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Decline Thiaf Pre-Release Thread

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Divinity: Original Sin
The only hope of an actual Thief game is going to only come from a Kickstarter it seems. If only someone would do one.

But who? the old-school gamimg kickstarters are normally being made by the original lead designers of the good old-school games, the ones that are kind of sick and tired of dealing with publishers. Sometimes, by legendary creators that don't make anything worth of a note in a long time, so publishers don't get interested in what they are doing.

But thief original devs are all inside the new age of games completelly tainted by next-gen fever. So a kickstarter should be started by a member of the fan community, but it would depend on how much known this fan member are, how much they're asking and so on. Would you back a thief like game if it was launched by ken levine, harvey smith, emil pagliarulo or warren spector?

I guess i'm OK with free FM every once in a while.
 

Melan

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The Dark Mod guys should fund an actual campaign through kickstarter.
The TDM team doesn't need (and can't accept) money. They need people getting of their asses and making missions (as well as replacement models and sound effects to make the mod standalone - this is the most important goal right now).

It is reasonably easy, and will earn you ... well, a certain amount of Internet fame. Still!
 

tuluse

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The only hope of an actual Thief game is going to only come from a Kickstarter it seems. If only someone would do one.

But who? the old-school gamimg kickstarters are normally being made by the original lead designers of the good old-school games, the ones that are kind of sick and tired of dealing with publishers. Sometimes, by legendary creators that don't make anything worth of a note in a long time, so publishers don't get interested in what they are doing.

But thief original devs are all inside the new age of games completelly tainted by next-gen fever. So a kickstarter should be started by a member of the fan community, but it would depend on how much known this fan member are, how much they're asking and so on. Would you back a thief like game if it was launched by ken levine, harvey smith, emil pagliarulo or warren spector?

I guess i'm OK with free FM every once in a while.
Warren Specter is available
 

JarlFrank

I like Thief THIS much
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
The Dark Mod guys should fund an actual campaign through kickstarter.
The TDM team doesn't need (and can't accept) money. They need people getting of their asses and making missions (as well as replacement models and sound effects to make the mod standalone - this is the most important goal right now).

It is reasonably easy, and will earn you ... well, a certain amount of Internet fame. Still!

Once I got the time I will start on a little DarkMod mission. I wanted to do this for more than a year already, and had started one long ago but abandoned it due to not having made any floorplans before (just spontaneously started and then didn't know how I actually want the mansion layout to look like... derp). I already got a backstory concept and a mission goal.

I'll try my best to actually finish and release that one. :P
 

Gelbvieh

Educated
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Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera
For convenience, (their) transcript from the dev podcast:
Well, in the spirit of sharing (and sharing quickly), here is a rough outline of the podcast. It might not be 100% accurate because I just wrote it while listening, but hopefully someone appreciates it
images%5Csmilies%5Cbiggrin.gif


Quick Summary

Yes they have a visibility gem in conjunction with a system that makes it clearer to the user whether they are in light or not (The Cloak, I think). They are attempting to make it as unobtrusive as possible.

How linear? It IS a story driven game but not JUST that. There are multiple choices and solutions to problems. Plenty of exploration will be had.

Why Garrett, why not a new character? They contemplated it but felt Garrett was so central to the Thief universe, they ultimately had to stick with him.

Will there be any callbacks to the original animated cut scenes? “It’s still in the plan”, but he sounded hesitant to give a resounding “Yes”. They still need to evaluate if/how they will be done.

Level editor? No comment.

Will the player be able to customize their hideout? There are a number of unique/meaningful objects that Garrett steals and that collection grows as the game progresses. “The original Thief wasn’t that much of an RPG”, so the main focus is not on ‘decorating’ your house.

Will there be moral choices, or a branching story? Basically they say that the story will be the story, but moral choices (such as stealing from the poor) will be left up to the player.

How has the leap to next-gen changed development? Early development really just revolved around planning and the next-gen quality is only going to give them an advantage in creating a more immersive game. They want you to be able to SMELL the street (not literally). He sounded very happy about the possibilities with the next-gen.

The Thief team is comparatively small, does this effect development for the next gen? There are challenges but there are advantages as well. The team will not be growing because of the jump to next-gen.

Multiplayer, Co-op or competitive? Short answer, No competitive multiplayer. It’s already so demanding to revitalize and respect the franchise that multiplayer would be a distraction. That said there are plans to include an online component. They DO want to focus primarily on the single player and deliver the best experience possible there
.
Can you beat the game without killing, or knocking people out? Yes and Yes. It’s a game about stealing stuff, not a game about killing people.

