Indie Guile & Glory: Firstborn - Top-Down Turn-Based Tactical RPG with Puzzles and Old-School Arcade Charm

[cyborgboy95]

https://www.elstonstudios.net/firstborn

Spoiler

ABOUT THIS GAME
A lone warrior enters the Drowned Lands, seeking revenge for the family he lost to an unimaginable foe. His quest takes an unexpected turn when he meets two other travellers, each drawn by desperation to the ancient land of gods and monsters.

Amidst the ruins of a long-forgotten empire, the companions find themselves swept up in events that will shape the fates of mortals and demigods alike. Legends come alive, and three heroes rise to challenge an ancient darkness from the earliest days of the world.
The Battlefield is Your Weapon

Master natural hazards and deadly traps as you make your stand against the darkness in turn-based tactical combat. The enemies in Firstborn may be immune to mortal weapons, but they can still die.

Cut a swathe through the hordes of nightmarish immortals by pushing, pulling or maneuvering your opponents into the path of lethal hazards.
Your Legend Awaits

Gather and lead a party of unlikely heroes as they rise from humble beginnings to become humanity's greatest champions.

Choose how your heroes grow and develop, and create the ultimate team to battle the ancient legions of the Firstborn.
Vanquish Mighty Bosses

Ferocious beasts haunt the forgotten corners of Firstborn's world, waiting to unleash their earth-shaking fury upon unwary travelers.

Wield skill, patience, and courage to prevail against impossible odds as you cast down nightmarish titans from an age long forgotten.
A Savage World

Take up the mantle of Aspirant and face the challenge of Guile & Glory's campaign head on; or assemble your perfect team to explore the furthest reaches of the Drowned Lands. As you conquer ever greater challenges, you will unlock powerful Boons of Divinity that offer new ways for your heroes to face their foes.

Each new region you explore will bring its own challenges and unique enemies to test your mettle as you lead your heroes on a quest for revenge across an ancient world of gods and monsters.

 

[Infinitron]

Sound effects are 1990 af.

 

[nlfortier]

This looks great. I love the old school aesthetic. The pixel art is excellent. Will there be Linux support?

 

[4249]

From the videos it looks like the combat system and all the classes are mostly based on pushing/pulling stuff around the battlefield to the one-hit environmental hazards. 3 statistics, level ups seem to increase those and improve your push/pull ability automatically. The trait details are not really shown in the video. But based on that, it doesn't look like much of an RPG at all tbh.

 

[Infinitron]

Hi all! It has been brought to our attention that the perfect clear requirements for The Chase are a little ridiculous. We wholeheartedly agree, and a patch is coming! In the meantime, here's a guide on how to put this horribly overtuned battle in its place.

 

[4249]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

 

[lukaszek]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

you dont get it, enemies by design are expected to behave this way

 

[J1M]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

I also had this first impression, but I am really enjoying this game. It is not a puzzle game. Unlike a puzzle game, you can advance without finding a perfect solution. Shortly after the intro you'll have enough 'glory' aka currency to unlock a decent range of abilities and control multiple characters. Characters get stronger and have progression similar to an RPG in the sense that you can revisit the first maps that felt like 'puzzles' and easily meet the bonus objectives with suboptimal play because your character can move further per turn or has additional abilities.

Combining the different character abilities is fun and interesting, especially if you upgrade the Outlander -> Avenger -> Gladiator class that can generate bonus actions and movement for your whole team when he kills something. One thing that people here may not like (but should considering the disdain for hit point-bloat) is that the game would prefer if you completed battles without taking damage. Hit points allow you to still win a map if you get hit once or twice, but you get bonus currency if you avoid damage. There's also no randomness to the combat. Certain characters have traits that make them juicier targets for the AI, but the main element is proximity.

It appears there are 10 playable characters, but 3 main ones (pusher, puller, blocker). Abilities can be used in multiple ways (push a teammate instead of an enemy, pull an object).

I didn't like the amount of dialog. It's fine, but too verbose. Cutscenes can be skipped by hitting ESC twice.

Overall, this game was a refreshing experience and one of the better games I played this year. A similar level of enjoyment as I had with Trials of Fire. Looking forward to playing more of it tomorrow. I would suggest this thread be moved to the tactics forum.

Grunker
rusty_shackleford
Galdred
Parabalus

 

[baud]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

I also had this first impression, but I am really enjoying this game. It is not a puzzle game. Unlike a puzzle game, you can advance without finding a perfect solution. Shortly after the intro you'll have enough 'glory' aka currency to unlock a decent range of abilities and control multiple characters. Characters get stronger and have progression similar to an RPG in the sense that you can revisit the first maps that felt like 'puzzles' and easily meet the bonus objectives with suboptimal play because your character can move further per turn or has additional abilities.

