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The Witcher 3 GOTY Edition

Frozen

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Jan 1, 2014
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I'm almost at the end actually, The Bloody Baron quest was clearly the highlight of the game for me. But seeing the praise the game has attracted, I really thought the gameplay would be interesting too... But after 50 hours of boredom, I thought that maybe I had missed something, but it seems not.
I honestly don't understand how this game can be 10/10 or The Best RPG Ever like many claim. It's really a shame that all the hard work that CDP has put into this project is just for the aesthetics stuff, I can't even imagine what could have been if so much effort was put into the gameplay.

Don't know what did you expect.
Its a sentimental story for normies with nice graphics and open world.
Everything in it is "just ok" at worst (like BG2 at its time) but nothing is really great.
Better mechanics (not great but better) are in TW1 and better story is in TW2. Creating that beautiful empty world ate most recourses for TW3.
 

Jasede

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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
To be honest-

I spent months and years on the Codex criticizing Witcher (1-3) without really giving it much of a chance. I still don't much like 1 or 2. And I still think 3 has a lot of severe problems - quests designed around the compass, Witcher-Vision, a bunch of filler content, sometimes lifeless map, some issues with the pacing, simplistic (but fun) combat--

But ...

But it's just... all in all, so incredibly well done. There's nothing in it I can point a finger at and say "this, right here, is terrible" -- the writing is outstanding at times, some characters are incredible well-written, easily PS:T tier (not most of them, mind you) -- but above all, there is a lot of attention to detail and atmosphere, two things I really admire.

So you might consider me bringing up the Japanese VA/loc a bit of a joke, but in reality it's just another way to express that they really cared about this game. They went above and beyond. I am not an expert on Japanese but from what I have played so far the translation is incredible - and the same is true for the English one. Voice actors, writing, everything just kind of works. I love Elex, but of course with regards to translation there is no comparison -- this is a world-class localization at work.

Despite me never really caring for CD Projekt, or Witcher, I must say that I am... very excited for the Cyberpunk game. By any indication it will be incredible and very faithful to the P&P system.

Sorry for the derail, continue discussing OS now.
 

Prime Junta

Guest
Despite me never really caring for CD Projekt, or Witcher, I must say that I am... very excited for the Cyberpunk game. By any indication it will be incredible and very faithful to the P&P system.

I just hope they'll put in less filler. W3 had a lot of good stuff in it but a lot of pointless time sink as well.
 

Perkel

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I just hope they'll put in less filler. W3 had a lot of good stuff in it but a lot of pointless time sink as well.

What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.
Maybe you mean POI ? That UI element should be switched off by default or just something you can enable on NG+.

Aside from that TW3 seems to be one of few RPGs that doesn't waste your time with bullshit. Even small side quests are usually fleshed out with their own details and stories you can remember on their own.

TW3 is more like collections of short stories than game really in that aspect.
 

Jimmious

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.
:what:

Dude the game has "quests" even for playing minigames(the card game) and fist fighting.
There are little bullshit "tasks" in every corner for you to do, most of them are just for the kicks - clearing random bandit camps for example. The game is riddled with time sink activities to the point that it feels impossible to finish due to my completionist nature
 

Perkel

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What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.

Dude the game has "quests" even for playing minigames(the card game) and fist fighting.
There are little bullshit "tasks" in every corner for you to do, most of them are just for the kicks - clearing random bandit camps for example. The game is riddled with time sink activities to the point that it feels impossible to finish due to my completionist nature

Those "filler quests" have full storylines on their own which are not worse than any other sidequest really. Especially fist fighting which i was kind of amazed since i never expected supposed filler quest to end in such way.

Those tasks are POI. Aside from Blood and Wine DLC where clearing camp is tied to quest you are not expected to clear those camps and nothing forces you to do so.

Saying Gwent is filler also is stretching.
 

Prime Junta

Guest
What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.

Collecting Gwent cards and playing Gwent tournaments.
Climbing the boxing ladder.
Treasure hunts.
A crafting system that has you picking flowers and collecting junk everywhere you go.
Phoned-in repetitive monster hunts.
Clearing settlements.
And more.

Edit: "Nothing forces you to do them" is not an excuse. Nothing forces you to collect shards or pick herbs in DA:I either but that doesn't make it any less of a pointless time sink.
 

