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Age of Wonders 4
- Thread starter Lagi
- Start date
-
- Tags
- age of wonders
Because they can sell it later as DLC
As is tradition now.
- Joined
- Jun 28, 2017
- Messages
- 31,774
Play AoW 1 if you want the real AoW experience.
Van-d-all
Erudite
I mean bugs proper, not some graphic glitches or misspelled text, but there's plenty of those too. Most annoying are the ones that should do something, but don't. Several character creation options don't give what they should (Godir sword doesn't give mount, nor ability). Various spells or tome effects don't apply as they should (Transmute Resources is not even in spellbook after researching). Some abilities are doubled or even trippled, because there are several with same name (you can have Intimidating Aura on single character twice; Spider's web damage is doubled).
But most of all there are numerical bugs. Reapers have souls upkeep aside already having mythical imperium upkeep. Lots of things, like upkeep, damage or bonus throughout spells, imperium development or city buildings says it's X but it's actually Y. And that's just things you can see, should you investigate. Hell only knows if things you don't see like critical chance, are even calculated right.
Zboj Lamignat
Arcane
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2012
- Messages
- 5,777
AoW wasn't even a 4X at the start, that's exactly the issues many fans have. And the issue modern gamers should have is that this is going all-in for being 4X instead of AoW, but the entire 4X aspect is bland af.
Wow you weren't kidding. Do you know if that game is worth putting up with all the storyfagness? I don't really like the music or graphics either.
The general combat, units are interesting, i remember the units concepts was very innovative, and you could give some items to t1 units - but still tactical combat in AOW3 is better. Research spell book is fantastic, because each "tech" is obtain in a little different way, and thats super cool. There is also extensive crafting system - if you into collecting ingredients and making consumable items for your units.
Lots of people on dex, absolutly no-life Eo, and are trying different characters. I just cannot get past the narrative wall.
Last week i play quite a few fantasy strategy games. Bear in mind that i play them in like 1h max session, a filthy casual, so not really sperging about them.
Cof Eo - too much reading
heroes 2 - superb units roster for each faction (fheroes2)
heroes 5.5 - drop it because orbiting with camera non stop in strategic map
age of wonder 3 - tactical combat is best ever. but the game feels like RPG on strategic map, plus you make doomstack.
age of wonder 1 mod evolve and ziggurat - this mods nicely trim the OP heroes, make tier1 useful and affordable, and add multiple subtle changes (spells adjustment). The game is much better than vanillla. Im playing it with UI mod (Scroll of Swiftness) which make few very handy key shortcuts (Q to cast spells is a bless, instead of fiddling with hero character sheet).
Myriads: Renaissance - play 60turn of demo. Great board game like game. I will buy it today.
Warhammer: Gladius - civilization with only combat. nah...
Fantasy general 2 - onslought campaign - procedural campagin. You can skip all narratives. Fantastic game system, very logical. I just love trying different units skills. I think its my deafult game now.
Caster of Magic for windows (2) - this game is superb. AI is hyper agressive, and you need trash mundane units to fend off neutral and enemy wizard scout. You make decision whether to build structures in city or train more units. But game is still about spells, summoning magic unit, enchant mundanes. Tactical combat is very quick, plus there is very good AutoCombat with multiple options (dont use spell etc). Combat system is very good. Each spell have application - they are very neatly balanced. ... and when you get the grasp of the core part of gameplay, the heroes appear with items creation.
In CoM UI & key control improve compare to MoM. Also core unit move 2 tiles instead 1, which make the game much more dynamic. You start with 2 settlers, so there is less of EndTurn spam. Each time you settle down a Swordsman unit is spawn - i guess to defend from scouts, but he is very good to scout the area in early game (lair/dungeons).
Yeah.. summoning tons of War Bears and Cockatrice is cool. Without being able to play simcity like in MoM due to constant thread from enemies the game is LOOOONG, each scenario take days easily.
