KickStarter Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Fenix]

EA buys them

More likely Microsoft for their Game Pass netflix-like idea.

 

[vonAchdorf]

The PS4 port has been known since Gamescom.

 

[gestalt11]

so for aldori defender it makes sense to use heavy armor until you get light ones with +8 or more dex bonus right?since heavy doesnt fuck up initiative i dont see any reason to not use it instead of light.

Heavy makes you move slower and aldori only get the damage resistance part of armor training. But basically yes if you have bad dex heavy is good and if you have good dex medium or light is better and with great dex none is actually best once you get +8 bracers of armor. 30 dex = +10 + 8 bracers= 18. full plate +5 = 14 + 1 = 15. But with armor training and mithral full plate that can change to actually being better since you can get 6 or 7 from dex and come out 2 better. But no armor lets you take a level of monk and still come out slightly better. But there are also robes that can give +5 dodge to bring none ahead more in total

In the end heavy and none can be, in theory, within 1 or 2 of each other. But none will still come out ahead because it will have much much better touch ac (like 10 or more better) and touch ac is very very important.

 

[gestalt11]

So i'm playing with mc knifemaster, human aldori, 2 psycho elf girls - one invulnerable rager with elven blade and one archer, eclesysomething for channel spam and now i'm trying to think of some arcane caster to save our collective asses with sirocco.

Sylvan sorc! Get a free doggy/kitty as a bonus!

Sylvan sorc is stupid strong with a smilodon. You can mystic theurge it with feyspeaker druid pretty well too for double the sirocco. (that will be 2 levels later though)

 

[Chippy]

Why does the Quarry feat cancel stealth? Is it like that in the rules? Can you imagine a hunter perfectly hidden in stealth, lining up a shot against bambi/some friggin deer and just as he's gonna take the shot, standing up and shouting: "THAT'S IT YOU LITTLE FURRY FUCKER! NOW YOUR GONNA GET IT RIGHT BETWEEN THE EYES!".
If I was roleplaying adult Minsc, then yeah...but the class is crap enough as it is.

 

[Lawntoilet]

Great. A promising dev, ruined with inevitable dumbed down consoletardism.

Maybe not this game, but the next and the next until EA buys them and fires everyone.

Well, they said they wanted to make Baldur's Gate, and that's what happened with the last devs who made Baldur's Gate, so history supports your argument.

Heavy makes you move slower and aldori only get the damage resistance part of armor training. But basically yes if you have bad dex heavy is good and if you have good dex medium or light is better and with great dex none is actually best once you get +8 bracers of armor. 30 dex = +10 + 8 bracers= 18. full plate +5 = 14 + 1 = 15. But with armor training and mithral full plate that can change to actually being better since you can get 6 or 7 from dex and come out 2 better. But no armor lets you take a level of monk and still come out slightly better. But there are also robes that can give +5 dodge to bring none ahead more in total

In the end heavy and none can be, in theory, within 1 or 2 of each other. But none will still come out ahead because it will have much much better touch ac (like 10 or more better) and touch ac is very very important.

Good analysis, but I think Flat-Footed is still important on your primary tank at least, so you don't get 1-rounded. Heavy Armor will give you better Flat-Footed AC at least.

 

[gestalt11]

Great. A promising dev, ruined with inevitable dumbed down consoletardism.

Maybe not this game, but the next and the next until EA buys them and fires everyone.

Well, they said they wanted to make Baldur's Gate, and that's what happened with the last devs who made Baldur's Gate, so history supports your argument.

Heavy makes you move slower and aldori only get the damage resistance part of armor training. But basically yes if you have bad dex heavy is good and if you have good dex medium or light is better and with great dex none is actually best once you get +8 bracers of armor. 30 dex = +10 + 8 bracers= 18. full plate +5 = 14 + 1 = 15. But with armor training and mithral full plate that can change to actually being better since you can get 6 or 7 from dex and come out 2 better. But no armor lets you take a level of monk and still come out slightly better. But there are also robes that can give +5 dodge to bring none ahead more in total

In the end heavy and none can be, in theory, within 1 or 2 of each other. But none will still come out ahead because it will have much much better touch ac (like 10 or more better) and touch ac is very very important.

Good analysis, but I think Flat-Footed is still important on your primary tank at least, so you don't get 1-rounded. Heavy Armor will give you better Flat-Footed AC at least.

If you want a very good dodge tank you should get uncanny dodge through 1 of the 3 ways, i.e R4, Barb2 or Arch2. Since R4 give you an options for -4 AC or -4 tohit debuff and also the 2d sneak attack is very easy to make happen on your tank via flanking. Most OP tanking builds probably want R4. Rules wise getting Uncanny twice should give Improved uncanny and protect against SA, but that does not seem to actually happen in game, so you would need to save edit that in to adhere to rules, but in that case a Arch2/R4 with whatever else could work ok, not sure if its better than simply taking perserve organs from Viv. You can't do barb with 1 level of monk, so its generally a no-go for OP builds meant to no-armor tank.

