Jade Empire in depth analysis

[buccaroobonzai]

Just started playing this game and thought I throw some ideas and thoughts around I had while playing: Here's a brief description from gamefaq's:

Jade Empire's is set in an area resembling medieval China. You'll take of the
roll of one of six (seven in the Limited Edition) character's. You're a
student of Master Li in the village of Two Rivers. Master Li has taken you in
as an orphan realizing a great destiny lies before you.

As you go about fulfilling your destiny you can choose the high path, the Way
of the Open Palm, in which you'll concern yourself with the Harmony of all
things without regard for you own self. Alternatively, you can take the low
path, the Way of the Closed Fist, in which you'll sow the seeds of Discord
which attending to your enlighten self interest.

The HUD

There are three areas of interest on the head.

The first area is the upper left, which has three bars representing the
current levels of your secondary attributes:
Red = Health
Blue = Chi
Yellow = Focus

Evade: B + Left Thumbstick.

Targeting: Press Left or Right Trigger to cycle through enemies targets.
Pressing both enters free target mode allowing you to move freely.

Tactical Pause: Press Back. Use the tactical pause to scope out the battle
field.

Focus Mode: Press Y. Slows down enemies until your focus reserve is exhausted
or you press Y again.

Chi Strike Mode: Attacks will do more damage but will consume Chi. Pres Black again to exit this mode.

Chi Heal: heal yourself and/or your follower.
Consumes chi as along as you hold down White and your health bar is less than
maxed.

Harmonic Combos: These special combos are starts by certain attacks in the
Magic and Support Styles. This starts a timer around the targeted enemy.
Switch to a Martial Style to finish the combo with a power attack (X).

Switching Styles: switch between the mapped styles

Pause Menu:
Character Record, Styles, Followers, Amulet, Journal, Map, Load Game, Save Game, Options

Primary abilities
The three primary abilities are body, spirit, and mind. Your character
start with a base value of 2 in each of this with 4 more point distributed in
some combination among them. Each time you level up you get three more point
to distribute among them. You can also get bonuses/penalties to this from
acquired techniques and equipped gems.

Secondary abilities
The characters secondary abilities are derived from the primary abilities.

Health = 100 + Body + Bonuses from Techniques and equipped gems.
Chi = 100 + Spirit + Bonuses from Techniques and equipped gems.
Focus = 100 + Mind + Bonuses from Techniques and equipped gems.

NOTE: Bonuses can be negative.

Health determines how much damage you can take, Chi is the mana pool for
healing and magically attacks, and Focus allow you to use weapon styles and
slow down enemies for a time.

Conversational skills
A characters conversational skills are also derived from the primary
abilities.

Charm = ceiling((Bodyind)/2) + Bonuses from Techniques and gems.
Intuition = ceiling((Spiritind)/2) + Bonuses from Techniques and gems.
Intimidation = ceiling((Body+Spirit)/2) + Bonuses from Techniques and gems.

The higher these skills are the greater the change they'll success in
conversation when they are offered

Closed fist/open palm meter
In the character record there's a meter indication your progress towards
mastery of either the Way of the Open Palm or the Way of the Closed Fist. The
Open Palm is at the upper end of the meter, while the Closed Fish is towards
the lower end.

Whenever you see a blue aura over your head during a conversation or when
completing a task you've progressed close the Open Palm. Conversely, a red
aura indicates movement towards the closed fist.

The path you choose is up to you as there are benefits and drawbacks to both.

Styles
Martial Styles
Legendary Strike, Leaping Tiger, Thousand Cuts, White Demon,

Support Styles
Heavenly Wave, Paralyzing Palm, Hidden Fist, Storm Dragon,

Magic Styles
Ice Shard, Dire Flame, Stone Immortal, Tempest

Weapon Styles
Fortune's Favorite, Golden Star, Dragon Sword, Eyes of the Dragon, Crimson Tears, Flawless, Mirabelle, Tang's Vengeance
Tien's Justice (Limited Edition only)

Transformation Styles
Horse Demon, Jade Golem, Red Minister, Toad Demon

Unique Styles
Spirit Thief

You can have several total followers, but must choose only one to accompany the main character in explore and combat mode. Only at camp will you have them all at one place.

Mini games: flyer arcade type top down 2d.

Overall game style notes:
The game reminds me of Bioware's past and JRPGs meshed together. It has a simialr exploration, party structure, and viewpoint as KOTOR, yet a combat mode more like fighting games with powers similar to some FF games. The combat mode is more enjoyable then KOTOR and NWN. It is not as tactical as BG because you only control the main character. It is RTwP so it is more clicky then Fallout/Arcanum combat. The game world is an interesting tangent for Western RPGs. It explores a mythical pseudo science alternate tech ancient Orient with gunpowder and rocket powered fliers. The fliers are actually implemented as a rudimentary transportatin system for the elite that the player uses. The gameworld is interesting and different from western rpgs, andnot very similar to JRPGs.