Will the Hammerites and Pagans be making an appearance? We saw references in the House of Blossom with the architecture but MORE will be revealed about the story in the near future. They want to let the Narrative Director give us the explanation. The story is not a prequel and not a sequel, it’s more of a ‘side-thing’. More will be revealed soon.

Overall Design of the World: The original games had magic. They are keeping the lore of the franchise, but focusing less on ‘fireballs’ and more on ‘mysticism’. They want to maintain immersion but still have the underlying layer to maintain the Thief feel. To me, it sounds like they are taking more of a subtle approach to magic.

Sidequests, challenges, collectibles: The game takes place in “The City” and you CAN just go straight through to complete the story, but there is plenty of depth and reward for those who like to explore.

How violent/mature will the game be? It WILL have an M rating. The storyline is for mature people, not necessarily because of violence but because it is for a mature audience. Yes the world is violent, but that’s not the goal of the game.

Wii version of Thief? Right now, the official announcement is really just “PS4, PC and Other next-gen consoles”. Take from that what you will. But they are focusing on the PC because that’s where the core fanbase is.

Release date is still 2014.
Do listen to the podcast if you wanna have the whole idea, their summary isn't comprehensive.

I'd really like for them to go into more detail about exactly how they're structuring/building their levels, but they're a.) not saying specifically and b.) not being asked specifically. Missions will definitely take place in separate levels with there being a central Hub thingy like in T3, but what about everything else.
A lot of talk about different paths and that, but how big will the levels be? Ie Hitman Absolution has multiple paths for things, but they're mostly just forks in a funnel. Is the difference between the front door and a window 5 meters to the left or right, or is there a garden to sneak through and a mansion to go around? A roof to climb? Is the house itself a separate instance?
Hopefully the next gen of consoles will be able to handle bigger levels instead of just prettier ones. Hopefully there will be a bit of a design shift along those lines. Probably I'm eating a gun.
 
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It seems to me like they're... backtracking a bit from some of the more questionable decisions that resulted in such a terrible backlash. Their PR is ruined right now.
 

Unkillable Cat

LEST WE FORGET
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As long as the 'Focus' feature is mandatory and not optional, then this is not even up for consideration in my books.

I'm also not very fond of their little play of side-stepping the lore and story of Garrett, and yet including Garrett as the protagonist. You can't do both without looking like an ass... oops, too late.

And yet, the above points clear things up a little and inject an air of cautious optimism into things, but it's still looking bleak.
 

Gord

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Might be that the fan-backlash made them reconsider some of their decisions.
The one thing I still don't get though is why they think Garrett is so "central to the Thief universe" and yet seem so eager to change both Garrett and the Thief universe.
 

JarlFrank

I like Thief THIS much
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
This sounds better than before, but any hope that this might be a decent Thief game is lost already anyway. Might be a decent game, but NOT Thief. And apparently the Sims games are hardcore RPGs because decorating your house is an element of RPGs. :M
 

Gelbvieh

Educated
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Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera
  1. Thief 4 ships with editor
  2. Brave souls band together for block-by-block recreation of T1 or 2, discarding all mechanics except those present in T1/2 and removing consolitis with surgical precision
  3. Re-released version becomes massively popular
  4. Valiant hordes of protesters storm the offices of IGN, brandishing signs reading "Your corridors offer no escape option", "Your ass had better hope this sign doesn't auto-aim" and "Your ad here". Non-specific staff member's severed heads are waved on pitchforks.
  5. Publisher decides to finance the real sequel to Thief 2
  6. This game is brilliant
  7. The universe suddenly ends and there is no more decline ever again.
 

Diablo169

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Grim Midlands
This is still going to be shit, despite all their platitudes and reassurances. Thousands of people will pre-order it on steam because it looks like Dishonored and the world will feel just that little bit worse.
 

sea

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This is still going to be shit, despite all their platitudes and reassurances. Thousands of people will pre-order it on steam because it looks like Dishonored and the world will feel just that little bit worse.
Of course they'll change very little. They don't care much about the original Thief fanbase and if they did they would never have made such fuck-ups to begin with. This is just Eidos covering their asses.
 

Lancehead

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There are multiple choices and solutions to problems.
Sounds like it'll be like DE:HR with specific designed solutions as opposed to the "sandbox" levels.

