Ultima The Ultima Series Discussion Thread

[SausageInYourFace]

So, either I am blind or in contrast to Gold Box, Wizardry and Might & Magic, there is no dedicated Ultima Series Discussion thread and instead a lot of tiny little ones? No idea why that is, so I thought I might try to create one.

Just managed to finish Ultima 5. Gotta say right away that I did it with walkthrough assistance but not completely play-by-walkthrough. Gameplay wise the game was really an upgrade over Ultima 4 in every possible way and did away with a lot of tedium (eg mixing spells, holy shit). Combat still wasn't really great though, I sometimes wish it had a faster blobber-style combat, dungeon exploration being first person anyway. They did however integrate some puzzles into the combat mode dungeon rooms, so there is that. Since the walkthrough shortened my playtime I went into DOOM pretty underleveled and got my ass kicked. However, a few scrolls of Summon Demon, Kill and Negate Time helped me to cheese my way through the toughest shit. The magic system has some cool stuff in it, unfortunately you probably won't need it for 90% of the game cause combat is usually pretty easy. The level of immersion these games still manage to create through the amazing fluff books (man, these books are pure love, they really bring the setting to life), the exploration and the conversation system is still amazing and so far the best part of Ultima for me.

I am posting mainly because I wanted to ask about experiences with Nuvie before I move on to Ultima 6. Is it recommended to play the game in Nuvie or are there still many bugs left? I am a bit sceptical since it seems to be still pretty early in its development.

Ultima 7 is already set up and ready to play in Exult, so I am looking forward to this a lot.

Well, maybe not the best post to kick off such a Series thread but I guess you gotta take what you can get. Here is a picture of Lord British, to get ya'll in the mood:

Alright! Ultima! DISCUSS!!!11!

 

[Infinitron]

NUVIE early in development? It's been in development for like a decade (with lots of stops and starts).

Pretty sure it's playable considering the developers had moved on to working on Martian Dreams compatibility.

 

[Neanderthal]

Could try out the Ultima 6 remake in the Dungeon Siege engine, not exactly same thing but pretty damn good nonetheless. Only real reason to own Dungeon Siege. Ultima 7 will knock your fucking socks off if coming to it from vanilla 6, it improves on that game in almost every area except combat and maybe the overarching theme. I'd personally avoid the Isle of Fire for a while, it negates progression for Avatar.

Only had one bug with Exult, which I installed with Jaesun's guide, that was a statue of the Avatar created on the Isle of Fire after completing the Exodus bit. However this didn't affect anything, and I don't think would have been created if I wasn't playing with old buckethead paperdoll.

I'm still wondering when there's gonna be a game that matches this? I know Sven was trying at Larian, but now he's prioritised co-op over creating the living world that he initially wanted (with obviously better turn based combat.) Most of the modern RPGs are focusing on just grinding combat (the supposed core content) rather than creating a believable simulation of the world they're portraying, and giving the players as many tools as possible in which to interact with that world, thereby easily creating more varied gameplay. Then again Fallout, Arcanum and Torment tried doing this to greater and lesser extents so there's still hope I suppose.

 

[SausageInYourFace]

NUVIE early in development? It's been in development for like a decade (with lots of stops and starts).

Pretty sure it's playable considering the developers had moved on to working on Martian Dreams compatibility.

Ah, I was just going by the version number (0.5) which indicates to me its still pretty unfinished? I don't wanna run into nasty bugs. I also noticed that people often seem to praise Exult but I rarely hear talk about Nuvie, thats why I was asking for first hand experience. Maybe its just because U7 is the more popular game.

I will try the Dungeon Siege Ultimas one day when I finished the classics, I think it would be weird to try the remake before the original. Besides, I am not a fan of these kind of 3D engines (NWN burned my forever). But I heard they are supposed to be really good so I will give them a try one day.

 

[Claw]

Ultima 7 is already set up and ready to play in Exult, so I am looking forward to this a lot.

Exult?

I don't know if Exult has been vastly improved since I last tried it (I am doubtful), but you should probably try DosBox instead.