Combining the different character abilities is fun and interesting, especially if you upgrade the Outlander -> Avenger -> Gladiator class that can generate bonus actions and movement for your whole team when he kills something. One thing that people here may not like (but should considering the disdain for hit point-bloat) is that the game would prefer if you completed battles without taking damage. Hit points allow you to still win a map if you get hit once or twice, but you get bonus currency if you avoid damage. There's also no randomness to the combat. Certain characters have traits that make them juicier targets for the AI, but the main element is proximity.

It appears there are 10 playable characters, but 3 main ones (pusher, puller, blocker). Abilities can be used in multiple ways (push a teammate instead of an enemy, pull an object).

I didn't like the amount of dialog. It's fine, but too verbose. Cutscenes can be skipped by hitting ESC twice.

Overall, this game was a refreshing experience and one of the better games I played this year. A similar level of enjoyment as I had with Trials of Fire. Looking forward to playing more of it tomorrow. I would suggest this thread be moved to the tactics forum.

Grunker
rusty_shackleford
Galdred
Parabalus

how long is the game? Like 10h or 25h?

 

[J1M]

how long is the game? Like 10h or 25h?

I don't know. Assuming there's only one world map, I estimate that I'm about halfway through. The game is still unlocking mechanics/abilities. Best guess, 12 hours. Will vary based on how important it is for you to complete all secondary objectives or the challenge maps.

 

[baud]

Bought the the game, played 3 hours this evening. The battles (so far) feel closer to a puzzle than a tactics game, as in each turn has one or more good solution to progress. Maybe it'd change in the future with new enemy types or systems, but so far it doesn't feel like tactics. But it's really fun to use the various abilities to kill the enemies.
The presentation is halfway between a RPG (like with the aesthetics, the characters, the story, skills, upgrades) and a puzzle game (maps that can be replayed for bonus objectives, each map introducing new mechanics, difficulty increasing for each map).
The progression system is interesting: each map completed give some currency that can be spent to buy boons and then upgrade them (and having two boons at max level unlock an elite boon, like the Gladiator J1M talked about); each character can equip one boon that will give different stats (health, movement and actions points) and various skills and passive bonus, but the boons can be freely swapped between missions and you can go back to earlier maps at any moments to grind some more currency to buy the one you want.

Though unlike puzzle games, you're not stuck trying to find the only solution and even if there's an incentive to finish below a turn number and without any damage, you're not forced to and play can imperfectly.

I didn't find (so far) that's there's too much dialogue and it's kinda Sword and Sorcery, which I'm liking so far.

If there was a sub-forum for puzzle games, I'd say the thread would belong there, more than in general RPG (or even tactical RPGs).

 

[baud]

Bought the the game, played 3 hours this evening. The battles (so far) feel closer to a puzzle than a tactics game, as in each turn has one or more good solution to progress. Maybe it'd change in the future with new enemy types or systems, but so far it doesn't feel like tactics. But it's really fun to use the various abilities to kill the enemies.
The presentation is halfway between a RPG (like with the aesthetics, the characters, the story, skills, upgrades) and a puzzle game (maps that can be replayed for bonus objectives, each map introducing new mechanics, difficulty increasing for each map).
The progression system is interesting: each map completed give some currency that can be spent to buy boons and then upgrade them (and having two boons at max level unlock an elite boon, like the Gladiator J1M talked about); each character can equip one boon that will give different stats (health, movement and actions points) and various skills and passive bonus, but the boons can be freely swapped between missions and you can go back to earlier maps at any moments to grind some more currency to buy the one you want.

Though unlike puzzle games, you're not stuck trying to find the only solution and even if there's an incentive to finish below a turn number and without any damage, you're not forced to and play can imperfectly.

I didn't find (so far) that's there's too much dialogue and it's kinda Sword and Sorcery, which I'm liking so far.

If there was a sub-forum for puzzle games, I'd say the thread would belong there, more than in general RPG (or even tactical RPGs).

Finished it, at least the story, there's a few more things left to unlock, I guess by going for perfect on all levels + on the randomly generated maps.
Took me 10 hours, including a few of the randomly generated levels (which aren't very interesting, since it's the usual maps with some random enemies) plus getting perfect score on all maps except the first two of the final boss.

Story went a little more 'high fantasy' in its themes at the end.

Went more and more puzzly as the game and the available skills progressed.

a good pick, so thanks to Infinitron for doing a news post.