Jimmious

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.

Dude the game has "quests" even for playing minigames(the card game) and fist fighting.
There are little bullshit "tasks" in every corner for you to do, most of them are just for the kicks - clearing random bandit camps for example. The game is riddled with time sink activities to the point that it feels impossible to finish due to my completionist nature

Those "filler quests" have full storylines on their own which are not worse than any other sidequest really. Especially fist fighting which i was kind of amazed since i never expected supposed filler quest to end in such way.

Those tasks are POI. Aside from Blood and Wine DLC where clearing camp is tied to quest you are not expected to clear those camps and nothing forces you to do so.

Saying Gwent is filler also is stretching.
But I believe Prime Junta 's point (and mine I guess) is not that the quality of the side quests is low but that there are WAY TOO MANY of them which eventually means you'll be busy for way too long doing side stuff
 

Prime Junta

Guest
I suppose if you're not the least bit OCD you can ignore the filler in TW3 and only enjoy the good bits.

I'm sure there's someone like that out there. Somewhere.
 

Kitchen Utensil

Guest
I suppose if you're not the least bit OCD you can ignore the filler in TW3 and only enjoy the good bits.

I'm sure there's someone like that out there. Somewhere.

Well, I usually suffer from pretty severe OCD when it comes to completing games. But W3's gameplay was so insufferable that I started to ignore everything but the mainquest about one third into the game just to get it over with. So yeah, it's possible.

Edit: Still didn't enjoy it much though. :3
 

Doktor Best

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Feb 2, 2015
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2,877
Whenever I try to fight with actual counter-attacking I can't get it right , ever, so yeah.
You can only counterattack humanoid opponents. With monsters and animals, you're better off dodging.
So basically rolling around... That's exactly the part I find annoying. I feel that in 90% of the fights I'm rolling away until I can land some hits or activate some ability. I would prefer to actually fight

You dont have to roll around constantly to dodge as there is also a regular sidestep which is even superior in most cases as it lets you engage much sooner after the dodge. The dodge roll is only for big sweeping attacks or aoe effects.

Combat got much smoother and more enjoyable to me once i figured that out.
 

Falksi

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TW3 is absolutely dripping with filler. Almost every weapon or bit of armour you stumble across is useless, and screams "stick with The Witcher Gear"

Oh look, another monster next, another bandit group, etc. Even if you don't go towards them especially with any intent, they still get very, very repetitive & boring after a while and hinder the enjoyment as opposed to enhancing it.
 

Perkel

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What ? I would argue that TW3 doesn't have any filler content.

Collecting Gwent cards and playing Gwent tournaments.
Climbing the boxing ladder.
Treasure hunts.
A crafting system that has you picking flowers and collecting junk everywhere you go.
Phoned-in repetitive monster hunts.
Clearing settlements.
And more.

Edit: "Nothing forces you to do them" is not an excuse. Nothing forces you to collect shards or pick herbs in DA:I either but that doesn't make it any less of a pointless time sink.

1. Gwent isn't filler. Filler is some shit like collecting 10 flowers or some shit. In Gwent quest you are not only collecting cards but also do proper quests with your mentioned tournament which has whole dialogs, characters and such.
2. Climbing the boxing ladder. Again. Clearly you didn't play it. There are like 5 fights from which half you can just play dead due to story reasons because they actually have story attached to them especially ending of that whole quest line.
3. Ok you got me there. Some of those don't have anything other than find place X. But there are in those treasure hunts quests where you do puzzles, talk to characters and some other shit. Hardly filler.
4. Now you are stretching. It is just gameplay element not filler.
5. Did you even play game ? I mean almost all monster hunts have sub-stories of their own.
6. POI. If you count POI as filler quest then you might just count them all. I addressed that before. You can switch in options POI and all poi are gone.

TW3 is absolutely dripping with filler. Almost every weapon or bit of armour you stumble across is useless, and screams "stick with The Witcher Gear"

Oh look, another monster next, another bandit group, etc. Even if you don't go towards them especially with any intent, they still get very, very repetitive & boring after a while and hinder the enjoyment as opposed to enhancing it.

