On the shoulders of giants: a new multiple choices LP!

[Jick Magger]

C

 

[kazgar]

Not giving a vote just yet though, will have to consider further.

Not sure C is the best choice, it could easily end up all northern Ireland in the village, with a fracture between the groups and no one being happy. However, pushing one over the other is probably going to leave the loser resentful. D may be the best option, leaving the various religious types unhappy, but as we're seemingly not outlawing worship, just focusing on other things, they can carry on as required, but without state support.

 

[Esquilax]

D. practicality over bullshit. I mentioned once and again: this will be an ahistorical path of development, which means more fun later.

Not ahistorical if we're living in a world where the supernatural does hold sway. If gods and spirits exist in this place, and judging by the Seer's visions, I think they do, it would be foolish to ignore them completely.

Judging by the update, if we stayed back near the hills, we would only have had brown sludge to drink. This place is definitely risky, but at least our people have a source of clean drinking water. Based on the information in the update, I think that the barbarian tribe are cannibals. If there are no dangerous beasts around, it was probably them:

They came back reporting an all clear. They found husks of boats and old skeletons, gnawed upon, but no hostile nor dangerous beasts. They even got to the very limits of the great forest laying there, but they didn't enter. They said they didn't like it, an eerie silence welcoming them when they got to its border.

As far as what choice to pick, I'm not sure. Given the threat within the forest, a little bit of zealotry and faith in the fire spirits would do us a lot of good - and maybe give us favour with the Wielder of Fire. On the other hand, I was the one that initially talked about the great religious benefits of joining the fire and water spirits together. So I'm not sure.

 

[Cassidy]

If gods and spirits exist in this place, and judging by the Seer's visions, I think they do, it would be foolish to ignore them completely.

Who knows if Curufinwe isn't just flavoring up the superstitious mindset of primitive peoples in his writing instead?

Who knows what kind of "medicinal herbs" the Seer consumed before having those visions?

 

[Hirato]

I want to vote for D, but...

Now that we've tampered with Fire, we should go for Water, and finally Wind, Earth and Heart. The Obsidian Embers shall be the wielders of the very elements themselves!

I'm voting C to help make the above a reality

 

[m4davis]

If gods and spirits exist in this place, and judging by the Seer's visions, I think they do, it would be foolish to ignore them completely.

Who knows if Curufinwe isn't just flavoring up the superstitious mindset of primitive peoples in his writing instead?

Who knows what kind of "medicinal herbs" the Seer consumed before having those visions?

The thing is even if it is medicinal herbs there herbs that got him to successfully see the future and learn about a group of people before he even met them I'am sorry but theres no way there isn't some sort of magic or spirits in this world.

 

[Urist McLurker]

From a lame meta-game view I feel that religion is the way to go, it has purpose in these times, we've got fuckall when it comes to science and knowledge so we might as well stay with superstitious nonsense to keep the people happy and motivated. And ontop of that, it seems possible that there's superstitious shit out there. That said, we should at every chance we get push for equality when it comes to religion so we don't get any religious clusterfucks in the future.

From an awesome larp view. BURN THE NON-BELIEVERS, FIRE FOR FIRE SPIRITS!


My main worry is that the people choosing the water spirits are from the tribe we saved, not from ours.
If they were from our tribe, it would only be religious beliefs dividing us, here, the refugees will have a religious and cultural divide from us, which will grow into further divides I would assume, such as class and social divides, and that's going to end us up right in the shit. Letting them keep both their beliefs..I don't know if that's a good choice.
B is clearly not an option.
Hrm.

 

[Computer Gamer Refugee]

I am going to vote for "A". We can learn how to keep the water spirits happy, but we should stick to fire worship. If we try to do both, that is asking for a schism and perhaps even civil war.

 

[Esquilax]

D

Have to agree with Computer Gamer Refugee on this one. I've thought about it, and it has occurred to me that what we need most now is unity. We have decided to stand our ground and deal with whatever comes, and that means that we can't afford to let ourselves be fractured and fighting among ourselves. There's an enemy out there in the forest, and we've seen what this enemy has done to those who were too weak to stand against them. While I would love to eventually create a syncretic faith that allows worship of both the water and the fire spirits, I'm afraid that the potential for bickering and a lack of focus on the big picture will result in a lot of infighting that might really screw us over in the event of an attack.

Also, I think that tactical use of fire will help in our war against these barbarians. It might be a smart (but very ruthless) idea to set the forest ablaze to reveal the barbarians. They don't know we're here, and we know that they originated from the forest, so it could definitely work.

Very tough choice. Having two faiths might actually be pretty good for us in the long-run - but right now, I'm not sure if we can afford it.

 

[oscar]

D, the Riddle of Steel!