I feel there is a lot lost with the incomplete implementation of daily routines for NPCs. When I last played U7 in Exult, it took me less than a minute or so to feel there was something wrong with the game. NPCs stumbled around randomly, seemed to stare at walls and behave incoherently. I blamed nostalgia first and kept playing, but eventually I got so irritated that I stopped playing to read development notes on Exult. When I used DosBox, it was a difference like night and day for me.

 

[Neanderthal]

Latest build of Exult is fairly much an exact copy of the original, only difference I could tell was that Guardian's head wouldn't appear on screen when he laughed or talked shit at you, there's a lot of improvements as well, hotkeys and such. Keyring mod adds a lot of stuff as well, though companion you gain from it is well OP.

Oh couldn't open or destroy a chest I encountered in dungeon Shame, only one in game.

 

[Bruma Hobo]

Why would you create this? omg, now they will fuse all Ultima threads here.

 

[Jaesun]

Exult has NPC's schedules working just fine. As of the latest build (which I play from time to time just to check on things and report bugs). If you want game-breaking bugs play it in DOS (the always broken Minoc bug and the Isle of the Avatar just to name a few). If you want to actually play it without any game-breaking bugs, play it with Exult. Also the sound/music is fucking TERRIBLE in DOS (due to the ancient MIDI limitations), even more so if you have any magic items. This is not a problem in Exult.

If you DO however for whatever reason want to play it in DOS, I can tell you some tips what to NEVER do when playing it in DOS (like NEVER EVER EVER EVER fly the carpet over the Isle of the Avatar, that completely breaks the game r00fles!).

 

[Prehistorik]

Exult has NPC's schedules working just fine. As of the latest build (which I play from time to time just to check on things and report bugs). If you want game-breaking bugs play it in DOS (the always broken Minoc bug and the Isle of the Avatar just to name a few). If you want to actually play it without any game-breaking bugs, play it with Exult. Also the sound/music is fucking TERRIBLE in DOS (due to the ancient MIDI limitations), even more so if you have any magic items. This is not a problem in Exult.

If you DO however for whatever reason want to play it in DOS, I can tell you some tips what to NEVER do when playing it in DOS (like NEVER EVER EVER EVER fly the carpet over the Isle of the Avatar, that completely breaks the game r00fles!).

Is the GOG version any better?

 

[Jaesun]

Is the GOG version any better?

If GOG uses DOSBox, then no, the same game-breaking bugs still exist. Interestingly no one has ever stepped up to fix the two most notorious game-breaking bugs in the DOS version. Though that may just be too difficult/impossible.

 

[Infinitron]

Exult?

I don't know if Exult has been vastly improved since I last tried it (I am doubtful), but you should probably try DosBox instead.

I feel there is a lot lost with the incomplete implementation of daily routines for NPCs. When I last played U7 in Exult, it took me less than a minute or so to feel there was something wrong with the game. NPCs stumbled around randomly, seemed to stare at walls and behave incoherently. I blamed nostalgia first and kept playing, but eventually I got so irritated that I stopped playing to read development notes on Exult. When I used DosBox, it was a difference like night and day for me.

You downloaded 1.2, didn't you?

For the longest time, Exult's official front page release was an ancient version because the most recent snapshot had bugs they were struggling to identify. They only overcame that relatively recently.

 

[Jaesun]

When using Exult ONLY use the 1.5X snapshots in the download section. 1.2 is ancient history and has that old item bug which they did find and finally fix.

 

[Prehistorik]

Ah and also, why the music sounds bad? I thought running dosbox with roland emulatour( e.g. mt32emu) should sound fine..

 

[Jaesun]

Ah and also, why the music sounds bad? I thought running dosbox with roland emulatour( e.g. mt32emu) should sound fine..

Because at the time, the Ultima engine can only use 8 of the 16 MIDI channels available. When you have magic items (magic items sounds are played through MIDI) the music and background sounds get all fucked up. The Ultima VII engine basically used MIDI for all of its sound effects (except for of course the Guardians voice over).

Exult has none of these limitations, you can set it to use digital sounds and music, of which I highly recommend (and they have recordings on the original music supposedly recorded from a real MT-32).