That is crap loot system not filler content.
 

v1rus

Arcane
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
2,294
Like it has been said - 90% of side quests (excluding those with ties to main characters (Keira questline, Lambert quest, Skellige throne quests, etc.) dont offer anything new. The quality of writing for those quests (characters, motivation, the quest itself) is very high on average, but they simply dont add anything relevant to the game - and the pacing of the main quest suffers terribly from it. Take your regular witcher contract - you get a good set up, good encounter and a satisfying resolution, but in the end, it all boils down to "ugly monstah killed someone, gtfo and kill it". Its not that sidequests are bad, its that they are completely and utterly forgettable - thanks to their overwhelming quantity. I did all Contracts (and every single sidequest, treasure hunt and PoI, for that matter) and I cant remember a single set up or differentiate between them, and it hasnt been a full month since i completed the darn game.

PoIs are nothing short of atrocious tho, and "you dont have to do 'em or side quests" isnt an excuse. If its in the game, it has to serve a purpose. Do PoIs ruin the game? No. Would the game be better if they didnt put 'em in? Probably not, actually - PoIs were added late into development cycle since the open world felt "empty", thus, PoIs are nothing more than a repercussion of a badly designed open world - they literally went with quantity instead of quality. The zones are beautiful, yes, but there is no way in hell you can differentiate between one part of Skellige from the other - there are no subzones or landmarks worth remembering, which, combined with vendor trash loot and quest compass, makes the gameworld itself an empty landmass you cruise across, with no inherent desire to explore it, since there is nothing to explore in the first place. Compare it to way smaller worlds of Gothic 1 and 2 - they are both open world games, but they chose their size carefully, intelligently planted shit around, tied the game world with quests, etc., thus I still know every god damn nook and cranny of 'em, by heart.

While we are on quest compass - its one of those trends in modern gaming that needs to go, asap, we all know that. Sure, you can turn of the quest compass but that solves absolutely nothing - the game was still designed to hold your hand, not demand intelligent engagement. I turned my mini-map when I started the game, tried exploring the world "naturally", but in the end I'd pretty much spam minimap so I could see in which direction the quest marker is leading me. The game was simply designed with quest markers in mind, and turning them off is akin to watching a colored art house flick in black and white because "it was supposed to be like that" and "its bringing out its artistic integrity".

And all this is coming with an absolute Witcher fanboi, who thinks the game is nothing short of a masterpiece, even with the problems i listed + those i didnt - terribad combat, terribly handled save game transfer, lackluster game design in general, etc.

Just to illustrate the worst fault in the games design - I vividly remember a quest in Skellige, "Lord of Arena" or something. In short, local village arena is closed, since a cursed ghost has been haunting it for quite some time. The poor fella was a regular fighter while he was alive, and he literally never defeated anyone, getting humiliated all the time. Thus, his tortured spirit is still haunting the god darn place. Everyone and their mother has defeated the poor sods spirit, but he keeps coming back, against his will, cursed to get humiliated again and again. So, when I got the quest, i decided to beat the crap out of him with my all-powerfull witcher mojo - he surely aint gonna cum back when i bitchslap him. So, I bitchslapped him, rested, and whaddya now, the son of a bitch came back. Tried once more, same result. Quest tracker just said "Find a way to permanently remove the spirit." Not willing to fuck with a trivial sidequest any more, I just googled it. Turns out that a "trivial sidequest" is actually best designed quest in the game - to remove the curse, you have to let him beat you. But it was the first time that a 100h+ long game demanded from me, the player, to think, not just spam light attack at marked monster, thus, I didnt even contemplate the possibility that the quest solution was anything but the usual quen, dodge, light attack, dodge bullshit. Surely, I just needed to collect some stupid quest item and bitchslap him harder.

With all that said, the game is nothing short of amazing, really. Its phucking beautiful, the soundtrack is superb and the writing, together with its presentation (voice acting, cutscene angles, etc.) is among the best the medium has ever seen - but never before with this kind of visual quality and technical advancement. The story (plot, characters, dialogue, thoughts, setting) is undisputedly remarkable, which, coupled with its amazing presentation results in one of the most emotionally powerful vidya experiences, ever. And if you think "emotions are fur gurlz, lul, fag" then you dont really care about art, buddy. Which is fine I guess, its just that we arent ever going to agree about any game (or anything else, for that matter), ever.