What the game lacks:
-Solo mode and stealth capabiltiy.
-Setting, disarming traps
-stealing and have items stolen
I think the game would have had better variety and more depth if rogue/thief playstyles were available. Even adding KOTORs solo and stealth modes-possible a fairly easy addition, it would have done much to enhance the gameplay.

Quest structure (Plot spoilers ahead!):
Two rivers The beginning of the game starts out like this:
start in school/town, learn about inhabitants through dialogue, do errands/retrievals, lear you are chosen student, stop bandit attack, learn of rival student, rival duel, explore spirit cave, rival takes girl-player chases rival, unknown enemies attack school while away, school destroyed- sensai/master gone,chase by flyer after Master Li. ( I liked the way the game started, I enjoyed it more the how BG started, and even Arcanum & Fallout).

Tien's Landing
Explore the town do errand/retrieval quests, get training,
Pirate lair. The initial stealthy approach, then help of a demoted pirate captain seeking vengeance with a clever use of wooden loading cranes that eliminate a group of pirates in one action. The game could have used many more of these situations to spice it up. It would have been nice to see opportunities to use dialogue skills to ally or manipulate NPCs and/or use more environmental objects/puzzles to defeat obstacles. Too many times the game just rests on combat after combat with no variety in gameplay for too long stretches.
The Great Dam
Where you find the inscrutable power source for the new flyer, and close or leave open the dam.

More to follow. Any thoughts on this game,and what are the outstanding, good and bad points?

 

[Jasede]

Outstanding: nothing
Good: Story, combat system (as far as I am concerned), Jade Master difficulty
Bad: too easy on non-Jade Master, way too short, choices are mostly good/bad

Didn't regret buying it or completing it, won't play it again.

With short I mean 13 hours if you do all sub-quests including the complete arena, time taken from my last save. That's on Normal, and was my first try. Of course Volourn will soon sweep in and claim I missed side-quests or lie.

 

[Texas Red]

I never got this about JE: you get weapons as times goes on. What if I want to improve my character yet not wield the beginning weapon? Do I have to save character points in order for later to spend them?

Also, this game could have used a lot more complicated character system. Simplicity only ruins combat and results in low sales, as evidenced by the same JE and the sucktastic Bard's Tale. I don't know where the publishers got the idea that people want fast and easy. For fuck's sake, the success of ALL past games relies on difficulty and, in terms of RPGs, complexity. Does Bioware ever wonder why BG 2 is their most successful game with a still large fanbase 10 years later?

 

[Demnogonis Saastuttaja]

This game would have been much better if they just ditched the role-playing elements altogether (I can't really see how a character would end up different than another, it's so shallow) and made the combat action really sharp, complex and challenging. Or maybe go the other way, have a lot heavier RPG elements and tactical, character-skill based combat. As it is, character developement is really unrewarding and the combat is a chore.

Otherwise, it's maybe worth playing for the style and story alone, but if you want your games to have some actual gameplay, better pass. Bonus points for being able to turn a little girl in to a demon.

 

[elander_]

It's so immature for a game to pretend to be an rpg when it isn't. VTM

 

[Occasionally Fatal]

In before "r00fles!"

 

[Volourn]

"Simplicity only ruins combat and results in low sales, as evidenced by the same JE"

define 'low'. Lower nthan other BIO games? Sure. Actually, low? No. JE on 360 sold 600k copies in 6 months. Overall, it's probably easily sold over amil. Not exactly low. L0L


"It's so immature for a game to pretend to be an rpg when it isn't. VTM"

JE doesn't pretend anything. It's exactly a sit is. An Action RPG.

 

[Bluebottle]

One of my flaws in approaching Jade Empire was to think of it as a Kung Fu rpg. As such I kind of expected a detailed and in depth combat system. After all the game made no bones of its action rpg status and martial arts would certainly seem to make a good foundation for an action rpg combat system.
This hope quickly proved to be ill founded, and so initially I was pretty disapointed. I did find some enjoyment when I looked on the game more as a simple Chinese mythological fantasy game than something deeply rooted in martial arts. I never quite got round what I'd initially hoped it to be though, and in the end I found it to be only a mildly entertaining distraction.

 

[Texas Red]

I never got this about JE: you get weapons as times goes on. What if I want to improve my character yet not wield the beginning weapon? Do I have to save character points in order for later to spend them?

Can anyone answer this?

 

[Erzherzog]

I never got this about JE: you get weapons as times goes on. What if I want to improve my character yet not wield the beginning weapon? Do I have to save character points in order for later to spend them?

Can anyone answer this?

Poor design. Even I noticed that, and I'm generally oblivious to a game's flaws if the game is generally average or better.

 

[Jaesun]

It's the only Bioware game with a male & male romance. hubba hubba.

 

[MetalCraze]

Jade Empire in depth analysis

You can't do a in depth analysis of something that has no depth.

 

[Ismaul]

It's the only Bioware game with a male & male romance. hubba hubba.

