3 because there was never a time when it was good.

 

[Ulminati]

Guess we'll be seeing you in-game in 10 years then

 

[shihonage]

By definition of localhost server emulation, you won't.

And given the likely rudimentary netcode used in ED, there could be an offline version out a month after its release. A bunch of stuff would be broken, but a few months later they'd reach full playability.

 

[Ulminati]

That'd still be longer than 95% of DRM solutions out there. And since they're already planning to add planetary landings/station exploration later, the emiulator will be just in time to entice a bunch of players to buy the official expansion instead of waiting another 6 months for the local servers to catch up. It took WoW years to have a semi-playable server for vanilla (missing tons of stuff). and they had a way, way bigger playerbase than ED is likely to have.

At least that's wha tI think the reason to axe single player was. Really strong DRM without risking the PR nightmare of adding intrusive DRM. that they didn't have to do parts of the code double for SP/MP was just an added bonus on top.

 

[shihonage]

There are degrees of thinness. Whereas WoW is a "skinny" client, ED is "curvy", or most likely, a "BBW" client. A skinny client version of ED would handle more like Eve Online, where you can forget about realtime combat.

With WoW they had to reverse-engineer all game mechanics, but with ED the most crucial mechanics are likely already in the client, which reduces the required workload significantly. This also increases likelyhood of the outcome where a few months from release the multiplayer part of ED will be filled with speed hackers who never miss a shot.

Also, due to likely general insecurity of server code, servers will likely be taken down or overloaded a lot of the time, which will eventually force Braben to release single-player code after all.

It's going to be really interesting to see this unfold. I still hope they change their mind on the retarded decision before release date.

 

[bonescraper]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online. Otherwise, they wouldn't create a galaxy that big. Again, we're talking here about 400 billion star sytems with trillions or quadrillions of stars and planets, with everything recreated in 1:1 scale. Even 500 systems would be too much for an offline singleplayer game. Offline singleplayer was always an afterthought. If you'd spend a second of your time picturing the sacle of this game, you would realize that.

But i guess they could cut out 500 systems, and make a separate stand-alone singleplayer game out of that, just to satisfy you pissheads. With static galaxy and economy it would be the most pointless game ever though.

 

[Norfleet]

There are degrees of thinness. Whereas WoW is a "skinny" client, ED is "curvy", or most likely, a "BBW" client. A skinny client version of ED would handle more like Eve Online, where you can forget about realtime combat.

Well, being a thin client is not something which precludes real-time combat. Netrek had real-time combat, in an age of dialup. It was also an extremely thin client, pretty much the archetype of secure clients: Open-sourced with multiple competing versions. The client had no authority to cheat with. Best you could do was make a bot client, which allowed you to lose very efficiently.

 

[shihonage]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online.

That would be great of ED had features of an MMO.

http://thebitpulse.com/2014/11/elite-dangerous-isnt-an-mmo-yet-and-may-never-be/

 

[Turisas]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online. Otherwise, they wouldn't create a galaxy that big. Again, we're talking here about 400 billion star sytems with trillions or quadrillions of stars and planets, with everything recreated in 1:1 scale. Even 500 systems would be too much for an offline singleplayer game. Offline singleplayer was always an afterthought. If you'd spend a second of your time picturing the sacle of this game, you would realize that.

But i guess they could cut out 500 systems, and make a separate stand-alone singleplayer game out of that, just to satisfy you pissheads. With static galaxy and economy it would be the most pointless game ever though.

You wanna talk about scale? You'd never come across other players if they didn't have that hand-holding matchmaker system in place, that apparently doesn't even work all that well according to shihonage's link.
It's just DRM, pure and simple. Fuck their "vision", devs always like to drum up these excuses when it's really all about the money (instead of RNG setting up prices of goods in system X, 0.1% of the time it'll be player #43827 affecting them - wow, muh immershun!). And why would you limit the amount of systems for SP? There's simply no reason to. There's plenty of valid reasons to prefer SP over MP and there's no need to list them all here.

 

[J_C]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online.

That would be great of ED had features of an MMO.

http://thebitpulse.com/2014/11/elite-dangerous-isnt-an-mmo-yet-and-may-never-be/

LOL, you quote that article? The first sencente is a load of horseshit, which shows how well written the article is.

Typically, an MMO takes place in a persistent world, where the things you do stay there even when you stop playing.

Yeah, EVE online may be the only one which does persistent world. Every other MMO resets from time to time. That's why you can grind the game again and again and again.

 

[shihonage]

I sense unrelated stress being projected into an arbitrary gaming topic.

You really need to end that relationship, J_C.

 

[J_C]

I sense unrelated stress being projected into an arbitrary gaming topic.

You really need to end that relationship, J_C.

I know, right! But not now.

