Incline Chris Avellone Appreciation Station

[Fairfax]

Don't be so sure. I said in another thread that Avellone might be angling for a Michael Kirkbride-like role at Bethesda, periodically contracted to brush up the Fallout lore. He said in a previous tweet that "I'd rather work with the Fallout lore at the source".

I'm sure he considered that before leaving, but he wouldn't gamble everything on the chance of getting that job, and he's already mentioned other reasons for leaving.
There's also what Beastro said:

Chris doesn't expect Obsidian to get another chance to make a Fallout game, or any other studio for that matter. The interesting part is: "and that's why I freelance". He obviously didn't leave Obsidian to hope Bethesda would hire him as freelance to work on it. It's more like "by freelancing there's a chance I'll get to work on franchises I love, some of which Obsidian can't/won't work on".
This is kind of big, because it's the first time he's mentioning one of the specific reasons for his departure.

If he hated what Obsidian did to his work in PoE, I can't imagine his reaction to hearing Bethesda's reasons for butchering it. :D

 

[Immortal]

He said in a previous tweet that "I'd rather work with the Fallout lore at the source".

 

[Infinitron]

He said in a previous tweet that "I'd rather work with the Fallout lore at the source".

 

[AN4RCHID]

gay

 

[Beastro]

He said in a previous tweet that "I'd rather work with the Fallout lore at the source".

He could have had gay sex worked at the source with Tim Cain when he was at Obsidian. :/

 

[Fairfax]

Again showing interest in creating his own IP.


Not only he doesn't expect a new Obsidian Fallout, he doesn't expect a Fallout spin-off at all.
Business-wise I think this would be a huge mistake for ZeniMax, but I get the feeling he's heard things and this is a bit more than an educated guess.

 

[Grimlorn]

So I guess it's true Bethesda didn't like that Obsidian made a better Fallout game than they did. My guess is there was some sort of fallout with Obsidian during New Vegas's development and that's why Bethesda refused to give Obsidian more time or fund any QA on the game.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

there was some sort of fallout with Obsidian

Yeah man, that was Fallout: New Vegas.

 

[Infinitron]

There doesn't need to have been any fallout. What Bethesda did by allowing that game to exist was really highly unusual and there was no reason to expect it to happen again. Publishers are highly protective of their IPs.

 

[Grimlorn]

There doesn't need to have been any fallout. What Bethesda did by allowing that game to exist was really highly unusual and there was no reason to expect it to happen again. Publishers are highly protective of their IPs.

Yeah but didn't it sell more copies than the FO3? Also they refused to spend any time or money on QA causing the game to be released with the same bugs as FO3 that Bethesda already fixed. Seems like there was a reason they didn't want to pay for QA and release it as it. And if it did sell more and make more money, wouldn't it be a good idea to do another spinoff with Obsidian. Does Bethesda hate money?

 

[DosBuster]

Fallout New Vegas was very interesting in that it was Bethesda's love letter to the old fans (yes Obsidian developed but it was Todd Howard who reached out and made it a thing), however, it also had the role of filling in the gap between Fallout 3 and Skyrim, furthemore it was Bethesda's only release in 2010 so that would of influenced the release date. Also there is no way you would release a fallout and elder scrolls game in the same year they're too similar and it'd be too close together.

 

[Fairfax]

No new Fallout before BGS itself makes the next one would be very stupid. They will only be able to release FO5 in 2021 at the earliest, unless they expand a lot and split in two teams: one for TES and one for Fallout. I think that's even less likely, though.

As for why Bethesda (ZeniMax, ultimately) might not want a spin-off by Obsidian or another external studio: could be because they're aware of FO4's backlash and underwhelming reception, so perhaps they don't want to risk further damage by giving it to another studio. The opposite would be even worse: fans welcoming another spin-off by Obsidian as the true sequel and the vastly superior game. It was already the case with FNV, of course, but this time around even Bethestards are being vocal about how much they miss FNV.
Some might say this is pettiness and jealousy, but it's all about money. They wouldn't want it to become a COD situation, where a lot of fans skip lesser versions and wait for Treyarch to release theirs.

No Fallout spin-off at all means leaving at least $750 million on the table (assuming it sells as much as FO4), while a FNV-like game would cost ~$20 million tops.

Fallout: Montreal by Bethesda Montreal announced at E3; late 2017 release. You heard it here first, folks.

 

[Lyric Suite]

What i'm trying to figure out now is whether Avellone going freelance is any good for us. If all this is going to lead to is him "offering" his services to Bethesda or other shit companies like that than we can say goodbye to Avellone for good. It would be like sticking a gold pebble in a giant turd, what's the point?

Of course, with Obsidian dropping the ball with PoE (let's cut the shit here. We all wanted another Torment-like game and i think Obsidian knew it too, so fuck them) i don't know whether this is going to make any difference. But still.

No more RPGs with semi-professional writing for us. Only Hollywood wannabe shit like Witcher.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

let's cut the shit here. We all wanted another Torment-like game and i think Obsidian knew it too, so fuck them

Oi, that's the Numanuma game. PoE was pitched as the next BG, wasn't it.

 

[Lyric Suite]

A Torment game made by the people that gave us Wasteland 2? Not holding my breath on that one.