Plenty of exploration will be had.
For decorating your hideout with collectibles, I suspect. :roll:

“The original Thief wasn’t that much of an RPG”
Why are Thief and RPG even in the same sentence to begin with? Fucking AAA industry wants to infect everything with "RPG elements".


Overall, agree with others that this summary gives better prospects for the game.

Edit:

Actually, the statement about being able to finish the game without knocking down anyone sounds promising. Previously they said you could finish the game without killing anyone, but that really doesn't say anything about the stealth aspects.
 

Gord

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There are multiple choices and solutions to problems.
Sounds like it'll be like DE:HR with specific designed solutions as opposed to the "sandbox" levels.

Plenty of exploration will be had.
For decorating your hideout with collectibles, I suspect. :roll:

“The original Thief wasn’t that much of an RPG”
Why are Thief and RPG even in the same sentence to begin with? Fucking AAA industry wants to infect everything with "RPG elements".

Buzzwords, I guess. They are supposedly popular with the hardcore and oldschool crowd.
However, neither is important in a Thief game, imho. The old ones didn't offer that (T3 had a little bit of choice, but almost no consequences) and as long as you are doing a similar, mission-based game, it's not necessary.
Of course, if you do C&C right, it can enhance the experience, but I'd rather have a faithfully done game with ~15 sandboxy missions with fixed objectives but freedom in how you approach them.
 

argan

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Sep 10, 2012
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As long as the 'Focus' feature is mandatory and not optional, then this is not even up for consideration in my books.

I'm also not very fond of their little play of side-stepping the lore and story of Garrett, and yet including Garrett as the protagonist. You can't do both without looking like an ass... oops, too late.

And yet, the above points clear things up a little and inject an air of cautious optimism into things, but it's still looking bleak.

According to that GI interview last week, it's optional. Doesn't mean shit though, if the game is designed with in mind. I think EM are just fucking around with the fans, when they saw the backlash.

The Eidos forums are happy to eat it up, as long as they are served what they want to hear.
 

MetalCraze

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While complete darkness was a big factor in the earlier Thief games, it made it difficult for players to see what was going on.

Lolol skyway u dumb u dunno jack shit those screenshots are just brightened

- future Codex Thiaf fandom of 15 years olds
 

WalmartJesus

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Why are Thief and RPG even in the same sentence to begin with? Fucking AAA industry wants to infect everything with "RPG elements".


That's why I hate the modern gaming landscape. Everything has to be a generic hybrid and any game that picks one genre and tries to excel in that said genre ...gets bashed for being "Archaic" and "clunky"


Actually, the statement about being able to finish the game without knocking down anyone sounds promising. Previously they said you could finish the game without killing anyone, but that really doesn't say anything about the stealth aspects.

Yeah, people shouldnt get too excited. This probably just means -- Guards have dumbfuck AI and conveniently stare at walls for the player to slip past with ease.
 

Telengard

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- Fighting against four or more guards in combat won’t go well

1) So, you can fight three guards at once and expect to win, and expect to do so consistently throughout a level - regenerating health detected.
2) Since it needs four guards to kill Garrett, can Garrett simply use the environment to allow only 3 of the half-dozen guards in the room to engage him at once, and thus kill all six one by one since not enough of them ever ganged up on him? - hmm


“We’re trying to find a balance between making combat enjoyable and allowing you to enter combat if you want, but at the same time not allowing you to clear a room that way.”

He adds, “We want you to play as a thief but we don’t want to force you to play as thief. You can play the game aggressively if you want but it won’t be easy.”

1) If Garrett can fight three guards at once, but isn't going to be able to clear rooms, does that mean that a lot of rooms will consistently have 4 or more guards? That would mean 10 guarded areas in a single zone will need a total of 40 guards in order to prevent Garrett from clearing them all through combat. Just how many guards are going to be in, say, a large mansion? Are you really going to put in 100+ guards to keep a combat-Garret from slaughtering everyone?
2) Define "easy". Since it's a possibility to play aggressively, will someone with good timing find it difficult engaging lots of enemies, or is it just button-mashers who will find it "not easy"
 

mindx2

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“We want you to play as a thief but we don’t want to force you to play as thief."

This has to be one of the STUPIDEST developer quotes I have ever heard!! It still just screams to me all kinds of fail every time I read it...

double-facepalm1.jpg
 

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