Cof Eo - too much reading
heroes 2 - superb units roster for each faction (fheroes2)
heroes 5.5 - drop it because orbiting with camera non stop in strategic map
age of wonder 3 - tactical combat is best ever. but the game feels like RPG on strategic map, plus you make doomstack.
age of wonder 1 mod evolve and ziggurat - this mods nicely trim the OP heroes, make tier1 useful and affordable, and add multiple subtle changes (spells adjustment). The game is much better than vanillla. Im playing it with UI mod (Scroll of Swiftness) which make few very handy key shortcuts (Q to cast spells is a bless, instead of fiddling with hero character sheet).
Myriads: Renaissance - play 60turn of demo. Great board game like game. I will buy it today.
Warhammer: Gladius - civilization with only combat. nah...
Fantasy general 2 - onslought campaign - procedural campagin. You can skip all narratives. Fantastic game system, very logical. I just love trying different units skills. I think its my deafult game now.
Caster of Magic for windows (2) - this game is superb. AI is hyper agressive, and you need trash mundane units to fend off neutral and enemy wizard scout. You make decision whether to build structures in city or train more units. But game is still about spells, summoning magic unit, enchant mundanes. Tactical combat is very quick, plus there is very good AutoCombat with multiple options (dont use spell etc). Combat system is very good. Each spell have application - they are very neatly balanced. ... and when you get the grasp of the core part of gameplay, the heroes appear with items creation.
In CoM UI & key control improve compare to MoM. Also core unit move 2 tiles instead 1, which make the game much more dynamic. You start with 2 settlers, so there is less of EndTurn spam. Each time you settle down a Swordsman unit is spawn - i guess to defend from scouts, but he is very good to scout the area in early game (lair/dungeons).
Yeah.. summoning tons of War Bears and Cockatrice is cool. Without being able to play simcity like in MoM due to constant thread from enemies the game is LOOOONG, each scenario take days easily.
Raghar
Arcane
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2009
- Messages
- 24,069
You play campaign first, then if game is replayable and has random maps, you play random maps. Campaign introduces slowly to systems, and it also restricts to limited tools, which is something you don't get at random maps.
- Joined
- Jun 28, 2017
- Messages
- 31,774
Barely any patches but already working on DLC.
Typical.
Typical.
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2020
- Messages
- 4,000
I played the first one and kind of felt like I already knew the game well enough after that.
vota DC
Augur
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2016
- Messages
- 2,318
The first game that wasn't a 4x at all had by fare the best campaign. Not just the tolkienesque mood but also unique features that weren't possible during regular game like forging a permanent alliance between goblins, lizardmen and highmen.
They should opt for a Homm city building style with fixed cities with fixed size like Aow1 but many buildings to improve them and the chance to raze and rebuild them. Aow 1 was too barebone with just upgrade, Wall, pillage and raze.
Since Aow2 game Is strange....who cares of other cities if you can build many of them and they will grow to the same size in no time?
Simcity is not adding any depth to the game. All this buildings inside cities just slow down unit production and not adding much to the game. Its basically numbers going up.
Lets leave besides the logic (how come you can develop cities in span of few days, during war - but they was not able to even construct peasants hut during hundreds years of prosperity), what is the strategic decision behind NOT building a barrack, temple or builders hall everywhere ? While it have a LOT of sense to consider building or not walls in forward placed city, to allow easier recapture (without having to bring slow ram, or siege units).
HoMM style is only fun for the first city, if you have them more, say 6x its only wearing to slowly build them all up. I finished today Caster of Magic (almost win, bastard kill my wizard in undefended main city - yes im moron, but i didnt expect him to be able bypass my doomstacks), and i delegate all building construction to Grand Vizer (AI).
Im not against the idea of building structures in city per se. But it should affect the strategy on the main map.
f.ex. if I am able to build farms; its represent by fields on the perimeter of the city; and the enemy unit stack could occupied thouse and heal his units, or just gain some resources, without even attacking my city.