So basically no armor tanking is optimally no question better, but will almost certainly take a lot of multiclassing. If you are going straight up one or two classes and not being complex then you may need to deal with trade offs like being flat footed vs better touch ac. But at the extremes no armor is strictly better. Higher total AC and much higher touch AC and no flat footed anyway.

For example here is a build:

Kensai 7, KF 4, Viv 3, SF1, Pal2, du3. This would go no armor and use lawful good monk robes and never be flat footed. This is a level 20 build since its my tank for my duo but you can just not have duelist for a level 17 build in a 6 man. This is a tank with 5d8 sneak attack (with sai in flurry of blows +1 attack, open hand) and +2 secondary attacks when feral mutagened and you can add two elements to your weapon 4 times for 7 minutes each. Go int 15+1 and cha 16 or 18 and dex 18(+4) with 10 wis. Halfling or musetouched aasimar. This can also be a skill monkey for all dex stuff and perception and UMD. It has room to be persusaion/dazzling display as well if you lose one of the other skills and you can switch KF to thug. And should have 20+ in every save. Wep finesse damage from rogue for sai, don't bother trying to enhance the feral mutagen attacks with strength or slashing grace, since for halfing (the probably best choice) with reduce person that will be low anyway, just proc SA and precise strike and +3 damage arcane strike on it.

Is that a lot of classes? yes its a stupid amount but its imminently doable and is 16 BAB and has Mirror Image/blur/displacement/shield. I am not sure if MI is needed as castable on a tank, there may be neckalce that gives you MI called Gyronna's amulet but losing Kensai for something else actually does very little anyway.

I use this with my Sylvan sorc/feyspeaker mystic theurge and use the level 12 (at max) smilodon to proc flanking and do extra damage.

 

[Sharpedge]

Now that I have had more time to play I finished up with Pitax in my unfair solo and am skipping days until the House at the End of Time. I did not struggle too much with Irovetti or his castle, Tsunami and Horrid Wilting Spam took care of pretty much everything. I discovered a nasty bug though, if you Baleful Polymorph an enemy their corpse cannot be looted. It seemed to be the least tedious way to kill the snake (who has 62 AC) but sadly I had to redo the fight due to that.

What's your build?

Aasimar Sylvan Sorcerer, with Smilodon as animal companion. For early game I mainly focus on buffing the smilodon and for late game you have some fairly powerful spells to kill things. If you want more details I can break it down a bit more, I think I rolled 18 dex, 18 cha, 16 con, or something like that and stat dumped pretty much everything else. I would need to go back and look. While levelling I raised Cha.

 

[AnnoyingCriminal]

I am really surprised how good this game is. Yes, it has fuckton of annoying things, loading screens are everywhere and last forever. Performance is awful. Writing is mediocre at best.
I still had fun, which is much more than most games, it is classic DnD influence?
Havent finished it, i am only on that barbarian invasion. I have heard that later part of the game is worse than the beginning, but even at this point i feel i got my enjoyment out of this game. Still willing to finish the game when i have more time.

 

[Yosharian]

Heavy armor reduces the Dex bonus, which in turn lowers initative.

Ah yes, you're right. My bad

 

[Yosharian]

Pathfinder: Kingmaker Is Coming to PlayStation 4, Xbox One and Nintendo Switch

This is so fucking stupid and a huge waste of time and money that will ultimately rob people like us who actually enjoy the game from future incline. Absolutely ridiculous.

I don't agree that it's a waste of time, but I worry that, like every other dev that starts on PC, eventually they will abandon us in favour of lucrative brainless console garbage.

See: Bethesda

 

[Lawntoilet]

Great. A promising dev, ruined with inevitable dumbed down consoletardism.

Maybe not this game, but the next and the next until EA buys them and fires everyone.

Well, they said they wanted to make Baldur's Gate, and that's what happened with the last devs who made Baldur's Gate, so history supports your argument.

Heavy makes you move slower and aldori only get the damage resistance part of armor training. But basically yes if you have bad dex heavy is good and if you have good dex medium or light is better and with great dex none is actually best once you get +8 bracers of armor. 30 dex = +10 + 8 bracers= 18. full plate +5 = 14 + 1 = 15. But with armor training and mithral full plate that can change to actually being better since you can get 6 or 7 from dex and come out 2 better. But no armor lets you take a level of monk and still come out slightly better. But there are also robes that can give +5 dodge to bring none ahead more in total

In the end heavy and none can be, in theory, within 1 or 2 of each other. But none will still come out ahead because it will have much much better touch ac (like 10 or more better) and touch ac is very very important.