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

C. Not so much out of superstitious nonsense, but rather out of utilitarian usefulness. Given those guys' familiarity with the water, perhaps they can help prevent further damage to the lake and ensure we have a source of drinking water and fishing. If we do nothing, I'm concerned the river may eventually poison the lake, making our settling here rather pointless, to say the least.
Water-worshipers have a valid reason to hate the fire-worshipers, but the latter are the majorly dominant religion and we're on the formers' ancestral grounds, so the water-guys will calm down eventually - besides, they're pacifists, remember? And the fire-worshipers have no reason to hate their water brethren, so I don't see any reason for serious problems there.
Plus, multi-religiousness would be the first step to widen our perspective and diversify our culture.

 

[treave]

What, you guys seriously thinking banning a religion and punishing its worshippers will bring about unity? So, besides religious differences, you'd throw another reason for discord into the mix: oppression. They already aren't happy, so you take their religion away from them and beat up whoever violates your laws. Yeah, that's a sure recipe for a happy tribe. This is something you pull off in a period of peace and prosperity when the fire worshippers hold enough influence to keep the others docile.

Doing this right now, right after a disaster, is just asking for trouble. In fact, this is the perfect time to combine the two faiths. Bullshit something about the fire spirits leading us to water so it was meant to be. Or something. So we were saved from being wiped out by the combined forces of fire and water. People will swallow this much more easily in the current conditions. And there's nothing you can do about fanatics right now, just make a note of it and send them out to be the first to die when the barbarians come.

Anyway, voting for C.

 

[Tigranes]

Unsure whether our assertion of A will enable tribal unity, though, or whether it will lead to a repressed underclass / minority religion.

C for now

 

[newcomer]

A difficult choice indeed... A might unite the tribe, but it may also cause oppression among the water worshipers. B will most likely bring revolt & military uprising since fire worshiper is majority. C might combine the religion, but might also cause schism. D is safe, but will not fit my dreams of declaring holy wars

C for now

 

[kazgar]

Maybe we should combine the two religions and focus on the power of the elements combined

We shall call this spirit: steam

All you need then is to give one of the larger members of the tribe a knife or 5, and he can be its seer.

 

[Kipeci]

Punching the water believers until they go for the fire spirits might eventually bring them out of fear into the fire spirits over time, sure, but I'm not sure how that'd bring more unity right now.

 

[Esquilax]

Fuck you, oscar. Bringing up one of my favourite movies like that. Fucking hell, flopping to D.

Hard-nosed, Conan-esque badassery will save the day. Bah! The spirits only exist to harm man - their sole gift to man is that they give him the tenacity to survive adversity. C makes sense too I suppose, treave makes some good points.

 

[newcomer]

Punching the water believers until they go for the fire spirits might eventually bring them out of fear into the fire spirits over time, sure, but I'm not sure how that'd bring more unity right now.

I'm not so sure either, it's one of the theory posted by Esquilax. I think maybe our fire keepers can argue that this is a "test of faith" from the fire spirit, or maybe an equally likely outcome is what you think, punching them out & banning water spirit worship, causing in lower social status & maybe some denial of human rights for water worshipers.

 

[GarfunkeL]

D. Spears for the Spear God.

 

[Hirato]

We shall build a large basin to represent the gentle earth mother who carries us upon her breast.
In this basin shall be water and flowers will adorn the edges to represent both its ability to bring life as well as the sweet scents of the air's serenade.
In the center will be a small island where an eternal fire will burn, a harsh, fair mistress who illuminates the darkness and revels truth.

 

[Internet]

This is hard! D has a no-shitty-nonsense appeal, however I can't envision a society without some form of spiritual belief.

C - polytheism isn't bad per se and the worship of spirits could pave the way for shamanism, arts or more advanced deities later. (blood for the Bear-God!Blood for the Bear-God!)

 

[Lindblum]

A Beat those refugee fuckers where they stand.

On second thought... Gods have always brought out the worse in this tribe.
Believe in one man! For the emperor!!!
D

 

[Zero Credibility]

D

That warrior guy has a very good point - two hands working can do more then a thousand clasped in prayer.

 

[Monty]

Much as I'd like to vote D we actually have some evidence of 'spirits' in this world and it seems logical to work towards increasing our knowledge of them. After all we went from worshiping a camp fire to watching a mountain explode after we sent an expedition inside, something predicted by a 'seer'. Did we unleash the fire spirit turning our keeper of fire into a wielder of fire? Do the other wards somewhere out there involve water and the other elements? Well we don't know yet so it makes sense to keep all our options open and C seems the best in this regard.

 

[treave]

To be fair it would be awesome, in a world of spirits, to have a group of atheistic tribals who absolutely refuse to believe in spirits despite all evidence to the contrary.

"Spirits? Mere metaphysical representations of natural elements given form by the human need to ascribe purpose where there is none. The wrath of the earth spirit you bow to, good chap, is nothing more than the wholly natural tectonic movements of the earth's crust itself.

What? You can control it, you say?

Oh.

Oh.

My dear man, that does look like an awfully smashing party trick. I am sure there is a rational explanation for all this, though. In the mean time, let me introduce you to our party trick.

We call it gunpowder."

But alas the boat for that has sailed the moment we all voted to turn them into a religious tribe. Don't rock the boat right now, vote for C.