 

[Prehistorik]

Because at the time, the Ultima engine can only use 8 of the 16 MIDI channels available. When you have magic items (magic items sounds are played through MIDI) the music and background sounds get all fucked up. The Ultima VII engine basically used MIDI for all of its sound effects (except for of course the Guardians voice over).

Exult has none of these limitations, you can set it to use digital sounds and music, of which I highly recommend (and they have recordings on the original music supposedly recorded from a real MT-32).

Ah, makes sense then
Would be interesting to compare..

 

[Jaesun]

Ah, makes sense then
Would be interesting to compare..

I have extensively played Ultima VII parts 1 and 2 using DOSBox and Exult with an ACTUAL Roland MT-32, I own 2 of them (VII is my favorite series, even though the combat is total fucking shit). There really is not much to compare (music wise). Exult is the vastly superior choice, and has none of the originals severe limitations. Combat wise, the DOS version *feels* different than it does with Exult, but the combat period is just complete and utter shit on both versions so, so that point is mostly useless.

EDIT: It is a DAMN shame no one has yet implemented a turn-based combat mode, similar to Ultima VI's combat system in Exult, which would at least make it....... slightly better?

 

[Neanderthal]

A-fucking-men.

Oh one thing I did notice in the Black Gate under Exult is that the farm widow in Paws (forgot her name) no longer says anything about the Shrine of Sacrifice, she used to make some kind of reference to it in the original as I remember. Think there might have been some kind of unimplemented plot here concerning her departed husband and the Lich there at night.

Oh speaking of Shrines, the quests added by the keyring mod to consult the Shrines of the Virtues are well implemented, and lead to a nice conclusion and a fairly big game change if you do them early enough.

 

[Prehistorik]

I have extensively played Ultima VII parts 1 and 2 using DOSBox and Exult with an ACTUAL Roland MT-32, I own 2 of them (VII is my favorite series, even though the combat is total fucking shit). There really is not much to compare (music wise). Exult is the vastly superior choice, and has none of the originals severe limitations. Combat wise, the DOS version *feels* different than it does with Exult, but the combat period is just complete and utter shit on both versions so, so that point is mostly useless.

EDIT: It is a DAMN shame no one has yet implemented a turn-based combat mode, similar to Ultima VI's combat system in Exult, which would at least make it....... slightly better?

Combat is what actually been keeping me off the series for a while. This and the scrubby look of Garriott and all this Lord British bullshit
But I'm inclined to get into it soon alongside the glorious wizardrys.

 

[Jaesun]

Combat is what actually been keeping me off the series for a while. This and the scrubby look of Garriott and all this Lord British bullshit
But I'm inclined to get into it soon alongside the glorious wizardrys.

Play the Wizardy series first. Play Ultima VII when you just want to have some meaningless fun/nostalgia. Though if you have never played VII before, you probably just won't get into it or outright dislike it. I still love it, and play it off and on again just to try out the various Exult builds, and to report bugs etc..).

 

[Claw]

You downloaded 1.2, didn't you?

For the longest time, Exult's official front page release was an ancient version because the most recent snapshot had bugs they were struggling to identify. They only overcame that relatively recently.

I believe it was actually 1.1.2 actually. I guess it's been a damn long time since I played Ultima VII.

I'm glad they kept at it. I was afraid Exult would get stuck in that half-finished state.

 

[AArmanFV]

Where is the poll?

Spoiler

Ultima IV, V, VII or VII will win anyway

 

[SausageInYourFace]

So I went ahead with vanilla Ultima 6. Is it normal that the music cuts out during conversation and starts again after the conversation is over?

 

[Dzupakazul]

So the Dosbox U7 straight from GoG isn't recommended, I take it?

 

[AArmanFV]

So the Dosbox U7 straight from GoG isn't recommended, I take it?

Spoiler

Take the abandonware version

 

[Jaesun]

So the Dosbox U7 straight from GoG isn't recommended, I take it?

The GOG version is fine but Play it with Exult if you don't want any game-breaking bugs.