Good analysis, but I think Flat-Footed is still important on your primary tank at least, so you don't get 1-rounded. Heavy Armor will give you better Flat-Footed AC at least.

If you want a very good dodge tank you should get uncanny dodge through 1 of the 3 ways, i.e R4, Barb2 or Arch2. Since R4 give you an options for -4 AC or -4 tohit debuff and also the 2d sneak attack is very easy to make happen on your tank via flanking. Most OP tanking builds probably want R4. Rules wise getting Uncanny twice should give Improved uncanny and protect against SA, but that does not seem to actually happen in game, so you would need to save edit that in to adhere to rules, but in that case a Arch2/R4 with whatever else could work ok, not sure if its better than simply taking perserve organs from Viv. You can't do barb with 1 level of monk, so its generally a no-go for OP builds meant to no-armor tank.

So basically no armor tanking is optimally no question better, but will almost certainly take a lot of multiclassing. If you are going straight up one or two classes and not being complex then you may need to deal with trade offs like being flat footed vs better touch ac. But at the extremes no armor is strictly better. Higher total AC and much higher touch AC and no flat footed anyway.

For example here is a build:

Kensai 7, KF 4, Viv 3, SF1, Pal2, du3. This would go no armor and use lawful good monk robes and never be flat footed. This is a level 20 build since its my tank for my duo but you can just not have duelist for a level 17 build in a 6 man. This is a tank with 5d8 sneak attack (with sai in flurry of blows +1 attack, open hand) and +2 secondary attacks when feral mutagened and you can add two elements to your weapon 4 times for 7 minutes each. Go int 15+1 and cha 16 or 18 and dex 18(+4) with 10 wis. Halfling or musetouched aasimar. This can also be a skill monkey for all dex stuff and perception and UMD. It has room to be persusaion/dazzling display as well if you lose one of the other skills and you can switch KF to thug. And should have 20+ in every save. Wep finesse damage from rogue for sai, don't bother trying to enhance the feral mutagen attacks with strength or slashing grace, since for halfing (the probably best choice) with reduce person that will be low anyway, just proc SA and precise strike and +3 damage arcane strike on it.

Is that a lot of classes? yes its a stupid amount but its imminently doable and is 16 BAB and has Mirror Image/blur/displacement/shield. I am not sure if MI is needed as castable on a tank, there may be neckalce that gives you MI called Gyronna's amulet but losing Kensai for something else actually does very little anyway.

I use this with my Sylvan sorc/feyspeaker mystic theurge and use the level 12 (at max) smilodon to proc flanking and do extra damage.

Yeah you're right. Armor tanks are a lot simpler to build, though, even if your endgame AC isn't as high (I had 62 or 63 unbuffed on Valerie at endgame). You also get (Improved) Uncanny Dodge as a Stalwart Defender (actually you get Improved Uncanny Dodge at level 7 AND level 9 ) and Tower Shield Specialist can get Immunity to Flanking, at least.
Did not know that getting Uncanny twice doesn't give Improved Uncanny, thanks.

 

[fantadomat]

Ehmmm... WAT

Yeah,it surprised me too. It make sense,there is only one road toward the destination. They disappear after that,you could talk with the two companions that you didn't pick.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

I am pretty sure this is the first time I see this:

https://wccftech.com/pathfinder-kingmaker-coming-consoles/

Pathfinder: Kingmaker Is Coming to PlayStation 4, Xbox One and Nintendo Switch


Pathfinder: Kingmaker, the cRPG funded via Kickstarter and launched in late September for PC(Windows, Mac and Linux) by developer Owlcat Games and published by Deep Silver, is being worked on for a release on PlayStation 4, Xbox One and Nintendo Switch consoles.

There hasn’t been a proper, official announcement yet. However, THQ Nordic’s latest financial report (where they also revealed the studio acquisitions of Coffee Stain and Bugbear Entertainment) included the title in a slide mentioning the most important announced projects in the pipeline, such as Metro Exodus, Dead Island 2, Wasteland 3, Shenmue III, Biomutant, Darksiders III, Wreckfest, Generation Zero and the console port of Pathfinder: Kingmaker. There are also two AAA, ‘top-secret’ projects by Volition and Deep Silver Dambuster in there.


Deep Silver, as you may recall, was acquired by THQ Nordic alongside Koch Media earlier this year, so it’s perfectly normal to find Deep Silver titles in the report.




We got in touch with Deep Silver and they were able to confirm that this is not a mistake, though additional details will only be provided at a later moment, in due time.

Not surprised, Unity is a multiplatform engine so the work needed to be done is relatively low.

 

[Lyre Mors]

I don't agree that it's a waste of time, but I worry that, like every other dev that starts on PC, eventually they will abandon us in favour of lucrative brainless console garbage.

See: Bethesda

This is a response to you and the other couple of people who seem to disagree with the statement.