 

[J1M]

Bought the the game, played 3 hours this evening. The battles (so far) feel closer to a puzzle than a tactics game, as in each turn has one or more good solution to progress. Maybe it'd change in the future with new enemy types or systems, but so far it doesn't feel like tactics. But it's really fun to use the various abilities to kill the enemies.
The presentation is halfway between a RPG (like with the aesthetics, the characters, the story, skills, upgrades) and a puzzle game (maps that can be replayed for bonus objectives, each map introducing new mechanics, difficulty increasing for each map).
The progression system is interesting: each map completed give some currency that can be spent to buy boons and then upgrade them (and having two boons at max level unlock an elite boon, like the Gladiator J1M talked about); each character can equip one boon that will give different stats (health, movement and actions points) and various skills and passive bonus, but the boons can be freely swapped between missions and you can go back to earlier maps at any moments to grind some more currency to buy the one you want.

Though unlike puzzle games, you're not stuck trying to find the only solution and even if there's an incentive to finish below a turn number and without any damage, you're not forced to and play can imperfectly.

I didn't find (so far) that's there's too much dialogue and it's kinda Sword and Sorcery, which I'm liking so far.

If there was a sub-forum for puzzle games, I'd say the thread would belong there, more than in general RPG (or even tactical RPGs).

Finished it, at least the story, there's a few more things left to unlock, I guess by going for perfect on all levels + on the randomly generated maps.
Took me 10 hours, including a few of the randomly generated levels (which aren't very interesting, since it's the usual maps with some random enemies) plus getting perfect score on all maps except the first two of the final boss.

Story went a little more 'high fantasy' in its themes at the end.

Went more and more puzzly as the game and the available skills progressed.

a good pick, so thanks to Infinitron for doing a news post.

Why do you feel the game became more "puzzly" as you unlocked more skills? I had the opposite experience.

 

[baud]

Bought the the game, played 3 hours this evening. The battles (so far) feel closer to a puzzle than a tactics game, as in each turn has one or more good solution to progress. Maybe it'd change in the future with new enemy types or systems, but so far it doesn't feel like tactics. But it's really fun to use the various abilities to kill the enemies.
The presentation is halfway between a RPG (like with the aesthetics, the characters, the story, skills, upgrades) and a puzzle game (maps that can be replayed for bonus objectives, each map introducing new mechanics, difficulty increasing for each map).
The progression system is interesting: each map completed give some currency that can be spent to buy boons and then upgrade them (and having two boons at max level unlock an elite boon, like the Gladiator J1M talked about); each character can equip one boon that will give different stats (health, movement and actions points) and various skills and passive bonus, but the boons can be freely swapped between missions and you can go back to earlier maps at any moments to grind some more currency to buy the one you want.

Though unlike puzzle games, you're not stuck trying to find the only solution and even if there's an incentive to finish below a turn number and without any damage, you're not forced to and play can imperfectly.

I didn't find (so far) that's there's too much dialogue and it's kinda Sword and Sorcery, which I'm liking so far.

If there was a sub-forum for puzzle games, I'd say the thread would belong there, more than in general RPG (or even tactical RPGs).

Finished it, at least the story, there's a few more things left to unlock, I guess by going for perfect on all levels + on the randomly generated maps.
Took me 10 hours, including a few of the randomly generated levels (which aren't very interesting, since it's the usual maps with some random enemies) plus getting perfect score on all maps except the first two of the final boss.

Story went a little more 'high fantasy' in its themes at the end.

Went more and more puzzly as the game and the available skills progressed.

a good pick, so thanks to Infinitron for doing a news post.

Why do you feel the game became more "puzzly" as you unlocked more skills? I had the opposite experience.

Maybe because I was playing it more like a puzzle, like checking how each map worked/where were the enemies/how to kill new enemies, then restarting to try to get a perfect instead of playing imperfectly and getting on with what I got on my first try.
And with all the best skills, I was mostly able to easily clear large chunks of the map instead of reacting to what the enemies are doing

 

[Galdred]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

I also had this first impression, but I am really enjoying this game. It is not a puzzle game. Unlike a puzzle game, you can advance without finding a perfect solution. Shortly after the intro you'll have enough 'glory' aka currency to unlock a decent range of abilities and control multiple characters. Characters get stronger and have progression similar to an RPG in the sense that you can revisit the first maps that felt like 'puzzles' and easily meet the bonus objectives with suboptimal play because your character can move further per turn or has additional abilities.

Combining the different character abilities is fun and interesting, especially if you upgrade the Outlander -> Avenger -> Gladiator class that can generate bonus actions and movement for your whole team when he kills something. One thing that people here may not like (but should considering the disdain for hit point-bloat) is that the game would prefer if you completed battles without taking damage. Hit points allow you to still win a map if you get hit once or twice, but you get bonus currency if you avoid damage. There's also no randomness to the combat. Certain characters have traits that make them juicier targets for the AI, but the main element is proximity.

It appears there are 10 playable characters, but 3 main ones (pusher, puller, blocker). Abilities can be used in multiple ways (push a teammate instead of an enemy, pull an object).