You just sold the game to half the Codex.

 

[Jasede]

It's quite hard to get though without a FAQ; I missed it the first time around.

 

[Texas Red]

It's quite hard to get though without a FAQ; I missed it the first time around.

That's what he said.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Any thoughts on this game,and what are the outstanding, good and bad points?

Outstanding: Soundtrack
Good: Voice acting, dialogue, story, art direction
Bad: Length and scope of the game, simple interface/inventory, easy combat.

Overall its worth getting because it is still a very enjoyable game with a great storyline, and you should be able to get the PC version cheap.

 

[MetalCraze]

you forgot to add shitty NPCs, shitty party members and dumbed down gameplay.

...Or better to say "traditional bioware things"

 

[Lesifoere]

Jade Empire in depth analysis

You can't do a in depth analysis of something that has no depth.

Stole the words right out of my mouth. First thing I thought when I saw the title "It has depth to be analyzed?"

 

[Korgan]

You can't do a in depth analysis of something that has no depth.

QFT. It was still enjoyable, espesially the massively broken 10 foot statue form.

 

[buccaroobonzai]

Well comparitively speaking to other rpgs, where would you put it? How about compared to Bioware & Obsidian's other rpgs.

I have only played up to the Imperial city part so far so I can't comment on anything beyond that in the game.

I do agree with the combat being simplistic. At first it works pretty good, then after 30+ fights it starts getting repetitive. It is also never tactical, and it would be a great benefit to the game if they had made it more so. Having the player control the several characters would have helped. Adding more weapon types both melee and ranged, as well as sneak attacks would have been good. The magical abilities are also in shortage compared to the variety of D&D magic capabilities.

As far as NPCs go, Dawn star appears to be a well if not greatly developed character. She may not be brilliantly original, but she is true to that type of intorspective personality. Kang is an intersting character, though theyre was room for even greater exploration of his persona.

Supposedly they are working on Jade Empire 2. If they would enable control of the whole party, make combat more tactical and important while reducing the grinding, add stealth, add more non-combat options to solve quests, and explore the gameworld more, it would make it quite a good game. Thats asking for a lot though in this era.

 

[Lesifoere]

Well comparitively speaking to other rpgs, where would you put it? How about compared to Bioware & Obsidian's other rpgs.

Badly. It doesn't hold a candle to Mask of the Betrayer or KotOR2, so you don't even want to compare it to Obsidian's. It's thinner even than Mass Effect, and that's pretty damn thin.

 

[MetalCraze]

Lesi, that's arguable.
At least JE had dialogues unlike 3 word "guess what I'm going to say now" excuses for ones and also not so bad level design in some places unlike copy-pasta that is ME.
JE is still very very bland though.

 

[Brother None]

I never got this about JE: you get weapons as times goes on. What if I want to improve my character yet not wield the beginning weapon?

With a few exceptions (the double swords and double axes you learn in the arena) all weapons are improvement over the two basic styles, sword and staff.

So you can just put point in the beginning weapon, and you won't lose them when you upgrade your staff. In fact, all upgrading your weapon does is add +25% damage each time.

PS: finished it in 17 hours, m'self. Did all side-quests I could find.
PPS: I thought the plot was hilarious. Nevermind how lame the plot twist is, but they couldn't actually manage to be subtle about it. Only one town in and people were already going "OMFG the strategist could never be such a fool!" and "OMFG there's a flaw in your style HOW HORRIBLE"
PPPS: funniest point in the game is when BioWare mocks itself, and you can ask the water chick "you're not actually listening to me, are you?" and she just rants on. That has to be meant as self-reflection, because almost all dialogue in the game just thunders on regardless of what you say. I've rarely seen 3 dialogue choices in the game that actually lead to 3 different results.
Funniest point in that? When you try to marry off the fat farmer and fail, he runs off shouting "Gang, I don't want no part of no gang", even though only 2 options mention a gang. The third doesn't, yet he'll still run away with the same line.

 

[racofer]

Jade Empire + in depth = does not compute.

 

[Azrael the cat]

I never got this about JE: you get weapons as times goes on. What if I want to improve my character yet not wield the beginning weapon? Do I have to save character points in order for later to spend them?

Can anyone answer this?

Most of the later weapons are upgrades of the starting weapons. So if you start with swords, and then you get a better sword your skill in the new sword style will already include any points you put in the old sword style.

Only major differences, as I recall, are somewhat justified:
- can't get 2-sword style until later. Not stronger than the beginning styles but a bit cooler, so kind of justifies having to skimp on weapon-skill till you get it.
- MIRABELLE. The most powerful weapon in the game, and the only gun. With decent points in it it pretty much devastates anything. Subsequently you get it rather late in the game, and need to do one of the better side-quests (regarding the British explorer insulting the ignorance of all the chinese philosophers) to get it. Definitely justified in forcing the player to skimp on weapon skills for a while if they want this one - should have made skill points harder to get in my opinion.