No, PoE is the game that had the best chances of giving us what we wanted. Games like KOTOR 2 and Mask of the Betrayer showed us that the capability was there. All that was needed was the opportunity, the financial and contractual freedom to finally do the game they always wanted to do but couldn't. PoE was their big chance to shine and they fucked up. Avellone leaving was pretty much the nail in the coffin but now we are left wondering whether anything good is actually going to come out of this. He is no longer gimped by the fucktards at Obsidian but will he have the opportunity to make something like Torment again? Frankly, i don't see how.

 

[Infinitron]

finally do the game they always wanted to do but couldn't

That game is called "Fallout: New Vegas - We Own The IP Edition", and they still haven't gotten the opportunity to make it.

Paraphrasing what I said earlier:

It turns out that Chris Avellone and Obsidian didn't have a big binder full of plans and ideas, all ready for their triumphant return to making classic isometric RPGs. They weren't thinking about those classics at all and never expected them to come back.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Beth will never allow another studio to take a jab at Fallout. Not after New Vegas got overwhelmingly higher Steam reviews than both F3 and F4.

 

[Lyric Suite]

finally do the game they always wanted to do but couldn't

That game is called "Fallout: New Vegas - We Own The IP Edition", and they still haven't gotten the opportunity to make it.

Paraphrasing what I said earlier:

It turns out that Chris Avellone and Obsidian didn't have a big binder full of plans and ideas, all ready for their triumphant return to making classic isometric RPGs. They weren't thinking about those classics at all and never expected them to come back.

If that's the case why do we give a shit about this people anymore?

So they left us behind and now want to "move on" to whatever passes off as an RPG or even a game this days. Cya then?

 

[Infinitron]

Well, they're thinking about them now. No telling what Avellone ends up doing, though.

 

[Prime Junta]

please accept this wise(ok, maybe it is foolish) piece of advice: take it to kickstarter and do your own thing. Start your own company maybe. Otherwise I assume you will never be able to work as you did in Torment. There will always be some faggot like Sawyer cutting off your content and pushing you down.

Managing a Kickstarter let alone a company is mostly administrative work. He's said multiple times that he doesn't want to do that.

 

[Barbarian]

Managing a Kickstarter let alone a company is mostly administrative work. He's said multiple times that he doesn't want to do that.

He can get someone to do it for him.

 

[Prime Junta]

Managing a Kickstarter let alone a company is mostly administrative work. He's said multiple times that he doesn't want to do that.

He can get someone to do it for him.

Then it wouldn't be his Kickstarter or his company anymore.

 

[Barbarian]

Then it wouldn't be his Kickstarter or his company anymore.

Nah, most of the more well organized and successfull kickstarters had at least a competent pr guy running it.

 

[Latro]

I'll run it, just give me all the money.

 

[Fairfax]

What i'm trying to figure out now is whether Avellone going freelance is any good for us. If all this is going to lead to is him "offering" his services to Bethesda or other shit companies like that than we can say goodbye to Avellone for good. It would be like sticking a gold pebble in a giant turd, what's the point?

Of course, with Obsidian dropping the ball with PoE (let's cut the shit here. We all wanted another Torment-like game and i think Obsidian knew it too, so fuck them) i don't know whether this is going to make any difference. But still.

No more RPGs with semi-professional writing for us. Only Hollywood wannabe shit like Witcher.

Having MCA work on Fallout again can only be good news for everyone. Unless Bethesda guts everything he makes, of course. Worst case scenario he keeps them from butchering Fallout lore even further.

According to Feargus, he did offer Chris the chance to make a spiritual sequel to PS:T, but he turned it down because he didn't want to go on "another death march". I think everyone here wishes TTON was a MCA-led project like the original, but he had his reasons.
It's not supposed to be good for us, really. He's clearly much happier as a freelancer.

A Torment game made by the people that gave us Wasteland 2? Not holding my breath on that one.

No, PoE is the game that had the best chances of giving us what we wanted. Games like KOTOR 2 and Mask of the Betrayer showed us that the capability was there. All that was needed was the opportunity, the financial and contractual freedom to finally do the game they always wanted to do but couldn't. PoE was their big chance to shine and they fucked up. Avellone leaving was pretty much the nail in the coffin but now we are left wondering whether anything good is actually going to come out of this. He is no longer gimped by the fucktards at Obsidian but will he have the opportunity to make something like Torment again? Frankly, i don't see how.

1. You're right that Obsidian is a shadow of its former self. Most of the key developers responsible for KOTOR2, MotB and FNV are gone. FNV lost almost 2/3 of its team IIRC. I wrote a list somewhere in the Codex. Pretty underwhelming stuff.

2. Will we see another Torment by MCA the freelancer? Almost impossible, unless InXile brings him over as director for TTON 2. It's very unlikely that he'll have as much influence and control over projects as a freelancer. Minor roles like his work on D:OS2 are much easier for a freelancer to get.
However, Swen and Larian as a whole are already used to working with writers in different countries (they have people in Belgium, Ireland and Russia atm). Adam Heine is working on TTON as Lead Designer and writer, and he lives in Thailand. I wouldn't be surprised if MCA got a Lead Writer role in the future.

Hopefully not at InXile.

Managing a Kickstarter let alone a company is mostly administrative work. He's said multiple times that he doesn't want to do that.

He said he can't do that because of family issues, it's different. He hated partner meetings and firing people, but he said in an interview that building Obsidian from the ground up was one of the best periods of his life.
I wouldn't be surprised if he helped create a new studio. Just don't expect him to be a partner again. And he doesn't have to manage a company to help launch a Kickstarter. He was already giving feedback on KS campaigns for other people when he was at Obsidian, for example.