I didn't like the amount of dialog. It's fine, but too verbose. Cutscenes can be skipped by hitting ESC twice.

Overall, this game was a refreshing experience and one of the better games I played this year. A similar level of enjoyment as I had with Trials of Fire. Looking forward to playing more of it tomorrow. I would suggest this thread be moved to the tactics forum.

Grunker
rusty_shackleford
Galdred
Parabalus

Thanks! Given that to my surprise, I loved Into the Breach, I will try this one (especially if I can count my playtime as R&D!).
How does it compare to Into the Breach or Druidstone?

 

[baud]

Thanks! Given that to my surprise, I loved Into the Breach, I will try this one (especially if I can count my playtime as R&D!).
How does it compare to Into the Breach or Druidstone?

Didn't play Druidstone, but I'd say it's easier than Into the Breach.

sperging about difficulty

In part because you can finish any mission by the skin of your teeth and it won't impact the rest of the campaign (well, you win less XP, but you can go back and grind) and you can retry any maps as much as you want (I often started a map, fucked around to find if there was any traps, then restarted and played seriously). Since the structure is different (like an actual puzzle game vs roguelike structure), there's way less pressure to play perfectly.
The maps are also bigger and there's less that phenomenon of having to deal with waves and waves of enemies (at least that's what I remember of when I played ItB on release), but rather clearing groups of enemies as you go. IA in G&G doesn't seem very clever and the balancing act of defending civilians building, doing the bonus objectives and killing bugs is absent.
Also the enemies seem weaker in G&G, since you nearly always have a way to one-shot them by pushing into water and the most powerful ones always telegraph their attack one turn before. The G&G enemies don't get stronger as much as those from ItB do across a playthrough, and then it's mostly made irrelevant since you're just one-shooting them in a pit.
In G&G, your characters can get much stronger, mostly because of getting multiple actions per turn is so powerful.

I only played ItB with three different squads, but G&G is much more limited with three main characters (plus a handful of temporary allies) and even improving their skills doesn't change how they play, or at least not on the level of switching mechs.

It's standard turn-based, not the enemy move > player turn > enemy attack of ItB and G&G is based around movement & action points (which can refilled later on with skills), so it's easier to control

It's less geared toward direct damage, but rather moving enemies, so you kill enemies by pushing them into pits, spike or in the enemies' line of fire,

The way G&G is structured is more reminiscent of a puzzle game, though I'd say the gameplay is more puzzly in ItB.

There's an actual story in G&G, not just a handful of throwaway lines.

 

[J1M]

What a dumbfuck AI, the enemy units don't give a shit about their own missiles and just run to get killed by friendly fire from the bowmen. Based on that and the menuing before the battle, this definitely looks mainly like a puzzle game, not a tactical or really any kind of RPG.

I also had this first impression, but I am really enjoying this game. It is not a puzzle game. Unlike a puzzle game, you can advance without finding a perfect solution. Shortly after the intro you'll have enough 'glory' aka currency to unlock a decent range of abilities and control multiple characters. Characters get stronger and have progression similar to an RPG in the sense that you can revisit the first maps that felt like 'puzzles' and easily meet the bonus objectives with suboptimal play because your character can move further per turn or has additional abilities.

Combining the different character abilities is fun and interesting, especially if you upgrade the Outlander -> Avenger -> Gladiator class that can generate bonus actions and movement for your whole team when he kills something. One thing that people here may not like (but should considering the disdain for hit point-bloat) is that the game would prefer if you completed battles without taking damage. Hit points allow you to still win a map if you get hit once or twice, but you get bonus currency if you avoid damage. There's also no randomness to the combat. Certain characters have traits that make them juicier targets for the AI, but the main element is proximity.

It appears there are 10 playable characters, but 3 main ones (pusher, puller, blocker). Abilities can be used in multiple ways (push a teammate instead of an enemy, pull an object).

I didn't like the amount of dialog. It's fine, but too verbose. Cutscenes can be skipped by hitting ESC twice.

Overall, this game was a refreshing experience and one of the better games I played this year. A similar level of enjoyment as I had with Trials of Fire. Looking forward to playing more of it tomorrow. I would suggest this thread be moved to the tactics forum.

Grunker
rusty_shackleford
Galdred
Parabalus

Thanks! Given that to my surprise, I loved Into the Breach, I will try this one (especially if I can count my playtime as R&D!).
How does it compare to Into the Breach or Druidstone?

I don't like Druidstone because it feels like you have to fail a mission once in order to have enough information to actually play it.

Guile and Glory can feel like that based on the tutorial mission, but as soon as you receive some upgrade currency it opens up into a tactics game instead of a puzzle game.

Into the Breach is definitely a deeper game with more thoughtful mechanics, in part because enemy actions are clearly telegraphed.