This game not only clearly does not belong on consoles because of the way it controls, but because of it's problems with performance even with the beefiest systems on the platform it was made for. Not to mention it will not appeal to the general casual taste of said console owners.

It's a waste of time and resources because it's going to sell like shit on consoles, and if the game had a troubled reception on PC because of things like complexity and difficulty, I can't imagine the outrage those few who buy it on consoles will express. It will serve to further drag the title through the critical mud and cause the publisher to apply pressure on Owlcat to alter things that are going to lead to an overall decline of quality. Either way it shakes out, it's going to deviate the focused strength of the developer.

It really surprises me how some folks around here can't recognize how this will play out given observable patterns in the industry in the past. I don't think it'll destroy Owlcat or anything, but there is no doubt in my mind that it will be a detriment in some way to the spirit of the qualities we appreciate in the developer here.

 

[Jasede]

Whatever your opinion, who actually believes they have a choice?

The publisher just sees "Oh, hey, that engine is easy to build for consoles! More consoles = more sales!"

 

[Lyre Mors]

I also was by no means implying this was a decision made by Owlcat.

 

[gestalt11]

Depending on the setup owlcat may not even do the development on a console version. That is often farmed out to a third party.

 

[TT1]

So, where the hell is Blakemoor mansion, in Pitax?

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

What the fuck is this? I finally get a wizard advisor slot open and Delgado can't take it? He can only be a treasurer!? I HAVE TO USE FUCKING OCTAVIA!?

TRASH BULLSHIT GARBAGE GAME

 

[Lawntoilet]

What the fuck is this? I finally get a wizard advisor slot open and Delgado can't take it? He can only be a treasurer!? I HAVE TO USE FUCKING OCTAVIA!?

TRASH BULLSHIT GARBAGE GAME

Delgado can be your Diplomat, too. You can use the Storyteller for your Magister if you don't want Octavia pissing on your parade for picking cool magic options.

Spoiler

"Spooky skellies are like slavery! Cool golems that keep human soldiers out of danger are like slavery!"

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

What the fuck is this? I finally get a wizard advisor slot open and Delgado can't take it? He can only be a treasurer!? I HAVE TO USE FUCKING OCTAVIA!?

TRASH BULLSHIT GARBAGE GAME

Delgado can be your Diplomat, too. You can use the Storyteller for your Magister if you don't want Octavia pissing on your parade for picking cool magic options.

Spoiler

"Spooky skellies are like slavery! Cool golems that keep human soldiers out of danger are like slavery!"

Unfortunately Storyteller's got a worse bonus than Octavia, but it still might be preferable because fuck's sake. I'll have to see if I've got anyone else that can take over the minister of propaganda slot if I move him to wizardry.

 

[Lawntoilet]

What the fuck is this? I finally get a wizard advisor slot open and Delgado can't take it? He can only be a treasurer!? I HAVE TO USE FUCKING OCTAVIA!?

TRASH BULLSHIT GARBAGE GAME

Delgado can be your Diplomat, too. You can use the Storyteller for your Magister if you don't want Octavia pissing on your parade for picking cool magic options.

Spoiler

"Spooky skellies are like slavery! Cool golems that keep human soldiers out of danger are like slavery!"

Unfortunately Storyteller's got a worse bonus than Octavia, but it still might be preferable because fuck's sake. I'll have to see if I've got anyone else that can take over the minister of propaganda slot if I move him to wizardry.

You can improve his modifier via projects, it will cost you some BP but you can get the NPCs to be as good or better than your party members.
If you mean Curator, Linzi or Jaethal can take over that.

 

[Cael]

I don't agree that it's a waste of time, but I worry that, like every other dev that starts on PC, eventually they will abandon us in favour of lucrative brainless console garbage.

See: Bethesda

This is a response to you and the other couple of people who seem to disagree with the statement.

This game not only clearly does not belong on consoles because of the way it controls, but because of it's problems with performance it has even on the beefiest systems on the platform it was made for. Not to mention it will not appeal to the general casual taste of said console owners.

It's a waste of time and resources because it's going to sell like shit on consoles, and if the game had a troubled reception on PC because of things like complexity and difficulty, I can't imagine the outrage those few who buy it on consoles will express. It will serve to further drag the title through the critical mud and cause the publisher to apply pressure on Owlcat to alter things that are going to lead to an overall decline of quality. Either way it shakes out, it's going to deviate the focused strength of the developer.

It really surprises me how some folks around here can't recognize how this will play out given observable patterns in the industry in the past. I don't think it'll destroy Owlcat or anything, but there is no doubt in my mind that it will be a detriment in some way to the spirit of the qualities we appreciate in the developer here.

Unity was originally made for Flash games. You do the math on that one.

 

[Yosharian]

Oh, the voices are still working in the New Game character creation. Wasted all that time decrypting all those voice files