This would create a decision if I really want to build that in this place.
f.ex.2 if I build Temple in the city; the population happiness will increase; but enemy could gain advantage if the god favor him more.
Now you would have to consider, if its worth it if your strategy assumes razing all captured cities (with temples) for quick money income in near future.
f.ex.3 if i build workshop, to increase production, then the magic potential in city drop.
This could be an issue if the city was a summoning point for all my magic troops, because now they cost more mana support, or they are summon 1 turn longer.
Lacrymas
Arcane
- Joined
- Sep 23, 2015
- Messages
- 18,732
The whole deal with wargame-like 4Xs like AoW and to an extent Gladius is that you can more or less outsource the majority of the demands of the tactical layer to the strategic layer. It turns them into a quasi RTS in that sense. There's a reason people are calling Gladius a turn-based RTS. The strategy part being super involved is missing the point, if you want that go play Old World. Its only function is to provide the tactical layer with as many options/diversity/complexity/whatever as possible, that's why we complain how the strategic locations in both Planetfall and AoW4 are so barebones and boring compared to AoW3. They provide almost nothing to the actual aspect that matters - the battles. However, this is a double-edged sword that, in my eyes, is actually the biggest issue with these types of games. A lot of the time, you can simply outproduce the opponent and the battles end up lopsided (like in an actual RTS, actually), especially in singleplayer against the AI. In multiplayer against real people who are at least close skill-wise, this tends to mellow out a bit, but it can still be noticeable.
agree, its quasi RTS: the influx of units is gradual first tier1 then later units. So each unit have a timing in game to appear and be relevant. But I skip battles (thet are mostly one sided, because as you said, why shouldnt i provide myself crushing advantage each time? maybe thats one of the reaso why i enjoy FG2 so much).
anyway... i am confused about your point. (i wishlist old world - its pricey now)
"The strategy part being super involved is missing the point," && "...we complain how the strategic locations... provide almost nothing to the actual aspect that matters - the battles."
but i have written "Simcity is not adding any depth to the game." ... how building Blacksmith [+5 production] adding anything to the battles?
AND f.ex. Walls are completly changing the combat. You need different units to make a siege.
anyway... i am confused about your point. (i wishlist old world - its pricey now)
"The strategy part being super involved is missing the point," && "...we complain how the strategic locations... provide almost nothing to the actual aspect that matters - the battles."
but i have written "Simcity is not adding any depth to the game." ... how building Blacksmith [+5 production] adding anything to the battles?
AND f.ex. Walls are completly changing the combat. You need different units to make a siege.
Serious_Business
Best Poster on the Codex
To say that the "real AoW experience" is the first game, or needs campaign to be real, is using the term real in a very ridiculous way and, indeed, has little to do with realism but everything to do with a certain taste. I do like the first game myself, and its campaign, but it produced some weak gameplay and problems that, of course, nostalgia will refuse to see. Anyway, I'm sad to say I somewhat agree with the edge fat cunt with the fedora and his definite lack of wit ; this game is bloated and needs patching. DLC is a cashgrab and, now that Triumph is successful, they will become complacent. We'll see how it goes but without a doubt they will do nothing about the AI, which is quite atrociously passive. This was already a problem in Planetfall. In AoW3, while not especially good, it was quite aggressive ; it forced the player to constantly expand which provided some tension, but here there is none of that. I'm not sure you can actually loose in AoW4, unless you really stack the odds agaisnt you in some specific scenario. Fun systems but no challenge, so no point really. No doubt some will see this as a possibility for "player expression". The influence of Pdox and Stellaris is really poisonous, not to mention - the horror - the idea of "roleplaying" in a strategy game.
They are all flawed. I want AoW1 but with AoW3 city combat and hexes, and some stuff from AoW2. But without some stuff from AoW2/3 like the stupid hero upgrade 'streamlining' and nerfing. And add the 2 undergrounds again the overland spell buildings. And the uber spells from the original like Stone Skin and Enchanted Weapon. And uber units like the Wraith.
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