Vapourware Injecting new characters

[MerchantKing]

It seems something is missing in many of the so-called rpgs in the last 20-25 years. That is everything is designed that your character will see the storyline from beginning to end with either reload or restart. Very few games short of a party wipe allow you to inject new characters into the game like with Icewind Dale or Temple of Elemental Evil. For BG1+2 you could always just replace party members if you don't want to revive them. You can pretty much end the game with an entirely different party than the one you started with if all your original characters died and were removed without wipes. With a wipe however, it's restart or reload. You never get to inject a new character into the world after a wipe with the world at that point preserved or events allowed to advance after that point with your new character having to deal with this. The only example of a game I can really think of where this is done is Zombie-U; if your character is killed you start as a new character and that character can even run into your previous character as a zombie carrying the equipment he died with. It's not an rpg, but it does something that you expect many true rpgs should be able to do.

In tabletop campaigns, especially those with good DMs, you could do this and see the consequences of the wipe with their goods sitting in the bottom of a dungeon, being used by some denizens in the world, or perhaps being distributed into the world through shopkeepers and pawnshops. So why have virtually zero games done anything like this? The closest you typically see is respawning your character in MMOs and having to pick up your gear again. But the state of the world relative to what anyone does is static in those.

 

[NecroLord]

I rather like the Fallout system. Your companions permanently die and you have to give them stimpacks and look out for them in order to keep them alive and healthy. NO resurrection possible!
That's what's lacking. There needs to be impact when losing a companion, like losing a friend or loved one.

 

[Kedar]

Some of the early (but not that early) RPGs did it, like Wasteland or The Bard’s Tale. If your characters died, you could create new ones to carry the torch.

 

[Ebonsword]

"Injecting new characters?"

Godammit! Not another BG3 sexuality thr...oops!

Never mind! Carry on as you were.

 

[Aemar]

if your character is killed you start as a new character and that character can even run into your previous character as a zombie carrying the equipment he died with. It's not an rpg, but it does something that you expect many true rpgs should be able to do.

In DCSS you can encounter player ghosts (unless the character was undead), which retain most of the previous stats at the time of death.

 

[octavius]

In old blobbers like Wizardry and Bard's Tale you could inject any number of new characters from the base/Adventurer's Guild in town.
But today it seems it's always A Chosen One And Their Romancing Partners.

 

[Butter]

The Dark Heart of Uukrul did this superbly. When a character dies, you have a limited time to get them back to town and if you can't resurrect them if you're too slow. But you can always recruit a replacement.

 

[Ladonna]

In old blobbers like Wizardry and Bard's Tale you could inject any number of new characters from the base/Adventurer's Guild in town.
But today it seems it's always A Chosen One And Their Romancing Partners.

Yeah. We need more games that start off with the "adventurer for loot and glory" hook rather than the Chosen One spiel.

Someone dies? Plenty more waiting for a party down at the tavern.

 

[Modron]

Do you guys remember how codexers loved to argue that JA 2 wasn't an RPG because you're playing laptop dude and not an actual merc in game? I wonder how they rectify that belief against blobbers where you can kill off, dismiss, and otherwise replace every single person in your party at any moment.

 

[Ladonna]

Do you guys remember how codexers loved to argue that JA 2 wasn't an RPG because you're playing laptop dude and not an actual merc in game?

I thought the merc you create is supposed to be the player character, who also has the laptop.

It doesn't work anyway; in Captive, you are a guy in a prison with a laptop, controlling robots, and that is considered a CRPG.

 

[laclongquan]

Another thread of tabletop screaming for attention, eh~

As long as OP, and their likes, dont actually listen to answers, just keep making them for no result~

Do you guys remember how codexers loved to argue that JA 2 wasn't an RPG because you're playing laptop dude and not an actual merc in game? I wonder how they rectify that belief against blobbers where you can kill off, dismiss, and otherwise replace every single person in your party at any moment.

In those days Codex was pretty small so the niche group of blobbers was even smaller than today~ Their squeaks were too small, too little to be noticed.

 

[Old Hans]

Some of the early (but not that early) RPGs did it, like Wasteland or The Bard’s Tale. If your characters died, you could create new ones to carry the torch.

i still have a hazy, half remembered memory of playing wasteland and having my party get stuck in a of cult temple and somehow making a new party to get them out.

 

[octavius]

Do you guys remember how codexers loved to argue that JA 2 wasn't an RPG because you're playing laptop dude and not an actual merc in game?

I thought the merc you create is supposed to be the player character, who also has the laptop.

It doesn't work anyway; in Captive, you are a guy in a prison with a laptop, controlling robots, and that is considered a CRPG.

In most party based games, at least those with decent tactical combat, I see myself as kind of a football (or "soccer") coach, trying to get the players to perform at their best and as a team.

I think it's the storyfag segment of the Codex who is of the wrong opinion that JA2 is not an RPG.

 

[Maxie]

I rather like the Fallout system. Your companions permanently die and you have to give them stimpacks and look out for them in order to keep them alive and healthy. NO resurrection possible!
That's what's lacking. There needs to be impact when losing a companion, like losing a friend or loved one.

how many of them are compelling enough to give a crap about
I'm not talking just writing quality, I'm talking stats, AI routines, even frickin combat barks

 

[NecroLord]

I rather like the Fallout system. Your companions permanently die and you have to give them stimpacks and look out for them in order to keep them alive and healthy. NO resurrection possible!
That's what's lacking. There needs to be impact when losing a companion, like losing a friend or loved one.

how many of them are compelling enough to give a crap about
I'm not talking just writing quality, I'm talking stats, AI routines, even frickin combat barks

Yeah, perhaps the companions in the first Fallout game.
But the ones in Fallout 2? Those are great. Ones like Cassidy, Sulik, Marcus (without a burst Big Gun) and Cat Jules (you find him in the EPA facility).

 

[Kev Inkline]

Injecting new (modern) characters with T? I agree.

 

[Velut]

While Kichikuou Rance isn't exactly rpg, but I really liked that after death of some characters you will get new ones. Would be cool to see something like that in new rpgs, but it will probably never happen because devs put too much content around them and too proud of their work to allow player to miss that content.