 

[Turisas]

I guess this is what they meant when they said dynamic universe:

Spoiler

" The Game may incorporate technology (which may be provided by Frontier or third party service providers engaged by Frontier (each a "Dynamic Advertising Provider")) which enables advertising to be uploaded into the Game on your PC, and changed while the Game is being played on-line. In order that the Dynamic Advertising Provider is able to direct advertising appropriate to your Game and geographic region, as well as to the correct location within the computer game, certain non-personally identifiable data and information may be retrieved and retained by the Dynamic Advertising Provider including your I.P. address, geographic location, in-game position, and information concerning the appearance of advertising visible during your gameplay (for example, the length of time an item of advertising was visible, the dimensions of the advertisements). In addition, the Dynamic Advertising Provider may assign a unique identification number which is stored on your PC and which is used to monitor and calculate the number of views of dynamic advertising during gameplay. None of the information collected for this purpose including the identification number can be used to identify you.

The technology employed by Dynamic Advertising Providers may be located outside your country of residence (including outside of the European Union).

Where a Game incorporates dynamic advertising technology, the technology which serves the provision of dynamic in-game advertising is integrated within the Game. This means that if you do not want to receive dynamic advertising, you should only play the game when you are not connected to the Internet."

Sell a game at full price, then show ads to the poor sods anyway. Nice one, Braben.

 

[praetor]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online. Otherwise, they wouldn't create a galaxy that big. Again, we're talking here about 400 billion star sytems with trillions or quadrillions of stars and planets, with everything recreated in 1:1 scale. Even 500 systems would be too much for an offline singleplayer game. Offline singleplayer was always an afterthought. If you'd spend a second of your time picturing the sacle of this game, you would realize that.

oh, you mean like the original Frontier: Elites?

and wtf does the size of the universe have to do with it being single or multi? are you implying that to "win" the game or have fun with it you have to explore everything? then how does "mulitplayer" change it? you'll explore as much in SP as you would in MP, it's not like your mind is linked to others over the internet. the only fucking difference between multi and single (other than the dynamic economy that isn't all that important or hard to do on the clinet in offline) is that from time to time you'll encounter real players instead of bots, and considering the size of the universe, you might as well be playing in singleplayer

it's obviously a D3 situation where they went with the shittiest, most obnoxious DRM available to mankind

i wanted to buy it, now i'm not sure any more

 

[Runciter]

This means that if you do not want to receive dynamic advertising, you should only play the game when you are not connected to the Internet."

 

[J_C]

This means that if you do not want to receive dynamic advertising, you should only play the game when you are not connected to the Internet."

Obviously this ad stuff was written before the scraping of offline mode. Nothing to see here.

 

[Mortmal]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online. Otherwise, they wouldn't create a galaxy that big. Again, we're talking here about 400 billion star sytems with trillions or quadrillions of stars and planets, with everything recreated in 1:1 scale. Even 500 systems would be too much for an offline singleplayer game. Offline singleplayer was always an afterthought. If you'd spend a second of your time picturing the sacle of this game, you would realize that.

oh, you mean like the original Frontier: Elites?

and wtf does the size of the universe have to do with it being single or multi? are you implying that to "win" the game or have fun with it you have to explore everything? then how does "mulitplayer" change it? you'll explore as much in SP as you would in MP, it's not like your mind is linked to others over the internet. the only fucking difference between multi and single (other than the dynamic economy that isn't all that important or hard to do on the clinet in offline) is that from time to time you'll encounter real players instead of bots, and considering the size of the universe, you might as well be playing in singleplayer

it's obviously a D3 situation where they went with the shittiest, most obnoxious DRM available to mankind

i wanted to buy it, now i'm not sure any more

Tried the beta a few days and even in its uncomplete stage , it's evidence enough it will be worth it .the flight model is fantastic, theres a huge feeling of liberty like the old frontiers ,if you are fan of them its a must buy, we have been waiting for that since ages. The online requirement, it's a DRM, thats the only stain on the picture, i wasnt expecting that either, i though you could play solo and update the markets on the live server if you wanted too, but apprently now you have to.
Well those servers arent going to maintain themselves for free, so cosmetics purchases and station ads are the lesser evil. I prefer to accept it , than getting nothing at all, except X2 and X3 we got no space game worth playing , and even those not everyone here will agree.

 

[Whiran]

Well those servers arent going to maintain themselves for free, so cosmetics purchases and station ads are the lesser evil. I prefer to accept it , than getting nothing at all, except X2 and X3 we got no space game worth playing , and even those not everyone here will agree.

What happens when they shut down the servers though?

Or, what happens when their cloudy infrastructure crashes or is down for maintenance?

Plus what in the world was that stuff about advertising? Was that for real?