Mind you, Blood and Wine is an improvement upon the base game, in every aspect, which is why i harbor high expectations for Cyberpunk. And, I just have to say it - with all praises I just sung to games writing, base Witcher 3 main plot could have been handled better. Not that it matters much tho, the game has way bigger problems than that.
 
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Falksi

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Well said v1rus

I've played it through twice now, and there's only a handful of quests which I actually remember. Not only do they add little, but their repetitive structure (usually - talk, travel, witcher senses, combat, travel back, talk) mean you start playing them on auto-pilot very quickly. There's rarely any genuine dialogue options of note, and for those reasons so much of the game just didn't engage or keep me interested.

The Lord of the Arena side quest is a top example of how quests should engage us, and never feel the same. Sadly so many of those quests can be played with your eyes shut.

It didn't feel like an adventure. I rarely felt like I had to quest for a specific item, solve a puzzle, pay attention to particular events, charm someone etc. in order to move a quest forward. It felt like typical modern AAA cut-paste gaming, just with good characters & great visuals. Superb aesthetics, but little soul, hold Witcher Senses button down & dodge to win.
 
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flyingjohn

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"The studio wasted a year trying to attempt to implement a system to cut and target enemy limbs similar to fallout vats system."
:hmmm:
 
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AwesomeButton

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PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
Everything is pointless filler, that some side activity in a game is pointless filler is a non-argument.

Pointless filler", as opposed to what? As opposed to sections of slightly interactive dialogues, taking turns with sections of twitch combat and "hunt the red-shimmering objects" mini-game? Like these are somehow filled with purpose?

Witcher 3 is woven together out of small portions of various such activities, in such a way that before you get bored of one activity, a section of a different activity follows it. And that's how the game manages to keep you entertained with activities which, if taken on their own, are nothing special. If you don't understand that, let me explain it to you.

It's a better formula than that of the Gamebryo games, because the world is designed miles better, and the writing, characterization, are some of the best you'll find in a videogame.

Of course, it's still a videogame, and as such allows the player to be the "director" of the action. But if you choose your version of the witcher 3 story to take you on a long period of doing the same activity - playing gwent with everyone, or hunting down all the hidden caches - the breaking of the entertaining pattern of activities is entirely on you. Don't blame the game for it.
 

Perkel

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>he zones are beautiful, yes, but there is no way in hell you can differentiate between one part of Skellige from the other - there are no subzones or landmarks worth remembering, which, combined with vendor trash loot and quest compass, makes the gameworld itself an empty landmass you cruise across, with no inherent desire to explore it, since there is nothing to explore in the first place. Compare it to way smaller worlds of Gothic 1 and 2 - they are both open world games, but they chose their size carefully, intelligently planted shit around, tied the game world with quests, etc., thus I still know every god damn nook and cranny of 'em, by heart.

Can't agree at all. EVERY part of map is different. You can see from almost anywhere distinct landmarks. I know it well because from very start i switched off corner map along with POI. After 2-3 hours i was able to navigate without problems world just by looking at those "non existing landmarks". Which was one of my favorite parts about G1-2.

But since you claim you did every POI i gather you fucked yourself because you didn't switch them off along with corner map. IDK what CDPR thought when they choose to leave them on as default.
 

Danikas

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"The studio wasted a year trying to attempt to implement a system to cut and target enemy limbs similar to fallout vats system."
:hmmm:

Great fucking news that you could find in their design document from 2013. Why even post videos from this faggot he acts like vegetarian cafeteria in their studio is some secret knowledge.
 

Falksi

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"The studio wasted a year trying to attempt to implement a system to cut and target enemy limbs similar to fallout vats system."
:hmmm:


You can definitely feel the influence which the departure of staff resulted in between each game.

Millions of fanboys are lining up for CDPR's next batch of games, and it'll be a miracle if they aren't CDPR's equivlent of Dragon Age 2.
 

Perkel

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Mar 28, 2014
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Sounds like he doesn't understand game dev in first place.
If they scrapped work this means that that works was either bad or didn't fulfill target (like being fun).

Creating a game is different than making a wall. While there is general design that you follow you can't follow it completely because at any point you can find that major part of the game doesn't work like it should or it is simply not fun to play.
 

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