 

[praetor]

i hate the X series, so i am/was definitely looking forward to ED. but always-on DRM is such a colossal shitstain of a decision that i just can't support it... goddamnit, Braben! why?!

edit: as Whiran noted, their servers being down for maintenance or other stuff is a big concern. my ISP acting up is another... those 2 things should not hinder my enjoyment of a mostly SP experience. but apparently master braben disagrees

 

[dbx]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online. Otherwise, they wouldn't create a galaxy that big. Again, we're talking here about 400 billion star sytems with trillions or quadrillions of stars and planets, with everything recreated in 1:1 scale. Even 500 systems would be too much for an offline singleplayer game. Offline singleplayer was always an afterthought. If you'd spend a second of your time picturing the sacle of this game, you would realize that.

But i guess they could cut out 500 systems, and make a separate stand-alone singleplayer game out of that, just to satisfy you pissheads. With static galaxy and economy it would be the most pointless game ever though.

I don't remember Elite, Frontier or FFE being MMOs...
Also, elite's universe is procedural, or do you really expect them to have the entire galaxy "on the cloud"...
And by the way this -> http://en.spaceengine.org/ has 400 bilion GALAXIES, each one with bilions stars, and most stars with 5-10 planets, and each planets has moons, asteroids, rings. And there's also comets, black holes etc. And you can land on every single one of them. All in roughly 800Mb.

 

[bonescraper]

I always thought offline singeplayer in this game was a dumb idea. It's like playing a MMO alone. The biggest MMO ever created.

This game always was meant to be played online.

That would be great of ED had features of an MMO.

I didn't say it is a MMO. It would be like playing Borderlands solo, pointless and boring. No dynamic economy or events, no player rivalry. A perfect example of a game that gets old after few days.

You wanna talk about scale? You'd never come across other players if they didn't have that hand-holding matchmaker system in place, that apparently doesn't even work all that well according to shihonage's link.
It's just DRM, pure and simple. Fuck their "vision", devs always like to drum up these excuses when it's really all about the money (instead of RNG setting up prices of goods in system X, 0.1% of the time it'll be player #43827 affecting them - wow, muh immershun!). And why would you limit the amount of systems for SP? There's simply no reason to. There's plenty of valid reasons to prefer SP over MP and there's no need to list them all here.

No, it's not DRM. This game was built around online based economy and persistent universe. In order to make a 100% offline singleplayer game you'd either have to compromise and deliver a dull, static game world, or you'd have to add entirely new mechanics, exclusively for the offline singleplayer mode.

oh, you mean like the original Frontier: Elites?

No. Like i said above, this game was built around online features, therefore it's totally unlike the original games.

and wtf does the size of the universe have to do with it being single or multi? are you implying that to "win" the game or have fun with it you have to explore everything? then how does "mulitplayer" change it? you'll explore as much in SP as you would in MP, it's not like your mind is linked to others over the internet.

You won't explore the entire galaxy, but where you won't go someone else will. And that impacts the whole game world and every player, to a bigger or lesser extent. Unexplored systems can be explored, then colonized, then new trade routes become available, factions may clash with each other over resource rich planets, etc. That's how the game was designed, and that's the shit Braben was talking about since the Kicstarter days.

the only fucking difference between multi and single (other than the dynamic economy that isn't all that important or hard to do on the clinet in offline) is that from time to time you'll encounter real players instead of bots, and considering the size of the universe, you might as well be playing in singleplayer

Just like i said above, you really show how clueless you are. It's not only the economy, it's everything from colonization and resource extraction to faction rivlary and wars.

So, most of you haven't been following the game at all, but now you jump in because you smell some kind of "conspiracy", and proceed to flood the thread with inane bullshit. The best part is, none of you motherfuckers have actually played the game. Those who have, Bradylama, Blaine, Ulminati, SuicideBunny, Mortmal, J_C and me don't give a fuck.

it's obviously a D3 situation where they went with the shittiest, most obnoxious DRM available to mankind

Bullshitz. R00fles.

 

[Mortmal]

Well those servers arent going to maintain themselves for free, so cosmetics purchases and station ads are the lesser evil. I prefer to accept it , than getting nothing at all, except X2 and X3 we got no space game worth playing , and even those not everyone here will agree.

What happens when they shut down the servers though?

Or, what happens when their cloudy infrastructure crashes or is down for maintenance?

Plus what in the world was that stuff about advertising? Was that for real?

When that will happen theres nothing preventing to remove the drm, and anyway who will still plays it then. This game will stay long term, many more features are planned and we already paid for the expansion pack .The DRM and ads(small panels at the entrance of biggest stations) are the lesser evils , biggest problem is people not paying for the games they enjoy, and big companies only publishing profitable mainstream stuff . We had nothing till people start paying upfront for kickstarters , now it has been a tsunami of incline.